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[Timber]

i don't suppose many people here care but it's good to care every once in a while so please pay attention. thank you.

http://www.theyshootpictures.com/gf1000.htm

The above is basically a site that compiles boatloads of lists from all sorts of knowledgeable persons of taste into a comprehensive list of the 1000 best movies ever made. they update it every year and i just found out the new list has arrived.

here's the top 25:

1. Citizen Kane (Orson Welles, 1941)
2. Vertigo (Alfred Hitchcock, 1958)
3. The Rules of the Game (Jean Renoir, 1939)
4. 2001: A Space Odyssey (Stanley Kubrick, 1968)
5. 8½ (Federico Fellini, 1963)
6. The Godfather (Francis Ford Coppola, 1972)
7. The Searchers (John Ford, 1956)
8. The Seven Samurai (Akira Kurosawa, 1954)
9. Singin' in the Rain (Stanley Donen/Gene Kelley, 1952)
10. Battleship Potemkin (Sergei Eisenstein, 1925)
11. Tokyo Story (Yasujiro Ozu, 1953)
12. Sunrise (F.W. Murnau, 1927)
13. Lawrence of Arabia (David Lean, 1962)
14. Bicycle Thieves (Vittorio De Sica, 1948)
15. The Godfather, Part II (Francis Ford Coppola, 1974)
16. L'Atalante (Jean Vigo, 1934)
17. Casablanca (Michael Curtiz, 1942)
18. Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, 1950)
19. Raging Bull (Martin Scorcese, 1980)
20. The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Dreyer, 1928)
21. Touch of Evil (Orson Welles, 1958)
22. Some Like it Hot (Billy Wilder, 1959)
23. La Dolce Vita (Federico Fellini, 1960)
24. La Grande Illusion (Jean Renoir, 1937)
25. City Lights (Charles Chaplin, 1931)

some notable developments:

Seven Samurai moved up a spot

Tokyo Story has been ejected from the top 10 in favour of Singin' in the Rain. both movies are pretty much perfect (albeit in very different ways) so i guess it's not that bad.

lots of Chaplin movies have suffered some blows. City Lights, Gold Rush, Modern Times and Monsieur Verdoux all went down down downright shameful

Best Movie Ever™ McCabe & Mrs. Miller went from 169 to 124. for the mathematically impaired: that's 45 spaces within the top 200. goin' all the way to the top, baby! conversely, Nashville suffered a drop.


the new entries are:

432. The Red Balloon (Albert Lamorisse, 1956)
525. The Story of a Cheat (Sacha Guitry, 1936)
535. Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind (Michel Gondry, 2004)
627. The Fly (David Cronenberg, 1986)
724. Robocop (Paul Verhoeven, 1987)
739. Pan's Labyrinth (Guillermo del Toro, 2006)
748. Ordinary People (Robert Redford, 1980)
752. My Own Private Idaho (Gus Van Sant, 1991)
773. The Lives of Others (Florian Henckel von Donnersmarck, 2006)
785. There Will Be Blood (Paul Thomas Anderson, 2007)
795. The Blues Brothers (John Landis, 1980)
804. Requiem for a Dream (Darren Aronofsky, 2000)
819. The Times of Harvey Milk (Rob Epstein, 1984)
826. Dracula (Tod Browning, 1931)
857. Seconds (John Frankenheimer, 1966)
866. Le Corbeau (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1943)
884. Ed Wood (Tim Burton, 1994)
886. The Gleaners & I (Agnès Varda, 2000)
890. The Dark Knight (Christopher Nolan, 2008)
916. Poison (Todd Haynes, 1990)
918. Jour de Féte (Jacques Tati, 1948)
922. The Death of Mr. Lazarescu (Cristi Puiu, 2005)
933. Amélie (Jean-Pierre Jeunet, 2001)
935. The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (Peter Jackson, 2003)
937. Million Dollar Baby (Clint Eastwood, 2004)
943. The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (Peter Jackson, 2002)
968. The Roaring Twenties (Raoul Walsh, 1939)
969. The Ox-Bow Incident (William Wellman, 1943)
971. Elephant (Gus Van Sant, 2003)
974. In Praise of Love (Jean-Luc Godard, 2001)
976. Kill Bill Vol. 1 (Quentin Tarantino, 2003)
979. Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (Vincente Minnelli, 1962)
981. Mothlight (Stan Brakhage, 1963)
990. Near Dark (Kathryn Bigelow, 1987)
992. Tale of Tales (Yuriy Norshteyn, 1979)
996. Mr. Arkadin (Orson Welles, 1955)
997. Husbands and Wives (Woody Allen, 1992)
998. The Truman Show (Peter Weir, 1998)
1000. Fires on the Plain (Kon Ichikawa, 1959)


now please discuss how boring Citizen Kane is

 

[cwmartin]

surprised by elephant

 

[eggandI]

I didn't care for the godfather tbh.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Fires on the Plain is on the board! Love that film.

