direct_quote
Member
When's Guy?
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Street Fighter V |OTVI| The More I Know, The Worse I Play
- Thread starter Reizo Ryuu
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lucebuce12
Member
I caught top 4
KBrad (Cammy)
Krone (Laura)
Chris G (Guile/Urien/Ibuki)
Du (Mika/Guile)
Yeah, that was for preorders. Not free with purchase currently.
Whens year of final fight
Chronospherics
Member
Guile is too good. It's dull that the most boring character to play is the most effective in the game. I'll admit I'm not a very dedicated player generally but having my worst matchups be Urien and Guile isn't much fun at all.
Guile is fresh air in a game where every strong character besides him is rushing you down. I don't even use Guile at all but fighting him keeps me from dropping due to the rest feeling monotonous.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
I think he is far from dull.
Chronospherics
Member
Of course it's open to interpretation, if you enjoy it then I'm not saying you are wrong. I only speak for myself and I'm just explaining how I feel.
My problem with Guile is that he doesn't have as much risk associated with his inputs. Very little risk at all in fact, unlike Ryu, Ken, Akuma etc. it's impossible for me to do anything on reaction to his booms, therefore anything do do has to be premptive, a guess, and then due to the recovery on his sonic boom, every attempt to place pressure on Guile carries more risk than it does against any other member of the cast.
For me, that makes the match boring. It feels as though the only way I can earn an opportunity to pressure is by sheer chance, I don't find that enjoyable, it's tedious. I don't have a problem with his playstyle per-se but more members of the cast need tools to combat it, what's the point in being a rush down orientated character if your anti-projectile toolset is only effective against characters that don't use fireballs? What's the point in having Rashid's v-skill roll a move specifically designed to be anti-projectile if Guile's recovery is so fast that he can punish you for using it?
At the moment Guile doesn't carry the risk that other characters to do execute his playstyle and that's why he's such a successful top tier character. Chun, Necalli, Cammy etc. they're great characters but their playstyle requires them to take chances and that means they don't perform as consistently as someone that doesn't need to take those risks. Heck Guile doesn't have a single bad matchup in the entire game. I have no issue with Guile's playstyle being viable, but I do not feel that he features any significant weaknesses, and in my view that makes him boring to play, spectate, and play against. In my local FGC everyone groans when someone selects Guile.
sixteen-bit
Member
more parry characters??
I know you're annoyed and you have every right to be but let's not pluck things out of thin air and make it a fact. He specifically said:
"After seeing releases from other companies, as well as some of the past of our own, maybe things weren't working 100% at launch"
Nowhere did he use SFV as a prime example (it could be one of them) and even mentioned thier own games in the past. Harada can hardly talk either as it would have been almost 2 years since Tekken 7 was released in arcades and it's still not ready yet for console.
As for the second paragraph, you sort of contradicted yourself there as you mentioned they don't communicate yet they recently have with a blog post to tell us there are CFN improvements and possible balance updates in the near future.
UcchedavÄda
Member
A great part of casual matches is being able to try do stuff like this:
I did it too late though, but luckily they pressed a button. And I still lost in the end.
I did it too late though, but luckily they pressed a button. And I still lost in the end.
sixteen-bit
Member
Yikes. Hold on till season 3 man, maybe then FANG will be GOAT. Who are we kidding they willl probably nerf him even more
ColonialHawk
Member
Gouken belongs in the dumpster that is also containing Blanka and Seth.
lucebuce12
Member
Yikes. Hold on till season 3 man, maybe then FANG will be GOAT. Who are we kidding they willl probably nerf him even more
You can still see a faint outline of what used to be F.A.N.G
But as season 3 rolls around, he's gonna turn into Vantablack:
Let's not go THAT far. I found Gouken to be pretty fun.
I would that thing you really like for seth.
SolarPowered
Member
I guess Capcom needs to add both Alex and Fang back to the game in season 3.
lucebuce12
Member
Alex even got a dope premium outfit in the form of that Halloween one.
F.A.N.G's got shit which is fitting cause he is shit
F.A.N.G's got shit which is fitting cause he is shit
lucebuce12
Member
Boy you really must not be able to play against him lol. FANG is really easy to beat once you realize that so many of his stuff is just an illusion and either isn't safe or can be punished.
I can provide some tips if you say which character you use?
Zombegoast
Member
I'm winning a lot of matches with Nash. I think people forgot that he's still a threat.
I'm sure you're right. Last night I played one for the first time in...well probably since launch. I don't get a chance to play much and I'm just a lowly Super Silver so I'm not saying I'm good. It might have been our connection, I felt like so much of what he'd throw out was in his favor. It was strange because I remember punishing a lot of this stuff in season 1.
