1.4 million
The Guardian: Street Fighter V: victory and diversity in the eSports world final
- Thread starter Tripon
- Start date
Really you think there is 800k copies on shelves plus there is many unranked people last time i checked to 999999.
Killa Sasa
Member
Call it moving goalposts for some (not me as I've been consistent on it since jump street), but I think a lot of people who like the game despite its significant issues see it as a missed opportunity.
Think of what would happen if they didn't botch the launch. Would be significantly bigger, no? Capcom can't have it both ways in terms of growing their base or profile speedily in this demo and providing a subpar package as a whole. Mutually exclusive goals.
The gameplay is good. *The packaging is not.* It's not a death blow but it makes a difference.
As is, I and other players will get a lot out of it but plenty of others won't. Game and community will be fine but I think you're not seeing the entire picture if you don't see this as a missed opportunity.
Not everything is pure success or bomba; sometimes things are just somewhat disappointing for publishers or players alike. Everyone needs to take their claims down to 4/10, oy.
More on topic: solid results but hope they have a plan to grow it. Was a pretty good watch too.
Watch Marvel do numbers if Papa Mickey forces them to get their shit together, have a real plan/package and execute supremely at launch.
Think of what would happen if they didn't botch the launch. Would be significantly bigger, no? Capcom can't have it both ways in terms of growing their base or profile speedily in this demo and providing a subpar package as a whole. Mutually exclusive goals.
The gameplay is good. *The packaging is not.* It's not a death blow but it makes a difference.
As is, I and other players will get a lot out of it but plenty of others won't. Game and community will be fine but I think you're not seeing the entire picture if you don't see this as a missed opportunity.
Not everything is pure success or bomba; sometimes things are just somewhat disappointing for publishers or players alike. Everyone needs to take their claims down to 4/10, oy.
More on topic: solid results but hope they have a plan to grow it. Was a pretty good watch too.
Watch Marvel do numbers if Papa Mickey forces them to get their shit together, have a real plan/package and execute supremely at launch.
Well, first I'd ask how you even check that. The game doesn't have sort options for the bottom of the leaderboard and there doesn't seem to be a web leaderboard.
The ~600k number I posited came from me encountering a player with 10LP when I started my PC account a couple of months ago. I remember feeling like that rank being only that number was a bad sign for sales. Around the same time, a thread on NeoGAF was posted about how few copies the game had sold between April and September both digitally and physical.
So you don't actually know. Regardless of how much it actually sold (which I highly doubt is 600K) 1.4m copies were still shipped and that revenue will go back to Capcom.
Are you bloody kidding me?
These games are way bigger, both casuals and hardcore gamers enjoy it, its fun, require less technical nouns (you have 4 abilities), can run one any computer, most of my friends and family play it and they don't like games, there is a healthy amount of depth to 100+ champs, etc
I could go on, but if you chose to be willfully obtuse and ignorant, then please don't come near Moba threads and moan.
Not sure what Capcom's revenue has to do with the discussion.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I feel like this is akin to pondering why a simple sport like soccer is more popular worldwide than something with more complexity like baseball or football.
It's pretty self-evident. There's a low barrier for casual entry, meaning there's a sizable fanbase made of current or ex-participants. To complement that, higher level play is fairly understandable to the average Joe with a pretty little amount of investment.
Except I'd argue that Street Fighter is the Football in this analogy and we live in the horrific alternate timeline where Handegg is a global sport. You can't get a lower barrier to entry than "hit them more than they hit you".
You really should cool your outrage for a second and read what I actually wrote. I'm not saying that anyone who likes MOBAs is a knuckle-dragging neanderthal (although I am of the opinion that team based competitive multiplayer is the root of all society's woes), just that I think they make for a terrible spectator experience especially going in blind.
Keep on going down below 0 lp then you will see lots of people ranked 999999 repeating until you get sick of it and go out lol.
It's more anticipation than reaction when you played fighting games nearly 20 years. Daigo once said he tries to filter his opponents' playstyles into types.
thelastword
Banned
Good article. I hope numbers and popularity improves even more next year, when popular and stalwart characters like Akuma, Sagat, "Blanka...lol" make a return.
