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[Hasemo]

Well, unless your new equipment is like 30-40 points higher than the old one with the bonus, lol.



I haven't gotten too far yet so not sure. I do know you can lock certain pieces when equipping stuff so you don't accidentally unequip it, heh. You can also Fuse equipment to try and get gear with the skills you want.

30/40 points is nothing if it makes all your other stats by 20+
And yeah, you have to plan, there's no way to keep skills on characters.
Super important thing about fusing - when a skill name shows in blue on the fusion screen it means that the old skill in that slot will be overwritten and lost. Yellow means added/upgraded stuff. I lost one Union because I didn't notice that at first.

 

[Aeana]

30/40 points is nothing if it makes all your other stats by 20+
And yeah, you have to plan, there's no way to keep skills on characters.
Super important thing about fusing - when a skill name shows in blue on the fusion screen it means that the old skill in that slot will be overwritten and lost. Yellow means added/upgraded stuff. I lost one Union because I didn't notice that at first.

I thought blue just meant it was sealed. I guess I didn't notice that.

 

[Hasemo]

I thought blue just meant it was sealed. I guess I didn't notice that.

That too, but I think that i. The end it's your old skills that end as locked new skills. And I don't think that I lost any combos while treating it like that.

 

[Shouta]

30/40 points is nothing if it makes all your other stats by 20+
And yeah, you have to plan, there's no way to keep skills on characters.
Super important thing about fusing - when a skill name shows in blue on the fusion screen it means that the old skill in that slot will be overwritten and lost. Yellow means added/upgraded stuff. I lost one Union because I didn't notice that at first.

If all of your gear is 30 to 40 over the old is what I meant. Like coming to a new tier of gear in a new town.

 

[Heyt]

So the only way of keeping skills permanently is fusing gear correctly and you lose skills if you don't?

 

[Hasemo]

If all of your gear is 30 to 40 over the old is what I meant. Like coming to a new tier of gear in a new town.

If you have 5 skill combon active, that almost never happens. New shops don't offer that much better eq

 

[Aeana]

Most of the equipment in the game that is actually an upgrade comes from enemies or chests, and a lot of it is tough to find duplicates of (for the sake of fusing). Of course, there are ways to make drops come more favorably from enemies, but it's not that much better in the end.

 

[Bebpo]

Skill system isn't bad. It's not as player friendly at getting all the skills, max skill character, but as you progress you tend to fill up more and more and the skill chart and double down on the stats you want.

Otoh, the skills all are pretty sucky and only make minor differences in battle so it's not that big of a deal. This isn't a Tales game where the skills are amazing and change the combat entirely or anything from what I've played. An extra 8% attack, or 20% resistance is nice, but it's hardly noticeable in the heat of battle.


And I'm not having any problem with equipment around 12-15 hours in. I keep getting better and better stuff every new shop and from enemy drops in dungeons. The upgrade curve is fine so far.

 

[FSLink]

A couple hours in:

+ Great music
+ Fun battle system
+ Environments aren't as boring as Xillia/Xillia 2's, much better made

= I'm not sure why we still have ending battle screens since there's some boss/mini boss fights where it drops you off at the field with a victory notice more seamlessly.

- No dashing available for the huge environments

- Battle camera, good god, even in single player it can get stuck behind walls really easily....a lot of the dungeons I've been in so far have been smaller hallways so the camera tends to get wacky. It's a mess on Hard mode where the enemies try to gang up on party members and it's zoomed in on a bunch of enemy's backs.

- Battles are 30FPS (?), not a huge negative since it's an obvious limitation due to seamless battling and the slower battle system anyway, but it's still worth mentioning

- Battles seem less in depth than Graces so far, difficulty balance seems off as noted by some other posters, way too easy in normal encounters even on Hard mode especially thanks to the fusion system


So far it's pretty fun but it's kinda disappointing in some ways.

