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[Escape Goat]

Like Greece, we want to get something from nothing. We want our entitlements and low taxes but don't want to sacrifice or change to keep them. It is going to take people dieing in the streets for real, purposeful change to come to our financial strategy.

Right now its just political theater. each side playing games with just pieces of the real solution.

 

[cajunator]

It is kind of interesting that debt is basically how the Us banking system has money to begin with. They load out with interest based on an amount that a person deposits into savings and that can be multiplied ten fold into loans to other people. It's kind of a genius way to do things, but it also means that paper money is by itself worthless. It's pretty much the idea that it is worth something that keeps it afloat, which is why counterfeiting is so heavily fought. If fake money begins being accepted the same as paper money, then there is no point in making a currency at all and people could pretty much use anything they wanted as money. In a way that kind of goes on already with coupons, trades, and independent money like the liberty dollar.

 

[Measley]

Thanks for wrecking the country Bush.

Worst.president.ever.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Cutting spending is the only way to get out of debt.

This is as dumb as saying "The only two numbers which add up to 10 are 7 and 3."

It's completely false. No matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make it true.

Stop lying.

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

This is as dumb as saying "The only two numbers which add up to 10 are 7 and 3."

It's completely false. No matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make it true.

Stop lying.

Only this is reality, and with the current debt we already hold, cutting spending is likely the only way to climb out of the hole.

Or we could take your word and?? What, raise taxes to the stratosphere?

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Only this is reality, and with the current debt we already hold, cutting spending is likely the only way to climb out of the hole.

Or we could take your word and?? What, raise taxes to the stratosphere?

Raise taxes to the stratosphere lol

Talk about hyperbole.

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

Raise taxes to the stratosphere lol

Talk about hyperbole.

Right? And if we decide to put that burden on the average citizen, youll have to probably push them into the exosphere...

 

[FLEABttn]

Or we could take your word and?? What, raise taxes to the stratosphere?

There is some significant amount of grey area between "only cut spending" and "only increase taxes" in order to fix the deficit.

If I live 100 miles away from a friend of mine, we could both meet at the halfway point. Or maybe he goes 30 miles and I go 70 miles. But him telling me the only place we can meet is at his house ignores literally every other solution in between.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Right? And if we decide to put that burden on the average citizen, youll have to probably push them into the exosphere...

Letting taxes go back to where they were a decade ago is raising them into the stratosphere?

How on earth did our economy survive when income tax rates were well above 50% for the wealthiest of Americans! There must have been mass unemployment and an absolute and total crippling of our entire economy!

 

[Cyan]

There is some significant amount of grey area between "only cut spending" and "only increase taxes" in order to fix the deficit.

So... ionosphere?

 

[GaimeGuy]

Only this is reality, and with the current debt we already hold, cutting spending is likely the only way to climb out of the hole.

Or we could take your word and?? What, raise taxes to the stratosphere?

or you could cut spending and raise taxes and not be an idiot.

Taxes are at the lowest point since the Gilded Age. So stop acting like they're at historically high levels or that they've been getting raised all over the place recently. It's a lie. Just like the "Cutting spending is the only way to get out of debt" crap you're still spewing.

 

[diddles]

Thanks for wrecking the country Bush.

Worst.president.ever.

the bush years were great. it's the obama years that have sucked so bad, and are only getting worse...

This is as dumb as saying "The only two numbers which add up to 10 are 7 and 3."

It's completely false. No matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make it true.

Stop lying.

it's absolutely true if you look at how our government behaves. you give them more money, they just spend more on nonsense. raising taxes will just bring more corruption and waste. cutting spending is the only mentality that will work.

 

[GaimeGuy]

the bush years were great. it's the obama years that have sucked so bad, and are only getting worse...

more lies.

 

[Baraka in the White House]

the bush years were great. it's the obama years that have sucked so bad, and are only getting worse...

it's absolutely true if you look at how our government behaves. you give them more money, they just spend more on nonsense. raising taxes will just bring more corruption and waste. cutting spending is the only mentality that will work.

