Support NeoGAF

[ThatGuy707]

So you want to play that game, but I’m sure you take MS’s obviously disingenuous “locked” comment at face value?

They said sustained not locked. You can expect those clocks at a minimum they didn't say it would never go a bit higher

 

[On Demand]

You guys are very desperate. PS5 is 3.5 and 10.3tf console. It's ok.

I can't believe there's a thread on this. The only thing misleading is this entire article.

Xbox Velocity Architecture - 100 GB is instantly accessible by the developer through a custom hardware decompression block

https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2020/07/14/a-closer-look-at-xbox-velocity-architecture/ Modern games require a significant amount of data to create the realistic worlds and universes that gamers experience. To enable the processor to work at its optimum performance, all of this data must be loaded...

www.neogaf.com

MS puts a pretty name on things thats already available. You can't make up in software what raw performance can do in hardware. XB fans love telling that about PS5 vs SX, yet now bring up this velocity crap as if it can make up a 3x difference in SSD speed.

 

[sonomamashine]

That's half of the time what you claiming

That's subjective, Like StreetsofBeige said.
If you where to believe everything a corporation is telling/selling you then ... oh boy. (Technicality)

 

[Romulus]

It seems that the ps5 being less powerful than the XSX has seriously damaged people’s perception. The Gears5 demo is an example of ENHANCED BACKWARDS COMPATIBILITY , it is not an example of a new gears game for the XSX. It is like Sony showing an enhanced BC version of , say spider man, and people going on about how it doesn’t look much better. It is like taking the enhanced version of gears of war 3 on the Xbox one x as an example of how Xbox one x games look.

You are going to be begging for the Sony BC games to have these types of improvements when Sony finally reveals how it will handle BC.

Alot of games made for XSX are going to be like this Gears 5. Bumps in resolution/fps over X1X and S. They'll be forced to code with those systems in mind. Then when you get to multiplatforms, dynamic resolution technology will ensure ps5 games will barely show any difference.

The only true next gen games will be on ps5. Theres no requirement to drag the ps4 along like XSX has with the Xbox one.

 

[Journey]

You guys are very desperate. PS5 is 3.5 and 10.3tf console. It's ok.

I can't believe there's a thread on this. The only thing misleading is this entire article.



MS puts a pretty name on things thats already available. You can't make up in software what raw performance can do in hardware. XB fans love telling that about PS5 vs SX, yet now bring up this velocity crap as if it can make up a 3x difference in SSD speed.

So developer comments are now Xbox fans talking?

 

[it_wasn't_me]

That's subjective, Like StreetsofBeige said.
If you where to believe everything a corporation is telling/selling you then ... oh boy. (Technicality)

Like they believe to their lovely Phil Spencer. But unlike Phil, Cerny is a system architect and designer.

 

[Fulcizombie]

Alot of games made for XSX are going to be like this Gears 5. Bumps in resolution/fps over X1X and S. They'll be forced to code with those systems in mind. Then when you get to multiplatforms, dynamic resolution technology will ensure ps5 games will barely show any difference.

The only true next gen games will be on ps5. Theres no requirement to drag the ps4 along like XSX has with the Xbox one.

Even if we accept this silly theory, as if we don’t know how game development works on pc for example, what was shown was an enhanced BC game. That’s it, no if’s and buts. When they show the first XSX games, if we don’t see any big differences then we can talk. Until then using an enhanced BC game is malarkey.

 

[Fulcizombie]

Like they believe to their lovely Phil Spencer. But unlike Phil, Cerny is a system architect and designer.

Phil Spencer promised powerful systems with the Xbox one x and the XSX, he delivered. He promised a new focus on 1st party development, he delivered. He promised a great service in gamepass, he delivered. Why wouldn’t we believe him when it comes to Microsoft’s plans ?

Cerny unveiled a console with variable clock speeds.

 

[welsay01]

Yep if it was at those clocks 90% of the time why even dedicate so much time to talking about the variable frequency? I mean we know it isn't a 10.28 TFlop machine on average. The key is what is the average performance gamers can expect and I get that can change with games. Is it 10.1, 9.2, 9,5, etc?

