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[GameAddict411]

I just can't agree with how the whole situation was handled. Evilore, if you are reading this you could have saved NeoGAF days before it exploded. Taking a leave of absences or even quitting the forums completely or selling it off was and is the best way to save the current community. I don't think the toxicity that happened in the off topic warranted the completely delete of a community that similar in size to the gaming section. On top of that the mods are now undercover and transparency is thrown out of the window. ModBot was created to elevate the pressure on individual mods. I just don't see the benefits to this. I have no idea how can NeoGAF recover after this, but it still saddens me how things ended up. The community ended up getting the hit instead of an individual. It's all it comes down to.

 

[LegendofJoe]

This forum will never be the same.
2017 proved to be a tough year for this community and the site in general.

Now I'm just getting angry. It isn't right that the (alleged) actions of one person can take down a community with so much history. Neogaf is more important than that.

If you care about this place Evilore (beyond the income it generates) think long and hard about what's best for its future. At the very least, now that so many people know your name, it may be best for you to become anonymous and/or step aside to let someone else run the site. I think it's the best option for both this community and yourself.

I love my Neogaf brothers and sisters, I'm not ready to say goodbye.

 

[Wamb0wneD]

You know what I've always hated most about Neogaf?

I rarely felt like I could speak my mind. You risked being called something terrible for simply asking a question, or asking for more evidence, or simply being on the fence about something. I realize people hate toxicity, but the ban culture here -fostered- toxicity because the bandwagon attack mobs were allowed to shower insults at will... even if the insults themselves were hate driven ['cunt', for example].

If you asked a question, you were accused of baiting. Do you guys realize how toxic that is? People should always be allowed to ask questions. If you asked for more evidence, you were done. Heck, I fucking hate Trump. But if I mention that? Then clearly, I'm lying... right? I'm just setting up for something else. Bullshit. Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. I've been far more left than almost every one here for longer than most here have been alive... but just because I don't agree with their agenda I risk being painted as a fascist, which is absurd. That's a culture of fear. That's censorship through ideology shaming. I guarantee my anarchy trumps your fucking Clinton loving nonsense, but god forbid I say anything against Clinton, because I get painted as a Trump loving fascist. That's sick. Sick, sick, sick. Broken minds led by broken ideology ruled by broken moderation that can't handle being questioned.

Now, you know what? I don't know if you're guilty of anything. I don't know if what was said to happen happened, and honestly, even if it did, I don't know what signals were or weren't sent, or what level of miscommunication happened. So I don't particularly like that you were summarily executed by mob. My guess is you're full of shit... but I know that's just a guess. I know I have no idea. And I won't execute you for it, just like I wouldn't execute Naughty Dog, even though it was so much fun for people here to leap to ridiculous conclusions based on a single tweet.

But you know what? You fostered an environment that summarily executes with no evidence. So while I hate it, and I'll -always- be on the side of 'wait for more information' regardless of the topic, I can't say I can't see the sick humor of it all. Some people need to learn by example, and if you're truly innocent of all charges, then I hope next time someone gets accused of something you support the presumption of innocence. This is not saying I don't think horrible things happen all the time - they do... my wife has been sexually harassed at work and I know how hard it is to come forward and rock the boat.

If you're guilty, then I hope you learn. Evolve. Grow. Become a better person. Everyone can change, even though some swear no one can.

If you're innocent, then also learn. Evolve. Grow. The culture of 'no proof needed' you fostered is sick... it flies in the face of everything our collective cultures have learned and fought for over the past few millennia. You reaped what you sowed, and it's either ironic, or horrifying, based on your guilt... which I can never know.

I'll probably get banned for this post. I don't think I said anything worth being banned for. In fact, I think this is a pretty fair assessment of both your actions, the accusations against you, and the general culture of this site. If you ban me, fine. If you don't, I'll still be here, posting, because, honestly, I don't judge a community on a single individual member. Heck, I don't judge -you- based on actions of a previous you, because I know people change over time.

People learn. People grow. People evolve. Maybe you have, maybe you haven't. Now it's time for you to do so, and in the process, evolve this site so it doesn't become an echo chamber of toxicity against anything deemed toxic.

Booooom.

