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[Sathsquatch]

Work harder for the PS3! That's meeting the needs of the consumer.

Even if the PS3 is expensive, Sony is still likely to take a loss on the hardware. That DOES meet the needs of the consumer by giving them a great value on the hardware. The PS3 will also provide many people with cheap Blu-ray player. That meets the needs of consumers while still giving Sony the edge they need. That's how this industry SHOULD work.

 

[Deku]

Even if the PS3 is expensive, Sony is still likely to take a loss on the hardware. That DOES meet the needs of the consumer by giving them a great value on the hardware. The PS3 will also provide many people with cheap Blu-ray player. That meets the needs of consumers while still giving Sony the edge they need. That's how this industry SHOULD work.

oh believe meI agree. The reason why I'm supporting PS3 and Revolution this generation is because I am counting Sony corporate welfare to put me in the Blu-Ray bandwagon and unlike the PSP's stupid UMD, it isn't a crippled outdated duplicative movie format and will actually have a great future ahead of it. Revolution will probably have a lot of fun games too and that's the only place for me to get my Mario and Zelda fix until Nintendo goes 3rd party of course, or at least some people can hope, they've been at it for 5 years now.

 

[_Angelus_]

Deku and monkeyrun-both of you had better be joke characters. Otherwise the human race is in serious trouble.:b

 

[Deku]

Deku and monkeyrun-both of you had better be joke characters. Otherwise the human race is in serious trouble.:b

You said it Angelus! it must be right!

 

[Amir0x]

heh most of you people are in for a rude awakening. By the time next gen is over the Rev would have outsold both the 360 and PS3 in Japan and America while it also gains second place in europe. If anything women, yes women who happen to be ahead of times when it comes to how games should be played will ensure that the Rev becomes a runaway success story.

I agree with him. After Gamecube's rousing success in cutting off the fat in terms of third parties (all the 'trash', like RARE and Dennis Dyack and also some EA games and also every significant Japanese third party game and every significant Western third party game and basically everything significant except Nintendo first/second party efforts, stray sports titles and Ubisoft), Revolution is going to pull a DS on everyone. Cheaper development environment, fuck crazy interface (but brilliant, innovative, and world-changin'!); it's going to motivate all the important devs to provide the critical support that was actually missing from the Gamecube (and I mean, what did GCN miss anyway? Burnout Revenge, Final Fantasy X, XI and XII, Kingdom Hearts, Disgaea, Knights of the Old Republic, Ninja Gaiden, Halo, Katamari, Guitar Hero? Pfft. Who cares about those. Resident Evil 4 and Fire Emblem, bitches.).





...






But seriously, I definitely think a lot of people are underestimating how Rev will do. I think especially in Japan it has the opportunity to put the squeeze on Sony. They're starvin' for that shit. And with America getting ready for the XBX360 onslaught, I think Sony is gonna have to be extremely consistent to continue being such a major market leader. I say bring it on: It's gonna have an awesome supplemental library and of course Zelda. And it's gonna be genuinely different, so there's a sort of guarantee of new experiences. I hope some of them turn out to be awesome.

 

[monkeyrun]

Deku and monkeyrun-both of you had better be joke characters. Otherwise the human race is in serious trouble.:b

You said it Angelus! it must be right!

this pretty much sums this thread up :lol :lol :lol

 

[Diffense]

Revolution will do quite well...especially in Japan.

You have to be a jackass not to see that...

but then some people thought a Gameboy successor would wither to PSP overnight...lol

 

[gamergirly]

As someone else in this thread has already pointed out, the Xbox has consisently gotten multiple titles into the top 10 selling games for any given week this year. Your belief that the Xbox is not selling software as well as it should at this point in its lifecycle is factually incorrect.

I don't care about MS's losses. They were due MS's poor preparation when entering the console domain, but they have nothing to do with me. The Xbox was a good deal for me, the consumer, and I like that. The hardware advantage that MS bought with that money was relatively small. If the inferior PS2 could outsell the Xbox, the slightly inferior GC should have had no problem taking on the Xbox.

It's funny that you label me egotistical when you are the one claiming some kind of moral authority to attack me personally over some dispute about Nintendo. I used to defend Nintendo like that, but I tried to stop getting personal about these little internet arguments. It's just not worth it. I don't know what kind of emotional attachment you have to Nintendo, and I'm sorry if I offended you.

You still like Nintendo. Great, good for you. That means almost nothing in the context of this argument. Some people will remain loyal to Nintendo to the end for whatever reason, but a number of people become disillusioned with their bizarre philosophies and self-absorption. You don't have to look very far to see a number of people on this very board that are vocally disatisfied with their GCN's. Nintendo has lost their business and mine. More importantly, Nintendo has disatisfied large numbers of consumers each generation as evidenced by the fact that they have sold (in absolute terms and in terms of marketshare) fewer consoles each generation.

