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The Big Ass Superior Thread of Learning Japanese

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Gromph

This tag is currently undergoing scheduled maintenance...
Staff Member
Question: is there a general JapanGAF thread for those of us living out here right now? I have some questions about general living I'd like to throw out to any residents, having just moved here, but I'm not sure where to begin asking stuff.

Drop me a PM and i will try to help you.
 

kubus

Member
So Skritter has been pretty awesome for me so far. I use the iOS app and apparently I learned 900+ word writings this week and over 1000 word definitions. Anyone else use it?
 
can one of you please confirm if " 悠遠 " translates into "far away"? much appreciated!

edit: no context. just need to know if it means literally "far away", not planning on using it in a sentence or anything.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
can one of you please confirm if " 悠遠 " translates into "far away"? much appreciated!

edit: no context. just need to know if it means literally "far away", not planning on using it in a sentence or anything.

It does, but it's definitely more poetic/dramatic than other ways of saying it.
 
It does, but it's definitely more poetic/dramatic than other ways of saying it.

i don't mind that... (i think? haha). planning on using it as a title for an album. possibly going to be putting kanji on the cover. what is the best way to say "far away" in kanji if being used for a title?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
i don't mind that... (i think? haha). planning on using it as a title for an album. possibly going to be putting kanji on the cover. what is the best way to say "far away" in kanji if being used for a title?

A good one, or at least pretty common (?) one might be:

遥か彼方

はるかかなた

Not really thinking of a good solution that's just one or two Kanji. Something like 遠方 would fit the bill, but would not sound right as the name of anything.
 
So Skritter has been pretty awesome for me so far. I use the iOS app and apparently I learned 900+ word writings this week and over 1000 word definitions. Anyone else use it?
Dropping by to say thanks. I used to "know" a few hundred kanji while studying abroad in Japan about four years ago and this app is an excellent way to brush up and learn more. I see it's free for a week, but I get to keep practicing all words I already covered-- so I guess I'll just cram as much as possible to take advantage of it before the $15/month kicks in!
 

kubus

Member
Dropping by to say thanks. I used to "know" a few hundred kanji while studying abroad in Japan about four years ago and this app is an excellent way to brush up and learn more. I see it's free for a week, but I get to keep practicing all words I already covered-- so I guess I'll just cram as much as possible to take advantage of it before the $15/month kicks in!
Cool! Glad it works for you. Yeah my free trial period ended recently and I'm looking at the subscriptions now. It's very pricey imo but then again this app is exactly what I was looking for and it really helps tremendously. I could never get into Anki because it didn't let me practice my kanji writing and this solves all of those problems. It's really nice that they let you keep practicing what you already learned without subscription though, so once I've run through all of my study material, I can stop paying. I'd say that's a pretty good motivation to study :p
 

Krejlooc

Banned
I figured this would be the best place to ask for help on a small test I'm trying out. If anybody isn't away, Dolphin, the Wii emulation, has pretty fantastic VR support already for VR headsets, which makes playing certain games, namely racing games, pretty damn awesome. A common request is for PCSX2, the PC PS2 emulator, to match that feature, but thus far it hasn't come.

Well, a long while back, a japanese developer came up with a set of Pro Action Replay codes for the playstation 2 that took over a library of common camera operations that a number of PS2 games used. Using a PS2 controller, when these codes are enabled, you can freely adjust the camera to give yourself freelook.

My idea is to take these PAR codes, modify them to better suit VR, drop them into PCSX2, and use an injection driver like VorpX or VireIO to map headtracking to the appropriate controls, hence giving PS2 games VR support.

Only problem? The manual for the PAR codes is in japanese. While I took many years of japanese, years of neglect has left my skill in atrophy. Hence, I'm looking for someone who can translate some pages for me, namely these:

http://web.archive.org/web/20080623203224/http://h1.ripway.com/ps2cc/

That should give me all the info I need to work on this. Anybody willing to lend a hand?
 

clem84

Gold Member
A while back I bought 3 necklaces with Japanese(?) symbols. I thought they looked cool and wasn't really interested in knowing what they meant. Maybe I should have looked them up sooner :). Anyway, there they are:

20140822_231211_zps76e32b19.jpg


20140822_231201_zps035983fd.jpg


20140822_231140_zps3912166a.jpg


Are those Chinese or Japanese symbols? Anyone know what they mean?
 