Damn...

 

[AlimNassor]

On Newsnight (BBC) last night a Chinese and American economic rep had some good stuff about this.
Mentioned was the fact that both America and China think that they are the centre of the world, but while China has thought this for the past 6000 years, only America feels the need to spread its influence. Like a shouty teenager.
China could have invaded the world many times over during the past 4000 years, they never have.

China is all about the motherland. And keeping up the symbiotic relationship with the US, nothing much will change. Keep looking for that bogeyman.

yah-huh. China thinks they are even remotely as powerful as the US, that's cute it really is cute. China struggles to build 1 Carrier, we have a ton. All we need to do is just part a few carriers right outside China and they'd be waving that white flag.

No doubt China was powerful. Han Dynasty China was just as advanced and powerful as Rome. Those 2 empires ruled the world, they were unstoppable.

 

[Cyan]

it's absolutely true if you look at how our government behaves. you give them more money, they just spend more on nonsense. raising taxes will just bring more corruption and waste. cutting spending is the only mentality that will work.

No, they spend more on nonsense without regard for how much is coming in. That's how it's always worked--how do you think we got $14 trillion in debt?

It's a silly thing to say anyway. Cutting spending and simultaneously increasing revenue is the best way to get out of debt. "But spending will rise!" is nonsensical.

Turn it around and maybe you can see why it's a bit silly: "Lowering spending is pointless. You give the government more breathing room, they just cut taxes, without regard for the effect on the debt or the American people. Lowering spending will just bring more pain and suffering. Raising taxes is the only mentality that will work."

 

[The Albatross]

Yep. So few people realize it, but China has been growing its influence in Africa in amazing and scary ways. The US is so backwards in diplomacy in the region that we will never have a seat at the table as Africa develops.

Eh.

China is pretty transparent with who they curry favor with in Africa: Rich oil barrons and warlords. The United States may work with warlords and oil barrons as well but at least, it has the decency to fake it with broad humanitarian efforts. And, well, frankly, I have never heard of a Chinese humanitarian NGO in Africa (maybe they exist, but they aren't well known if they do)... I'd imagine that your local private college probably does more humanitarian work in the country than any NGO in China.

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

or you could cut spending and raise taxes and not be an idiot.

Taxes are at the lowest point since the Gilded Age. So stop acting like they're at historically high levels or that they've been getting raised all over the place recently. It's a lie. Just like the "Cutting spending is the only way to get out of debt" crap you're still spewing.

Theres a difference between "only cutting spending" and "cutting spending is the only way to reduce the debt"...

But I guess in your world it doesnt matter if you spend spend spend, you can always tax tax tax.

We cant even cut spending enough to get out of a deficit, let alone start tackling the debt.

the bush years were great. it's the obama years that have sucked so bad, and are only getting worse...



it's absolutely true if you look at how our government behaves. you give them more money, they just spend more on nonsense. raising taxes will just bring more corruption and waste. cutting spending is the only mentality that will work.

Typical one-sided american political talk here, refusing to see that government is the problem, not the parties...

 

[speculawyer]

Cut defense spending. Raise taxes.

That is a big start . . . but it will take a bit more than that.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Theres a difference between "only cutting spending" and "cutting spending is the only way to reduce the debt"...
But I guess in your world it doesnt matter if you spend spend spend, you can always tax tax tax.

We cant even cut spending enough to get out of a deficit, let alone start tackling the debt.

Typical one-sided american political talk here, refusing to see that government is the problem, not the parties...

Don't try to change what was being said.

Every single person who says "cutting spending is the only way to reduce the debt" means the former. They are the ones who are screaming "NO NEW TAXES!!!!"

And I said cutting spending and raising taxes is the answer. Every "liberal" has been saying so. No one is saying only tax increases will solve this. No one.

