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[Guzim]

Why The Dark Knight Should Not Win Best Picture

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1.
By SpeedingUptoStop on January 10, 2009 at 4:09 pm

You really do like to play things close to the chest!

 

[Blader]

I posted it in the oscar thread but for those don't look there: Why The Dark Knight Should Not Win Best Picture

I don't know if I'd say TDK deserves to win Best Picture, but to put Slumdog and Wall-E over it? Hell no.

 

[Expendable.]

hes not psychic, but as he said before, people are predictable. any specific points that you have a problem with?

One specific point I never could get my head around was the henchmen in the buildings to pull the wire on the helicopter. How'd they know the copter would be that high? Exactly at that point? How did they know the car chase would wind up there?

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

 

[Ashhong]

One specific point I never could get my head around was the henchmen in the buildings to pull the wire on the helicopter. How'd they know the copter would be that high? Exactly at that point? How did they know the car chase would wind up there?

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

well they knew the car chase would end up there because it was right outside of that tunnel and the only way to their destination.

the height thing i cannot explain lol. but since the joker knew they would need air support, maybe he knew that they would need to be at a certain height to shoot. its not 100% believable, but its definitely plausible imo

 

[Solo]

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

Its best not to analyze some of these things, because yeah, you'll find a fair bit of holes. TDK is a great movie, but there are quite a few things small issues like this that really have no explanation. Most of the Joker's plans seem to hinge on about 10 different things going off perfectly.

 

[Mr. Sam]

I could see WALL-E being put over The Dark Knight, but Slumdog Millionaire? Really? It's good, no doubt, but I'd like to hear the reasons that you thought that it was a better film.

I hear Slumdog is brilliant. I wouldn't know.

Spoiler

I preferred Changeling to TDK TBH.

 

[dmshaposv]

I don't get the circle jerking over slumdog millionaire. The movie is visually fantastic and masterully directed (Danny Boyle deserves a director oscar) but the story was your typical rags to riches.

I noticed in that blog he says TDK primarily doesn't deserve the best picture oscar because of its plot holes. Slumdog also has its fair share of plotholes, the most jarring of which I'd like to point out:

Spoiler

Salim and Jamal are two slumdogs who never completed their education, yet they are suddenly able to talk fluently in english? keep in mind that this would not have been a problem had the entire film was in english language - but quite a few characters also spoke in hindi. There is a clear distinction made when the characters switched languages.

I'm not the one to hand out oscars, but while I agree that TDK had several flaws, so did Slumdog. If one can say that TDK doesn't deserve a best picture statue for its flaws, the same argument can also be made for slumdog (or any other oscar bait film released this year, for that matter).

Anyway if there is one thing we all can agree upon: 2008 was one the weakest year in film this decade.

 

[Solo]

Anyway if there is one thing we all can agree upon: 2008 was one the weakest year in film this decade.

Ive been saying this for weeks now, except I say it IS the weakest, and by a rather large margin, too. If 2007's best had come out in 2008, then we wouldnt even be talking about Slumdog, TDK, or Benjamin Button for Best Picture. I would take any of TWBB, Jesse James, Into The Wild, or No Country over any of 2008's crop.

 

[Expendable.]

I don't get the circle jerking over slumdog millionaire. The movie is visually fantastic and masterully directed (Danny Boyle deserves a director oscar) but the story was your typical rags to riches.

I noticed in that blog he says TDK primarily doesn't deserve the best picture oscar because of its plot holes. Slumdog also has its fair share of plotholes, the most jarring of which I'd like to point out:

Spoiler

Salim and Jamal are two slumdogs who never completed their education, yet they are suddenly able to talk fluently in english? keep in mind that this would not have been a problem had the entire film was in english language - but quite a few characters also spoke in hindi. There is a clear distinction made when the characters switched languages.