It will be whatever the game demands of it up to 10.28. Not every game is going to demand the full power of the system. If a game needs 10.28 TFLOPS all the time then it will get it all the time, but it won't get the full 3.5GHz CPU with it. Most games won't demand the full amount all of the time. Thus he expects it to be that high only a "majority of the time".

 

[Romulus]

Even if we accept this silly theory, as if we don’t know how game development works on pc for example, what was shown was an enhanced BC game. That’s it, no if’s and buts. When they show the first XSX games, if we don’t see any big differences then we can talk. Until then using an enhanced BC game is malarkey.

I'm not saying it won't be enhanced further than what we're seeing, it just won't be anything earth-shattering because the scope of the project has to work within the constraints of Xbox One S etc.

 

[TBiddy]

Alot of games made for XSX are going to be like this Gears 5. Bumps in resolution/fps over X1X and S. They'll be forced to code with those systems in mind. Then when you get to multiplatforms, dynamic resolution technology will ensure ps5 games will barely show any difference.

The only true next gen games will be on ps5. Theres no requirement to drag the ps4 along like XSX has with the Xbox one.

You need to educate yourself. You could start by Googling "Matt Booty 2 year" and see if you can find a result that will tell you why your post is utterly wrong.

But seriously. There will be very few games, that would need to work on the XB1. How many exclusives do you think Microsoft will release between holidays 2020 and holidays 2021? 3? 4?

 

[quest]

It will be whatever the game demands of it up to 10.28. Not every game is going to demand the full power of the system. If a game needs 10.28 TFLOPS all the time then it will get it all the time, but it won't get the full 3.5GHz CPU with it. Most games won't demand the full amount all of the time. Thus he expects it to be that high only a "majority of the time".

So don't bother with high end graphics, physics. Ai. Frame rate, ect you know a real next gen game. Unless you want wild unpredictable performance because of Variable clocks all over the place. Give me fixed clocks any day of the week.

 

[Romulus]

You need to educate yourself. You could start by Googling "Matt Booty 2 year" and see if you can find a result that will tell you why your post is utterly wrong.

But seriously. There will be very few games, that would need to work on the XB1. How many exclusives do you think Microsoft will release between holidays 2020 and holidays 2021? 3? 4?

I just read it, I don't see anything that convinces me otherwise so long as Xbox one is in the equation. Exclusives are were the system can shine, Halo CE for example didn't have some older machine to cater to, it was built around Xbox, and that's why it was visually great. It stood out for that reason, developing solely around a new, powerful closed box. That's over for Xbox.

 

[TBiddy]

I just read it, I don't see anything that convinces me otherwise so long as Xbox one is in the equation. Exclusives are were the system can shine, Halo CE for example didn't have some older machine to cater to, it was built around Xbox, and that's why it was visually great. It stood out for that reason, developing solely around a new, powerful closed box. That's over for Xbox.

You need to read again.

The mandate is first party only. Until some point in 2021. What do you think happens after that?

I'm not saying it won't be enhanced further than what we're seeing, it just won't be anything earth-shattering because the scope of the project has to work within the constraints of Xbox One S etc.

This is wrong, and you need to realize that.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

Phil Spencer promised powerful systems with the Xbox one x and the XSX, he delivered. He promised a new focus on 1st party development, he delivered. He promised a great service in gamepass, he delivered. Why wouldn’t we believe him when it comes to Microsoft’s plans ?

Cerny unveiled a console with variable clock speeds.

It's about tech talking not about who delivered what.

 

[Romulus]

You need to read again.

The mandate is first party only. Until some point in 2021. What do you think happens after that?

That's still huge. "Some time in 2021" is barely confirmation. Even then, XSX comes out of the gate with an Xbox one S anchor. Halo has to drag that POS around lol.
Then after they drop Xbox One, they'll release minimum system specs that games will have to run on for PC then. It's still not the same as creating a game from the ground up. You're still using the shotgun approach to reel in as many PC users to run it that are on 1060 etc. Even if the requirements were higher than an XSX, you still don't get the benefit of locked down specs.

I mean, even at a best-case here, a developer can't just solely focus on XSX specific specs, GPU, SSD, and CPU. Those are custom. Same with PS5, the difference is, sony allows it out of the gate.