 

[Aeana]

Skill system isn't bad. It's not as player friendly at getting all the skills, max skill character, but as you progress you tend to fill up more and more and the skill chart and double down on the stats you want.

Otoh, the skills all are pretty sucky and only make minor differences in battle so it's not that big of a deal. This isn't a Tales game where the skills are amazing and change the combat entirely or anything from what I've played. An extra 8% attack, or 20% resistance is nice, but it's hardly noticeable in the heat of battle.


And I'm not having any problem with equipment around 12-15 hours in. I keep getting better and better stuff every new shop and from enemy drops in dungeons. The upgrade curve is fine so far.

Skills are better if they're stacked with the "same" bonus and can be quite the force to be reckoned with in that case. But as mentioned, there are a couple of union bonuses that are just insanely powerful (such as the one for the first column which gives you +20 to all stats). It's mainly managing these bonuses that makes the skill system and upgrading equipment begin to feel like a chore. Maybe you'll never feel that way, but I sure do and it's quite a drag for me.

- No dashing available for the huge environments

There is something like this later.

- Battles seem less in depth than Graces so far, difficulty balance seems off as noted by some other posters, way too easy in normal encounters even on Hard mode especially thanks to the fusion system

Battles have a lot of depth that's unfortunately obscured at first, either because the game doesn't tell you about it until you find it on a stone tablet at some point in the game, or because you need to equip a battle action to gain access to it.

 

[Hasemo]

Skill system isn't bad. It's not as player friendly at getting all the skills, max skill character, but as you progress you tend to fill up more and more and the skill chart and double down on the stats you want.

Otoh, the skills all are pretty sucky and only make minor differences in battle so it's not that big of a deal. This isn't a Tales game where the skills are amazing and change the combat entirely or anything from what I've played. An extra 8% attack, or 20% resistance is nice, but it's hardly noticeable in the heat of battle.


And I'm not having any problem with equipment around 12-15 hours in. I keep getting better and better stuff every new shop and from enemy drops in dungeons. The upgrade curve is fine so far.

Regular skills aren't that bad, it's the combos where the system breaks down imo. Try to get the first union, which gives +20 to all stats and changing equipment after that.
Near the end, I could improve one character's attack by a large amount, but it would decrease the defense by good 200 because of breaking some weird skill combo, so I basically couldn't do anything with that slot.

Edit:
Ninja'd.

 

[Bebpo]

I'm not sure how I feel about 30fps battles. Back in the Symphonia PS2 days I didn't touch that version because I couldn't imagine playing Tales battles in 30fps, but here it seems mostly fine. The timing windows for blocking, dodging, combos are not that strict (and you can even make the longer in the options menu) and so it seems to work fine.

But I do think if I went back and played a 60fps 3d Tales battle in a different game right now it'd feel a lot nicer control wise and visually.

 

[FSLink]

I'm not sure how I feel about 30fps battles. Back in the Symphonia PS2 days I didn't touch that version because I couldn't imagine playing Tales battles in 30fps, but here it seems mostly fine. The timing windows for blocking, dodging, combos are not that strict (and you can even make the longer in the options menu) and so it seems to work fine.

But I do think if I went back and played a 60fps 3d Tales battle in a different game right now it'd feel a lot nicer control wise and visually.

Yeah like I said, it's not a huge negative since the slower battles work for it, but I thought it was worth mentioning. It's just something I noticed immediately.

There is something like this later.



Battles have a lot of depth that's unfortunately obscured at first, either because the game doesn't tell you about it until you find it on a stone tablet at some point in the game, or because you need to equip a battle action to gain access to it.

A dashing ability? Or do you mean the quick travel?

And I'm not liking the battle actions thing, it reminds me of how annoying it was to unlock Item Thrower for all characters in Vesperia. I did get the one that was Square+D-Pad to switch to party members mid battle without pausing, but I'm not a fan of how it's locked initially.