 

[Aurongel]

This whole situation is just... sad. Regardless of ones affiliation, to see such a strong community implode in this way is terrible. I think Gaf has been unique on the web in the last few years for fostering such a large community that it could in some way be broadly impactful, yet filled with prominent and generally respected personalities, and retaining a classic message board format. The depth of humor and insight was at times phenomenal; and that it still rose out of a forum that was at times anything but seemed telling of the continuing power of these structures. There's not many boards left formed in this classic style that are highly active anymore.

It's a shame it was all undone over one man's hubris. I suppose it should be an abject lesson in the costs of not living up to your own ideals or handling adversity with grace. Maybe the community will come back in some form, but it seems clear the place will never be the same.

This community rose to prominence and was made great by developers, artists and social minorities with new perspectives.

I just don't see how this place is attractive to them anymore. Refocusing on games and letting people blow off some steam in this thread is smart but the actual lessons that need learning aren't being learned by those in charge.

I think the only way to actually course correct at this point is with entirely new leadership. In the meantime, those who built the community will disperse - perhaps for the better.

GAF is bigger than one person and it probably deserves better.

 

[infinitys_7th]

And they should have been banned. If diversity bothers you, you are the problem.

I love original Star Trek, TNG, DS9, and even VOY.

Diversity is fine - Michael Burnham is not.

 

[ShironRedshift]

The meltdown here prompted that.

Under that logic, Gaming itself should be deleted as well. Just look at all the account suicide threads there. Plenty of meltdowns to be seen. That's no reason to nuke a forum. Ride out the wave, perhaps. But nuking an entire section and taking all the communities with it? That makes no sense.

The stated reasons just make no sense and are full of holes. That screams of continued dishonesty. And more dishonesty is definitely not what we need right now.

 

[danthefan]

Apparently it's a big enough deal for him to delete half of his site over, despite giving absolutely no indication that he was ever considering such a thing at any point beforehand. It's weird to see people saying people are making a big deal over nothing, when Tyler seems to have had the largest reaction out of anyone.

For fuck sake the bat shit crazy reaction prompted that.

 

[Vicetrailia]

I'm as liberal as it gets, and I certainly wouldn't be the first to defend Evilore, but let's not make the situation out to be more than it was. Tyler awkwardly misread a situation, but the internet is making it seem like he assaulted the poor girl. When a man and a woman are sharing a hotel room, and there's alcohol involved, and someone goes in the shower and leaves the door open - it's not out of the realm of possibility that a person could misread the signs and make a pass. What's important is that both sides agree that, when she made it clear she wasn't interested, he backed off and respected her wishes. That's the difference between consent and non-consent.

If every man (or woman) was ripped to shreds and had their careers ended because they misread some social signs, half of the country would be out of a job. It sounds like a misunderstanding that never escalated beyond that point. I don't see how anyone can equate this as a 'me too' sexual assault situation. Yes women need to be believed, but in her version of the story he made a mistake and backed off when she made that clear. That's all you can ask of someone in that situation.

This definitely feels like the spark that blew up a gas tank, but let's not make the spark out to be a forest fire. This is a real person's life we're talking about here. This is nothing close to a Harvey Weinstein situation.

This is what I was thinking, I agree.

But I agree with The Albatross the most because I feel like OT is getting punished for something that isn't their fault. People are going to see it how they see it, and you know a lot of people don't play games when it comes to sexual assault.

 

[jabuseika]

He has my full respect, until there is hard hitting evidence, he did nothing wrong. A lot of people here are making him out to be like Trump or Hitler.

I would tend to agree completely.

But this is not the first time he's been accused. You have to bring that into the set of facts.

If this is truly some kind of revenge against him, the best thing to do would be for him to step away. Lies or not, he's putting the entire community on the line of fire. I don't blame the mods that left, they shouldn't have to deal with that.

This, the way it remains, will not survive. I hope reasonable decisions are made.

If not, then this is the end.

 

[-Mutsukki-]

If you wanted a focus on gaming, all you needed to do was not click the OT.

that's absolutely not true and you know it

 

[Wamb0wneD]

Tried shit posting a few times to get a ban but I'm sick of getting ignored so I'll ask it here in this sticky thread. to those anonymous mods browsing the forum right now ban me Don't wanna be apart of a forum where Evilore is in charge.

