About the Gemastu Leak and the Chorus Men.
Everyone seems to think they're going to look something like this.
I have a gut feeling it may be the "Chorus Kids" and it'll be these three from Rhythm Heaven Fever.
Chorus MEN.
Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 9: F5 F5 F5 F5 F5 F5
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Chorus MEN.
I know they are, more movement options doesn't translate to L-canceling and wavedashing, it can be something else specific to smash4, all I saw from her was a facebook post, not a well writen or well though intreview like most other players.
edit:
above.
All I'm trying to say is they weren't shouting we need L-canceling and wavedashing for this game to be viable for tournament play like the rest of the internet, they weren't as toxic as the rest of the community to a demo of a uncomplete game.
But...huh? L-canceling and wavedashing are movement options.
oreomunsta
Banned
The pink one is a drag =p
SenorArdilla
Member
All he needs is the bow tie and they'll be practically identical. Like that Munchy Monk game.
I'm kind with you. I'm indifferent to them now, but i have faith that they'll both have super cool and unique movesets. Or at least the Chorus Men will. I dunno what they can do to Chrom to make him interesting, but in Sakurai I trust
SliceSabre
Banned
No I must have Chrom. An Anna is fine too though.
Who knows, maybe that's just the general name, and if there's another Gematsu leak the dude will refine it to "Chorus Kids" a la Mii Fighters.
Just a possibility.
Chorus men is the kind of wacky thing I'd love in the roster. I could do without Chrom but eh.
Bring on the Shulk.
OmegaSmash
Member
Such a shame that died. I feel that a better art style would've helped out immensely. It looked way too "korean MMO", and didn't get nearly enough publicity overall.
OK, I'm just going to give a straight up in depth post about what I (and the competitive community generally) want in this game, what it means for the competitive viability and how this affects the casual player.
Increase the window for dash dancing
Alright, some people have already pointed to videos where characters are "dash dancing" in the current build, but they seem to misunderstand the use of dash dancing and what is happening in the current build.
A dash dance is basically where you just change direction mid dash, simple as that, when you start a dash there's a certain window of opportunity where you can reverse and start dashing in the other direction.
This just gives you more control over your character, it doesn't lock you into an unsafe dash and allows you to play mindgames with the opponent trying to force them to read whether you're going to go straight in with a dash attack/aerial or delay it a bit and react to what they do.
It's literally just pressing the stick in the opposite direction so it's not a complex input and it doesn't offer the character any real physical advantage other than the mind game aspect, so it's not something that is too complicated for the casual gamer and I believe is pretty intuitive honestly.
In the current build, the window where you can change direction is dramatically reduced to the point where you can only do it by staying in the same spot, you travel no actual distance so it's usefulness as a bait is negligible.
Less landing lag
Ok, one of the changes in this game is a general increase in landing lag, I'm completely fine with the increased lag when you do an air dodge, I think that's a great way of stopping people from spamming it so much.
But the increased landing lag when you do an aerial attack is something that again limits movement options, because it keeps you stuck on the ground unable to do anything for longer it ruins your ability to followup an attack with another to have some form of combo game, some people say "well that just increases the effectiveness of ground based approaches right? It stops people from spamming aerials too because they're not safe anymore, how is that bad?"
At a very basic level I could see why someone might think this, but 95% of the characters are based around an aerial game and you don't increase the effectiveness of ground-based characters by nerfing everyone elses aerial game, you do it by improving the ground game of those characters (stuff like super armour on moves to stop them being knocked into thee air as much is what helps, see P:M bowser).
There are quite a few people then that have been asking for some form of Lag-cancelling (the official term is soft landing), this is where, in melee and 64, you press a button several frames before you land to decrease the amount of landing frames, what this does is increase the viability of offensive approaches rather than giving all the advantage to the person on defense.
Me? I hate L-Cancelling, there is no reason whatsoever to not lag cancel your move and it's an annoying input to time, especially for people like me with slow reactions and bad muscle memory.
So what a lot of people have proposed is to just reduce lag off of aerials in general, you feel less stuck to ground unable to do anything for long periods of time but I generally want something different that would improve the combo game but also give more opportunities for a punish game.
A good balance would be to make moves have less landing lag if you connect with either a player or a shield, but if you miss the attack because the other player dodges, then you get the increased lag that can lead to a punish, aerial characters get to keep their combo game but they still have risk if they just constantly try to short hop aerial you all the time.
Momentum conservation
Ever wondered why captain falcon sucked in brawl despite having buffs? This is the reason (as well as no L-Cancelling, but this hurt more I think).
In melee, if you ran and jumped, as opposed to jumping from a stand still, you jumped further due to the conservation of momentum, it makes the game more fluid and just makes more sense in general, they removed this in brawl so you always just jumped the same distance regardless of your speed.
It allows characters based around being fast to actually make more use out of that speed and doesn't require any extra inputs or anything, it's just something that makes sense.