I'm not the one to hand out oscars, but while I agree that TDK had several flaws, so did Slumdog. If one can say that TDK doesn't deserve a best picture statue for its flaws, the same argument can also be made for slumdog (or any other oscar bait film released this year, for that matter).

Anyway if there is one thing we all can agree upon: 2008 was one the weakest year in film this decade.

http://thefilmstage.com/2009/01/05/in-defense-ofthe-2008-film-season/

 

[Ashhong]

I don't get the circle jerking over slumdog millionaire. The movie is visually fantastic and masterully directed (Danny Boyle deserves a director oscar) but the story was your typical rags to riches.

I noticed in that blog he says TDK primarily doesn't deserve the best picture oscar because of its plot holes. Slumdog also has its fair share of plotholes, the most jarring of which I'd like to point out:

Spoiler

Salim and Jamal are two slumdogs who never completed their education, yet they are suddenly able to talk fluently in english? keep in mind that this would not have been a problem had the entire film was in english language - but quite a few characters also spoke in hindi. There is a clear distinction made when the characters switched languages.

I'm not the one to hand out oscars, but while I agree that TDK had several flaws, so did Slumdog. If one can say that TDK doesn't deserve a best picture statue for its flaws, the same argument can also be made for slumdog (or any other oscar bait film released this year, for that matter).

Anyway if there is one thing we all can agree upon: 2008 was one the weakest year in film this decade.

i dont understand how people can use the argument that "its a typical story". many movies are variations of the same idea. you could say TDK is just your typical good vs evil story as well. its not the premise that matters, its the execution. and thats where slumdog excels imo.

also i would hardly call that a jarring plot hole. u dont hear any talking for many years if i remember right. from when they get on the train until they get to the taj mahal. if everyone is around them, who knows what they could learn. at least they kind of leave it open, which isnt the case in TDK

 

[Solo]

http://thefilmstage.com/2009/01/05/in-defense-ofthe-2008-film-season/

While I dont personally have an issue with it (as youre generally an agreeable chap and a good poster), I must say, man you get away with an awful lot of self-promotion here at GAF :lol

 

[Mr. Sam]

Ive been saying this for weeks now, except I say it IS the weakest, and by a rather large margin, too. If 2007's best had come out in 2008, then we wouldnt even be talking about Slumdog, TDK, or Benjamin Button for Best Picture. I would take any of TWBB, Jesse James, Into The Wild, or No Country over any of 2008's crop.

Move to England. They were all 2008 films for us. Probably.

Spoiler

And half of these new Oscar nominees are 2009 films.

But hey, I can call No Country my 2008 film!

 

[Solo]

Move to England. They were all 2008 films for us. Probably.

Be prepared for a 2009 drought then! :lol

 

[Panda Bear]

One specific point I never could get my head around was the henchmen in the buildings to pull the wire on the helicopter. How'd they know the copter would be that high? Exactly at that point? How did they know the car chase would wind up there?

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

I'm curious, can you name a film without plot holes?

 

[PhoenixDark]

Ive been saying this for weeks now, except I say it IS the weakest, and by a rather large margin, too. If 2007's best had come out in 2008, then we wouldnt even be talking about Slumdog, TDK, or Benjamin Button for Best Picture. I would take any of TWBB, Jesse James, Into The Wild, or No Country over any of 2008's crop.

Agreed. I'm baffled about Benjamin Button even being on consideration. It's an average film on nearly every level, except for the technical wizardry. TDK is much better, despite its flaws

 

[y2dvd]

As much as I like TDK, after repeated viewings, I agree that Wall-E is above TDK. I dunno about Slumdog Millionaire though.

 

[I_D]

One specific point I never could get my head around was the henchmen in the buildings to pull the wire on the helicopter. How'd they know the copter would be that high? Exactly at that point? How did they know the car chase would wind up there?

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

The Joker and his men made them go into the tunnel, and then used vehicles to ensure things went their way. There are only so many exits from a tunnel. It would be safe to assume the Joker had men at other exits as well.