 

[TBiddy]

I mean, even at a best-case here, a developer can't just solely focusing on XSX specific specs, GPU, SSD, and CPU. Those are custom. Same with PS5, the difference is, but sony allows it out of the gate.

You're still wrong, though.

Any developer who wishes to release exclusively on the XSX can develop just for that console. Just like on the PS5. The only developers who are mandated to create cross-gen versions are 1st party. And we will see, probably, 3 or 4 games arrive on both platforms. Halo being one of them and most likely Forza 8 another one.

 

[welsay01]

So don't bother with high end graphics, physics. Ai. Frame rate, ect you know a real next gen game. Unless you want wild unpredictable performance because of Variable clocks all over the place. Give me fixed clocks any day of the week.

If you constantly need 2.23GHz on the GPU and you constantly need max CPU, it will down clock it by a 'couple' of percent and it can stay there indefinitely if the chip determines that the workload it's being fed demands it. That would still be 3GHz+ of Zen2 - it's not all of a sudden becoming a Jaguar. And it's not going to change unexpectedly. It changes based on what is needed up to the cap limits.

I'm not saying this is superior to locked clocks or that it will close the gap between it and the XSX, Just saying people are misinterpreting how it works and spreading FUD.

 

[Romulus]

You're still wrong, though.

Any developer who wishes to release exclusively on the XSX can develop just for that console. Just like on the PS5. The only developers who are mandated to create cross-gen versions are 1st party. And we will see, probably, 3 or 4 games arrive on both platforms. Halo being one of them and most likely Forza 8 another one.

Are you saying any dev can release an exclusive XSX game without it being on PC? That's very cool if true.

 

[hyperbertha]

You're still wrong, though.

Any developer who wishes to release exclusively on the XSX can develop just for that console. Just like on the PS5. The only developers who are mandated to create cross-gen versions are 1st party. And we will see, probably, 3 or 4 games arrive on both platforms. Halo being one of them and most likely Forza 8 another one.

But how many developers wish to create games exclusively for Xsex? Do you have confirmation that next gen xbox games won't also come out on PC? Because if they do that number is zero. Not to mention they lose a whole year. Stupidest decision by microsoft imo.

 

[TBiddy]

Are you saying any dev can release an exclusive XSX game without it being on PC? That's very cool if true.

Of course. There's no mandate to release on PC as well.

But how many developers wish to create games exclusively for Xsex? Do you have confirmation that next gen xbox games won't also come out on PC? Because if they do that number is zero. Not to mention they lose a whole year. Stupidest decision by microsoft imo.

I fail to see the relevance of the first question, outside of starting a list war. The second question, you need to expand. Are you talking first or third party?

With regards to the last point. I see where you're going, and while I agree to a certain point, we very rarely see consoles pushed to their limits in the first year anyways.

 

[iHaunter]

Yeah no console with great games ever failed right?

Such as?

 

[hyperbertha]

Of course. There's no mandate to release on PC as well.



I fail to see the relevance of the first question, outside of starting a list war. The second question, you need to expand. Are you talking first or third party?

With regards to the last point. I see where you're going, and while I agree to a certain point, we very rarely see consoles pushed to their limits in the first year anyways.

It is a relevant question. If MS wants its games to also go to PC the number is zero, and lets not kid ourselves, there is an extremely high chance of that happening. And as for third parties, isn't that by default zero? I can't recall any AAA third party developing exclusively for MS last gen.

 

[ThatGuy707]

It will be whatever the game demands of it up to 10.28. Not every game is going to demand the full power of the system. If a game needs 10.28 TFLOPS all the time then it will get it all the time, but it won't get the full 3.5GHz CPU with it. Most games won't demand the full amount all of the time. Thus he expects it to be that high only a "majority of the time".

Your explanation doesn't even make sense. If most games never need to be that high then it would almost never be that high going by your logic. Thus it would not hit those clocks the majority of the time. So your explanation sounds wrong. If I only need 9.5 TFlops most of the time and according to you the GPU delivers me 9.5TFlops it is not running 10.28 the majority of the time. It is running at 9.5 TFlops.