My Japanese teacher said there is a difference between these two statements:

1) 本田さんは山田さんが好きじゃないと思います。

2) 本田さんは山田さんが好きだと思いません。

Specifically she said case number 1 is more common in Japanese speech and left it at that since it was a beginners course.

Could anyone elaborate on the difference between 1 and 2?
 

mantidor

Member
My Japanese teacher said there is a difference between these two statements:

1) 本田さんは山田さんが好きじゃないと思います。

2) 本田さんは山田さんが好きだと思いません。

Specifically she said case number 1 is more common in Japanese speech and left it at that since it was a beginners course.

Could anyone elaborate on the difference between 1 and 2?

My japanese is reaaally rusty D: I think it goes like this:

He thought he doesn't like him/ He thinks he didn't like him.

Aren't those different tenses in english as well? now I'm confused as well T_T
 

clem84

Gold Member
I bought Heisig's Remembering the Kanji 1. For those of you that don't know it's a book that teaches you the writing of some 2200 Kanjis and their meaning, but it doesn't tell you how to pronounce them. I understand many Kanjis have different pronunciations depending on if they're part of a compound or not. But still, memorizing the meaning of different Kanjis and nothing else, like the different words they make up and the pronunciation of those words, seems kinda pointless.

This book came highly recommended that's why I purchased it. Should I just get rid of it or is there some benefit in going through this book?

EDIT: Never mind, I got the answer to my question in the first post.
 
My japanese is reaaally rusty D: I think it goes like this:

He thought he doesn't like him/ He thinks he didn't like him.

Aren't those different tenses in english as well? now I'm confused as well T_T

Translating literally case 1 is: I think Honda does not like Yamada

Case 2 is: I do not think Honda likes Yamada


Both are present tense. I did not use past tense.


Case 1 is rarely used in English, and I wouldn't really say the two cases (in English) are different in meaning. Just one sounds awkward. My teacher said that in Japanese the two cases have different meanings, not simply that one was more awkward phrasing. Or maybe I misunderstood her?
 

kubus

Member
My Japanese teacher said there is a difference between these two statements:

1) 本田さんは山田さんが好きじゃないと思います。

2) 本田さんは山田さんが好きだと思いません。

Specifically she said case number 1 is more common in Japanese speech and left it at that since it was a beginners course.

Could anyone elaborate on the difference between 1 and 2?
I am definitely not fluent and I don't have a lot of conversation experience in Japanese, but my gut feeling tells me that the second would only be said in a context where it is thought that Honda likes Yamada. The speaker disagrees by saying he/she doesn't think that.

So the first would be like a statement and the second more like a reaction.

But it would be nice if someone with more knowledge could confirm!
 

test_account

XP-39C²
Can someone tell me what "なりそこない" means? I've seen it being translated as "wannabe", but is there a better, or different, transation for it?
 
Translating literally case 1 is: I think Honda does not like Yamada

Case 2 is: I do not think Honda likes Yamada


Both are present tense. I did not use past tense.


Case 1 is rarely used in English, and I wouldn't really say the two cases (in English) are different in meaning. Just one sounds awkward. My teacher said that in Japanese the two cases have different meanings, not simply that one was more awkward phrasing. Or maybe I misunderstood her?

I remember my professor said that the Japanese don't say 思いません like we do in english. She said that you always say 思います because you're doing the thinking all the time. So it's not possible not to think.

I see the other way used a lot too though so... I have no idea.
 

Gacha-pin

Member
Translating literally case 1 is: I think Honda does not like Yamada

Case 2 is: I do not think Honda likes Yamada


Both are present tense. I did not use past tense.


Case 1 is rarely used in English, and I wouldn't really say the two cases (in English) are different in meaning. Just one sounds awkward. My teacher said that in Japanese the two cases have different meanings, not simply that one was more awkward phrasing. Or maybe I misunderstood her?

You can take the second one like 本田さん doesn't think 山田さん like (it) in some context. I think both sentences, especially the second one are too informal for a language class.

Can someone tell me what "なりそこない" means? I've seen it being translated as "wannabe", but is there a better, or different, transation for it?
fail to be someone/something :D
f0008837_03136.jpg
 
You can take the second one like 本田さん doesn't think 山田さん like (it) in some context. I think both sentences, especially the second one are too informal for a language class.