As for the helicopter, they didn't shoot the cables until the helicopter was in sight. The helicopter didn't need to hit the cables directly at the X crossing, it only needed to hit one cable. It wouldn't really be that hard to pull off.



EDIT:
I'm probably the lone soldier in this...
But WALL-E gets worse every time I watch it. :lol

 

[ezekial45]

I'm probably the lone soldier in this...
But WALL-E gets worse every time I watch it. :lol

You're not. I like Wall-E, but i think the movie has been getting a lot more praise than it deserves imo. I still think that The Incredibles is the better pixar movie.

 

[rollingstart]

Agreed. I'm baffled about Benjamin Button even being on consideration. It's an average film on nearly every level, except for the technical wizardry. TDK is much better, despite its flaws

I can agree with that. Not only with Button, but I just don't understand the insane amounts of love for Slumdog either.

 

[Blader]

One specific point I never could get my head around was the henchmen in the buildings to pull the wire on the helicopter. How'd they know the copter would be that high? Exactly at that point? How did they know the car chase would wind up there?

I would love answers, because I'm sure people know more about this stuff than I do.

It's not like they were hanging the wires like a clothesline, they were being fired out of guns. As long as the chopper wasn't flying completely above the buildings, they could fire the wire wherever they wanted.

And the Joker knew where the car chase would lead because he was forcing the cops to go that way, first with the burning fire truck that blocked the original route, and then by chasing them in the tunnel.

 

[Blader]

You're not. I like Wall-E, but i think the movie has been getting a lot more praise than it deserves imo. I still think that The Incredibles is the better pixar movie.

I also think Wall-E is overrated. It's a cute film, but I don't see what the big deal is. Same with Slumdog.

And incidentally, since when did Danny Boyle become one of the greatest directors of this generation? Slumdog is the only of his films that I've seen, but were Sunshine and 28 Days Later really that good?

 

[I_D]

I also think Wall-E is overrated. It's a cute film, but I don't see what the big deal is. Same with Slumdog.

And incidentally, since when did Danny Boyle become one of the greatest directors of this generation? Slumdog is the only of his films that I've seen, but were Sunshine and 28 Days Later really that good?

28 Days Later is fantastic. The best zombie movie ever made, IMO ([Rec] is close, though).


Sunshine is also fantastic... cept the very end. It has great scenes, but the ending is too damn bad to consider the movie a must-see.

 

[thetrin]

The comment on that awful review was great:

Thank you -- one of the few reviewers who's not mesmerized by this overblown videogame imagery masquerading as story. The only character that had any resemblance to a complex human was Alfred, but the continual shifts & multiple-climaxes gave the movie an illusion of depth. Armond White is one of the few reviewers who applied some consciousness & sensitivity to the onslaught of effects. I'll be checking out White's reviews.

Note to anyone who considers themselves an authority on movies: stop using video games as a derogatory term. It makes you sound like a 75 year old mental patient.

 

[master15]

I would take any of TWBB, Jesse James, Into The Wild, or No Country over any of 2008's crop.

One of those doesn't belong.

While I dont personally have an issue with it (as youre generally an agreeable chap and a good poster), I must say, man you get away with an awful lot of self-promotion here at GAF :lol

I'm glad I'm not the only one that has noticed. Yikes, and here I thought mods banned that kind of spamming.

 

[jett]

Slumdog is one of the most overrated oscarbaits I've seen in years.

 

[jett]

You're not. I like Wall-E, but i think the movie has been getting a lot more praise than it deserves imo. I still think that The Incredibles is the better pixar movie.

That's because Brad Bird >>>> all the pixar-douches combined

 

[Solo]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that has noticed. Yikes, and here I thought mods banned that kind of spamming.

Hard to miss after he'd made several threads, all of which were links to his website and reviews :lol I too assumed the ban hammer would have come down. But, like I say, he seems like a decent enough guy, so it doesnt bother me too much.