I repeat: Stop lying. God damn it.

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

Don't try to change what was being said.

Every single person who says "cutting spending is the only way to reduce the debt" means the former. They are the ones who are screaming "NO NEW TAXES!!!!"



I repeat: Stop lying.

And they are delusional, but I would also say your delusional if you think we can get out of the debt we are in without cutting spending.

Hence, cutting spending is the only way we will get out of this debt.

 

[GaimeGuy]

I have come to the conclusion that the majority of conservatives lack the cognitive ability to read and process information. -_-

 

[cajunator]

The country hasn't been "great" since the 50's. Things started to go downhill and only got worse as time went on. The economy got better and worse in cycles, but it was pretty much artificial growth through the Clinton and bush years and only now we can see the real economy without the illusions of the dot com bubble, the real estate bubble, and the subprime loan bubble. All those bubbles have burst in epic fashion which leads us to the clusterfuck we have today. This wasn't one president's fault and it can't be one president's solution.

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

I have come to the conclusion that the majority of conservatives lack the cognitive ability to read and process information. -_-

Nah, just selective post reading.

Ill stick with the delusional comments though.

So yes, as it stands, you cant tackle this current national debt without cutting spending

Spoiler

and raising taxes would certainly help.

The country hasn't been "great" since the 50's. Things started to go downhill and only got worse as time went on. The economy got better and worse in cycles, but it was pretty much artificial growth through the Clinton and bush years and only now we can see the real economy without the illusions of the dot com bubble, the real estate bubble, and the subprime loan bubble. All those bubbles have burst in epic fashion which leads us to the clusterfuck we have today. This wasn't one president's fault and it can't be one president's solution.

Reallly???

Can I try on those nostalgia glasses after youre done with them?

 

[mavs]

Only taxing those groups isn't going to raise a lot of money, and they're barely getting by as it is. However taxing the richest 5% will raise a lot of money, and their lifestyles won't change drastically.

Spending also needs to be corralled, but the govt. needs more income too.

Other way around. Taxing the rich doesn't change their lives much compared to the money it brings in, but the money it brings in doesn't change our fiscal position very much. It's a no-brainer, but it's also a drop in the bucket. Taxing the middle class has a large negative impact on their lives, but it brings in mad money.

The country hasn't been "great" since the 50's. Things started to go downhill and only got worse as time went on. The economy got better and worse in cycles, but it was pretty much artificial growth through the Clinton and bush years and only now we can see the real economy without the illusions of the dot com bubble, the real estate bubble, and the subprime loan bubble. All those bubbles have burst in epic fashion which leads us to the clusterfuck we have today. This wasn't one president's fault and it can't be one president's solution.

Great...compared to the Depression and a huge deadly war. We are humming along mostly the same as we always have during the time we have spent at the technological frontier. Bad policy has slowed us down here and there, but you can't expect to live life and never make bad decisions.

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

I'm glad i mostly stick in PoliGaf as i'm in pain watching these economic...anal sises

 

[sans_pants]

Nonesense. The price of oil has exploded since 2003. When I was 16 (in 2000), gas was under $1/gallon. You can't blame the current $4/gallon on inflation.

The soldiers and the weapons manufacturers can find new jobs. Sorry, but not all jobs are socially necessary.

Alternatives to carbon-based fuel were urgent in the 70's. 40 years later, the situation is dire. We needed to be solving these problems before now. But we do have good options in solar, hydro, wind, and geothermal. Even if we only used these options in buildings, it would make a huge difference. But electric cars are very practical as well.

if everyone switched to electric cars tomorrow it would destroy this country

 

[HephalumpsAndWoozles]

if everyone switched to electric cars tomorrow it would destroy this country

It most certainly would not. But why discuss hypothetical impossibilities?

 

[jaxword]

the bush years were great. it's the obama years that have sucked so bad, and are only getting worse...

The Recession started halfway through Bush's term.