I'm currently an Xbox fan, but I used to be a huge Nintendo fan. I convinced no fewer than four people to buy Gamecubes in a single winter. I even went as far as to research deals for them so they could get the system for cheap. I've read enough about Nintendo in the last few years to change my mind about them. As a software developer, Nintendo has not really lived up to the high standards they set for themselves during previous generations. SMS, Zelda TWW, and their other titles are good but not nearly as exciting as their previous generation games. Nintendo could easily have done more to earn third party support or at least tried to fund more new IP's or done SOMETHING to make up for the lackluster third party support.

Nintendo rips people off to protect their bottom line, and I don't have to like it. Nintendo constantly resells their games on new platforms without even packaging them together as compilations, like other companies do. Now they expect consumers to pay the same price for "smaller games" to lower the cost of development. I hold Nintendo to the same standards that I hold any other company, and they aren't providing the same value as anyone else right now. I criticize them and their fanbase because I don't like people supporting this nonsense.

There's nothing factually incorrect about decreasing software sales. Xbox didnt outsell GC solely due to any hardware advantages or disadvantages(online gaming is a minor selling point), Nintendo's marketing and handling of the system harmed the console more than the competition did.

There's nothing personal or emotionally distatched, I just felt the need to correct you an overzealous, exaggerated definition of a Nintendo fan. It was almost ridiculous to be honest. Something expected from a fanboy, not somebody trying to claim to "unbiasedly" portray a situation.

Im not totally satisfied with my GC, either, but I dont feel the need to knock it up for a couple of cheap laughs. You can point at any system and make a big deal out of its faults and flaws. Just like the companies that make them. It just so happened you decided that GC should be the victim this time around bc of whatever grudges you have against Nintendo.

There's not a company in business today that doesnt rip off a customer. There's no reason for you to be jealous that Nintendo profits while other companies are not as fortunate. They might not have lived up the high standards that you might have set up for them, but that doesnt mean many others dont still enjoy their games. You cant play games for a company that has run itself out of business trying to please people like you.

 

[Deku]

There's not a company in business today that doesnt rip off a customer. There's no reason for you to be jealous that Nintendo profits while other companies are not as fortunate. They might not have lived up the high standards that you might have set up for them, but that doesnt mean many others dont still enjoy their games. You cant play games for a company that has run itself out of business trying to please people like you.

Except its highly unlikey MS or Sony will go out of business anytime soon, no matter how stupid they become. Not that they are stupid.

In anycase, the argument of the otherside is fundamentally flawed. It's a natural reaction to explain away why Nintendo can make good money by attacking how it makes money. In the same way that someone will attack Microsoft for being able to do what it did with the Xbox for gouging consumers with its Windows and Office suites. Should we all be angry at MS too?

Subsidized hardware is a great thing for consumers, but hardly something to be proud of since the corporations will find a way to extract their profits from you somewhere eventually.

 

[mckmas8808]

But seriously, I definitely think a lot of people are underestimating how Rev will do. I think especially in Japan it has the opportunity to put the squeeze on Sony. They're starvin' for that shit. And with America getting ready for the XBX360 onslaught, I think Sony is gonna have to be extremely consistent to continue being such a major market leader. I say bring it on: It's gonna have an awesome supplemental library and of course Zelda. And it's gonna be genuinely different, so there's a sort of guarantee of new experiences. I hope some of them turn out to be awesome.

You are like 1,000% correct. And I honestly think Sony sees this coming. To think that Sony doesn't see it is kinda being ignorant. Imagine if all those videos that Sony showed at E3 actually look exactly like that when released. People would still be very excited about their games.

I too think that Nintendo will do a 180 and surprise people in Japan. I might even be like the DS.

 

[Flo_Evans]

Well, to be fair, SotC is a major release. The same can be said about any company's major release compared to a strawman scenario.

And of course, the irony of your argument is that the derivative products you accuse Nintendo of manufacturing actually sell extremely well. So they probably aren't getting their ideas about people getting bored from those games, because they clearly aren't.

then where are they getting these ideas? do they have some sort of crystal ball where the can see another big crash is 10 years? WTF.

Lets be real here, the only company to signifactly expand the market has been SONY (by getting casual 'non-gamers' to buy sports games, not funky controllers). Nintendo keeps talking about non-gamers and other such BS because all of the gamers have choosen to go with sony, who has all the games. The only reason nintendo made profits was from GBA. If they know so much about what the industry needs to do to make consoles sucessfull why havent they apllied any of this foresight with the gamecube?

I mean I bought less than 10 games for my cube. I own more fuckin dreamcast games than cube games. WTF. That is a faluire. I dont really give a shit how many billion yen N has in the bank or how much MS lost. Give me more than 10 reasons to own your peice of shit plastic or STFU nintendo.