Such drama. Log out and be done with it. If you think you're making a point by being obnoxious then you're wrong.

 

[Zelmardonpoktendo]

The brand is tarnished, at this point. Anyone who is eager to join GAF while Tyler stays in the core leadership position is doing so with knowledge and consent towards his actions - or at minimum, his handling of the past two days.

It is not a group I would feel comfortable aligning myself with.

Consent what exactly?

I come in this board to read news about gaming and get excited about it with other fellow gamers, I don't consent any of his actions that he has been accused of which he has denied. Me believing in his word is my choice, however it does not consent anything. His personal life isn't my problem nor does it consent any sort of behaviour that has been spoken about,

you don't know me or know anything about me, like you don't know anything about him

So shut your fucking mouth.

 

[johnFkennedy]

Tried shit posting a few times to get a ban but I'm sick of getting ignored so I'll ask it here in this sticky thread. to those anonymous mods browsing the forum right now ban me Don't wanna be apart of a forum where Evilore is in charge.

Why not just stop coming here? Why do you need the ban?

 

[ec0ec0]

This feels weird, and I feel bad for the victim of all of this. The woman of course.

you mean the alleged victim, and she didn't seem to feel to bad about the "incident", as she continued to be friends with him, and even had a sexual relatioship with him later.

Before calling someone a victim, we should have something more solid that a social media post. Like, context of their relation, a formal accusation....

 

[tsumineko]

I don’t believe you.

I was there lurking on Opa-ages when I saw you post those pictures. You know the ones.

Goodbye.

 

[Madness]

Remains to be seen how this all plays out.

 

[Herr Schwarz]

Yo admins? Can we have off topic back already.

I'm over this story its a nothing burger.

Yes I do view a man presenting himself for a woman and . her saying no and said man leaving as a nothing burger.

Bring back OT please! Walkin dead thread!

I'm available for PR baby!

 

[HarryKS]

The bad rep Neogaf had / has is due to people being outright banned if their views were different from the ones of the ruling party. Sympathise to TB? Banned. Stood neutral during gamergame? Banned! Don't think that diversity for the sake of diversity is good for video games? BANNED!

By all accounts it seems like EvilLore was wrongfully accused, but him getting a taste of his own poison is like poetry. Neogaf should be about video games, not about sensitive people behind the ruling scene.

Pretty sure those bans were all from the same dude.

 

[Riposte]

I'm noticing all these people flooding the forums with porn and just walking off.

This is despicable. Include the source in your post, you savages.

 

[ZeoVGM]

Fuck. Thor: Ragnarok was coming out and I wanted to discuss it on GAF.

Well, something good came out of all this, I suppose.

 

[GTI Guy]

I'm really bummed that the OT is gone. Most of my time was spent there reading about politics and various goings on in the world. I know right before the site shit the bed people were talking about setting up something on discord. If someone out there can send me a link that would be cool. Thanks

 

[blankempathy]

I love these "it was nothing" statements omitting the fact that she was sick and throwing up hence why she jumped in the shower. Does it matter if she hooked up with him later? Clearly she felt violated from that incident to make a statement about it online. Does her hooking up with him later cancels out her feeling violated somehow?

 

[Nydius]

RIP DatingGAF.

Also Mental Health GAF. That community helped a lot of people even if "helping" meant just being there to listen.

 

[G0DLIKE]

I missed lurking so much. I didn't know where to go. I tried Reddit and 4chan but they smelled like stale cigarettes and play-doh.

This whole thing is bullshit. You're all setting fire to your accounts out of a false sense of righteousness.

There's no assault here.

He left when she said fuck off.

Really bad time to present yourself. But ok... you hook up weeks later.


This is what you're setting fire to your accounts over.

Get some perspective ya weirdos.

.

 

[TarNaru33]

This whole ordeal reminds me so much of this:

Welcome to the NeoGAF lynch mob, where you are guilty until proven innocent, where relationships between humans are pure black and white and can never be ambiguous or misread, and where backing off when asked is akin to full-on rape.

Okay.

