Support NeoGAF

[ElFly]

Wait, are you telling me that 2/3 of the supplements work?

Because that's kind of huge.

 

[Cyan]

Wait, are you telling me that 2/3 of the supplements work?

Because that's kind of huge.

No, it's saying that 2/3 of the supplements actually include the thing that doesn't work that they claim to include.

 

[ElFly]

No, it's saying that 2/3 of the supplements actually include the thing that doesn't work that they claim to include.

Too late I bought 3 different penis enlarging herbs just to be sure.

 

[Funky Papa]

post impressions 4 gaf pls

 

[Jag]

Wait, are you telling me that 2/3 of the supplements work

This article is talking about herbals, which is a subset of dietary supplements that include vitamins, minerals, herbs or other botanicals, amino acids, and substances such as enzymes, glandulars, and metabolites.

 

[Ferrio]

I work in an office with a bunch of 45+ year old women. It's crazy how much they buy into all this shit, especially the homeopathic bullcrap. One of them is constantly coming back from the alternative medicine shop with some new overpriced bullshit.

 

[Tenck]

I work in an office with a bunch of 45+ year old women. It's crazy how much they buy into all this shit, especially the homeopathic bullcrap. One of them is constantly coming back from the alternative medicine shop with some new overpriced bullshit.

So many people at work buy a bunch of crap, and next week comes and they're still buying more stuff that hasn't been cured by stuff they bought last week. Not sure why they put so much faith into stuff that obviously isn't working.

 

[meltingparappa]

I work in an office with a bunch of 45+ year old women. It's crazy how much they buy into all this shit, especially the homeopathic bullcrap. One of them is constantly coming back from the alternative medicine shop with some new overpriced bullshit.

Well you know... what's the harm in innocently seeking an 'alternate' to centuries of proven medical science?

 

[Piecake]

So many people at work buy a bunch of crap, and next week comes and they're still buying more stuff that hasn't been cured by stuff they bought last week. Not sure why they put so much faith into stuff that obviously isn't working.

They like to feel like they are doing something, and its a hell of a lot easier than changing up your diet and exercising. You know, stuff that would actually make you healthier, but requires effort and commitment

 

[Drencrom]

No way!

 

[Stet]

I can. There are two potential problems with multivitamins:

1) Overdosing on vitamins. Many of these multivitamins include very high doses of specific minerals which if properly absorbed could cause overdoses. Vitamins, like most "healthy" things, are good only in moderation.
2) With all that said, your chances of overdosing are quite low, because absorption rates on vitamins in pill form are extremely small. As in, the amount of actual vitamin your system absorbs from these pills is nearly nonexistent. We don't quite know why yet, we just know that it's true. As such, there's a real chance that the tiny amount of vitamins you get from a pill is less valuable than the (possibly) tiny amount of contaminants you get along with it. All pills contain at least some contaminants -- it's inevitable with any ingest product, even hamburgers have some fecal matter, etc. -- but these types of supplements may contain an especially large amount because they are largely unregulated.

This is easy to test with high-iron multivitamins which frequently, if taken on an empty stomach, can lead to vomiting. Iron is one of the worst to overdose on.

 

[speculawyer]

The main thing these supplements do is create expensive heavily vitamin supplemented urine.

 

[grumble]

This is easy to test with high-iron multivitamins which frequently, if taken on an empty stomach, can lead to vomiting. Iron is one of the worst to overdose on.

It takes a lot of iron to overdose. Iron supplements like Palafer often given to iron deficient anemics are 300mg of ferrous fumarate (100mg of elemental iron). That's a metric ton compared to multivitamins, is supposed to be used daily and does not cause acute overdose. you'd have to eat a whole pile of multivitamins to OD on them (which young children can do and then they die, hence child proof caps).

 

[NekoFever]

I work in an office with a bunch of 45+ year old women. It's crazy how much they buy into all this shit, especially the homeopathic bullcrap. One of them is constantly coming back from the alternative medicine shop with some new overpriced bullshit.

Ask her why she has to keep going back if they're so effective.

There's a woman in my office who was complaining yesterday that her acupuncture treatment didn't help her leg pain. NO SHIT.

Edit: I went straight from posting this to Facebook, and the first message on my feed was someone talking about their new chiropractor. They're everywhere!

 

[Adam Blade]

A fool and his money...

 

[Henchmen21]

Still never got why people would choose that stuff over regular medicine.

People are stupid?

 

[Durask]

They like to feel like they are doing something, and its a hell of a lot easier than changing up your diet and exercising. You know, stuff that would actually make you healthier, but requires effort and commitment

Also, to an average person, science and pseudoscience sound the same, in fact pseudoscience always sounds better because it makes a lot more promises.

 

[SteveWinwood]

truly shocked

 

[Durask]

Two bottles labeled as St. John’s wort, which studies have shown may treat mild depression, contained none of the medicinal herb. Instead, the pills in one bottle were made of nothing but rice, and another bottle contained only Alexandrian senna, an Egyptian yellow shrub that is a powerful laxative.

At least they have a sense of humor.

 

[Durask]

BTW, I am not shocked at all.

In other countries, especially China and HK, these "herbal remedies" are often loaded with steroids, painkillers and antibiotics.

It works, too, because if you start taking steroids in large doses, initially you feel GREAT and really start believing in those herbs.

 

[CharlieDigital]

Still never got why people would choose that stuff over regular medicine.

Related: 100% of Herbal Supplements Useless

A lot of "regular medicine" has roots in naturally occurring substances. Penicillin, aspirin (as far back as 460BC), botox, aloe gel, marijuana, cocaine, opium, etc.