 

[PkunkFury]

But seriously, I definitely think a lot of people are underestimating how Rev will do. I think especially in Japan it has the opportunity to put the squeeze on Sony. They're starvin' for that shit. And with America getting ready for the XBX360 onslaught, I think Sony is gonna have to be extremely consistent to continue being such a major market leader. I say bring it on: It's gonna have an awesome supplemental library and of course Zelda. And it's gonna be genuinely different, so there's a sort of guarantee of new experiences. I hope some of them turn out to be awesome.

Right on the money. Sony has the most to lose next gen and they will really have to stay on their toes to keep their head above the competition. 360 is not only launching 6 months to a year ealrier, but the 360 library is really shaping up. I'm suprised at some of the Japanese support going into it already. I was dead certain my 2 consoles this gen would be PS3 and the Rev, but all of the 360 news is starting to get me hyped for next gen. If Microsoft's library keeps building, and Sony doesn't announce a price/release date that is to my liking, PS3 may lose my vote. And I know I'm not the only one thinking this way.

On the other front, Nintendo is giving consumers an actual reason to choose the Rev over the other systems this time (as opposed to the "It will play Zelda some day" that the GC had going for it). The different approach will be what sells the system. Rev may not put the crunch on Sony in America, but it'll take a nice bite of their bread and butter in Japan. All of you who don't think that the rev will sell at least on par with the GC need to re-evaluate your predictions. Considering how well gameboy re-releases of old Nintendo games have sold, how can you not picture the Rev being an explosive hit in Japan, with its I-tunes like library of classic games. Not even considering the next-gen software it will get, the Rev is already a force to be reckoned with over seas.

Revolution will be the type of thing sells on buzz. All it takes is one "must have" game for the Rev, and the machine becomes a hit, simply because no other platform can offer similar content. The Rev is the type of thing you will see on good morning america type shows. The type of thing that will attract crowds at demo stations, for no other reason than because people are curious. Remember the buzz the eyetoy got? Rev will have a similar force on its side, simply because the technology is different. However, unlike the Eyetoy, a steady stream of software could turn that buzz into real momentum. It could fail, but it could also succeed. I for one think it will at least perform at GC level. But, having seen absolutely no software for it yet, I don't think any of us can really make educated predictions.

 

[Deku]

then where are they getting these ideas? do they have some sort of crystal ball where the can see another big crash is 10 years? WTF.

That's a good question actually. I don't have an answer to it, but it maybe an issue with audience, mainly when Nintendo talks about people getting bored of games, they are referring to their home market, which has shrunken.

Lets be real here, the only company to signifactly expand the market has been SONY. Nintendo keeps talking about non-gamers and other such BS because all of the gamers have choosen to go with sony, who has all the games.

At one time, all the games were with Nintendo and with Atari before that. The market could easily shift to any number of different manufacturers. Actually, despite having a strong chance of maintaining its leadership with the PS3, every hardware reset pose a number of risks to the incumbent. I really wouldn't be so sure.

The only reason nintendo made profits was from GBA.

That's actually not true. They make profits because everything they do is highly profitable including their GC releases.

 

[Flo_Evans]

That's actually not true. They make profits because everything they do is highly profitable including their GC releases.

they may make profit from the cube, but I would really like to see the %. I bet it is less than 10%.

At one time, all the games were with Nintendo and with Atari before that. The market could easily shift to any number of different manufacturers. Actually, despite having a strong chance of maintaining its leadership with the PS3, every hardware reset pose a number of risks to the incumbent. I really wouldn't be so sure.

yes but it WAS sony who took gaming away from the 'nerds' and made it mainstream by expanding the market to 'non-gamers'. Nintendo is trying to do the same thing with a diffrent approach. and yet are labeled as 'inovators' or 'saving' the industry for mearly attempting the same thing sony did years ago.

 

[cvxfreak]

That's actually not true. They make profits because everything they do is highly profitable including their GC releases.

Yeah, I mean, how much could it have cost to develop something like Kirby no Air Ride which sold a million copies worldwide, or something like Atsumare Made in Wario?

 

[monkeyrun]

they may make profit from the cube, but I would really like to see the %. I bet it is less than 10%.

1 cent of profit is still profit, unlike MS xbox.

 

[xabre]

I might even be like the DS.

It'll be exactly like the DS. You don't need an expensive, features packed console for it to be a success, you need compelling software driving concepts that appeal to the most varied demographics of the market; sadly this forum is full of twats that think of only the former.

 

[_Angelus_]

then where are they getting these ideas? do they have some sort of crystal ball where the can see another big crash is 10 years? WTF.

