I hate how the game insinuates player agency (mainly
the ability to abandon the mission and leave Dubai) and then chastises you at the end for making horrific decisions.
You barbequed 50 civilians, that's a bad soldier! How about you actually give me the option just to leave or some other peace oriented option.
Just finished it on hard (PC). Was not expecting at all for this to crack my running top 3 of 2012 list after the first hour or so - it's the definition of slow burn, narratively and design wise. Mechanically, [if you're willing to get used to some very minor quirks] it easily stands alongside Gears. The way the game part of this game has been brushed aside by critics, in true bandwagon form, is laughable.
Will most likely never even visit the multiplayer menu, sadly, but for the campaign alone: highly, highly recommended.
I agree with this, Spec ops is nicely underrated i want a sequel.
The campaign is so greatly designed and love the way the narrative plays out, Nolan North does another great performance and funny enough thats his natural voice lol. The controls is what is the biggest hurdle as it tends to be a little unresponsive, but once you grasp the mechanics and the controls the combat really starts to shine.
Granted, I'm only four chapters into the game, but I am already beginning to run into issues with the narrative and Yager's portrayal of the city. Here are a couple of problems I have had thus far:
- The signage in Dubai is in Arabic, yet all of the natives speak Farsi. To put that into perspective, it would be like placing the game in France, but having all of the residents speak Italian.
- A CIA field agent is identified based on his "tags". Given that field agents never carry any formal identification when they are outside of the United States, this kind of scenario would be improbable.
- For unexplained reasons, not a single member of the Arab League has, or ever had, any presence in Dubai. The only two countries ever mentioned are the UAE and the United States.
Did anyone at Yager bother to do any genuine research on Dubai before developing the game? From what I have seen, the premise is about as poorly thought out as Homefront. It lacks any kind of nuance or attention to detail.
I actually just feel bad for you right now.
Instead of enjoying the concepts being portrayed you are seemingly going though the game finding faults.
If i got all crazy everytime there was an inaccuracy or some form of creative license taken in media id probably hate everything.
There is no planet krypton
Bullets dont spark when they hit cars
Defibrillating someone who is flat-lining: Nigh pointless
Shooting a drum of oil will lead to a very slippery floor.
You dont fly 10 feet back when shot
WaterWorld???...Fuck off.
Chill out man the game isnt trying to be absolutely accurate, very few forms of action entertainment are.
If thats bothering you so i imagine you should quite playing action games and just setting with the odd simulator.
On Topic
I for one am really enjoying this game.....but one thing is absolutely killing me, well two things actually.
1. Anti-Aliasing....where did it go, the jaggies are destroying everything, does anyone have working bits for this with nvidia?....I tried stock UE3 and Mass Effect 3 but both yield less than stellar results.
2. Random slowdowns, the game is ~60 99.2% of the time, but every now and then not even during actions scene(usually when characters are talking and doing the slow walk thing) i get slowdowns that reach 35 frames....anyone else have these issues or is it likely my PC doing something in the background??
Anyway, coming off the broken Ghost Recon to this im pleasantly surprised a B tier game thats pretty damn well made, im really enjoying this.
I would have liked it to be more tactical 3rd person than full on gears just because i think it would suit the games narrative more, but this is still fine.
^^^ I think when a game attempts to convey a realistic military conflict, with realistic military themes, it warrants criticism if notable military errors are made. I wouldn't have picked up on the language thing, but if somebody is familiar with the language and region then I think it's fair to criticise. It would be like playing a game set in Japan where everyone speaks Mandarin.
The opposite of this, actually. Its combat scenario design puts a finer point on just how rote, unbalanced and unfun most of Uncharted 3 was to trudge through.
I'm not big on Uncharted (especially Uncharted 3), but Spec Ops for me was just as average in combat, usually less so. I disliked the loose feel of the weapons, and mechanically the game is about as bare bones as a third person shooter can be. Even Binary Domain, a game I also thought was quite flawed, kept itself interesting with the strategic dismemberment.
Spec Ops just doesn't have enough going on for me to consider it a great playing game. Encounters almost always boil down to "here comes another wave!", which was one of my major criticisms of Uncharted too. I didn't enjoy shooting most weapons (the game gets shotguns right, I'll give it that), and the enemy variety suffers due to the 'realistic' setting. Troops, guy with rockets/grenades, fast guy, heavy dude, ~fin.