Just because it's herbal, natural, or plant based does not mean it's not useful or does not have medicinal qualities.

The only detriment to herbal supplements in the modern day is that they are not subject to the same rigor as mass pharmaceutical products.

herp natural derp

I don't see it this way at all. The reality is that many molecular compounds that occur in nature have an effect on the function of the human body. Some compounds are well understood and have been synthesized like caffeine, some compounds are still not well understood or have not been studied widely for their purported uses.

Indeed, that is what makes them attractive to scammers, but at the same time, that is quite a shame because it is likely that there are many plants and naturally occurring compounds which do have some medicinal benefit.

 

[meltingparappa]

The only detriment to herbal supplements in the modern day is that they are not subject to the same rigor as mass pharmaceutical products.

That rigor of course, includes dosage, necessity, minimized side effects and isolating the active ingredient.

There's a world of difference between a doctor identifying what turned out to be a bacterial infection and prescribing a synthetic pill meant to work as immediately and efficiently as possible, versus someone walking into a GNC and eating a handful of pills with a label exclaiming "boosts immune system!"

I wonder how many more would end up in the emergency room if homeopathic medicine actually allowed you to overdose.

 

[NekoFever]

I don't see it this way at all. The reality is that many molecular compounds that occur in nature have an effect on the function of the human body. Some compounds are well understood and have been synthesized like caffeine, some compounds are still not well understood or have not been studied widely for their purported uses.

Indeed, that is what makes them attractive to scammers, but at the same time, that is quite a shame because it is likely that there are many plants and naturally occurring compounds which do have some medicinal benefit.

I'm not disputing the efficacy of many naturally occurring substances. But the reason why people buy herbal remedies – which, in this instance, isn't talking about proven medicines derived from natural sources – is because of the fallacious belief that natural = good.

 

[Kano on the Phone]

A lot of "regular medicine" has roots in naturally occurring substances. Penicillin, aspirin (as far back as 460BC), botox, aloe gel, marijuana, cocaine, opium, etc.

Just because it's herbal, natural, or plant based does not mean it's not useful or does not have medicinal qualities.

The only detriment to herbal supplements in the modern day is that they are not subject to the same rigor as mass pharmaceutical products.



I don't see it this way at all. The reality is that many molecular compounds that occur in nature have an effect on the function of the human body. Some compounds are well understood and have been synthesized like caffeine, some compounds are still not well understood or have not been studied widely for their purported uses.

Indeed, that is what makes them attractive to scammers, but at the same time, that is quite a shame because it is likely that there are many plants and naturally occurring compounds which do have some medicinal benefit.

That isn't based on anything at all. No one is saying that natural things aren't useful, what they're saying is that there's a naturalistic fallacy whereby things are deemed to be special or useful just because they're natural (you seem to be subscribing to that fallacy as well).

 

[reaver18]

There are many many studies that all show taking daily multi vitamins increases rate of mortality and various types of cancer.

I always try to tell people that all those bullshit supplements you're taking to be 'healthy' or get better results at the gym are killing you slowly. They're non regulated and you really have no clue what it is you are ingesting.

 

[CharlieDigital]

That isn't based on anything at all. No one is saying that natural things aren't useful, what they're saying is that there's a naturalistic fallacy whereby things are deemed to be special or useful just because they're natural (you seem to be subscribing to that fallacy as well).

See below:

herp natural derp

 

[Durask]

There are many many studies that all show taking daily multi vitamins increases rate of mortality and various types of cancer.

I always try to tell people that all those bullshit supplements you're taking to be 'healthy' or get better results at the gym are killing you slowly. They're non regulated and you really have no clue what it is you are ingesting.

It's hopeless because vitamins are good for you and they are natural.

I think a better question is: why do people distrust science and logic and love pseudoscience and quackery...

 

[Necromanti]

See below:

I think you should have bolded his next line instead.

It's hopeless because vitamins are good for you and they are natural.

I think a better question is: why do people distrust science and logic and love pseudoscience and quackery...

A lack of scientific literacy, for one. Pseudoscience is constructed so that it targets--and is readily "understood" by--the general population.
Gullibility.
A sort of quasi-religious appeal to faith and belief, at times.
Ignorance.
Perhaps being used as a last resort.
And of course, the trusty placebo effect.

I don't...mind it too much due to the letter, but the potential dangers of the lack of regulation coupled with the excessive exploitation of the vulnerable and gullible is pretty appalling.

 

[reaver18]

It's hopeless because vitamins are good for you and they are natural.

I think a better question is: why do people distrust science and logic and love pseudoscience and quackery...

Dat billion dollar industry

 

[Jag]

There are many many studies that all show taking daily multi vitamins increases rate of mortality and various types of cancer.

And most of the studies are either observational, compilations or based on ingredients forms not even found in most multivitamins.

I always try to tell people that all those bullshit supplements you're taking to be 'healthy' or get better results at the gym are killing you slowly.

Based on what evidence?

They're non regulated and you really have no clue what it is you are ingesting.

Not true.

 

[WARCOCK]

Get USP verified brands if you NEED supplementation.

 

[NekoFever]

See below:

Did you read my response?

I said that in response to someone asking why people subscribe to this crap. I wasn't at all saying natural substances can't be medically useful.

 

[Durask]

BTW, these guys actually test the supplements - however you have to pay to get the results.

http://www.consumerlab.com/

 

[Kano on the Phone]

See below:

Come on, dude, he'd already clarified in the post right before mine.

 

[Sgt.Pepper]

I only take Omega 3 capsules these days. I used to spent lots of money on supplements, but I wised up 3 years ago.