Lets be real here, the only company to signifactly expand the market has been SONY (by getting casual 'non-gamers' to buy sports games, not funky controllers). Nintendo keeps talking about non-gamers and other such BS because all of the gamers have choosen to go with sony, who has all the games. The only reason nintendo made profits was from GBA. If they know so much about what the industry needs to do to make consoles sucessfull why havent they apllied any of this foresight with the gamecube?

I mean I bought less than 10 games for my cube. I own more fuckin dreamcast games than cube games. WTF. That is a faluire. I dont really give a shit how many billion yen N has in the bank or how much MS lost. Give me more than 10 reasons to own your peice of shit plastic or STFU nintendo.

Pretty slick post overall but your last paragraph hits the high point. Sega was strapped for cash,had to start from scratch because they had no brand to lean on,and yet they managed to put out a better product over a 2 year lifespan than Nintendo has with its GameCube. And people question why Nintendo are in trouble with regards to the console wars.

 

[ThunderEmperor]

then where are they getting these ideas? do they have some sort of crystal ball where the can see another big crash is 10 years? WTF.

Lets be real here, the only company to signifactly expand the market has been SONY (by getting casual 'non-gamers' to buy sports games, not funky controllers). Nintendo keeps talking about non-gamers and other such BS because all of the gamers have choosen to go with sony, who has all the games. The only reason nintendo made profits was from GBA. If they know so much about what the industry needs to do to make consoles sucessfull why havent they apllied any of this foresight with the gamecube?

I mean I bought less than 10 games for my cube. I own more fuckin dreamcast games than cube games. WTF. That is a faluire. I dont really give a shit how many billion yen N has in the bank or how much MS lost. Give me more than 10 reasons to own your peice of shit plastic or STFU nintendo.

tell us the truth did you actually buy all those games for the dc. Ihave a DC to and own all the games that came out on that system but never bought one . ahahahahhaha

 

[Amir0x]

Right on the money. Sony has the most to lose next gen and they will really have to stay on their toes to keep their head above the competition. 360 is not only launching 6 months to a year ealrier, but the 360 library is really shaping up. I'm suprised at some of the Japanese support going into it already. I was dead certain my 2 consoles this gen would be PS3 and the Rev, but all of the 360 news is starting to get me hyped for next gen. If Microsoft's library keeps building, and Sony doesn't announce a price/release date that is to my liking, PS3 may lose my vote. And I know I'm not the only one thinking this way.

On the other front, Nintendo is giving consumers an actual reason to choose the Rev over the other systems this time (as opposed to the "It will play Zelda some day" that the GC had going for it). The different approach will be what sells the system. Rev may not put the crunch on Sony in America, but it'll take a nice bite of their bread and butter in Japan. All of you who don't think that the rev will sell at least on par with the GC need to re-evaluate your predictions. Considering how well gameboy re-releases of old Nintendo games have sold, how can you not picture the Rev being an explosive hit in Japan, with its I-tunes like library of classic games. Not even considering the next-gen software it will get, the Rev is already a force to be reckoned with over seas.

Revolution will be the type of thing sells on buzz. All it takes is one "must have" game for the Rev, and the machine becomes a hit, simply because no other platform can offer similar content. The Rev is the type of thing you will see on good morning america type shows. The type of thing that will attract crowds at demo stations, for no other reason than because people are curious. Remember the buzz the eyetoy got? Rev will have a similar force on its side, simply because the technology is different. However, unlike the Eyetoy, a steady stream of software could turn that buzz into real momentum. It could fail, but it could also succeed. I for one think it will at least perform at GC level. But, having seen absolutely no software for it yet, I don't think any of us can really make educated predictions.

I agree. I think rev is primed to fill a sizable hole in the industry in terms of consumer desire, and it should work out well for Nintendo. That said, I also don't think it'll be a replacement. I think this is the first Nintendo innovation that would just end up being a legitimate alternative.

 

[heidern]

they may make profit from the cube, but I would really like to see the %. I bet it is less than 10%.

No it will be more than 10%. As of June 05 Nintendo had sold 295M GBA+DS games at around $30 each or less. By the same time they've sold 160M GC games at $50 a pop or less. Certainly portable hardware has been a lot more profitable than GC hardware, but overall if you combine hardware and software then GC is likely accounting for between 30-40% of their profits.

 

[methodman]

I mean I bought less than 10 games for my cube.

Well, you'll be buying that 11th one next year won't you?

edit: or 10th? lol

 

[Flo_Evans]

tell us the truth did you actually buy all those games for the dc. Ihave a DC to and own all the games that came out on that system but never bought one . ahahahahhaha

well maybe not all of them, but I bought more than 10 (wich I can't find all of atm )

Well, you'll be buying that 11th one next year won't you?

yeah I am still gonna buy Fire Emblem and Zelda. I guess thats the rub. I really get pissed at nintendo and all their BS, but I need Zelda in my gaming life.