Ryu is my main but I don't bother with him in lounges. I was using Rog, and Nash. Rog came down to the last sliver of health in a two out of three.
lucebuce12
Member
FANG only has the 4 moves that are in his favour, rest are punishable or are minus.
cr.mk which is +3 oB and is his best frametrap up close.
st.lp which is +3 oB and on counter hit, links into st.hp
coward's crouch kick which is +2 oB.
st.hk which is +1 oB
cr.mk is his most dangerous button imo since if done straight in your face, the pushback is small enough that he can still go for through and it being +3 means the CH game is real.
st.lp is of course a plus jab so treat it as any other jab and respect it if possible.
coward's crouch kick, when done point blank, can be beaten by a late tech. If not done point blank it is KINDA possible for them to do a shimmy so it's more reliable to just hold back.
st.hk is +1 oB but FANG doesn't have a 3-frame button. If you have a 3-frame button, always press it after blocking st.hk. Worse case, you trade. Best case, you get a counter hit. Normal case, they don't press a button and now you're on the advantage.
For his moves, his sleeves are all punishable save EX. They can be spaced so that they can't be punished by most moves save a medium normal but that's not particuarly common.
his light trap, the one where he hits twice and goes back, is -9 oB but unpunishable save for some CAs because of the distance.
his medium and heavy trap are HEAVILY punishable on block so keep an eye out.
His upballs are fairly straight forward. Don't press buttons if he does an EX one.
Other than that, my advice is to keep jumping at them if they keep using trap or throw if they keep using upballs for fake pressure.
by the way, if you jump then you can only get hit by the trap if you've already thrown out a normal. You can empty jump and land and block the trap.
Also the trap, like the poison, goes away if you land a hit on fang. So jumping at him is much more reliable than you'd think.
EDIT: This is also like the 4th or 5th writeup I've done for FANG, and this is probably the shortest ones. My apologies.
cr.mk which is +3 oB and is his best frametrap up close.
st.lp which is +3 oB and on counter hit, links into st.hp
coward's crouch kick which is +2 oB.
st.hk which is +1 oB
cr.mk is his most dangerous button imo since if done straight in your face, the pushback is small enough that he can still go for through and it being +3 means the CH game is real.
st.lp is of course a plus jab so treat it as any other jab and respect it if possible.
coward's crouch kick, when done point blank, can be beaten by a late tech. If not done point blank it is KINDA possible for them to do a shimmy so it's more reliable to just hold back.
st.hk is +1 oB but FANG doesn't have a 3-frame button. If you have a 3-frame button, always press it after blocking st.hk. Worse case, you trade. Best case, you get a counter hit. Normal case, they don't press a button and now you're on the advantage.
For his moves, his sleeves are all punishable save EX. They can be spaced so that they can't be punished by most moves save a medium normal but that's not particuarly common.
his light trap, the one where he hits twice and goes back, is -9 oB but unpunishable save for some CAs because of the distance.
his medium and heavy trap are HEAVILY punishable on block so keep an eye out.
His upballs are fairly straight forward. Don't press buttons if he does an EX one.
Other than that, my advice is to keep jumping at them if they keep using trap or throw if they keep using upballs for fake pressure.
by the way, if you jump then you can only get hit by the trap if you've already thrown out a normal. You can empty jump and land and block the trap.
Also the trap, like the poison, goes away if you land a hit on fang. So jumping at him is much more reliable than you'd think.
EDIT: This is also like the 4th or 5th writeup I've done for FANG, and this is probably the shortest ones. My apologies.
He specifically mentioned other companies and it doesn't take much to see that SFV, a game in the same genre, is pretty much the best example out there. No other fighting game managed to botch a launch this hard in the recent times.
Even among casuals it got a bad reputation, in a hardcore forum like GAF the magnitude of scrutiny is obviously amplified. Which is evident looking at the frequent SFV threads on gaming side.
There is no real contradiction in the second paragraph, as it's about the information they convey. I already mentioned that "CFN improvements" means nothing until we see what is being changed and there is literally no insight from them regarding what the improvements actually are.
Possible balance changes is also pretty vague. For all we know they could nerf Alex, Ryu, FANG and Nash even more and it's going to be another "lol Capcom gonna Capcpom".
More concrete information like "we are working on improving the netcode, desync teleports, Replay UI, matchmaking, better ping filtering, ragequit punishment and some other QoL changes" or "We are taking Alex and Fang under review to see, if there are further changes needed" is leagues better than a "yeah we are/might be doing something". The quality of the communication doesn't instill any confidence.
Look at it this way. When somebody asks you what Capcom is going to do to improve SFV, how good does this answer look like: "They are improving CFN and are possibly working on another balance patch."? There is nothing to work with in that statement.
