Dedication Through Light
Member
Gaf chose SAO as their 5th best anime of 2012.
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Spring Anime 2013 |OT -7| My Giant CG Pony Can't Possibly Read This Much Baudelaire
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Gaf chose SAO as their 5th best anime of 2012.
Well, it is an anime about MMORPGs
I really should watch it one day so i can actually validate this pre-conceived notion I have based off everybody else's reactions, but part of me feels like that would be giving up
I really should watch it one day so i can actually validate this pre-conceived notion I have based off everybody else's reactions, but part of me feels like that would be giving up
Funny you say that precisely today! ;-)
So.......is that an endorsement?
Joe Molotov
Member
Yurimaster.
HolyBaikal
Banned
I got people constantly telling me "you must go watch it now".
And "it's like .hack, but much better."
It is true that I liked .hack.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
It's a roughly meaningless statement
It's no .hack//quantum
Right on, brother. Right on.
Well, I'll be damned!
From the New World is good, if uneven. 17-20 is a really great stretch, and the ending is excellent.
Don't watch SAO.
Yuricam.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Something something Angel Beats top ten something something
Dedication Through Light
Member
Angel Beats is in my top 5
1 Evangelion
2 Angel Beats
3 Phi Brain
4 Guilty Crown
5 Blast of Tempest/K
Someone need to post firehawk's ep24 review.
What fucking lies. You should know better. SAO isn't even near the top 10.
[Evangelion 2.22]
“The world is a nasty place” proclaims Shinji, as even if that is ostensibly true, it’s also apparent that the Rebuild interpretation has allowed for some of those previously sharp edges to have softened somewhat. I personally consider End of Evangelion to itself carry its own positive assertions, though it was delivered from such an oblique perspective, that I hardly begrudge anyone for failing to acknowledge those overtures.
The positive undertone is the main aspect of why I found 2.22 to be an improvement on the work laid down by 1.11, as it signals a point where the Rebuild franchise is starting to shift into new territory, all of its own. Now it casts its gaze over the middle-act, where broader subject matter is wholly embraced, in lieu of the earlier atypical "weekly" format, to which we had become accustomed. The narrative was now fully entrenched in the baroque, standing as something which betrayed its earlier (more palatable) sentiment. Shinji’s outlook was irreparably fractured at this juncture, a point which had been depicted with a certain bluntness about it. We again inhabit this tipping-point of the narrative, which now carries with it a new caveat. Where it had once wallowed in the abject misery that would soon befall everyone; we now see how those same circumstances manifest, when our characters don’t embrace their demons quite so freely. 2.22 goes some way to evoking that earlier spirit, simultaneously retaining that overarching sense of dread, whilst also allowing for the material not to continually flirt with the melancholy, as it had once been compelled.
There is a certain exuberance that pervades the entire feature, and it’s quite surreal to experience Evangelion, without its dogged persistence towards affirming that dissolution of the human condition. If the television series was the wildly irrational adolescent, this is the contemplative rebuttal. Thought it stands to reason, that its outbursts can be just as pertinent, if not more so, amidst this more balanced outlook. The closing section exemplifies this, where the preceding (almost saccharine) optimism, could almost fool one into forgetting the oppressiveness of the past. It’s something that plays upon its audience quite wonderfully, pre-empting our own cynicism, and somehow lulling us (well, me) into this unfamiliar position. No matter the how austere something is, our expectations are always likely to have a disproportionate effect. In this regard, the preface of 1.11 goes some way to placating these assertions, where the biggest differences had been some minor shuffling of those pre-existing narrative elements. So by the time we reach the pivotal dramatic beats here, it punctuates in an entirely different way than it had done previously.
Viewing it all in binary terms, the familiar broad-strokes are all there, but the film does an effective job of situating it all in an entirely different (and convincing) context. I no longer have such reservations, regarding the earlier subtlety of the series being largely obscured, because it's now clear they are attempting to convey something quite different from within that framework. If hope was eventually born out of despair in EoE, it is now enduring, in spite of the world around it.
Rei probably stands as a clear testament to this change,
Though It had been something that was touched upon previously, circumstances dictated that it never really became anything other than a means, by which to inform future events.