 

[Timber]

surprised by elephant

I donno. it's the kind of movie cinephiles tend to like. i was actually more surprised by the inclusion of The Dark Knight

 

[Timber]

i found a neat button that allows you to see the movies that have been jetissoned from the list. one of the most egregious ones is Almodovar's 'Women on the Verge of a Nervous Breakdown' which I saw a while back and is the most hilarious damn thing.

Leaving Las Vegas also left the list which is a very, very good thing. God, what a horrible movie.

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

I like Citizen Kane and think that it's still a good movie in spite of all the years, but I think that much better movies have been made in the past 70 or so years. That that movie is still held up as the #1 of all time is always surprising to me.

 

[Dabookerman]

Why do so many people like Citizen Kane? I mean it's so old, and it's in black and white. I remember watching it, and I thought it was about a vigilante who beat people up with a cane.. And then I left feeling rather disappointed.

 

[backflip10019]

So I guess a truly great (top 25) film hasn't been made in the past 30 years? Yeah, don't agree with that.

 

[Borgnine]

Return of the King at 935? BULLSHIT, it at least deserves to be in the top 928. Shit list.

 

[Dabookerman]

Return of the King at 935? BULLSHIT, it at least deserves to be in the top 928. Shit list.

Oh god. You made a mistake

 

[gdt]

So I guess a truly great (top 25) film hasn't been made in the past 30 years? Yeah, don't agree with that.

Old fogey crotchety critics are the sample group.

 

[PantherLotus]

I've seen only 4 of the top 25 and yet I feel like I've caught a pretty good cross-section of film history. Heh.

 

[Veidt]

So basically another case of "the first movies were the best! These new things, colour, CGI or watever sucks. Just so you know!!!"

 

[Souldriver]

The only thing I was thinking was "if they added new movies to the list, they better have Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind on there"!


I'm happily surprised that it's the third highest new entry at 535.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Good for Seven Samurai. One day it'll make it to #1 baby!

Robocop better than Return of the King is awesome, although Fellowship should have gotten a mention instead.

edit: Nevermind, Fellowship is already on there and in a deservedly higher spot.

It's in the 700s somewhere.

Heh, yeah, figured I should check the whole list after making that comment.

edit 3: ooooooooooh Heat has gone up!

 

[Borgnine]

Robocop better than Return of the King is awesome, although Fellowship should have gotten a mention instead.

It's in the 700s somewhere.

 

[Timber]

So I guess a truly great (top 25) film hasn't been made in the past 30 years? Yeah, don't agree with that.

well, as the list is called 1000 Greatest Films it's pretty clear that people consider many films made in the past 30 years truly great

also, you need to let things like these simmer for a while if you want to fully comprehend their worth and be able to judge their staying power/timelessness. i'm sure plenty of newer movies will climb up the ranks eventually.

 

[Danielsan]

These greatest movies ever lists are always horse shit.
Yes these movies were great in their day and they were very influential, but they don't hold a candle to the great movies of this decade.
Put them in a "most influential movies list ever" and move on.

 

[Bleda]

That's a pretty good top 25. I had never heard of this site before.
I am going to check the rest of the list.

 

[Biff]

How can a 56 year old movie suddenly jump a spot up the list? Our view of Japan has evolved so powerfully over the last year that now the work made 56 years ago is slightly more powerful then it was 55 years ago?

If you really think about it, it hurts your brain.

So, if apes take over earth tomorrow, Planet of the Apes should be #1, because it ended up being right?

 

[joeyjoejoeshabadoo]

Mr. Arkadin has a better behind the scenes story than the actual film. I wouldn't call it a bad movie but it's not that great.

 

[Timber]

These greatest movies ever lists are always horse shit.
Yes these movies were great in their day and they were very influential, but they don't hold a candle to the great movies of this decade.
Put them in a "most influential movies list ever" and move on.