Actually I am not sure how many cube games I have atm... I lent it to a friend to play RE4. I think it is something even more pathetic like 7. RE0, REremake, RE4, some rouge squadren game I got as a gift, SSB, WW, and SCII.

edit: 8, forgot about MP.

 

[ThunderEmperor]

then where are they getting these ideas? do they have some sort of crystal ball where the can see another big crash is 10 years? WTF.

Lets be real here, the only company to signifactly expand the market has been SONY (by getting casual 'non-gamers' to buy sports games, not funky controllers). Nintendo keeps talking about non-gamers and other such BS because all of the gamers have choosen to go with sony, who has all the games. The only reason nintendo made profits was from GBA. If they know so much about what the industry needs to do to make consoles sucessfull why havent they apllied any of this foresight with the gamecube?

I mean I bought less than 10 games for my cube. I own more fuckin dreamcast games than cube games. WTF. That is a faluire. I dont really give a shit how many billion yen N has in the bank or how much MS lost. Give me more than 10 reasons to own your peice of shit plastic or STFU nintendo.

tell us the truth did you actually buy all those games for the dc. Ihave a DC to and own all the games that came out on that system but never bought one . ahahahahhaha

 

[Tony HoTT]

well maybe not all of them, but I bought more than 10 (wich I can't find all of atm )





yeah I am still gonna buy Fire Emblem and Zelda. I guess thats the rub. I really get pissed at nintendo and all their BS, but I need Zelda in my gaming life.

First I gotta ask why the hell you're genuinely pissed at Nintendo?

You can buy a Cube for like 50 fuckin bucks now. What's their to be mad about? It had a good run with Windwaker, Metroid Prime, and Mario Sunshine in the beginning. Not their best games but better than most shit out there. Paper Mario rules too.

Get a fuckin grip atleast it's cheap.

 

[Flo_Evans]

First I gotta ask why the hell you're genuinely pissed at Nintendo?

You can buy a Cube for like 50 fuckin bucks now. What's their to be mad about? It had a good run with Windwaker, Metroid Prime, and Mario Sunshine in the beginning. Not their best games but better than most shit out there. Paper Mario rules too.

Get a fuckin grip atleast it's cheap.

I pissed cause I had one on day 1 dude. Its low resale value isn't really a bonus. :lol

 

[wonderfuldays]

Nintendo for the win!

:lol

 

[pgtl_10]

While I admire and respect Iwata I can't help noticing he has a very flawed viewpoint:



How exactly did GTA:SA or Halo 2 surprised gamers?
They didn't.

People wanted more of the same a better more of the same but still the same.
There has to be something that Sony and Microsoft are doing right when three GTA games sell around 50 million copies and two Halo games sell around 10 million copies while at the same time Nintendo is doing something wrong when two Metroid Prime games sell less than 2.5 milion copies.

The problem lies within Nintendo, not within gamers, they aren't bored - I'm not bored, is GAF bored with gaming?

I think you misunderstood what Iwata is trying to say here. I believe Iwata is saying that evantually people won't like what they are playing and would say:

"This happens every time! In every single game the same thing happens!"

I think Iwata is not talking about an immediate gaming crash but evantually people will get bored with gaming. I like Nintendo going with a fresh approach. They are trying to give me a relatively different product which I can try out and expierence. I have been getting bored with the way games are played now. The concept is the same and bores me. In that quote I think means difference and freshness. He wants people to say:

"I haven't played this before!"

No one is disputing that GTA and Halo aren't selling well but are other RPGs, shooter and so forth selling like they did a generation before?

 

[Tony HoTT]

About this Revolution.

I think it's going to be more successful than the DS. It IS going to bring in a lot of non-gamers and casual gamers regardless of what you people say. I think the terms "gamer", "non-gamer", and "casual gamer" are a little vague and undefined though. I'm going to go as far as saying it's not possible to define these catagories either... yet. These terms are being thrown around by bigwigs from all these companies who are attempting to tap into this "market". The sales of the next-gen console are really going to define what these groups are. I'm going to attempt to define these groups though.

I imagine gamers are those that buy atleast 1-2 games a month and play regularly. These people probably read about games either online or in magazines. They take this hobby seriously and dedicate a substantial portion of their income to keep up. Basically we know beforehand that these people are going to buy a next-gen console. Sony, and Microsoft are heavily targeting this market because they are informed. This is why we see all sorts of spec warfare going on. The companies want to keep a lasting impression the the gamer's mind.

Some people consider casual gamers the ones that buy Halo, and sports games. Others define them as people with a game system that may even be from a previous generation that just sits collecting dust in their entertainment center. Every once in awhile they'll pick up a game or put a quarter in the arcade machine at a movie theater. Everyone wants a piece of this market. The interest is there, but they really need to see something that genuinely impresses them. Third parties target this market through the use of licensed games, and console makers target them with some sort of advertising theme (Sony has the hightech thing going on, initially Xbox went after the Xtreme market, and some would argue Nintendo targeted kids however I think their problem was not having a definition). The Revolution will definitely catch the interest of this group.