That role facilitated the overarching plot, but not before diving in a spot of existentialism. Which curiously, served to emphasize how Rei came to barely resemble a character at all, reverting back to type,
All of this I mention, because of how radically it shapes the course of this retelling.
Shinji and Rei's relationship is the key beneficiary here, in that it is allowed to come to fruition. Previously used as the epitaph of hope itself, at least in Shinji’s own mind, it formed the crux of that aforementioned descent. Here, it's used to outline that, this time, it may be something of a misnomer. His character is barely distinguishable from the crumbled mess he he had once been, being granted a certain agency about his actions. He carries this signal of intent through to the finale. To say he is a redeemed figure would be a misrepresentation, though he is certainly more affable in this guise. Their inexplicable link is more explicitly portrayed here, and it allows Rei to exist as something more than a lingering epitaph.
Asuka is as conceited as she ever was, though she no longer attempts to hide this behind social platitudes. Her interpretation (at least for now), is one of extreme negativity. In a way, it lends to her being a much more readily sympathetic figure (at least in my eyes). Her actions are much less cynical, and clearly corralled by her own bemusement towards her isolation. She doesn't understand the world she is thrust into, nor does she pretend to. In a film formed around reconciliation and intimacy, Asuka stands alone as a tragic figure.
Alas, the same cannot be said for the new addition Mari, whose inclusion is so trite and unsatisfying, that it’s difficult not to view her as anything other than a by-product of a marketing meeting. Her role is a periphery one, and inconsequential to the larger narrative here, which makes her continued presence, all the more egregious. Maybe there are some grand designs for her in future installments, but surely this was nothing that could have been better served by her introductory scene alone? It is firmly established that she retains some earlier characteristics from the series proper, all of which had been exhibited much more clearly through its fully-formed protagonists. Namely, how their humanity (or increasing lack, thereof) was seemingly symbiotic to their own fates within the Evangelion. As it stands, everything only served to exacerbate my resentment for the character, as situations were contrived for her, so that she could awkwardly slide in amongst the rest of the cast. She is a glorified insert character, or at least is being presented as such. Sure, her nihilistic bent is not without merit, but considering how stuffed this particular narrative already was, I could have done without her being, quite literally, parachuted into the story. The fact that she is a new character in an already established fiction, hardly means that we need reminding of her presence. In light of my feelings on most other aspects of this production, this felt conspicuously tactless. She is representative of my fears towards the remaining two parts, which puts a slight dampener on things.
I acknowledged my earlier apprehension over trying to assess an incomplete work, and it looks as though I may have been a little presumptuous. This part of the Rebuild tale succeeds through its conviction to reconfigure with we already know, offering a contrasting perspective on all too-familiar despondency. Frankly, I'm unfamiliar with how people generally regard these films, but I'm starting to foster a begrudging respect for them. Try as I might to divorce my feelings of the original from this experience, I think that albatross is precisely why I think its successes should be commended.
TL
R version
“The world is a nasty place” proclaims Shinji, as even if that is ostensibly true, it’s also apparent that the Rebuild interpretation has allowed for some of those previously sharp edges to have softened somewhat. I personally consider End of Evangelion to itself carry its own positive assertions, though it was delivered from such an oblique perspective, that I hardly begrudge anyone for failing to acknowledge those overtures.
The positive undertone is the main aspect of why I found 2.22 to be an improvement on the work laid down by 1.11, as it signals a point where the Rebuild franchise is starting to shift into new territory, all of its own. Now it casts its gaze over the middle-act, where broader subject matter is wholly embraced, in lieu of the earlier atypical "weekly" format, to which we had become accustomed. The narrative was now fully entrenched in the baroque, standing as something which betrayed its earlier (more palatable) sentiment. Shinji’s outlook was irreparably fractured at this juncture, a point which had been depicted with a certain bluntness about it. We again inhabit this tipping-point of the narrative, which now carries with it a new caveat. Where it had once wallowed in the abject misery that would soon befall everyone; we now see how those same circumstances manifest, when our characters don’t embrace their demons quite so freely. 2.22 goes some way to evoking that earlier spirit, simultaneously retaining that overarching sense of dread, whilst also allowing for the material not to continually flirt with the melancholy, as it had once been compelled.