For once this is definitely one of those games where I don't align with the 'hidden gem' attitudes surrounding the release.
It's like, I can feel myself being clumsily manipulated by the game designers, and on some level it detracts from the impact; but on another, the direction of the cutscenes and the imagery... it's kind of just powerful on its raw lonesome.
I actually just feel bad for you right now.
Instead of enjoying the concepts being portrayed you are seemingly going though the game finding faults.
If i got all crazy everytime there was an inaccuracy or some form of creative license taken in media id probably hate everything.
There is no planet krypton
Bullets dont spark when they hit cars
Defibrillating someone who is flat-lining: Nigh pointless
Shooting a drum of oil will lead to a very slippery floor.
You dont fly 10 feet back when shot
WaterWorld???...Fuck off.
Chill out man the game isnt trying to be absolutely accurate, very few forms of action entertainment are.
If thats bothering you so i imagine you should quite playing action games and just setting with the odd simulator.
If a game touches upon geopolitical issues, I expect it to have some basis in reality. To that extent, if Yager elects to ignore the presence of the Saudi Arabia, much less the entire Arab League, and, at the same time play up the relations between the U.S. and other Arab countries as a motivating factor for the CIA's presence, then they have done a poor job of establishing a solid and internally consistent narrative. Right off the bat, the game presents nonsensical, absurd scenarios that are better served in a popcorn action flick than a military drama. Apocalypse Now, by comparison, begins in a relatively grounded environment that is easily understood by the viewer and then begins a slow transition into absurdity. Only as the characters travel further into the jungles of Vietnam, do they begin to lose their sense of a morality and enter into a realm complete insanity. Everything in Spec Ops, on the other hand, is over-the-top, absurd, and goofy from the very beginning. It is about as bombastic as any other shooter and doesn't have any particular interest in meditating on its own themes. It spends a brief two or three minutes between action sequences displaying piles of dead or burning corpses, and then immediately transitions into another firefight. I find myself scrutinizing their depiction of Dubai because it is largely symptomatic of how poorly thought out the game's underlying premise is. They chose Dubai not for any interesting thematic purposes, but because the city looks exotic and can easily be made into a no-man's land.
Also, I can't help but feel frustrated when the game makes the player out to be a remorseless, twisted killer. I am constantly railroaded into situations where I simply can't do anything but kill soldiers or civilians. I am frequently told about the horrors of war, yet I am almost never given an alternative approach to the different scenarios. For the entirety of the game, I am told, "HEY BRO, KILL ALL OF THESE PEOPLE OR DIE". Towards the latter half of the game, the game does a 180 and chastises me for completing the mission objectives. Honestly, what does the game expect me to do? Stop playing? The player shouldn't be talked down to when she literally cannot make any meaningful decisions in the game.*
On the subject of gameplay, I don't really know what to say about it that hasn't already been discussed; the mechanics are more or less the same as any other game of its ilk.** To be perfectly clear, I don't hate the game. I found the dialog written for Lugo and the DJ, for example, to be humorous at times and the voice acting is pretty good across the board. I just think that Spec Ops is no better or worse than any other run-of-the-mill shooter that I have played in the past year. The praise this game has gotten for its narrative both from people on this forum and the gaming press is, in my opinion, unearned.
tl;dr Yager was far more interested in shaping the world around their own narrative than authoring a story that fits the setting of the game. On top of that, the gameplay is average.
*
Aside from the encounter with Konrad, as far as I know.
** This is true at least on the Combat Op difficulty level. I can't speak to either Suicide or FUBAR.
In terms of morality and the message Yager was trying to send,
I'm impressed they managed to get a game with these themes into production, and I respect them for trying to deal with themes that are largely absent in war games. But the game, like so many other morally driven games, suffers from a narrative that tells the player how to feel, and punishes them for it, without giving them any alternatives.
They had a good idea there, but failed to capitalise on the advantages of interactive story telling.
Finally, a game that properly recognises designated sociopathy. Classic themes, classic twists, well-executed for the most part.
BUT I agree with Eat's assertions. In that sense this has more in common with a movie
, although it manages to do something interesting with the 'forced interactivity' an expectations behind and around a game, I think.
I have to say also that I agree with Azer's criticisms, but they also don't really matter unless you're terribly hung up on Dubai and being grounded in 100% realism; the setting could really have been anywhere, but we got way more interesting setpieces out of sandstorm'd Dubai.