 

[Expendable.]

Hard to miss after he'd made several threads, all of which were links to his website and reviews :lol I too assumed the ban hammer would have come down. But, like I say, he seems like a decent enough guy, so it doesnt bother me too much.

The few threads about reviews and news were just sources. The posts with just links in this thread was my friend who wrote the article. He used this account to defend what he wrote. Won't happen again though.

 

[Patrick Bateman]

During the course of the film, the Joker only once removes his make-up, causing it to become more unkempt and resemble an infection as it worsens.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Knight_(film)#Design


When does he do that? I can't remember.

Ah, he did it at that police memorial/funeral:

 

[Expendable.]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dark_Knight_(film)#Design


When does he do that? I can't remember.

Ah, he did it at that police memorial/funeral:

Yeah I remember when that picture was released before TDK actually came out and was wondering WTF was going on. Great make-up work.

 

[dmshaposv]

So we've practically ripped apart the entire 2008 line-up in one page. Almost every important film released this year has been called overated by someone or the other.Good job, Gaf. :lol

 

[ezekial45]

So TDK only has one nomination at the golden globes tonight, right?

EDIT: Yup.

 

[B.K.]

Harvey Dent lives?

 

[ezekial45]

Harvey Dent lives?

I don't know what to believe anymore. :lol

EDIT: I'm glad that TDK has gotten a lot of enthusiasm from the community at the Golden Globes. Tom Cruise seemed really into it.

 

[rollingstart]

Harvey Dent lives?

more like early signs of going wacko over people asking him that question all the time

 

[UltimaPooh]

Not that shit again.

 

[thetechkid]

Harvey Dent lives?

As much proof as I need.

 

[wRATH2x]

Harvey Dent lives?

Oh My GOD!!!!!!

:0

 

[Game-Biz]

Harvey Dent lives?

Well, fuck me sideways.

 

[Patrick Bateman]

I still hope Ledger's death was a publicity stunt and that he will reprise his role as the Joker in the next Batman movie.


Can't wait!

 

[wRATH2x]

I still hope Ledger's death was a publicity stunt and that he will reprise his role as the Joker in the next Batman movie.


Can't wait!

I really,REALLY want that to happen.

But thats never,NEVER gonna happen.

R.I.P.

Heath :_(

 

[Young Nobleman Of Sadness]

Harvey Dent lives?

I'd like to see him back in the sequel, honestly. Not only because Two Face is the second greatest Villains in the Batman Gallery, but because Eckhart did an awesome job. But above all, it got too little screen time...

Story-wise, Gordon and Bats could had put him secretly under threatment in Arkham Asylum, and faked his death not to dissapoint the people of Gotham.

This could be one of the Plot Twists in the Third Film, revealing that Harvey was alive all along.

Just add Edward Nigma sending riddles to Bats and Gordon telling them that he knows who's got the "Five Star Room in Arkham" during the first part of the movie and we have half of the script already written.

P.D: I still can't belive they didn't paid another homage to The Long Halloween, ending TDK in the same Fashion.

You know, "Rachel...." instead of "Gilda..."

 

[Masked Man]

SO happy about last night. I didn't watch the Golden Globes--as per usual, because I never know when they're being aired--but I awoke to pleasant news this morning. Heath totally deserved the award and I'm so happy for him and all of the hard work that went into the film itself. I think this bodes well for us come Oscar night.

Oh, and since no one else responded to this yet:

How about this "off-the-cuff" Dent soundbite then (which I am paraphrasing): "Either you die a hero, or live long enough to become the villain."

Dent's a politician, and he's currently having dinner with one of the richest and most powerful men in the world. Naturally, some of the politician-charm will come oozing out in hopes of impressing Mr. Wayne, so it's unsurprising that he resorted to something affected so as to seem witty and/or memorable.