So basically another case of "the first movies were the best! These new things, colour, CGI or watever sucks. Just so you know!!!"

So basically more posts that scream "I have not seen 90% of these movies but will complain about their position anyway" and/or "I am a giant toolbag!"

note to danielsan: movies better than Lost in Translation do indeed exist. and they have indeed been made in the previous century. sorry to disappoint you.

 

[Roi]

That's a pretty good top 25. I had never heard of this site before.
I am going to check the rest of the list.

Never heard of it? It's the most important (top-)film list!

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

These greatest movies ever lists are always horse shit.
Yes these movies were great in their day and they were very influential, but they don't hold a candle to the great movies of this decade.
Put them in a "most influential movies list ever" and move on.

These films are at the top of this list because they are outstanding films that over time have proven their worth as lasting cinematic art. Wait a little while longer before you proclaim your favorite film from 2008 the BEST FILM EVER.

So basically more posts that scream "I have not seen 90% of these movies but will complain about their position anyway" and/or "I am a giant toolbag!"

note to danielsan: movies better than Lost in Translation do indeed exist. and they have indeed been made in the previous century. sorry to disappoint you.

Pretty much. This thread is quickly turning into a shit fest full of "THESE MOVIES ARE OLD, THEY SUCK," which is very unfortunate.

Watch some of these god damn films with an open mind before you go yapping. All it does is make you sound ignorant.

 

[Timber]

Which reminds me, I neglected to mention their list of the 21st century's best films

http://www.theyshootpictures.com/21stcentury_allfilms.htm

if old movies intimidate you then you can consider this the definitive Best EVAR list.

it will be updated later this month. I'm expecting There Will Be Blood to enter the top 10.

 

[Alucrid]

I'm thinking about getting netflix, would they have these on there? Preferably on stream?

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

I'm thinking about getting netflix, would they have these on there? Preferably on stream?

The majority of Kurosawa's films in the TSPDT top 25 are available on Netflix streaming, as are The Searchers, Vertigo, 2001, 8 1/2, Bicycle Thieves, and probably more.

 

[Bleda]

Never heard of it? It's the most important (top-)film list!

Yeah! It seems to be pretty well-known, I don't know how that happened!

 

[Danielsan]

So basically more posts that scream "I have not seen 90% of these movies but will complain about their position anyway" and/or "I am a giant toolbag!"

note to danielsan: movies better than Lost in Translation do indeed exist. and they have indeed been made in the previous century. sorry to disappoint you.

I'm not claiming that there aren't any better movies than Lost in Translation.
Thanks for remembering what I love though.

I just think that scriptwriting, acting and cinematography have vastly approved over the years and better films have been made than the mandatory list of historically relevant movies.

 

[eggandI]

These lists are always so dodgy. There is some truth to them but then again everything is so subjective that I find them to be a waste of time more than anything. I mean personally, I think City of God is much more interesting, real and powerful than a film like Casablanca, which is supposed to have the "perfect" script or whatever.

I think "most influential films" is a better title for these lists.

 

[Sanjuro]

Never heard of the site before but that is a very nice list. /bookmarked.

 

[MThanded]

804. Requiem for a Dream (Darren Aronofsky, 2000)

 

[Solo]

#2 and #4 are, along with The Good, The Bad and The Ugly, my favorite movies.

 

[Blader]

Battleship Potemkin is only there for being influential. I refuse to believe there are people who watch that film for enjoyment.

Same for The Bicycle Thief.

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

If I had to pick an objective 'best film of all time', I'd probably pick 2001: A Space Odyssey, though that probably wouldn't be my personal #1 (top five, though).

To the OP: I notice that you are a huge McCabe and Mrs. Miller fan. I saw that for the first time recently, and while I liked it, I was kind of surprised that it is as acclaimed as it is. Is it the type of film that you have to watch a few times to really fall in love, or do you have a review somewhere that could maybe help me figure out what I am missing? As I said, I did like it, but I want to love it.

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Battleship Potemkin is only there for being influential. I refuse to believe there are people who watch that film for enjoyment.

Same for The Bicycle Thief.

I love Bicycle Thieves. It's quite depressing, so it's not the type of film you often revisit, but I think that it definitely holds up as a powerful piece of cinema that stretches beyond its status as an influential neorealist work.