It feels like he was intentionally vague. He could have said if you are at 10.28 TFlops GPU you are at ____ for the CPU. If you need max CPU you are at ___ GPU power. I suspect he doesn't want people to know those details though or at least Sony doesn't.

I think most games will be pretty demanding on the GPU/CPU especially when there is a console that has higher specs. Devs will be trying to max out the PS5 and then scaling to the XSX.

 

[Romulus]

Of course. There's no mandate to release on PC as well.

I'd like that. I just don't see it happening to ignore the windows platform. Has that even happened since windows was brought into the fold?

 

[CJY]

Like they believe to their lovely Phil Spencer. But unlike Phil, Cerny is a system architect and designer.

He's also a developer and:

 

[TBiddy]

It is a relevant question. If MS wants its games to also go to PC the number is zero, and lets not kid ourselves, there is an extremely high chance of that happening. And as for third parties, isn't that by default zero? I can't recall any AAA third party developing exclusively for MS last gen.

I still have no idea what it is you're asking me. Can you rephrase perhaps?

I'd like that. I just don't see it happening to ignore the windows platform. Has that even happened since windows was brought into the fold?

No idea, to be honest.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

He's also a developer and:

Yep, long time ago ( 36 years ) he developed Marble Madness.

 

[hyperbertha]

I still have no idea what it is you're asking me. Can you rephrase perhaps?



No idea, to be honest.

I'm saying there is a very high chance MS will also release its first party games onto PC, which means their games will need to be tied to weak PCs. Do you have any reason to think otherwise? Because you seem pretty confident their games are actually exclusives to Xbox SeX. You also mentioned third party but I don't see how they are relevant. Third parties aren't going to develop exclusively for Series X anyway are they? I can't recall that happening last gen.

 

[TBiddy]

I'm saying there is a very high chance MS will also release its first party games onto PC, which means their games will need to be tied to weak PCs. Do you have any reason to think otherwise? Because you seem pretty confident their games are actually exclusives to Xbox SeX.

I've never said that.

 

[DIEHARD.]

So whats the different name other than Variable Rate Shading?

Sony doesn't use VRS until they state they do.

 

[welsay01]

Your explanation doesn't even make sense. If most games never need to be that high then it would almost never be that high going by your logic. Thus it would not hit those clocks the majority of the time. So your explanation sounds wrong. If I only need 9.5 TFlops most of the time and according to you the GPU delivers me 9.5TFlops it is not running 10.28 the majority of the time. It is running at 9.5 TFlops.

So what if it's not running 10.28 when the game only calls for 9.5? That does not mean it's incapable of running 10.28 full time if it needs to. That's the point.

If XSX is running a game that only uses 9.5, it will only use 9.5. The GPU is still running max clock and max power so it's essentially wasting that power maintaining that clock when only a fraction of the CUs are being used at that moment. Whereas the PS5 will reduce power since it's not being used. Again, I'm not saying locked clocks are inferior - I'm just saying that just because it's locked it doesn't mean it's always using the max 12.1.

And before you ask again, why Sony went with variable, I am sure it was to squeeze the most performance out of a cheaper APU so they could save money on that component and spend more in other areas.

It feels like he was intentionally vague. He could have said if you are at 10.28 TFlops GPU you are at ____ for the CPU. If you need max CPU you are at ___ GPU power. I suspect he doesn't want people to know those details though or at least Sony doesn't.

I agree with this somewhat. Saying a 'couple' of percent leaves it open for people to speculate. However, I am not smart and I was able to understand what he was saying. I think some of the people who don't understand it though should asking questions for clarity and not spreading misinformation.

 

[Romulus]

No idea, to be honest.

That's a huge deal honestly. It would absolutely blow my mind to see an XSX exclusive not on PC now that I think about their current situation and strategy. They seem to talk a lot about making sure games are on the windows "family" and to revert back just to make some anomaly XSX game seems strange. But we have to say it's not impossible just because there's no mandate that we know of.

Either way, we'll definitely see Sony games taking full advantage of its custom specs, and that's exciting.

 

[hyperbertha]

I've never said that.

So as it stands, Xbox really cannot have any games that can make full use of its hardware, unlike the PS5, which is what the other guy was stating.