None of this is even true though. I think people need to actually think and understand what a GAF lynch mob is before stating it. I have seen some, but majority of the time people claimed it was a lynch mob or "outrage", it wasn't even so. Accusations alone isn't what nuked this, it was poor handling of it. Everyone thought the mods were leaving specifically and only because Evilore gave instructions of silently getting rid of the discussions. That may be a reason for all I know, but when it comes to things like this, one must be quick at giving an appropriate response.

I 2nd what some others are saying. While I did read up on gaming news and such, I mainly came here for the OT discussions including politics and news that I never knew of.

Getting rid of OT (granted it may be temporary) makes no sense in trying to deal with the toxicity people are complaining about either. I see no reason why people can't speak of political and social issues because some others on the wrong side of history feels they are getting ganged up on.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Well, something good came out of all this, I suppose.

You say that now but you'll miss my insight. You'll miss having someone to rub thoughts on.

 

[MadraptorMan]

I really appreciated this forum. Originally I came for game discussion but I actually stuck around so many years because of the Off Topic forum...and I'm actually fine with the mod's plan to "refocus" on gaming if the road map forward includes reviving the OT forum later down the line.

However, unfortunately, and I am just trying to be practical and honest here, I think it's near impossible for there to be a decent future for this site if Evilore remains at the helm. Even if the allegations against him are false...the damage has already been done and the forums are crumbling. The only way forward here is for him to resign and pass on management to someone else. Even then, I don't know how likely a decent recovery is...but it's got a much better shot than what we are sitting on right now. A change of guard is the one and only shot this place has of returning to something resembling the community it was.

 

[Officerrob]

Fuck. Thor: Ragnarok was coming out and I wanted to discuss it on GAF.

Movie-GAF isn't coming back

 

[Bsigg12]

Baseball GAF, the World Series is gonna be lit. Houston in 6.

 

[sinkfla87]

Well, something good came out of all this, I suppose.

Hahaha.

 

[ZeoVGM]

that's absolutely not true and you know it

It's factually true. What are you even talking about?

 

[Brazil]

Oh, well. I feel like had a good ten-year run here, and I'll miss this place. I hope all of the good people who shared a little of their knowledge or compassion with others here go on to live fulfilling lives.

Best regards, people.

See y'all.

 

[Skeletron]

Always avoided political threads and don't give a fuck about any of this. Hope ya'll get back to posting about games and benign shit like "how often should I get a haircut?" so I can have something to chuckle about during lunch. If not I guess there's reddit or somethingawful.

 

[MrToast]

I would tend to agree completely.

But this is not the first time he's been accused. You have to bring that into the set of facts.

If this is truly some kind of revenge against him, the best thing to do would be for him to step away. Lies or not, he's putting the entire community on the line of fire. I don't blame the mods that left, they shouldn't have to deal with that.

This, the way it remains, will not survive. I hope reasonable decisions are made.

If not, then this is the end.

They clearly weren't committed then, you have to push through and make it better, I know I would.

Also I disagree, I hope it stays this away apart from all the account suicide threads and posts, because it can only get better from here on out after this questionable accusation has passed its course.

 

[Hashmal_Bringer_of_Order]

Under that logic, Gaming itself should be deleted as well. Just look at all the account suicide threads there. Plenty of meltdowns to be seen. That's no reason to nuke a forum. Ride out the wave, perhaps. But nuking an entire section and taking all the communities with it? That makes no sense.

The stated reasons just make no sense and are full of holes. That screams of continued dishonesty. And more dishonesty is definitely not what we need right now.

I assume it'll be back in a bit. I've never been the victim of a witch hunt but i assume it doesn't lead to the most rational of short term decisions.

 

[BADMAN]

I feel like this thread is meant for cathartic ranting in hopes that people will tire themselves out and return to being regular gaffers. If that's the case then the idea is inherently insulting. If Tyler doesn't step down within the next 24 hours then Gaf will erode into a shell of what it once was. The only people left will be those who don't care that the owner is a creepy fuck. I don't want to be a part of that kind of community. If you really love the community Evilore, step the fuck down.