The non-gamer is the person who is really hesitant to have anything to do with gaming. They are intimidated by game stores, and aren't willing to put in the effort to educate themselves. They are usually intrigued by games with simple interfaces. If they play a game they definitely don't want to spend time learning how. Arcade games where you point guns, play guitar, and dance around on a mat target this crowd really well. For those willing to put in more time there are simulation titles like Nintendogs, and The Sims that target this market really well. Nintendo has promised to tap into this market next generation. They will succeed because they are offering a new interface that's going to be easy for this non-gamer to jump right into. I can't count how many times people unfamiliar with games have picked up a controller and moved their whole body with their on screen avatar. Nintendo's controller is perfect for them. No matter how many times game companies have shoved their controller in their face the non-gamers haven't picked up on it. Nintendo will change that to a degree just by offering something new. For the most part these people are going to have no idea how things like gigahertz, ram, and hard drives affect their gaming experience. Throw a magic wand in their face and they are definitely going to give it a try.

While I can't tell the future I think the Revolution will do really well as long as interesting software is released. Nintendo has to prove its console though. They have to offer something right at launch. Something huge. But until we hear more information about specific games we're just going to have to wait and see what happens. It's really not worth arguing over.

 

[Deku]

The problem with labels is its connotaitons. Are the gamers who got hooked on the Sims any less of a gamer because they had no interest in games before The Sims and devoted substantial portions of their time playing the Sims? Non-gamers can be turned into gamers too. Lots of people who normally don't play a lot of games got hooked on The Sims, and they spent a lot of time on it and went out and bought the expansion pack. That may be their addiction and they may willingly go out and buy a new hardware to play the next generation of that game.

If you look at the sales of Nintendogs, which has probably sold over 500k units in NA by now, you have to wonder who is buying the game. There's a group on GAF who obviously bought them, but many people here probably don't own it. So someone out there in the market is buying the game and enjoying it. It may be their only game on the DS for months and months. Those are gamers too and they'll probably pick up more games that interests them once they have their foot in the door.

 

[Tony HoTT]

Deku- They are less of a gamers to corporations if they look at purchasing habits. Sure they may buy millions of SIMS expansion packs but they aren't buying other gaming software. Someone has to try and break them in.

 

[WindyMan]

Non-gamers can be turned into gamers too.

Only if they start from the same starting line.

 

[Monk]

Pump out another Mario Street Walker, then tell us that people are getting bored with games.

1. There are many gamers that feel like quitting after this gen including myself.

2. The rate at which the console hardware and software isn't rising fast enough for the industry as games next gen will cost ~10 million to make.

3. They make more mario and pokemon games because their fan base want more of them.

4. If Nintendo did the same as Sony and MS, they are going to die. This is their only way for them to survive.

 

[Flo_Evans]

1. There are many gamers that feel like quitting after this gen including myself.

2. The rate at which the console hardware and software isn't rising fast enough for the industry as games next gen will cost ~10 million to make.

3. They make more mario and pokemon games because their fan base want more of them.

4. If Nintendo did the same as Sony and MS, they are going to die. This is their only way for them to survive.

1. then quit, quiter.

2. bullshit. we have heard this argument for 20 years.

3. Then why are they pissing off thier fans? They seem more interested in my grandma then me. So be it. I don't think my grandma gives a shit about thier 'new ways to play' either.

4. wrong. if they did the same as sony or MS they wouldn't make as much proft.

 

[marc^o^]

Rev Controller is the most promising device ever. If Nintendo releases some killer apps at launch that live up to the controller promises, a big bang will happen: the Revolution will become insanely mainstream. You may hate Nintendo, but you can't hate progress. The Rev controller is just that, progress, modernity, innovation, revolution. How many killer apps will it take for you to get one?

 

[Amir0x]

Rev Controller is the most promising device ever. If Nintendo releases some killer apps at launch that live up to the controller promises, a big bang will happen: the Revolution will become insanely mainstream. You may hate Nintendo, but you can't hate progress. The Rev controller is just that, progress, modernity, innovation, revolution. How many killer apps will it take for you to get one?

It's alternative. Some will like it, some won't. Period. Nothing to do with progress or the hatred thereof.

 

[Chrono]

Rev Controller is the most promising device ever. If Nintendo releases some killer apps at launch that live up to the controller promises, a big bang will happen: the Revolution will become insanely mainstream. You may hate Nintendo, but you can't hate progress. The Rev controller is just that, progress, modernity, innovation, revolution. How many killer apps will it take for you to get one?

Let's see those killer apps first...