 

[TBiddy]

So as it stands, Xbox really cannot have any games that can make full use of its hardware, unlike the PS5, which is what the other guy was stating.

I think the best idea here is to wait and see what releases this fall and next year. I sincerely doubt that neither you nor I have anywhere near enough knowledge to draw any conclusions regarding your quote.

 

[Romulus]

I think the best idea here is to wait and see what releases this fall and next year. I sincerely doubt that neither you nor I have anywhere near enough knowledge to draw any conclusions regarding your quote.

It would just be a breakneck thing to go from exclusive Xbox games, to the shared PC "family", back to exclusive Xbox game when PC gamers are already primed and willing customers. It sends an awful message to the millions of PC gamers out there to just pull the rug out from under them suddenly.

 

[TBiddy]

It would just be a breakneck thing to go from exclusive Xbox games, to the shared PC "family", back to exclusive Xbox game when PC gamers are already primed and willing customers. It sends an awful message to the millions of PC gamers out there to just pull the rug out from under them suddenly.

To be frank, it's not like Microsoft is releasing dozens of games that PC gamers are desperate for.

 

[Elenchus]

The truth is that TF numbers for both systems are "peak" values of what the systems can provide when the game requires that much processing power. The difference between the two systems however is that there is no "worst case" scenario for XSX where the clock could drop under maximum load/stress to flux the GPU under the given 12.147 TF number.

OTOH, there may be worst-case scenarios where the PS5's GPU might drop by 2% of the clock, or to 10.07 TF, depending on just how stressful the game is in terms of being technically demanding and whether some other part of the hardware (like the CPU) is at maximum load simultaneously.

That's basically what the difference between "locked clocks" and "variable clocks" actually is, but should be easy enough to picture how it can play out in practice. So the debate shouldn't be if PS5 will see a clock drop greater than 2%; I doubt it will ever drop below that figure. The question is if the GPU's performance will scale linearly with clocking well above its sweetspot range (which we can assume, going from XSX's clock, is probably between 1825 and 1875 MHz in the upper scale range for the improved 7nm process node, 1900MHz at absolute peak).

Evidence from RDNA1 cards shows that in fact performance does NOT linearly scale, so real-world differential in performance between PS5 and XSX on GPU tasks could be a lot more than the 15% - 17% paper spec figure. I'd personally venture it could be up to 25% in favor of XSX, that's with being very optimistic on efficiency gains of RDNA2 on an improved 7nm process btw. But I doubt it will be to the 30% figure we saw with actual RDNA1 overclocked cards on PC.

Gaming Bolt is saying it does not expect Sony’s over clocking to scale linearly, that XSX’s 15% GPU advantage on paper may actually be 25-30% in real world performance, and that it expects PS5 to run in 1800p often.

It’s at 9:15-11:25 in the video below. Just one view but interesting analysis.

This is the problem with Sony’s approach of tell but don’t show. Not everyone is going to buy Cerny’s powerpoint slides.

 

[sonomamashine]

Like they believe to their lovely Phil Spencer. But unlike Phil, Cerny is a system architect and designer.

Send ear nudes to Cerny.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Elenchus Yeah, I saw that vid earlier in the morning. They bring up a very good and real point. I think PS5 will fare somewhat better in that regard due to the enhanced 7nm node, but neither of these consoles are using EUV which would've brought even more efficiency gains.

Real-world difference between the two in GPU capabilities will probably fall around 20% - 25% IMHO, that's assuming enhanced 7nm brings at least a 10% IPC gain over RDNA1. Just going off MS's clock for XSX's GPU; something tells me they pushed about as north of the new sweetspot as possible, which is probably about 1875 MHz (maybe 1900 MHz if being very generous).

 

[ThatGuy707]

So what if it's not running 10.28 when the game only calls for 9.5? That does not mean it's incapable of running 10.28 full time if it needs to. That's the point.

If XSX is running a game that only uses 9.5, it will only use 9.5. The GPU is still running max clock and max power so it's essentially wasting that power maintaining that clock when only a fraction of the CUs are being used at that moment. Whereas the PS5 will reduce power since it's not being used. Again, I'm not saying locked clocks are inferior - I'm just saying that just because it's locked it doesn't mean it's always using the max 12.1.