Too informal for a language class? But I used polite (ます) form...
 
Tsk tsk tsk at the OP saying he will update the thread and not doing so since the day it was posted six years ago. Is the information still relevant or are there better resources now?
 

Desmond

Member
I just saw a lyric in a song that caught my eye:

性格の悪い女の子

Why is の used here as opposed to が?
 

clem84

Gold Member
I'm looking for the kanji for courage. I googled and I came up with a few different answers:

il_570xN.377665199_q8gi.jpg


kanji-courage-symbol.jpg


courage.gif


I'm a little confused. Which one is it?
 

Kilrogg

paid requisite penance
I just saw a lyric in a song that caught my eye:

性格の悪い女の子

Why is の used here as opposed to が?

が would be more correct/written, but both mean the same thing. の is used extremely often in these cases. Think of it as a way to turn the preceding word/phrase into a modifier for the following noun.
 

eot

Banned
I found an old mickey mouse cartoon in Japanse and I figured I should try to make sense of it and maybe learn something. Slow going, but oh well. I have a question about a short sentence though (in reference to some music I think):
聞くと元気が出るね

What does the "と" mean in this context?
 

Desmond

Member
I found an old mickey mouse cartoon in Japanse and I figured I should try to make sense of it and maybe learn something. Slow going, but oh well. I have a question about a short sentence though (in reference to some music I think):
聞くと元気が出るね

What does the "と" mean in this context?

Looks like the conditional と to me. Means "if"/"when" for when the outcome is definite.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
I found an old mickey mouse cartoon in Japanse and I figured I should try to make sense of it and maybe learn something. Slow going, but oh well. I have a question about a short sentence though (in reference to some music I think):
聞くと元気が出るね

What does the "と" mean in this context?

It binds 「聞く」to 「元気が出る」 to form a causative relationship.

Listen -> feel happy
 

eot

Banned
Thanks!

So, something like:
When leaving, hearing the music makes you feel good ? (I suck at translating even if I somewhat get the meaning).
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Thanks!

So, something like:
When leaving, hearing the music makes you feel good ? (I suck at translating even if I somewhat get the meaning).

Not quite.

元気が出る is just a phrase that means "feel good," "feel happy," or "cheer up." Imagine the genki coming out from inside of you or something.

So just, "I always feel good when I hear [this song/music]," or "[this song/music] cheers me up."
 

clem84

Gold Member
The second one is the "kanji for courage" and the third one is the actual word for courage.

Sorry if this question sounds silly. I'm just a beginner.

I'm not sure I understand your reply. If I wanted to write courage in a sentence I would use the third one right? Then what is the point of having a kanji that represents a word, like courage for example, if when you're using it, it's different.

I mean, sentences are made up of kanjis that represent words, correct? Some words require more then one kanji which are called compound. Maybe I'm not making any sense here. I don't understand why there's a kanji that represents a word, but when you actually use that word, you have to write something different.
 

eot

Banned
Not quite.

元気が出る is just a phrase that means "feel good," "feel happy," or "cheer up." Imagine the genki coming out from inside of you or something.

So just, "I always feel good when I hear [this song/music]," or "[this song/music] cheers me up."

Oh, that makes more sense since genki is the subject :)
 

Kansoku

Member
Sorry if this question sounds silly. I'm just a beginner.

I'm not sure I understand your reply. If I wanted to write courage in a sentence I would use the third one right? Then what is the point of having a kanji that represents a word, like courage for example, if when you're using it, it's different.

I mean, sentences are made up of kanjis that represent words, correct? Some words require more then one kanji which are called compound. Maybe I'm not making any sense here. I don't understand why there's a kanji that represents a word, but when you actually use that word, you have to write something different.

Writing in a sentence would use 勇気, yes.

Kinji's doesn't represent word. They represent concepts. According to Tangorin, 勇 can represent courage; cheer up; be in high spirits; bravery; heroism. Some kanji can be used by themselves to represent "words", like 日(nichi) is "day" and 来る(kuru) is "to come". You can use 勇(yuu) by itself, as 勇(yuu) or 勇ましい(yuumashii), a noun meaning bravery/courage and a adjective with the same meaning. Compounds sometimes make sense, like today = now + day (今日(kyou) = 今(ima) + 日(nichi)).