For people getting hung over it not being realistic, they have said in every interview that it's not trying to be a realistic game. More of a psychological thriller, and the craziness of Dubai adds to the story.
So far kind of on the fence about the game. Feels like Uncharted in a war zone a lot, with Drake's voice, the same combat and enemy types. Only not as incredibly good looking as Naughty Dog's games and without the traversal to break it up. Packs a bit more of an emotional punch too obviously.
Just passed through The Gate, so I guess I'm into the best part of the game?
For people getting hung over it not being realistic, they have said in every interview that it's not trying to be a realistic game. More of a psychological thriller, and the craziness of Dubai adds to the story.
My concern isn't necessarily about realism.* It is about the narrative and gameplay lacking internal consistency, to the point that major sections of the game simply do not make any sense and many of the emotional turning points are woefully contrived.
* If that was the case, I would have brought up the massive sandstorms or
Story kept me going and some setpieces were pretty atmospheric. The name and boxart has a lot of people against it, but boy can this be a definite sleeper hit of the year.
It's like, I can feel myself being clumsily manipulated by the game designers, and on some level it detracts from the impact; but on another, the direction of the cutscenes and the imagery... it's kind of just powerful on its raw lonesome.
kill the snipers before they offed the "2 men hanging from the overpass sign"... I couldn't. But when I tried, the game recognized my "third option". lol.
'
I kinda wish the game gave you more "third options" like above though. Nice regardless.
I started playing the game but I have a major issue with the sound. There's no sound with any of the pre-rendered cutscenes. I got to the main menu the first time without any sound at all. I alt-tabbed and came back and the sound was fine. Played through the intro chopper scene without issues but then no sound in the intro cutscene.
I looked around a bit and the only solution people are giving is the disable the other sound card (other than the one you are using of course). The problem is that my only sound card is the one I use (the hdmi port of my videocard).
I started playing the game but I have a major issue with the sound. There's no sound with any of the pre-rendered cutscenes. I got to the main menu the first time without any sound at all. I alt-tabbed and came back and the sound was fine. Played through the intro chopper scene without issues but then no sound in the intro cutscene.
I looked around a bit and the only solution people are giving is the disable the other sound card (other than the one you are using of course). The problem is that my only sound card is the one I use (the hdmi port of my videocard).
Started playing this today and was instantly surprised. I was expecting some "realistic" Ghost Recon style soulless boredom, but instead I had actual fun! Definitely isn't the typical generic realistic shooter thing that you'd expect from the title, much more arcade-action and story-driven shenanigans instead.
die the game doesnt actually reload, it just goes back to the moment before that happen and walker is shaking his head in disbelief, then if you keep walking a normal armored enemy attacks you instead.
If you're sitting on the fence, I'm happy to tell you that it was WELL WORTH the money. Campaign was about 6-7 hours or so (I played it at different intervals, so it's hard to nail down.), and I was VERY surprised at how good the story was.
If you like gritty, dark, crazy type stories with underlying moral dilemma, grotesque scenes of mass murder based in a dilapidated city where there is no law, and humanity is reduced to the basic instinct of survival versus murder, then you should really buy this.
This game will likely not make GOTY lists, but should certainly surprise some people as a sleeper hit. Perhaps it's because I came in with low expectations, and was open to surprise?
Sure the game makes some mistakes along the way, and doesn't reinvent the wheel in terms of gameplay. But you'll find that almost every category comes in at par. My only complaint with the gameplay was the shoddy cover system. It was too sticky and not cooperative in dangerous situations.
Visually, the game did it's job very well. As an American, have a deep interest in Dubai, and I always love when games and movies visit there, such as Ace Combat Assault Horizon, Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol, etc. Dubai is a wonderous place, and is the PERFECT setting for a story based on madness such as this.
My concern isn't necessarily about realism.* It is about the narrative and gameplay lacking internal consistency, to the point that major sections of the game simply do not make any sense and many of the emotional turning points are woefully contrived.
* If that was the case, I would have brought up the massive sandstorms or
It's not really internally inconsistent. Your problems mainly stem from your already-existent external knowledge of Dubai, alongside pacing problems or suspension of disbelief.
Am I the ONLY one here that was disappointed in the story? Felt like mediocre gameplay wrapped around a decent narrative / story but nothing spectacular.