Yeah Blanka...if any character is a casual bringer...it's the green jungled Brazilian...
Yeah Blanka...if any character is a casual bringer...it's the green jungled Brazilian...
Megawarrior
Member
Ricki and nuckledu at the grand finals felt so perfect to me but I still can't believe infiltration flopped like that. 😧 He got lazy.
Sorry, got emotional all of the sudden (doesn't help that everyone here on GAF is expert on MOBA even though few of them have played it.
Its a great spectator sport. The fact that hundreds of millions of people play it, make it more familiar and familiarity brings understanding to enjoy high-level technical and strategic plays.
Fighting games are niche, whether people ignore it or not is up to them. Its not flashy and it revolves around mashing buttons on situations people don't know unless you play to an high level. MOBAs can be relatable. I have learned so much by just watching (and I am still shite) on another hand, I can never relate to Fighting games pros, because I cannot pull off those moves.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I mean that's a reductive view of MOBAs, but that still points to my soccer analogy. "Kick the ball in the net more than they kick it in yours." The rulebook for FIFA is like 1/3-1/2 the size of the NFLs, and there's a reason why soccer is popular worldwide, when football is way more complicated in terms of rulesets and way higher in terms of entry.
I don't know if the ruleset analogy is great here.
The barrier of entry is a bit lower for mobas but the knowledge wall of arcane and arbitrary things to know about the game to get anywhere is just as big as in fighting games. Though unlike in say, SF5, the matchmaking also has a much bigger pool of complete beginners.
In the end, all e-sports are super complicated, even stuff like CS. Which is why most people who watch, especially regularly, have at least some knowledge of what is going on. And why the popular e-sports to watch are usually also fairly popular games.
NipplesAndToes23
Member
Oh shit, for real? Maybe I should've watched it. Usually someone Japanese or Korean be winning the biggest tournaments lately.
Rashid easily had the best arc of the SFV story. I really hope Capcom continues to ride that high & put him in MvCI as the SFV rep.
As for Ricki, while I was rooting for NuckleDu, I wouldn't have minded her winning. Ricki worked her ass off to get where she got in the Capcom Cup & I look forward to seeing her improve further in Season 2.
NipplesAndToes23
Member
Ninja, you fucking sleep. Them catchy ass character themes. That fucking"Moments in Love" with Dan, the tranquility of Sakura, the intensity of "Crumbling Laboratory", that shit is about to go down shit with Ryu vs Gouken. This dude here.
Scrub Mcgrubb
Member
Yeah Japan is having a rough year... EVO champ is Korean... Capcom Cup champ is American. The same just happened for Tekken 7... the EVO champ and now Iron Fist champ is a Korean player as well.
BlackBanditSho
Member
Dunno, MrCarter. There are a lot of people who feel like Barkley's Justice, and as we enter season two, it would be unwise for capcom to overlook them.
The division between 'traditional' gamers and 'Esports' folk is of great concern to me professionally and personally.
I don't get it.
Street Fighter is the one game that has roots in traditional game history. Many 'core' gamers played it in their arcades, or their Sega Genesis, Super Nintendoes, Laundry mats, or local pizza shops. If there's one game that crosses over the generational, cultural, and technological divides, it's Street Fighter, right? Even Madden or any long- running sports game comes with the shackles of jock-culture or understanding material that, for a long time, was counter-culture to most gamers.
Street Fighter was one of the games that, regardless your gaming tastes, you probably owned. It took me a while to understand, but I totally get why the audience that doesn't give a shit about tourneys is so angry at the lack of an arcade mode. Or launching with a package that completely misunderstood the bulk of the game's purchasing audience.
There was a miscalculation, but Capcom is course-correcting in the best way that a giant corporation can.
My concern is that the spectator audience for this game should be much larger.
Of the esports, it seems the easiest to follow. It has history with the gaming audience.
This isn't about how many sold or who is playing the game. I'm wondering why the gaming audience doesn't follow SF like regular people watch football or basketball.
These are the things I try to tackle.
I didn't know Nage worked on SF5.
I think Nash and Ken got hurt the most by the reduction in kaput delay.