 

[eBay Huckster]

I'm over this story its a nothing burger.

weird how your definition of nothingburger is apparently "story that merits the deletion of half the site"

 

[All Hail C-Webb]

I've been on GAF since at least 2001 (I remember the 9/11 thread), and you could always tell there was something special about the community here. This was just a forum, attached to a not very popular gaming site, that grew and evolved to become one of the most popular sites on the internet.
Usually, with growth like that, things become hard to maintain, but GAF actually improved as it grew. As a kid, I was sometimes annoyed by the strict moderation, but it became clear that it was part of the bigger picture.
If you wanted to join in on these great discussions with developers and industry people, you had to live up to a certain standard. If you wanted to be a part of one of the most well rounded, thought provoking, and often hilarious discussions on the internet, you had to treat the other members with respect.

With that strict moderation, Neogaf attracted the ire of those who could not abide by the rules. Forums and groups were created by banned members where they bonded over their hatred of GAF, and laughed as they called each other fags, and made racist comments. I'm sure that many of these people were involved in gamergate, and the_donald, and they have been celebrating the last few days. They took down their enemy. One of the few places that they wanted to be, but couldn't because they didn't want to let go of their vitriol and hatred.

I'm not ready to give up on the best online community there is.

The Amirox situation sucked, and I think he got too much leeway because he had been here for so long. It happens everywhere, in business, and communities, we overlook the signs because someone is a longstanding member of the community, and you feel you know them.

I really believe that the Evilore issue has been blown out by people with an agenda (though his response left something to be desired). I'm sure that many are genuinely upset, but I believe that far more were just waiting for something to jump on. I kept waiting to hear this terrible thing, but it looks like all of the outrage is over a post that Evilore made himself, and the shower incident.

The ass grab makes Evilore sound like he was into Pick-up artist stuff at the time. Douchey, but something that happens every night at clubs. If he wasn't removed from the bar, the girl didn't complain, and I'm fine going with Evilore's side of the story, since there is no other side.

With the girl in the shower, he looks like he made a move, failed, and held some resentment after. This is the type of thing that American Pie would have told us was hilarious. According to the girls' version, he didn't try anything after she said no, he sulked and was mean. That she admits to sleeping with him at a later date just makes me think this was not the awful situation this is being made out to be.

All that said, I think there were far better ways for Evilore to respond to this than some of the comments in interviews. I think that altering the OT is a sign of weakness. They come after you because they hate what you had, and what it signified, and you're showing them that their hatred will overcome. I hope that this is only a temporary thing, and down the line the community comes back stronger than ever.

They hate us cause they anus.

 

[Herr Schwarz]

Don't take away OT! This whole thing is bollox why change anything ffs.

 

[Mexen]

Mental health and retirement investment OTs were helpful, please archive or revive them in time. Thanks in advance.

 

[ramuh]

Also Mental Health GAF. That community helped a lot of people even if "helping" meant just being there to listen.

Amen. I was highly encouraged by the people there who were legit trying to help out many GAF members.

 

[Aurongel]

Don't quote or draw attention to people acting dramatic and demanding a ban.

They want the attention, don't give it to them. At the same time though, the community as a whole needs to blow off some steam and those who weather it will lead the way on maintaining an open and insightful dialogue about all of this.

 

[Uno Venova]

I'm noticing all these people flooding the forums with porn and just walking off.

This is despicable. Include the source in your post, you savages.

:lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[newsguy]

I missed lurking so much. I didn't know where to go. I tried Reddit and 4chan but they smelled like stale cigarettes and play-doh.

You sure that’s wasn’t just Amirox’s computer chair?

 

[CharminUltra]

So many gray usernames. It's like when you open one of those old threads from years ago, except this one looks like them after only a couple of hours.

 

[Femto.]

Also Mental Health GAF. That community helped a lot of people even if "helping" meant just being there to listen.

Man, I hope those affected can find a replacement to vent.

 

[Depths of Orion]

Some people are really fucking weird on here. Calling him a rapist and saying he sexually assaulted the woman? Even in her side of the story she said he left after she yelled at him.

Then, they went on with their relationship and even slept together? Sorry but you guys are going way overboard with your accusations.

 

[Lucky Seven]

.

 

[Herr Schwarz]

So many gray usernames. It's like when you open one of those years old threads, except this one looks like them after only a couple of hours.

And they're all idiots. The mod team deserted over this nothing burger too. That's just sad.

 

[Doctor Manhattan]

God dammit I'm gonna miss OT. I have been lurking here for a decade and a member for a few months and I fucking love this place.Hopefully things will go back to normal.