 

[Skiptastic]

http://thefilmstage.com/2009/01/05/in-defense-ofthe-2008-film-season/

I'm sorry, did you just say that Sex Drive is one of the most underrated comedies in movie history?

Now THAT'S comedy! :lol

 

[pringles]

I also think Wall-E is overrated. It's a cute film, but I don't see what the big deal is. Same with Slumdog.

Exactly. It's a nice movie and if I was 10 years old then maybe I'd think it was one of the best movies ever, but just the thought of it being nominated for a Best Picture Oscar is silly to me.
I don't really think TDK deserves a BP nomination either though, as much as I love it.

 

[Expendable.]

I'm sorry, did you just say that Sex Drive is one of the most underrated comedies in movie history?

Now THAT'S comedy! :lol

Yeah definitely. It was one of the funniest of the year. Too bad no one saw it.

 

[AniHawk]

SO happy about last night. I didn't watch the Golden Globes--as per usual, because I never know when they're being aired--but I awoke to pleasant news this morning. Heath totally deserved the award and I'm so happy for him and all of the hard work that went into the film itself. I think this bodes well for us come Oscar night.

Oh, and since no one else responded to this yet:



Dent's a politician, and he's currently having dinner with one of the richest and most powerful men in the world. Naturally, some of the politician-charm will come oozing out in hopes of impressing Mr. Wayne, so it's unsurprising that he resorted to something affected so as to seem witty and/or memorable.

But what about Rachel saying that the last guy they let guard Rome never let up his power. NO HE WAS STABBED TO DEATH AND NEVER BECAME EMPEROR.

I'm glad she exploded.

 

[Escape Goat]

But what about Rachel saying that the last guy they let guard Rome never let up his power. NO HE WAS STABBED TO DEATH AND NEVER BECAME EMPEROR.

I'm glad she exploded.

But did he ever give up his power willingly?

 

[Bit-Bit]

Exactly. It's a nice movie and if I was 10 years old then maybe I'd think it was one of the best movies ever, but just the thought of it being nominated for a Best Picture Oscar is silly to me.
I don't really think TDK deserves a BP nomination either though, as much as I love it.

So does Wall-E and TDK have to fit into some sort of criteria for them to be considered for BP? I mean, people really like these two movies. That's reason enough. Do both of them need great music, great acting, great stories, great everything in order to be nominated? Because I thought they both had very good qualities of all of these things. The story in Wall-E might not be complicated but it sure is told in an amazing way.

They are both really good films. Wall-E to me was a great film that will forever remain a classic. I can re-watch Wall-E a million times and never get bored. If that doesn't deserve a BP than I don't know what will.

 

[Dabookerman]

So does Wall-E and TDK have to fit into some sort of criteria for them to be considered for BP? I mean, people really like these two movies. That's reason enough. Do both of them need great music, great acting, great stories, great everything in order to be nominated? Because I thought they both had very good qualities of all of these things. The story in Wall-E might not be complicated but it sure is told in an amazing way.

They are both really good films. Wall-E to me was a great film that will forever remain a classic. I can re-watch Wall-E a million times and never get bored. If that doesn't deserve a BP than I don't know what will.

People prefer overly cliched, incredibly predictable tripe like Slumdog Millionaire, a film that will pretty much be seen the same way Crash is seen now, in a few years time.

Dark Knight was amazing. People didn't go watch it in the cinemas multiple times just because they wanted it to get good sales at the box office.
Wall-e is amazing, Pixar are the masters at 3D animated movies, and they should be the only ones allowed to make them. Infact no, Dreamworks and all the other wannabees should continue making them, so when Pixar does release one, they show people exactly how 3D Animated movies should be made. Not counting on celebrity voice work to get people to watch your film, but instead talented animators, artists, direction to get people to watch it.

I mean, don't people here say that Toy Story 2 is a bit crap as well?

These are the same people that will say Dark Knight is overrated.