Wish I would have waited and gotten it cheaper, wasn't worth full price to me. Bought it because I love good stories.. I mean i read a review where the story was compared to that of Bioshock.... I mean... Really?
Also, multiple times when I was presented with choices, I just kept going and some parts i couldn't even tell I made a choice, then I found out later that I did..
Am I the ONLY one here that was disappointed in the story? Felt like mediocre gameplay wrapped around a decent narrative / story but nothing spectacular.
Wish I would have waited and gotten it cheaper, wasn't worth full price to me. Bought it because I love good stories.. I mean i read a review where the story was compared to that of Bioshock.... I mean... Really?
Also, multiple times when I was presented with choices, I just kept going and some parts i couldn't even tell I made a choice, then I found out later that I did..
Looking back at Jeff Gerstmann's review at Giantbomb, he stated that the story wasn't that amazing, but the way it was told was what really stands out... also that the gameplay is very generic which i would say to be true as well.
Maybe I'll just consider myself siding with Jeff on this one.
die the game doesnt actually reload, it just goes back to the moment before that happen and walker is shaking his head in disbelief, then if you keep walking a normal armored enemy attacks you instead.
It's not really internally inconsistent. Your problems mainly stem from your already-existent external knowledge of Dubai, alongside pacing problems or suspension of disbelief.
So far I agree with him. A lot of it is contrived and doesn't make much sense. It's a good first attempt and refreshing for a video game but there are still a lot of weaknesses in the story and exposition.
Wish I would have waited and gotten it cheaper, wasn't worth full price to me. Bought it because I love good stories.. I mean i read a review where the story was compared to that of Bioshock.... I mean... Really?
OH WOW THAT ENDING of SPEC OPS, don't know why I didn't figure it out sooner. And the other endings. Jeez louise. Now want to do another playthrough to change my decisions.
Amazing experience, for me, best story in a game this year.
Nolan North, what a turn of a performance. Never knew he had that in him.
OH WOW THAT ENDING of SPEC OPS, don't know why I didn't figure it out sooner. And the other endings. Jeez louise. Now want to do another playthrough to change my decisions.
Amazing experience, for me, best story in a game this year.
Nolan North, what a turn of a performance. Never knew he had that in him.
A cohesive, consistent and well paced narrative that ideally integrates player agency and interactivity into the means of storytelling in order to distance itself from cinema and literature.
GTA4 is a shitty story because Rockster/Houser can only write one type of character, and the attempt to make Niko a defined, scripted avatar is at odds with the way players are able to interact with the experience.
I have similar issues with Spec Ops' story, though to far less extremes.
If you're sitting on the fence, I'm happy to tell you that it was WELL WORTH the money. Campaign was about 6-7 hours or so (I played it at different intervals, so it's hard to nail down.), and I was VERY surprised at how good the story was.
If you like gritty, dark, crazy type stories with underlying moral dilemma, grotesque scenes of mass murder based in a dilapidated city where there is no law, and humanity is reduced to the basic instinct of survival versus murder, then you should really buy this.
This game will likely not make GOTY lists, but should certainly surprise some people as a sleeper hit. Perhaps it's because I came in with low expectations, and was open to surprise?
Sure the game makes some mistakes along the way, and doesn't reinvent the wheel in terms of gameplay. But you'll find that almost every category comes in at par. My only complaint with the gameplay was the shoddy cover system. It was too sticky and not cooperative in dangerous situations.
Visually, the game did it's job very well. As an American, have a deep interest in Dubai, and I always love when games and movies visit there, such as Ace Combat Assault Horizon, Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol, etc. Dubai is a wonderous place, and is the PERFECT setting for a story based on madness such as this.
I cant help but feel the name Spec Ops has turned some people away, its a little generic for people to take seriously, Got to the Gate last night....OMG
Bioshock used a lot of environmental storytelling backed by audio logs, tried to introduce a moral dimension, deconstructed a facet of gaming, and the actual shooting bits weren't the best. I still think that had Bioshock not come out this game would've taken its place in terms of the conversations that generated.
I can see why you'd say that, their similarities are close. I personally think Bioshock's most interesting narrative parts (save for the deconstruction of choicelessness in gaming) are entirely in its backstory. This might be a meaningless distinction, but I don't really count it as part of its narrative, which I think of more as the events which the player experiences, as opposed to the elements which they reconstruct.