Who knows, who's actually responsible for controlling the information flow. All I know is those who are doing the communication are just using the cards they are dealt with and it's not really an envious position to be in. Same thing for the devs, who are always under pressure.
Hopefully they can use the 30th Anniversary to turn it around, but the challenge itself is quite huge.
Nah I appreciate it. Cr mk was definitely what he used most to get at me as Rog. His poison traps really weren't an issue as I remember figuring those out back when. He just felt so plus on so much stuff for some reason. Mashing jab after everything and usually winning out.
I honestly only stayed competitive after I started jabbing likewise and throwing meaties out the window as apparently my timing was so atrocious. Low jabs on his wake up worked way more. So relying on Rog's target combo was kinda paramount. Maybe I just don't press enough buttons...idk.
I honestly only stayed competitive after I started jabbing likewise and throwing meaties out the window as apparently my timing was so atrocious. Low jabs on his wake up worked way more. So relying on Rog's target combo was kinda paramount. Maybe I just don't press enough buttons...idk.
I mean, as much as we see threads on the gaming side spiral into shit flinging left, right and centre, the game still won GAF's fighting game of the year and second place was nowhere near close. With the communication, it's like a double edged sword. When Capcom don't say anything consumers will complain and when they do, they will complain that it's not enough. As for the "nerfs", I don't know what all this moaning is about as I think all the bottom-mid tier characters have a chance - it's how the player uses the character not the character itself. Just look at NuckleDu yesterday winning a tourney with Mika who some thought was nerfed to oblivion.
The information, for now, is vague but promises that they may not be able to keep are always worse than showing something concrete. Match making, replay and rage quit system (without the jailing system) has been fine for awhile so we'll see what else they improve in spring. You're right, the 30th anniversary is a great platform to use to promote and improve this game for sure and I'm caustiously optimistic that they have a lot more to show throughout the year.
Shadow_Lord
Member
Guile is just a solid character all-around, but I wouldn't call him unbalanced in some obvious ways like Urien is. Like, if he were to get nerfed, it would be minor adjustments like upside down kick not being able to link into cr.MP anymore, his V-Trigger going back to 3 bars, etc. Urien would need some more significant adjustments.
When I think of how each character "should" feel in terms of uniqueness and strength, it's the current Guile and Balrog. It'd be great if each character could be like them.
I agree with phenom's assessment that Guile is 'auto neutral'. I just find him more unpleasant to deal with than Urien in general.
Yeah, I think Guile and Balrog are about the ideal level of strength that every character should shoot for. The issue with Season 2 doesn't seem to be what characters are really good but rather some characters got nerfed that probably shouldn't have been (FANG, Nash, Alex).
Zombegoast
Member
Makes me wonder how Capcom decided in some of the buffs/Nerf. Balrog has a 3f normal, a v skill mix up that leads to vtrigger that does a crazy amount of damage from coast to coast while still being his turn. I only managed to win against him as Alex is because of cr.mp and hit confirm into v trigger or punish his dash punch ob. Never have i felt like i have an opening when he can randomly ex dash punch.
Having no invincible reversal really cripple some of the characters. If Capcom knew better, they would make parries A 2f start up. Nobody ever use this move because it can't be used on reaction because it can be CC'D
He's mostly asking for more choices and stuff that fits an archetype or changes one to something else, which I agree with.
But that's usually not what people are arguing for when they talk about buffs.
I think most people would agree that giving players more than one V-Skill or V-Trigger to choose from would make for a better game and that would fit this argument pretty well.
UcchedavÄda
Member
Additional V-Skills, V-Triggers, or even CAs would be interesting, but I wonder how that would fit into ranked, casual, and lounges without character select. In IV you had the opportunity select your Ultra based on who your opponent is playing, but that would not be possible in V without adding additional screens in those cases. Or perhaps they adapt the VS screen to also serve that purpose.
Ucchedavāda;229314186 said:
Yeah, I'm not really into the idea of additional selectable tools (I'd rather every character just get more tools on top of what they have) but they could just have the Vs. screen be where you can pick your CA/VS/VT/etc. by pressing a button. If you don't pick in time the game randomly chooses for you.
I just want more defensive options for everyone. Enough with the constant rushdown please, I want more neutral.
And speaking of changes, they need to overhaul the way ranked works to be more fun to watch. Excellent Adventures is free publicity that would benefit greatly with character select in ranked and a good messaging system.
And speaking of changes, they need to overhaul the way ranked works to be more fun to watch. Excellent Adventures is free publicity that would benefit greatly with character select in ranked and a good messaging system.
Nemesis121
Member
This...
Most online Guile DO NOTHING, they go full TURTLE and make you come to them, rarely do i see an aggressive Guile's....
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