And before you ask again, why Sony went with variable, I am sure it was to squeeze the most performance out of a cheaper APU so they could save money on that component and spend more in other areas.



I agree with this somewhat. Saying a 'couple' of percent leaves it open for people to speculate. However, I am not smart and I was able to understand what he was saying. I think some of the people who don't understand it though should asking questions for clarity and not spreading misinformation.

Why would XSX run something slower at 9.5 vs at 12.1, and get it done faster, makes no sense especially when the console is built around sustaining the 12.1. Sounds like you are talking utilization not speed.

It can't run full time 10.28 though if the CPU demand is heavy. So it gives power based on utilization, it seems like you are saying.

Also, you can lock speeds. I locked speeds on my CPU because I used to have a CPU that would only throttle up when needed to save heat/power. It was garbage and made things laggier because I was on a desktop(So I didn't care about power/heat) and I wanted it to be fast all time so there was no ramp up. I got sick of the stutter when it would ramp up to high performance. So I can be at 0% utilization but still be at those speeds.

Gaming Bolt is saying it does not expect Sony’s over clocking to scale linearly, that XSX’s 15% GPU advantage on paper may actually be 25-30% in real world performance, and that it expects PS5 to run in 1800p often.

It’s at 9:15-11:25 in the video below. Just one view but interesting analysis.

This is the problem with Sony’s approach of tell but don’t show. Not everyone is going to buy Cerny’s powerpoint slides.

Yeah, Sony could have released detailed information like MS about how the clocks will scale up or down to clear this up. I think though it probably isn't as favorably as they are portraying it. Otherwise, why not be more specific? They were very specific on the issues they felt favored them.

 

[Elenchus]

I'm not saying it won't be enhanced further than what we're seeing, it just won't be anything earth-shattering because the scope of the project has to work within the constraints of Xbox One S etc.

And what if MS just makes two versions of the game? That’s an expensive venture but with an estimated spend of 500 million its not out of the question.

Matt Booty specifically said Halo would be pushed on XSX:

Microsoft will still be taking full advantage of the power of the Series X with some of its IPs at launch. Halo Infinite — which is launching across both generations of Xbox — will be making the most of the latest hardware, "Our approach is to pick one or two IP that we’re going to focus on and make sure that they’re there at the launch of the console, taking advantage of all the features. And for us, that’s going to be Halo Infinite, which is a big opportunity. It’s the first time in over 15 years that we’ll have a Halo title launching in sync with a new console. And that team is definitely going to be doing things to take advantage of [Series X].”

Xbox Achievements and News from TrueAchievements - the world's biggest Xbox site

TrueAchievements is the home of Xbox achievements for Xbox Series X, Xbox One and all other Xbox platforms. News, guides, leaderboards, reviews and more.

www.google.com

 

[Romulus]

To be frank, it's not like Microsoft is releasing dozens of games that PC gamers are desperate for.

Halo was very popular on Steam, and I would imagine Forza is also. Not to mention, going forward more IPs are supposedly coming and to suddenly pick and choose, "oh PC guys you can't have that game, but this one is okay" just doesn't make any sense. Not to mention the whole "PC windows/xbox" family they keep talking up is suddenly disbanded in specific cases.

 

[Romulus]

And what if MS just makes two versions of the game? That’s an expensive venture but with an estimated spend of 500 million its not out of the question.

Matt Booty specifically said Halo would be pushed on XSX:

Microsoft will still be taking full advantage of the power of the Series X with some of its IPs at launch. Halo Infinite — which is launching across both generations of Xbox — will be making the most of the latest hardware, "Our approach is to pick one or two IP that we’re going to focus on and make sure that they’re there at the launch of the console, taking advantage of all the features. And for us, that’s going to be Halo Infinite, which is a big opportunity. It’s the first time in over 15 years that we’ll have a Halo title launching in sync with a new console. And that team is definitely going to be doing things to take advantage of [Series X].”