I don't think much of Bioshock's moral dimension really.
Well, I just finished it. It's 2:31am local time. The fact that the game kept me up this late is amazing to me. This was the second of two sittings in which I completed the game. Few games can keep my attention, but this one did.
I played the game on Easy based on all the poor reviews of the gameplay in particular and my general ineptitude with shooters. I have no regrets. My ability to mostly play like Rambo really paid off as the game progressed.
I was at time genuinely affected by the game. That was surprising. Having finished the game, the story telling was not what I expected it to be, but I still very much enjoyed it. I only paid $25 for the PC version, but I think if I had paid 50 or 60, I would probably still be satisfied. Then again, I'm in the tank for any game that gets story telling (mostly) right, especially if the production values are given the proper attention.
So far, this is the most interesting game I've played this year.
To address some of the criticism: I am glad that I came into the game with very low expectations. I expected a mostly bad game with some kind of interesting take on the story. If the story has been spoiled, or you've bought into the hype, it will be very easy to come away disappointed, but I think that's true of almost any game. The gameplay was better than I expected, and by that I mean I never got frustrated with the combat, which for me is rare.
Question about a combat sequence/possible choice:
Can you choose not to use the white phosphorus and still move the game forward, or is that scenario an infinite kill room? I tried a few times without it, and it seemed like some enemies could not be hit and others would just infinitely respawn.
Yeah this game deserves multiple play throughs, but not for the endings, but to notice the story-beat subtleties the game has, albeit subtlety that is in between bouts of shooting 100+ dudes.
Also to your point, I was like "ooh so this is why they hired the guy from Condemned cause no one else could think of that right? =/ Does that guy only have one phobia or something?
Well, I just finished it. It's 2:31am local time. The fact that the game kept me up this late is amazing to me. This was the second of two sittings in which I completed the game. Few games can keep my attention, but this one did.
I played the game on Easy based on all the poor reviews of the gameplay in particular and my general ineptitude with shooters. I have no regrets. My ability to mostly play like Rambo really paid off as the game progressed.
I was at time genuinely affected by the game. That was surprising. Having finished the game, the story telling was not what I expected it to be, but I still very much enjoyed it. I only paid $25 for the PC version, but I think if I had paid 50 or 60, I would probably still be satisfied. Then again, I'm in the tank for any game that gets story telling (mostly) right, especially if the production values are given the proper attention.
So far, this is the most interesting game I've played this year.
To address some of the criticism: I am glad that I came into the game with very low expectations. I expected a mostly bad game with some kind of interesting take on the story. If the story has been spoiled, or you've bought into the hype, it will be very easy to come away disappointed, but I think that's true of almost any game. The gameplay was better than I expected, and by that I mean I never got frustrated with the combat, which for me is rare.
Question about a combat sequence/possible choice:
Can you choose not to use the white phosphorus and still move the game forward, or is that scenario an infinite kill room? I tried a few times without it, and it seemed like some enemies could not be hit and others would just infinitely respawn.
Yeah, I couldn't have said it better. I stayed up until 1am last night to finish the whole game in one sitting... Now I'm sitting at work the next day and still thinking about the story.
Yeah this game deserves multiple play throughs, but not for the endings, but to notice the story-beat subtleties the game has, albeit subtlety that is in between bouts of shooting 100+ dudes.
Also to your point, I was like "ooh so this is why they hired the guy from Condemned cause no one else could think of that right? =/ Does that guy only have one phobia or something?
I like that after the first big decision with choosing Adam or Lugo's side, the other party is making rude remarks throughout the course of the game. When I do second playthrough and choose Lugo's side, will Adam be angry with me instead? And does that affect the
Wow its pretty rare when a game actually makes me feel bad, but that was sad. I said out loud "Oh shit" when that american soldier says "Why... we were trying to help" and then you see all those melted people... and the mother/child zoom in. That was legit gruesome.
Just all the mass murder, bodies bound and gagged, people hanging... its pretty grim atmosphere but its pulled off well. I really enjoy it, feels fresh even though its so dark.
And playing on hard the firefights are more intense than I expected. You can get dropped pretty quick if you stick your head out. And they do a really god job of using grenades to flush you out, you can't bunker in anywhere in most cases.
I know its a good game for me because like the guy above said, I'm at work right now thinking about it haha. I really want to get home and finish it to find out what the hell is going on!
i want a sequel.