To be fair, 勇 can be used as a noun, but I've seen 勇気 more often.
 

georly

Member
Hi everyone, I've recently decided to learn japanese, but have little time and resources available to me at the moment.

My goal is to start REALLY slow, and learn one or two things a day. I've printed out a 'katakana chart', and have decided to learn to read and write 1-2 characters a day.

Is that an OK approach? Are there any better suggestions for learning/memorizing 1-2 katakana symbols a day?

I noticed on my 3DS that it seems you can modify some katakana symbols (make them smaller/add circle things...), so how/when should I learn about that stuff?

I'm talking as a complete idiot who has done no research into learning japanese (I haven't had much time! I'm taking it slow). Just let me know if I'm doing it wrong, and what step 1/2 should be for someone who can only dedicate about 5-10 mins a day right now.
 

Kansoku

Member
Hi everyone, I've recently decided to learn japanese, but have little time and resources available to me at the moment.

My goal is to start REALLY slow, and learn one or two things a day. I've printed out a 'katakana chart', and have decided to learn to read and write 1-2 characters a day.

Is that an OK approach? Are there any better suggestions for learning/memorizing 1-2 katakana symbols a day?

I noticed on my 3DS that it seems you can modify some katakana symbols (make them smaller/add circle things...), so how/when should I learn about that stuff?

I'm talking as a complete idiot who has done no research into learning japanese (I haven't had much time! I'm taking it slow). Just let me know if I'm doing it wrong, and what step 1/2 should be for someone who can only dedicate about 5-10 mins a day right now.

You should learn the kana first (hiragana and katakana, especially hiragana). Try to learn a row (like k+[a i u e o] = か き く け こ) per day, and just write them a lot (following the stroke order, it is important). This should be enough. It's also important to learn how them work, like the double consonants and youon. I think this have everything.

Next, I think you should at least learn how kanjis work. You don't have to memorize them right away, but being at least familiar with them when learning vocab helps a lot. These two links explain it well IMO.

Then since you don't have much time, choose grammar or vocab next.
Learning vocab is pretty easy with things like Anki and Memrise, and it might take only 15 minutes of your day.
Or grammar which will demand a little more time from you. I recommend Tae Kim.
You can do both with textbooks like Genki if you like them.

And then just practice, practice and practice. You can write stuff for correction at lang-8. I really like the /r/LearnJapanese subreddit as well(They have a nice FAQ, lots of resources). And it's really important to immerse yourself with Japanese right from the star. Music, games, anime, dramas, whatever you like.
 

georly

Member
You should learn the kana first (hiragana and katakana, especially hiragana). Try to learn a row (like k+[a i u e o] = か き く け こ) per day, and just write them a lot (following the stroke order, it is important). This should be enough. It's also important to learn how them work, like the double consonants and youon. I think this have everything.

Next, I think you should at least learn how kanjis work. You don't have to memorize them right away, but being at least familiar with them when learning vocab helps a lot. These two links explain it well IMO.

Then since you don't have much time, choose grammar or vocab next.
Learning vocab is pretty easy with things like Anki and Memrise, and it might take only 15 minutes of your day.
Or grammar which will demand a little more time from you. I recommend Tae Kim.
You can do both with textbooks like Genki if you like them.

And then just practice, practice and practice. You can write stuff for correction at lang-8. I really like the /r/LearnJapanese subreddit as well(They have a nice FAQ, lots of resources). And it's really important to immerse yourself with Japanese right from the star. Music, games, anime, dramas, whatever you like.

Wondeful post, thank you. Bookmarking it all.

I noticed your order for vowels is different than in english (presumably our AEIOU is because it's in alphabetical order). a i u e o might take some getting used to... until I noticed it's the same order as metal gear's La Li Lu Le Lo, which will really help!

Is that... why the la li lu le lo are like that?
 

Kansoku

Member
Wondeful post, thank you. Bookmarking it all.

I noticed your order for vowels is different than in english (presumably our AEIOU is because it's in alphabetical order). a i u e o might take some getting used to... until I noticed it's the same order as metal gear's La Li Lu Le Lo, which will really help!

Is that... why the la li lu le lo are like that?