There is a certain exuberance that pervades the entire feature, and it’s quite surreal to experience Evangelion, without its dogged persistence towards affirming that dissolution of the human condition. If the television series was the wildly irrational adolescent, this is the contemplative rebuttal. Thought it stands to reason, that its outbursts can be just as pertinent, if not more so, amidst this more balanced outlook. The closing section exemplifies this, where the preceding (almost saccharine) optimism, could almost fool one into forgetting the oppressiveness of the past. It’s something that plays upon its audience quite wonderfully, pre-empting our own cynicism, and somehow lulling us (well, me) into this unfamiliar position. No matter the how austere something is, our expectations are always likely to have a disproportionate effect. In this regard, the preface of 1.11 goes some way to placating these assertions, where the biggest differences had been some minor shuffling of those pre-existing narrative elements. So by the time we reach the pivotal dramatic beats here, it punctuates in an entirely different way than it had done previously.
Viewing it all in binary terms, the familiar broad-strokes are all there, but the film does an effective job of situating it all in an entirely different (and convincing) context. I no longer have such reservations, regarding the earlier subtlety of the series being largely obscured, because it's now clear they are attempting to convey something quite different from within that framework. If hope was eventually born out of despair in EoE, it is now enduring, in spite of the world around it.
Rei probably stands as a clear testament to this change,
as we bear witness to her gradual “humanizing”.
Namely, Rei II’s death, and her "birth" therein.
as the living avatar she was modeled to be.
Shinji and Rei's relationship is the key beneficiary here, in that it is allowed to come to fruition. Previously used as the epitaph of hope itself, at least in Shinji’s own mind, it formed the crux of that aforementioned descent. Here, it's used to outline that, this time, it may be something of a misnomer. His character is barely distinguishable from the crumbled mess he he had once been, being granted a certain agency about his actions. He carries this signal of intent through to the finale. To say he is a redeemed figure would be a misrepresentation, though he is certainly more affable in this guise. Their inexplicable link is more explicitly portrayed here, and it allows Rei to exist as something more than a lingering epitaph.
Asuka is as conceited as she ever was, though she no longer attempts to hide this behind social platitudes. Her interpretation (at least for now), is one of extreme negativity. In a way, it lends to her being a much more readily sympathetic figure (at least in my eyes). Her actions are much less cynical, and clearly corralled by her own bemusement towards her isolation. She doesn't understand the world she is thrust into, nor does she pretend to. In a film formed around reconciliation and intimacy, Asuka stands alone as a tragic figure.
Alas, the same cannot be said for the new addition Mari, whose inclusion is so trite and unsatisfying, that it’s difficult not to view her as anything other than a by-product of a marketing meeting. Her role is a periphery one, and inconsequential to the larger narrative here, which makes her continued presence, all the more egregious. Maybe there are some grand designs for her in future installments, but surely this was nothing that could have been better served by her introductory scene alone? It is firmly established that she retains some earlier characteristics from the series proper, all of which had been exhibited much more clearly through its fully-formed protagonists. Namely, how their humanity (or increasing lack, thereof) was seemingly symbiotic to their own fates within the Evangelion. As it stands, everything only served to exacerbate my resentment for the character, as situations were contrived for her, so that she could awkwardly slide in amongst the rest of the cast. She is a glorified insert character, or at least is being presented as such. Sure, her nihilistic bent is not without merit, but considering how stuffed this particular narrative already was, I could have done without her being, quite literally, parachuted into the story. The fact that she is a new character in an already established fiction, hardly means that we need reminding of her presence. In light of my feelings on most other aspects of this production, this felt conspicuously tactless. She is representative of my fears towards the remaining two parts, which puts a slight dampener on things.
I acknowledged my earlier apprehension over trying to assess an incomplete work, and it looks as though I may have been a little presumptuous. This part of the Rebuild tale succeeds through its conviction to reconfigure with we already know, offering a contrasting perspective on all too-familiar despondency. Frankly, I'm unfamiliar with how people generally regard these films, but I'm starting to foster a begrudging respect for them. Try as I might to divorce my feelings of the original from this experience, I think that albatross is precisely why I think its successes should be commended.