Xbox Achievements and News from TrueAchievements - the world's biggest Xbox site

TrueAchievements is the home of Xbox achievements for Xbox Series X, Xbox One and all other Xbox platforms. News, guides, leaderboards, reviews and more.

www.google.com

I've seen that before and highly doubt it, even then its on PC and will have a "minimum system specs" userbase that they can't leave out. Even making it relatively high like a 1060ti is nowhere near the XSX.

 

[SonGoku]

Gaming Bolt is saying it does not expect Sony’s over clocking to scale linearly, that XSX’s 15% GPU advantage on paper may actually be 25-30% in real world performance, and that it expects PS5 to run in 1800p often.

It’s at 9:15-11:25 in the video below. Just one view but interesting analysis.

This is the problem with Sony’s approach of tell but don’t show. Not everyone is going to buy Cerny’s powerpoint slides.

They are wrong basing their analysis on a RDNA1 card and PC OCs are a different beast, performance also doesn't increase linearly with CUs as its harder to reach perfect parallel utilization
A frequency boost also improves performance of other GPU components

 

[Marlenus]

I just don't know what to say to people who believe temperature is irrelevant at 2.23GHz!

Do you know how many PC GPUs can sustain 2.23GHz?

ZERO

Maybe the PS5 is water cooled.

 

[Elenchus]

I've seen that before and highly doubt it, even then its on PC and will have a "minimum system specs" userbase that they can't leave out. Even making it relatively high like a 1060ti is nowhere near the XSX.

Well you have to remember Halo’s development began 5 yrs ago. Doubtful 343 would have known XSX’s final specs since XSX’s development began 4 yrs ago.

Launch games never max out a new console for this obvious reason so all this chatter seems like mountain out of a molehill stuff.

I’d wager PS5’s games would run just fine on PS4 but that Sony simply won’t permit it for marketing purposes and that even then there will be cross gen 1st and 3rd party PS5 games.

This is mostly a perception issue.

 

[welsay01]

Why would XSX run something slower at 9.5 vs at 12.1, and get it done faster, makes no sense especially when the console is built around sustaining the 12.1. Sounds like you are talking utilization not speed.

Yes! I think we're getting somewhere... kinda. Not all things are going to use all CUs all the time. Just because you throw a process at it, it doesn't mean it's going to spread across all CUs. Lets say you run pong on XSX. You think it's going to spread the workload over 52CU when it can be done on a fraction of a single one?

So if the PS5 is only utilizing 9.2 on a specific game, does that mean it's not capable of 10.28 on another game?

If XSX is only utilizing 9.2 on a specific game, does that mean it's not capable of 12.1 on another game?

It can't run full time 10.28 though if the CPU demand is heavy. So it gives power based on utilization, it seems like you are saying.

TFLOPS are a measurement of the peak capability of the GPU's ALU. It has nothing to do with the CPU. Yes in worst case scenario on PS5, if the CPU demand is as high as the GPU then it will downclock, but that does not change what the peak capability of the GPU is in its best case scenario.

 

[ThatGuy707]

Yes! I think we're getting somewhere... kinda. Not all things are going to use all CUs all the time. Just because you throw a process at it, it doesn't mean it's going to spread across all CUs. Lets say you run pong on XSX. You think it's going to spread the workload over 52CU when it can be done on a fraction of a single one?

So if the PS5 is only utilizing 9.2 on a specific game, does that mean it's not capable of 10.28 on another game?

If XSX is only utilizing 9.2 on a specific game, does that mean it's not capable of 12.1 on another game?




TFLOPS are a measurement of the peak capability of the GPU's ALU. It has nothing to do with the CPU. Yes in worst case scenario on PS5, if the CPU demand is as high as the GPU then it will downclock, but that does not change what the peak capability of the GPU is in its best case scenario.

Yep, I get the utilization but I didn't watch the whole Cerny presentation it was too boring for me. Anyways though someone said PS5 will mostly run at 10.28 TFlops that is where this confusion started. I already know that is its peak performance. My point is that if it is based on utilization as you say then you cannot say definitely that it will mostly run at 10.28. So that assumption that it will run at 10.28 TFlops most of the time is wrong.

 

[DIEHARD.]

A bunch of tech guys analyzing next gen gaming tech, like we are.