Probably. =P
 
I'm taking a stab at learning Japanese, and I could use some moral support. Here's where I'm at:

I'm 25-years old, and I've come to feel that this is too old to learn a new language. It's a foolish sentiment, I'm sure (and one assuredly developed to validate my fear of trying), but I feel it nonetheless. Like many of you, the idea of living and working in Japan has been a lifelong dream, and I'm sick of putting it off. I'm setting a goal: I *will* move to Japan in 1.5-2 years.

The plan was always to enroll in the JET Program immediately upon graduation. I studied English at a very good school, so this always felt like the perfect marriage between two subjects I love. Then I met a girl--likely the girl--and I put my plans on hold. It's been about 1.5 years since graduation and I don't regret my choice, but I still find myself with this insatiable longing to go through with my original plan. Now, relationship complications aside, I've decided that I have to start taking steps to leave.

I'm starting with a 10-week class. It doesn't start until mid-September so I'll likely get a head start on kana with a few workbooks I already have. Is it possible for me to have a solid foundation with which to relocate in 1.5-2 years of these classes? Should this be enough to land a job at a private school? Or is this a hopeless endeavor?
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I'm taking a stab at learning Japanese, and I could use some moral support. Here's where I'm at:

I'm 25-years old, and I've come to feel that this is too old to learn a new language. It's a foolish sentiment, I'm sure (and one assuredly developed to validate my fear of trying), but I feel it nonetheless. Like many of you, the idea of living and working in Japan has been a lifelong dream, and I'm sick of putting it off. I'm setting a goal: I *will* move to Japan in 1.5-2 years.

The plan was always to enroll in the JET Program immediately upon graduation. I studied English at a very good school, so this always felt like the perfect marriage between two subjects I love. Then I met a girl--likely the girl--and I put my plans on hold. It's been about 1.5 years since graduation and I don't regret my choice, but I still find myself with this insatiable longing to go through with my original plan. Now, relationship complications aside, I've decided that I have to start taking steps to leave.

I'm starting with a 10-week class. It doesn't start until mid-September so I'll likely get a head start on kana with a few workbooks I already have. Is it possible for me to have a solid foundation with which to relocate in 1.5-2 years of these classes? Should this be enough to land a job at a private school? Or is this a hopeless endeavor?

Just to drop some truth bombs, you will not need a lick of Japanese if you want to go to teach English in Japan this second. If that's why you're studying, just stop now, apply, and go. You will most likely not take your studies seriously enough and end up wasting 1.5-2 years because you thought you needed some sort of "foundation." Just go. You'll retain more from simply being there and being around it all the time. If you're studying because you actually want to be proficient in the language, that's fine, but you've already admitted you don't have the mentality for it right now. Throw on top of it basic life and relationship issues and you probably won't be much further along than any college kid taking a class a semester.

I could be wrong, and you might be a language prodigy that really tackles it for the next year or two.. but I still don't think that's necessary if your goal is simply to go to Japan and teach. That 1.5-2 year window you gave yourself is probably for other non-Japan related stuff to get settled, in which case it's just an excuse to not leave right now.

Just go.
 
Just to drop some truth bombs, you will not need a lick of Japanese if you want to go to teach English in Japan this second. If that's why you're studying, just stop now, apply, and go. You will most likely not take your studies seriously enough and end up wasting 1.5-2 years because you thought you needed some sort of "foundation." Just go. You'll retain more from simply being there and being around it all the time. If you're studying because you actually want to be proficient in the language, that's fine, but you've already admitted you don't have the mentality for it right now. Throw on top of it basic life and relationship issues and you probably won't be much further along than any college kid taking a class a semester.

I could be wrong, and you might be a language prodigy that really tackles it for the next year or two.. but I still don't think that's necessary if your goal is simply to go to Japan and teach. That 1.5-2 year window you gave yourself is probably for other non-Japan related stuff to get settled, in which case it's just an excuse to not leave right now.

Just go.

Ha, fair enough. Even if you're slightly off the mark (not your fault--I didn't adequately explain my situation), I appreciate your frankness. Learning Japanese to me is more important than a means to an end; I have a strong desire to speak and read the language.