TL
R version
Ultimadrago
Member
HolyBaikal
Banned
I have been made insanely curious as to why GAF doesn't like Sword Art Online.
I haven't watched it, by the way.
I haven't watched it, by the way.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
See, duckroll? You are the only person in the world who likes Mari!
Bad writing + most popular show since Madoka
Dedication Through Light
Member
Basically it's apparently a pretty alright MMO-jokey kinda show for about 10 or so episodes and then falls off the rails into some weird otaku author diatribe for around 14 episodes. At least that's how I've had it explained to me.
Oh, and it was popular because of/in spite of it, too.
It is an undisputed factory of sadness.
Truly the worst thing about SAO. It didn't respect the five second rule.
You should watch SAO if you want an uninspired harem/fanservice anime with boring characters, incest plots, a complete removal of the little tension it had halfway through and an art style that is the result of mashing together every Korean/Japanese MMORPG/RPG, that thinks and pretends to be something more interesting.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Like comparing malaria to ebola.
That's....actually a really good description of it.
If you think you want to watch SAO you should probably just watch Accel World.
HolyBaikal
Banned
Ah, now I'm getting it.
Lots of people do seem to talk about it.
It really does seem to rub people the wrong way when something they feel undeserving gets really popular.
Dedication Through Light
Member
I thought Sword Art Online improved over the course of the episodes and turned out really good. You should also consider Accel World. Though Sword Art Online has one of the better protagonists out there and occasionally does have really fantastic action moments.
But that would require watching the show, its quicker just to hate it, right
I second this. It has Kuroyukihime and SkyRaker in it. Plus amazing shifting toilets and the best douchebag antagonist that you want to see get his ass beaten and handed to him.
He's busy doing a writeup for his "Tropes vs Women in Anime I Don't Like" Kickstarter
Such an improvement that it went from that to this:
And to dismiss all of AnimeGAF's votes (which includes yours btw) to claim GAF as a whole vote SAO as their fifth favourite is laughable. All that shows is that those who probably only watched SAO and one other show couldn't even bare voting for it. I mean at one point it was clearly the most watched show on GAF and yet it struggled to even win with what should have been some default number one votes.
Speaking of which...
Niji-iro Hotaru
So, finally had the chance to watch it. I really liked it, but I don't think it's a film everyone will like. I'd say it depends on what you're coming for.
For starters, I think the whole film is carried by its visuals- to a point where if you don't like the style/don't care for that aspect much, it becomes very hard to enjoy.
The story is nothing revolutionary, and at its core, it's a very simple character piece- which doesn't bode well, as the characters aren't particularly strong or layered.
It is, however, wrapped up in tons of :firehawk and mythological references, and I think I could have gotten a bit more out of it if I were Japanese/had a better understanding of the culture. I can't even properly say if there's any sensibility in the handling of the two time periods and the fate of the village, because most of the implications probably flew over my head. The more personal stories are correct, but as they hinge in the strength of the characters, they don't become more than that.
What impressed me about the film, and what will keep with me over time, long after I have forgotten the details of the plot, is, of course, the visual execution of it all. The film has a distinct hand-made quality, with very little use of digital techniques. The characters are drawn and animated very sketchily, and they even intentionally left outlines unfinished and made little bits of colouring boil over. The animation, as a result, is very lively and loose, thus giving room for some really neat moments of character acting. The style makes a very effective use of the production process and the animators involved, because the big differences in approach and timing between the cuts don't come off as disruptive; instead they complement the aesthetic. The drawing style throughout all feels very much like the character designer (and Animation director for the film), Hisashi Mori. A big part of your reaction to the visuals will probably come down to how much you like his style. I love it, so I loved the animation, but I'm aware it's not everyone's cup of tea.
Besides that, I thought the art direction was nigh amazing. Again, there's a warm hand-drawn feel to it, but there was also something about how the lighting was applied and the rustiness of the backgrounds that made me feel like I was watching a 90s film. It almost looks cel-made!
There was a pervasive sense of melancholy throughout the film, like the director was reminiscing about older and better times and sending a love letter to an era long gone. In that sense, the art direction is functional to the main themes of the film, and contributes immensely to the atmosphere they were intending to deliver.