 

[Bebpo]

Regular skills aren't that bad, it's the combos where the system breaks down imo. Try to get the first union, which gives +20 to all stats and changing equipment after that.
Near the end, I could improve one character's attack by a large amount, but it would decrease the defense by good 200 because of breaking some weird skill combo, so I basically couldn't do anything with that slot.

Edit:
Ninja'd.

Yeah I've had that first column union of +20 stats to all for a while so far and I keep changing equipment and it's never gone away. I dunno, I fuse a ton in this game because it's easy and fun. So I'm constantly adding more and more skills to my to equipment and upgrading their stats, but then next tier equipment drops or at new shops usually are so much stronger they make the fused weapons outdated and I sell them.

That's why I'm enjoying the equipment curve. In the 4-5 hour gaps between new equipment tiers, I'm constantly fusing and upgrading my current equipment, so I'm always getting stronger equipment and more skills.

And yeah, I still don't think +20 all stats is that much of a big deal in a game like this. It'll help a little, but I don't really notice it in battle so I probably won't be going out of my way to keep the union if I lose it for some much better equipment.

 

[Aeana]

Yeah like I said, it's not a huge negative since the slower battles work for it, but I thought it was worth mentioning. It's just something I noticed immediately.



A dashing ability? Or do you mean the quick travel?

And I'm not liking the battle actions thing, it reminds me of how annoying it was to unlock Item Thrower for all characters in Vesperia. I did get the one that was Square+D-Pad to switch to party members mid battle without pausing, but I'm not a fan of how it's locked initially.

Yes, a dashing ability. There's a support talent that gives you a speed boost after battle, and it stacks (i.e. if you get it again while you still had it, it makes you go faster than before). This also is applied when you pass NPCs who say something as you're passing by.

 

[Datschge]

Yes, a dashing ability. There's a support talent that gives you a speed boost after battle, and it stacks (i.e. if you get it again while you still had it, it makes you go faster than before). This also is applied when you pass NPCs who say something as you're passing by.

This is so hilariously odd an idea for a feature. "Wah, he's telling me something useless, let me run fasTER~~" =P

 

[R_thanatos]

This is so hilariously odd an idea for a feature. "Wah, he's telling me something useless, let me run fasTER~~" =P

This sound so stupid , i kinda want to try it ASAP.

 

[Shouta]

OK seriously, Superfly's OP for this sucks. I like her singing but this style of song is turrible for her.

At least have her do something like Tamashii Revolution.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2tedgbqJJs

 

[Rhapsody]

I just listened to the OP yesterday. Wasn't really feeling it unlike most Tales games.

 

[dakkumauji]

I agree, she can sing pretty well, but this song is definitely not her style.

Even though I thought it was going to be good from the 15 seconds you hear in those commercials, lol

 

[Soriku]

It's one of the best Tales OP songs

 

[Jathaine]

It's one of the best Tales OP songs

Agreed.

Also, someone said the combat has less depth than Graces f... is that even possible? A system where you don't need cancels or any advanced techniques or anything, just around step and go all day. That same Graces f?

Oi vey. I really hope its not true.

Fortunately, this video makes me think there's still hope.

 

[Rhapsody]

Graces is only simple if you want it to be, imo. There's a lot more stuff to utilize than the latest Tales, imo.

I don't think tiered skills necessarily gives more depth.

Edit: Not that I think Graces is the deepest. I can understand the dislike for no cancels on rules (but mostly on Hearts for me).

 

[kayos90]

This dragon boss is duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuumb.

 

[Aeana]

Agreed.

Also, someone said the combat has less depth than Graces f... is that even possible? A system where you don't need cancels or any advanced techniques or anything, just around step and go all day. That same Graces f?

Oi vey. I really hope its not true.

Fortunately, this video makes me think there's still hope.

"Don't need" is not the same as "doesn't have." Not needing to use a feature is not a flaw of the system, it's a flaw in the encounter design. If the feature is there in the system then it can be said to have that depth.

 

[keisuke999]

omg this trophy for getting Same 16 is killing me. I need an idiot's guide.