Japan has a real young talent problem. There are a few, but they don't have a NuckleDu. Like even Eita is 28 or something and he's sometimes treated liked a newcomer.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
I always figured that the whole point of SFV's character select thing was to force people to pick a main. I can't see any other reason for that implantation.
No, the question is why you even need a character select screen if you don't know what your opponent is going to pick anyway (like SF4 before you had two Ultras). It saves a lot of time this way.
UcchedavÄda
Member
In theory it would also allow for better match-making, since the server can match you up based on your performance with the character you've selected, instead of your overall performance. But I don't think that SFV actually does that.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
UcchedavÄda
Member
Considering their avenue into e-sports as well as the increased amount of people that have been involved and have watched SFV since SFIV I don't think it's too early to say it's been successful - which is what the main point of this thread is. The sheer passion and dedication from these "hardcore" players from diverse backgrounds is what is being celebrated, and it should be, because they have worked for years to get there.
People who blame the "tournament scene" are simply trying to find something to shit on because they didn't get the attention they allegedly deserve but what they don't realise is that the focus should have been on both the core and casual player. People will keep on playing the game regardless however I do hope they put something together for casuals soon.
even if it is easy to follow(a health bar) it's not exciting unless I understand the skill and strategy involved. personally I like team games and long matches. short game length is not a positive to me.
Other than Akuma all the characters in season 2 are new to Street Fighter, if they're being honest us, that is.
Tekken was always a Korea game though, losing SF is something else. This was supposed to be their forte.
BlackBanditSho
Member
for the past 5 years, i've been talking to friends about a 'what if' scenario where SF is team-play only at tourneys. Something like Korea's CRASH 3v3 format. It adds a whole new element of strategy. You could steal the concept of 'picks and bans' from MOBAS, and even copy traditional baseball where you can alter your starting line-up or rotate out depending on the situation.
I'd go so far as having the year of tourneys be scouting grounds for points and teams, where at the top of the season, like every sport, you can even have a player draft.
Basically, I'd shake-up SF in a major way. Teams offer a sense of regional pride or spectator ownership. There's camaraderie, and great drama. Use 1v1 games throughout the year as players work to get picked up by teams. The big 'premiere' events are team-based only.
Those are my suggestions. Then again, I"m the insane dude that wants Capcom to have a career mode that allows you to play in the FGC working your way up to sponsored player and fighting sim a.i versions of the top players. Update stats regularly. FGC Player profiles, rivalries, mains, and info in game. All leading towards Capcom Cup.
Ultrachen does commentary. Replay analysis. etc. Let ESPN pay for some to so it can be an ESPN production with ESPN graphics everywhere.
And yes, casuals still get their Arcade mode.
But I'm insane and very much in the minority.
TheSpoiler
Member
He was a rep for that FF cross over so I could definitely see him in Marvel.
Thanks for saying that! I too liked how Rashid was first introduced in the story and then slowly becomes the hero. It really surprised and sort of touched me when John Takeuchi said that he started playing Rashid purely because of the story, because he was this character who was so utterly loyal to his friend. Good stuff!
I super hope you are right! When I was young, I was so sure this is how we would advance. Things recently feel dire, but it's mostly likely me realizing that this "better time" isn't actually going to happen in my own lifetime, or at least to the extent I hoped.
I would looooove to know how Capcom comes up with new characters. I imagine two Wheel of Fortune-like devices; one of non-sequitor ideas, the other of skin colours - except, you know, green is on that wheel.
this isnt a moba thread tho
Shadoken
Member
More like MOBAs are Football and Street Fighter is UFC/Boxing. Team sports will always be more popular , regardless if the 1v1 sport is easier to understand.
But there is always something about that 1v1 aspect , maybe if everything went right with SFV and it was handled better by a better management it could achieve that. eSports in general need to be more mainstream for something like FGs to pick up. Right now it is still very much relegated to the same audience that buys their game.
Traditional sports on the other hand is followed by tons of the people who dont actively "play" that sport. And right now Dota and League have a much bigger player base than SF. Especially when countries like China which have HUGE Moba playerbase dont really play Fighting games all that much. F2P is a major thing over there.