Just look at dat 2D!
Overall, I'd say that this was a worthwhile film as a re-interpretation of a very common type of story, and brings some freshness to the table purely in terms of how it looked. I appreciate seeing something so different and stylized, that gives the creators enough freedom to work their craft and make the story theirs. It's not really Wolf Children, so if you come expecting that kind of balance you'll be disappointed. But I think it's a very interesting film on its own right.
I just don't get Reki Kawahara's obsession with MMOs. Say there are two anime series about exploring the galaxy, fighting aliens, etc. but one is in an MMO. What reason do I have to choose that one? Unless you work in some ridiculous circumstance where you die in real life the MMO version is at a disadvantage as there is no tension. During the second half of SAO why would I care about any of the fights prior to the absolute final one? I wouldn't because it's Kirito, but anyway, what does him loosing some gold or experience have to do with the grand scheme of things?
The only thing I see the MMO version having over the non-MMO is that it appeals to people who can't socialize outside of MMOs themselves.
note: I haven't watched Accel World, I'm just commenting on the MMO bit.
The only thing I see the MMO version having over the non-MMO is that it appeals to people who can't socialize outside of MMOs themselves.
note: I haven't watched Accel World, I'm just commenting on the MMO bit.
I think MMOs are an interesting setting, but they do remove tension and it's very difficult to get it back without resorting to the good old 'die in the game you die for real' trope.
One thing I would really like to see is a show where the story in-game is important because the people in the show commit to the in-game story. Like, it's not because they're forced to like it, or because they're being threatened or whatever; it's because they're playing a game and they want to have a good time with the game. Maybe some kind of RP thing, I don't know.
That or an e-sports tournie I guess.
One thing I would really like to see is a show where the story in-game is important because the people in the show commit to the in-game story. Like, it's not because they're forced to like it, or because they're being threatened or whatever; it's because they're playing a game and they want to have a good time with the game. Maybe some kind of RP thing, I don't know.
That or an e-sports tournie I guess.
Haganai Next - End
What kind of ending was that, they should have had useless protag be part of the student council, would have been an interesting change of pace, this somehow exceeded my expectations of it being a shitty harem non-ending.
What kind of ending was that, they should have had useless protag be part of the student council, would have been an interesting change of pace, this somehow exceeded my expectations of it being a shitty harem non-ending.
Just gotta have people getting spawn camped for seven hours straight.
HolyBaikal
Banned
I have no idea where this little joke is coming from.
Internally, it feels like a perfect fit, though. I feel like women are underrepresented in the media, and I turn around and watch shows about female characters and many of them fall into the "shoujo" demographic and are written from a female perspective. My anime fandom doesn't stop me from agreeing with feminist ideas and my feminism doesn't stop me from enjoying anime with sexism in it.
Then there's what whole "Who is a feminist? Do I qualify as a "real feminist"" existential issue. I figure I'm close enough considering that I agree with around %80-90 of the positions held in feminist theory. If people tell me I'm not one I don't let it stop me.
Dedication Through Light
Member
ALFheim Online and Accel World are I guess great takes on MMO, I dont think being trapped in one is all that compelling, but when blended in with the real world dynamics and to a greater extent enabling those abilities in the real world setting, with some deep ever evolving game mechanics, it actually becomes interesting.
Having death being the main point of tension in a series doesnt really seem all that compelling to me. It kind of made SAO predictable in that regard...
In Accel World, the tension is definitely absent too. Its a future version of the same tech in SAO in a game where it wont actually kill you, but it has much more interesting and fun characters and some interesting fighting avatar designs.
Plus the most elegant and gorgeous butterfly girl and cutest pig. Its brilliant.
I'm roughly on your side of the fence, but it's just tiring to see the same arguments go fucking around and around in circles over on gaming. I mean we were in a lull spot until the IDGA thread popped up, and then the Mojang thread, and quite apart from nobody really knowing the full set of facts for either of those cases you just have a fucking endless horde of one stop idiot punters jumping in to yell "WHITE KNIGHT" or "FUCKING BIGOT" over and over and over again...
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