 

[FSLink]

http://www.twitch.tv/fslink

Streaming a bit now if anybody is interested in watching.

 

[Hasemo]

This dragon boss is duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuumb.

Strategy for 90% of bosses/enemies which aren't resistant to water:
1. Equip Water Kamui
2. Do the down + circle combo
It also helps that water kamui has the hp recovery skill, best aoe attack etc.

 

[keisuke999]

Strategy for 90% of bosses/enemies which aren't resistant to water:
1. Equip Water Kamui
2. Do the down + circle combo
It also helps that water kamui has the hp recovery skill, best aoe attack etc.

lol this is how I beat

Spoiler

Dark Kame-nin at the Cat Villiage

at level 45.

 

[Jathaine]

"Don't need" is not the same as "doesn't have." Not needing to use a feature is not a flaw of the system, it's a flaw in the encounter design. If the feature is there in the system then it can be said to have that depth.

For most games I'd agree but...

I'd argue that in the case of Graces f this isn't true since around step takes away the need for such things as it adds stagger time (for no good reason). Its the dominant strategy for good reason. Unless you just want to be fancy, there's no real benefit a vast majority of the time and that's regardless of what you're fighting against but that's really a topic for another thread.

 

[FSLink]

I guess Sorey is Asbel 2.0.

;P Well it's only possible during the Mystic Arte tutorial only but yeah.

Also just realized this song from Vesperia/Xillia 2 comes back during some bosses:
Vesperia/X2 version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFsSmoH9lxY

Zestiria version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fsy51iyQn8

 

[Shouta]

I laughed so hard at "Mibo" haha

 

[Bebpo]

Been playing a ton of this, I...really like this Tales. I think this is finally the accomplishment of what games like FFXIII and Xillia tried to do and failed to do: make a linear story-driven jrpg that still feels like the PS2 era of jrpgs and is damn fun and full of content.

I mean sure there's tiny issues with battle camera sometimes, some difficulty spikes, questionable art direction when first entering areas and they are ugly before they get pretty, UI could be better, skills are a bit weird in this one, etc etc...

But really that's all small stuff. What the game has going for it is:

+great battle system
+pretty good story with great pacing
+good cast
+tons of dungeons with actual puzzles and dungeon design
+a fun overworld to explore
+great music
+good to great graphics
+and it seems like it's a good length and conclusive

So basically you have an rpg with a world to explore, dungeons to maze through, a good story, a good cast, great battles, great graphics and music and near-seamless presentation and it's all wrapped up in a well paced story driven narrative that hardly has any "ok, I'm saving and turning it off for the night" spots and is instead "one.more.save.point"

Basically all you lose by going this direction is sidequests, of which there are hardly any. But unlike XIII or Xillia it doesn't feel like you're just walking down a path from cutscene to cutscene because along the way there's good fields and lots and lots of dungeons and the map design is solid and the battle system and sub-systems still make it feel like a Tales game. I've been reading the game is about 30-40 hours in length. Which makes sense because when you take out all the sidequests from a 50-60 hour Tales game, and just focus on a main story you're probably looking at 30-40 hours. I mean I feel like there's been so much game so far and and I'm only 16 hours in. So I have no worries that I won't get a full fledged 50-60 hour major rpg experience, just it might be 20 hours less since they cut out all the optional fat. And I'm totally ok with that.

The game just keeps getting better and better as it goes in every aspect from story, to battle system, to dungeon design, and enemy balance. If it can keep this up until the end, this definitely has the potential at this point to be one of my favorites in the series. Really happy with it so far.

 

[Mendrox]

On GameFAQs is a good guide for the battle system, skills and stats. That really helped me and I understand everything now.

 

[FSLink]

Streaming again: http://twitch.tv/fslink

Yeah I gotta agree, the town/field design in this is loads better than Xillia 1/Xillia 2.