I think those are just the basics, there's a few other things I've forgotten that certain people want and certain people don't (I've probably forgotten at least 1 actually important one), but this is what a lot of people consider necessary to make smash 4 really good as a competitive game.
you're on my shitlist now
By asking for 'more movement options' they also ask for L-canceling or wavedash equivalents. L-canceling could just be automatic (i.e. cut landing lag across the board) and wavedashing could manifest in another form or something. People want to feel like they have a good control over their character when playing and that means adding a lot of movement options, but that doesn't mean the same movement options melee provided. We don't want them game harder for more casual players, but removing these options rather than find ways to make them more accessible is a boring approach.
JoeInky's post above highlight the most important ones, in my opinion.
SenorArdilla
Member
I see what you did there.
Technically their name is the Chorus Kids.
See:
Rhythm Paradise character roll
Game and Wario credits
GameGuru59
Banned
Thanks, that's very helpful.
They're called Chorus Men in Japan, though.
Beelzebufo
Banned
Unlikely. The first three characters you showed are known as the "Chorus Men" in Japan. He wouldn't identify them when he meant another character.About the Gemastu Leak and the Chorus Men.
Everyone seems to think they're going to look something like this.
I have a gut feeling it may be the "Chorus Kids" and it'll be these three from Rhythm Heaven Fever.
Also, it's worth pointing out the Chorus Men are in more games (including one not in RH series) and are the main characters for the best selling RH game. Marshall's only in one game.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Don't forget Sakurai said he was trying to wittle down "transformation" characters. It makes sense for the Chorus Men to be all the same three figures, i.e. Ice Climbers
SliceSabre
Banned
I like the three 'Kids?" more than the three "Men?" just based on these pictures alone.About the Gemastu Leak and the Chorus Men.
Everyone seems to think they're going to look something like this.
I have a gut feeling it may be the "Chorus Kids" and it'll be these three from Rhythm Heaven Fever.
Beelzebufo
Banned
Also, did Marshall and friends ever even sing? Why would they be called Chorus Anything?
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
I wonder what will be the Chorus Men's icon. There's nothing in the Rhythm Heaven games that instantly comes to mind. A sole musical note would be a copout.
They show off more of their personality here. I think they're adorable.
Beelzebufo
Banned
A musical note makes more sense than a gear does for Megaman.
Wreck-It Ralph
Member
I hope the Chorus Kids/Men can summon the wrestler for one of their attacks.
PadWarrior
Member
Chorus kids scare me lol
Hoagmaster
Member
The Destructoid Show had a segment at Smashfest where they asked people about the game. Didn't get to go but I'm sure it was exciting (and packed).
lol
Beelzebufo
Banned
That's obviously what the leak was referencing lol. Nothing about Marshall and friends was never called Chorus Kids or men or anything. Chorus Men are Chorus Men.
I wouldn't call it a copout. Musical notes appear all throughout the games and in marketing materials.
I'm super stoked if they include the chorus bros. I'm always down for new additions with vastly different and interesting move sets. Also to see what kirby would look like once he sucks him. As much as I love Chrom and Fire Emblem, another sword wielding lord seems absolutely boring. I still would trade Marth for my waifu, Lucina. I'm trying to think of characters that are so weird and different that would add well to smash4.. but all the ones that come to mind are assist trophies. Sigh.
So I spent this morning checking out all of Clash's 1v1s today, and I think the match that caught my attention the most was WFT VS ZSS, probably made Smash 4 look about as good as I've seen it despite one of the players being a random Nintendo rep.
Paralyzer into up-smash into up-B into forward aerial(?) looked golden.
Save 'N Quit
Banned
Reminder that boring ass Chrom is acceptable so long as we get glorious Shulk first.
That was actually a good match.
Here's a video of Gravity Suit Samus.
Updated, running out of material to work with though.
It's paralyser into up-air into up-B, the final hit is part of the up-B.
It's also not a true combo because WFT got out of the helpless state before the up-B, he just made a bad read and tried to attack which left him open to a punish.
Technically their Japanese name is コーラスメン which translates to Chorus Men, but since we are referring to them in the latin alphabet we should refer to them by their localised name of Chorus Kids.
Still looked good!
can I use that 3rd Sonic palette as my icon?
Updated, running out of material to work with though.
Beelzebufo
Banned
All of the characters on the Japanese site use Latin alphabet. They'll be referred to as Chorus Men on the Japanese website, and obviously we referred to as such when the leaker got his information. Either way, there's only one character the leaker could have intended to list.
Yeah it's the kind of thing that looks good at early levels when the metagame is developing but when people get more used to what they can and can't do then stuff like that will happen less often.
That's just talking about the current build though, it could change.
I would infinitely prefer Isaac, Ray 01 and Saki over either. I'm waiting Samurai.
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