8 pages of speculation heh. We don't know if the rev controller will be all kinds of awesome because we haven't seen any software for it. Maybe the new Mario will rock, maybe it won't. Maybe it'll be as refreshing and great as Mario 64, maybe it won't.

You can't say whether Nintendo's new approach will work or not until you see and play the games, which will happen in a little over 7 months at E3 2006.

It's alternative. Some will like it, some won't. Period. Nothing to do with progress or the hatred thereof.

Maybe the remote design, but I can see Microsoft and Sony implementing motion sensor tech in their next consoles. Controllers will still look the same and have as many buttons/sticks but with motions sensors - nothing to lose here. if a game requires the sensors they'll be used otherwise you can just play with the controller as usual.

Again if not many games come out that demonstrate why this new tech is needed then I guess that won't happen. It's all up to Nintendo. Miyamoto keeps repeating he's confident in this new direction so I'm hoping they're working on some great stuff.

 

[marc^o^]

1. then quit, quiter.

2. bullshit. we have heard this argument for 20 years.

3. Then why are they pissing off thier fans? They seem more interested in my grandma then me. So be it. I don't think my grandma gives a shit about thier 'new ways to play' either.

4. wrong. if they did the same as sony or MS they wouldn't make as much proft.

The Nintendo you're pissed off at is not Iwata's one. The new Nintendo provides us with everything we wanted, such as free online gaming, fully loaded Mario Kart, unique controls over games, lots of new franchises & lots of games, which makes their low price even more appreciable, a great feeling their philosophy is not only working, but kicking ass.

 

[Amir0x]

Maybe the remote design, but I can see Microsoft and Sony implementing motion sensor tech in their next consoles. Controllers will still look the same and have as many buttons/sticks but with motions sensors - nothing to lose here. if a game requires the sensors they'll be used otherwise you can just play with the controller as usual.

Again if not many games come out that demonstrate why this new tech is needed then I guess that won't happen. It's all up to Nintendo. Miyamoto keeps repeating he's confident in this new direction so I'm hoping they're working on some great stuff.

I'm sure there will be great stuff. Without doubt, actually. I'm just saying it's an alternative method of control. We're at a point where the 2D method of input is so utterly refined and perfect that there is no genuine need for replacement, only new and alternative. Some people will enjoy it, others won't. And indeed, perhaps it will be implemented in future controllers. At that time it'll be that some people will like the games that have the sensor type control, and others will enjoy the more traditional type control.

 

[Tony HoTT]

It's alternative. Some will like it, some won't. Period. Nothing to do with progress or the hatred thereof.

Pretty much, but there is also some crossover that makes it a little less alternative. Pending actually playing the thing I'm going to jump out and say that it will improve controls for a lot of existing genres like FPS, and RTS on consoles without having to hook up some sort of mouse and keyboard control.

A lot of shit won't matter like RPGs, but most RPGs you could get away with playing on a NES pad.

 

[DSXBoy]

Pretty slick post overall but your last paragraph hits the high point. Sega was strapped for cash,had to start from scratch because they had no brand to lean on,and yet they managed to put out a better product over a 2 year lifespan than Nintendo has with its GameCube. And people question why Nintendo are in trouble with regards to the console wars.

Why are Sega out of the Games Console business and languishing amongst the also-rans of game developers?
:lol :lol :lol

 

[Cold-Steel]

Why are Sega out of the Games Console business and languishing amongst the also-rans of game developers?
:lol :lol :lol

Heh, SEGA fanboys deserve what was coming to them.

Spoiler

*Note* I used the word fanboys, not fans

 

[Luckett_X]

Dreamcast > Gamecube

Simply for the sheer amount of new ip's and titles, and the first true online console.

Lets see if Nintendo can make the Revolution its own Dreamcast (lol u can take that 2 different ways omfg!111)

 

[Monk]

1. then quit, quiter.

2. bullshit. we have heard this argument for 20 years.

3. Then why are they pissing off thier fans? They seem more interested in my grandma then me. So be it. I don't think my grandma gives a shit about thier 'new ways to play' either.

4. wrong. if they did the same as sony or MS they wouldn't make as much proft.

So basically you are pissed off they are not targetting you and you think that games don't cost more to make than last gen or atleast not more than the rate at which buying habits are increasing. In other words, you are sticking your fingers and singing "la la la la".

 

[GitarooMan]

This was a couple pages back, but I'm gonna make an attempt at answering.

...

After the "golden age" (SNES vs Genisis) non-gaming companies suddenly took heavy interest in gaming 'cos of the money Nintendo was making. Sony, especially, seemed interested in forming an "allience" with Nintendo to get their way into the industry. "Our" (the nerds) industry. For one, Sony was seen largely as a non-gaming company. Two, the whole Sony/Nintendo SNES CD-ROM add-on PlayStation was a fiasco. I followed it closely 'cos as it was happenning and was a big fan of Sony & Nintendo and a big fan of Sega getting their ass kicked by them. But, as I followed, it became clear that Sony & Nintendo's "partnership" was sour and when Sony walked away with their own game machine I felt betrayed. Third, when Sony ultimatly made the PlayStation popular...the most popular gaming system ever...the "betrayal" was amplified by their "Hollywoodization" of gaming...a past time that once belonged to just as nerds.