Kind of disappointing about the sidequests, but eh Tales sidequests were always more of a chore anyway. And apparently there's some post-game stuff.

Plus Go Shiina. :3

 

[Heyt]

Wow such positive impressions from Bebpo. Thanks!
For the ones playing the game, do you like the fields in Zestiria more than the overwold maps in Tales pre-Hearts? (or before the influence of Hase and his 1:1 ish scale maps)

 

[FSLink]

Wow such positive impressions from Bebpo. Thanks!
For the ones playing the game, do you like the fields in Zestiria more than the overwold maps in Tales pre-Hearts? (or before the influence of Hase and his 1:1 ish scale maps)

I personally do so far, though I do wish there were faster movement from the get go.

The bushes/trees popping in are kinda distracting too but it's a minor complaint, and it's at least improved over Xillia/XIllia 2 where NPCs would take awhile to load if you dash up to them too fast.

 

[Heyt]

I personally do so far, though I do wish there were faster movement from the get go.

The bushes/trees popping in are kinda distracting too but it's a minor complaint, and it's at least improved over Xillia/XIllia 2 where NPCs would take awhile to load if you dash up to them too fast.

How's quick travel in the game? Just like Xillia?

 

[RalchAC]

Wow such positive impressions from Bebpo. Thanks!
For the ones playing the game, do you like the fields in Zestiria more than the overwold maps in Tales pre-Hearts? (or before the influence of Hase and his 1:1 ish scale maps)

In general impresions are really positive, for what I've read.

The major complains are the skill system (which looks like Vesperia but you don't keep the skills when you change your gear, which isn't nice) and the Alisha related stuff.

Outside that it seems they've made a really solid game. People like the story and characters, the battle system, the dungeons and towns seem an improvement over Xillia games. And fields don't seem too bland, which was my main worry when they showed the character running around an enormous field full of nothingness.

Hopefully they'll stick to this style of design from now on, since it seems it's the better received. They've been changing world design aimlessly for a while.
__

As soon as I finish Tales of Hearts R and I get a couple of trophies from One Piece Pirate Warriors (like the online only coins) I think I'm going to replay Graces. This thread has made me want to play it again.

I personally do so far, though I do wish there were faster movement from the get go.

The bushes/trees popping in are kinda distracting too but it's a minor complaint, and it's at least improved over Xillia/XIllia 2 where NPCs would take awhile to load if you dash up to them too fast.

In Xillia was bearable, but it was totally bad in Xillia 2. Since the game wasn't designed with the fast running boots in mind, some NPCs loaded like 5-8 second after you arrived to them. That happened to me A LOT when going to the bounty guy.

 

[Fisico]

Wow such positive impressions from Bebpo. Thanks!
For the ones playing the game, do you like the fields in Zestiria more than the overwold maps in Tales pre-Hearts? (or before the influence of Hase and his 1:1 ish scale maps)

I'm not sure yet so far, I'll wait to finish the game before making any conclusion, but the very fact I'm considering it could be better than overworld maps is already a vast improvement compared to the post Hearts Tales.
And obviously as said above it lack faster movement at the beginning,

 

[Hastati]

Edit: Gotcha!

 

[Mendrox]

It looks like this was discussed a bit in the DLC thread, but are all of these negative reviews really just crazy raging fanboys? I mean I could believe it, but I was kinda blown away reading some.

Link

Are there any other annoying IAP locks in this game, or is this just people being as irrational as usual?

Well. Bad camera, missing story related characters (or rather, characters who are usable for only 3-4 hours), story related points that are just bad, stupid story points, confusing skill system, stupid battle system (by forcing you to have certain people in teams)

Game is still fun, huh.

Edit: Just to inform you - I am playing the game at the moment.

 

[Hasemo]

Well. Bad camera, missing story related characters (or rather, characters who are usable for only 3-4 hours), story related points that are just bad, stupid story points, confusing skill system, stupid battle system (by forcing you to have certain people in teams)

Game is still fun, huh.