The 1.5-2 year window is for two reasons:

1) To save money (I can't currently afford a plane ticket). I recently took on a semi-lucrative freelance gig that should allow me to do this effectively.
2) I'm in a lease with my girlfriend, and I'm not eager to leave her. She fully understands and supports my desire to go, and her job is such that spending some time with me in Japan isn't unreasonable. She teaches online, so a stint in Japan wouldn't mean the end of our relationship.
 

upandaway

Member
Just to drop some truth bombs, you will not need a lick of Japanese if you want to go to teach English in Japan this second. If that's why you're studying, just stop now, apply, and go. You will most likely not take your studies seriously enough and end up wasting 1.5-2 years because you thought you needed some sort of "foundation." Just go. You'll retain more from simply being there and being around it all the time. If you're studying because you actually want to be proficient in the language, that's fine, but you've already admitted you don't have the mentality for it right now. Throw on top of it basic life and relationship issues and you probably won't be much further along than any college kid taking a class a semester.

I could be wrong, and you might be a language prodigy that really tackles it for the next year or two.. but I still don't think that's necessary if your goal is simply to go to Japan and teach. That 1.5-2 year window you gave yourself is probably for other non-Japan related stuff to get settled, in which case it's just an excuse to not leave right now.

Just go.
For what it's worth there's also the trap of thinking just being in the home country of a language does things without any effort which I don't think is truthful. If you study with a "I'll study the language here and magically learn to apply it when I'm there" that's not going to work, you'll need to do both things both here and there

I was never in Japan but that's the kind of thing that's the same for all languages, I think
 

I'm an expert

Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Ha, fair enough. Even if you're slightly off the mark (not your fault--I didn't adequately explain my situation), I appreciate your frankness. Learning Japanese to me is more important than a means to an end; I have a strong desire to speak and read the language.

The 1.5-2 year window is for two reasons:

1) To save money (I can't currently afford a plane ticket). I recently took on a semi-lucrative freelance gig that should allow me to do this effectively.
2) I'm in a lease with my girlfriend, and I'm not eager to leave her. She fully understands and supports my desire to go, and her job is such that spending some time with me in Japan isn't unreasonable. She teaches online, so a stint in Japan wouldn't mean the end of our relationship.


I wasn't off the mark. I knew the reasons were money and the girl. If you did jet they'd pay for your ticket anyway, but I know you wouldn't leave on the spot anyway. If your goal is to be proficient, get ready for some good hard work.


For what it's worth there's also the trap of thinking just being in the home country of a language does things without any effort which I don't think is truthful. If you study with a "I'll study the language here and magically learn to apply it when I'm there" that's not going to work, you'll need to do both things both here and there

I was never in Japan but that's the kind of thing that's the same for all languages, I think

I've met plenty of people who were there longer than me and couldn't even order a happy meal. Sure, they exist. But at the least there you pick up stuff you'd never think to study when in the comfort of your bedroom. I'm saying if the choice is be lazy at home or be lazy in Japan, might as well do Japan.
 

Desmond

Member

Cranzor

Junior Member
I haven't posted here in a while but I wanted to write a little retrospective about Remembering the Kanji since so many seem to dislike it. It took about a year to complete and I finished it about a year ago.

I went through Remembering the Kanji immediately after learning kana, which is pretty odd. I'm actually glad I did, but I'm not sure if I'd ever recommend anyone else do that.

If you want to learn how to write kanji and become familiar with the most common ones, it's fantastic. If you want to learn meanings, it's pretty good. If you want to learn anything else, it won't help at all.

I've still been keeping up with reviews in Anki. Nowadays, I miss nearly every one (it asks the meaning and I write the kanji). I write the ones I miss and review them afterwards though. I remember all of the ones I miss as soon as I review them, but in the moment when I try to recall them, I often just can't. But it doesn't really matter most of the time.

The most important benefit I got from completing the book was just becoming familiar with the kanji. Before going through it, they looked like a chaotic mess of strokes. Afterwards, I could recognize them in words and so on pretty easily.

Right now, I'm going through Genki and I keep thinking how glad I was to finish RTK since it really helps me remember vocabulary easier.

So in case anyone is thinking of using it: I don't know if I'd recommend it. See if you can check it out beforehand somehow, you might like it. I ended up going in expecting to learn something completely different than I actually did. I'm glad I did and I don't regret it, but it might not be for everyone.
 
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