So, in conclusion, I think alot of the "console bigotry" stems from the fact that alot of us "gaming OG's" feel as though you "young punks" with your X-BOXEN and Playing Stations have stolen gaming from us nerds. You basturds!

Anyways, I used to be a BIG console racist who believed that Nintendo made no mistakes & that MS/Sony were the white devil's of the gaming world. Now I'm still a fan, but I'm more realistic and less fanatical!

I absolutely understand this sentiment, I was also one who grew up on Nintendo. I think that in any market the early people who were in at the beginning feel somewhat betrayed when the market expands and they're not the focus anymore (similar to a band someone discovers who "sells out"). What's interesting is that some Nintendo fans (not you) seem hypocritical in that they don't like the new people brought in by Sony and Sega, yet are encouraged by the fact that Nintendo is trying to bring in other "non-gamers" now with Rev and DS, as if Nintendo will expand the market in a "good" or "better" way.

I honestly think Nintendo's biggest problem (which hasn't been discussed much here), is that their in-house software development, not hardware development, has slowly but surely dropped in quality IMO. Nintendo's first party output on GC was the worst in quality for any system they've ever made IMO, and that makes the lack of third-party support more evident. For NES, SNES, and N64 they're were tons of quality Nintendo games that made the system worth owning, for GC they're will still some but they seemed rushed (Wind Waker, SMS) and they're weren't that many of exceptional quality. If I was a big Nintendo fan (I still like their games, I'm just wouldn't call myself a huge fan of the company), I would be more worried about their software output than the Rev hardware

 

[ziran]

the 1up article was good.

i think choice is great.

i've been disappointed with many games this gen, across all platforms. i'm ready for something different. whether nintendo has the answer or not, i don't know, and won't know til i play rev's games.

as for the videogames market in decline, well we know the situation in japan is bad, but a similar thing is happening in the west, disguised by gta, fps and a few ea games. the majority of genres and franchises are in decline. mgs, re, tony hawk, gran turismo, zelda, mario, tekken, burnout, jak, tomb raider, etc, etc, are all declining.

the big difference between ms and sony vs nintendo, is ms and sony believe better graphics and more realism will draw more gamers in, and nintendo doesn't. here i agree with nintendo. the problem is the games.

if you improve the graphics, so what? the games are still the same.

if videogames are to expand the software has to expand. new types of games have to be made. sony, ms or a third party could do it, not just nintendo.

 

[Catchpenny]

Jesus Christ. What a lousy thread.

Revolution is an interesting alternative, something new. Will it work? I don't know. Is it better than having another PS3/Xbox360 out there? Hell yes. And who cares how many other people are buying it? Gloating about marketshare is just as dumb as gloating about profits.

If you're not interested, go buy one of those consoles and stop whining about what Nintendo does. I'll be buying a PS3, and perhaps a 360, but I'm also getting a Revolution because it looks fun and different. You can enjoy games as they are and still want to see them taken in a new direction. Like ziran says above, choice is good.

Anyhow, let's get to the real important thing: Dreamcast fuckin' blows. Some fun arcade ports, and I really liked Jet Set Radio and Samba, but that's it. Man, at least Nintendo fans wax nostalgic over the right consoles. Take your mongloid controller, your endless sailor searches and your Poochie mascot, and march right on out of this thread. Better yet, ditch that crap and boot up your Saturn. The rest of us want to discuss consoles made in this century.

 

[gamergirly]

It's alternative

It's not an alternative if it becomes a standard.

 

[PhoenixDark]

*sigh*

The controller is very innovative, and it brings some great new ideas to the table; I don't see how anyone can disagree with that. But, as many people have already said, we need to see some software to get a better picture of what the controller is truly capible of.

At its core, the idea of getting "non-gamers" to play games is a good idea. In any business you want to bring in new customers to further expand the market. But, my problem is with Nintendo's insistance that these "non-gamers" are truly worth this risk that they are taking. Everyone on this board knows people who simply can't get into games. Nintendo might be able to convince these people that the Revolution is fun and easy, but is this new demographic going to be reliable? Are non-gamers going to continue to buy software and spend money? There are plenty of non gamers as we speak who really like Madden or even Nintendogs. But, you rarely see these people move away from those particular games and buy/try other stuff; I know people who only play Madden, a little Halo, and nothing else. How will Nintendo get these people to truly commit?

 

[:Motorbass]

Finally I can post it :>