Edit: Just to inform you - I am playing the game at the moment.

What is so bad and "stupid" about the story exactly?
Also the skill system isn't really confusing, it's just limiting equipment progression if you want to keep combinations.
And the last thing - what's "stupid" about the battle system? You can change half of your team however you want even mid battle, what's wrong with that? Allowing for 4 tenzoku in a party would completely break the system imo - you'd have all elemental weaknesses covered and you could just spam aoe attacks with everyone.

 

[Datschge]

It looks like this was discussed a bit in the DLC thread, but are all of these negative reviews really just crazy raging fanboys? I mean I could believe it, but I was kinda blown away reading some.

Are there any other annoying IAP locks in this game, or is this just people being as irrational as usual?

There are not any "IAP locks" in the game, negative reviews for major releases are par for course in Japan, and the biggest part of the outcry is not even the fault of the game itself but how the publisher chose to promote the game initially, setting up expectations the developer apparently originally never planned to fulfill.

If you are not letting yourself being manipulated by PR there is still a fun if flawed game to be found, as the different impressions, especially by Bebpo but also by Hasemo, Fisico, FSLink, R_thanatos, Shouta, Aeana and others on the last couple pages can attest.

Please let not derail this thread again.

 

[Torraz]

Hooray, finally got my copy . Any hints / tips / things to know before starting?

Totally forgot about the OVA....

Thank you!

 

[Hastati]

There are not any "IAP locks" in the game, negative reviews for major releases are par for course in Japan, and the biggest part of the outcry is not even the fault of the game itself but how the publisher chose to promote the game initially, setting up expectations the developer apparently originally never planned to fulfill.

If you are not letting yourself being manipulated by PR there is still a fun if flawed game to be found, as the different impressions, especially by Bebpo but also by Hasemo, Fisico, FSLink, R_thanatos, Shouta, Aeana and others on the last couple pages can attest.

Please let not derail this thread again.

Thanks! I guess I haven't noticed the crazy ratings for a lot of these games. I won't bring it up again.

 

[Aeana]

Sheesh. Someone mentioned GameFAQs so I decided to go take a look. I wonder how many of the people complaining so loudly even understand the language. In particular, there's lots of people talking about how shallow the combat is... And I just don't feel that way at all after all of the things they introduce over time, particularly through the battle actions, but there's also some neat features built in that the game sadly doesn't even tell you about right away (the stone tablets are really dumb, I have to say). I think the only major complaint I really have with the combat is that your combos are limited for no real reason, and the combo extension skill is a bit of a pain to maintain since it's a same+4 skill (which also means you have to give up the BG+1 same skill for that particular matching, which is same+3).

By the way, if anybody wants to see the skill system all laid out, check out this post, I think it does a pretty good job.

 

[Mendrox]

What is so bad and "stupid" about the story exactly?
Also the skill system isn't really confusing, it's just limiting equipment progression if you want to keep combinations.
And the last thing - what's "stupid" about the battle system? You can change half of your team however you want even mid battle, what's wrong with that? Allowing for 4 tenzoku in a party would completely break the system imo - you'd have all elemental weaknesses covered and you could just spam aoe attacks with everyone.

Well my main point which is a Rose/Kamui spoiler:

Spoiler

Having a pure heart so that you can Kamui with your Tenzukou, and her being an assassin is a point which really annoyed me. Alisha leaving all the time doesn't bother me, but also Edna herself, with her reason for tagging along (and it being resolved in a sidequest) is another part which bugs me.

 

[è£ ç”²æ‚ªé¬¼æ‘æ­£]

Finally found the Gold Key. Time to go back to every Town, Dungeon and Field for those chests oh god

Why does the treasure hunting support talent not mark them on the map permanently?

 

[Falk]

Sheesh. Someone mentioned GameFAQs so I decided to go take a look. I wonder how many of the people complaining so loudly even understand the language.

Slightly better over the complaints from watching streams. (And not knowing the language on top of that)