 

[Blader]

I love Bicycle Thieves. It's quite depressing, so it's not the type of film you often revisit, but I think that it definitely holds up as a powerful piece of cinema that stretches beyond its status as an influential neorealist work.

I didn't really think it was all that depressing (or at least not as depressing as I was expecting), which may be why I was let down by it. :lol

 

[Cosmic Bus]

I come into these topics for the first post, and right on schedule, I get a headache from some of the responses before the end of the first page.

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

I come into these topics for the first post, and right on schedule, I get a headache from some of the responses before the end of the first page.

Which ones specifically? I respect your opinions on movies, so I'd be interested to get your take on this.

 

[Kafarabo]

804. Requiem for a Dream (Darren Aronofsky, 2000)

One of my favourite films.

 

[Timber]

I'm not claiming that there aren't any better movies than Lost in Translation.
Thanks for remembering what I love though.

I just think that scriptwriting, acting and cinematography have vastly approved over the years and better films have been made than the mandatory list of historically relevant movies.

And I think you haven't seen nearly enough old movies to make these kinds of judgements. I might be assuming too much, but what you're saying indicates that you seriously lack either movie-watching experience or taste.

Scriptwriting, especially in Hollywood, used to be a hell of a lot better overall than what it is now. The very fact that old movies couldn't rely so much on action and visual grandeur made good screenwriting absolutely imperative. There's a reason so many of Casablanca's lines have become a part of pop culture vernacular. Movies by people like Billy Wilder and Ernst Lubitsch had some of the cleverest lines as well as turns and twists of plot you'll ever find. To Be or Not To Be is as witty today as it was in the 40s.

I saw Limelight yesterday, which was written by someone who is hailed first and foremost as a great slapstick comedian of the silent era. It features lines such as these:

Terry: I thought you hated the theater?
Calvero: I also hate the sight of blood, but it's in my veins.

Now how is that any worse than anything released today? And sure, old Hollywood movies tended to be different in terms of subject matter, characters and acting. But that doesn't make them inherently worse. And if it's realism you want from old movies - the kind of realism modern 'arthousy' films have - then there are plenty of European films that will suit your taste. In the top 25 alone are movies like The Bicycle Thief and L'Atalante.

And cinematography has been as splendid as it can be nowadays since the 1920s. Movies by John Ford, Orson Welles, Federico Fellini, Michael Powell and countless others contain some stunning imagery. There wasn't as much CG and bombast back then, but you'll encounter shot composition as gorgeous as any in plenty of old movies.

Watch 8 1/2. Then watch it again and again (the again part is important) and then tell me it isn't as funny, exuberant and profound as any 21st century movie. Or watch The Bicycle Thief and Umberto D and tell me they aren't as sad and affecting. There's nothing about these movies that makes them inferior in any way to anything that's new. And they're not just for old stuffy critics. They're movies worth watching by anyone who appreciates good things.

 

[Cosmic Bus]

Which ones specifically? I respect your opinions on movies, so I'd be interested to get your take on this.

Oh, come on now, we both know the ones I'm talking about.

I wouldn't really have anything to add to the discussion; there are plenty of excellent, interesting, worthwhile films on the list (as far as I've read through it, at least) and just as many that I don't personally have any love for yet I understand their importance or significance.

As expected, Timber's doing a great job rebutting the naysayers, so I'll just sit back and continue to massage my temples.

 

[Timber]

These lists are always so dodgy. There is some truth to them but then again everything is so subjective that I find them to be a waste of time more than anything. I mean personally, I think City of God is much more interesting, real and powerful than a film like Casablanca, which is supposed to have the "perfect" script or whatever.

I think "most influential films" is a better title for these lists.

But does it really matter? Do lists like these and your own personal taste have to coalign perfectly? This list doesn't purport to be some kind of infallible authority. It's there to point out movies that are well-loved to those who haven't seen them. How come every time we see a list we need to criticise it - even if we acknowledge subjectivity - instead of being thankful that it's made available to us? I found out about this site about two years ago. At the time I'd seen about 200 of its entries; right now I'm just over 400. Many of the movies that without the list would've taken me much longer to become aware how have become some my favourites, and have been wonderful and memorable experiences. Lists aren't just there to shoot down your taste and tell you you're wrong. The same goes for critics. They can serve to enrich you as long as you'll let them.

I'm starting to sound pretty sappy right now but it does bother me somewhat that folks would rather bicker about than celebrate good art.

 

[Osuwari]

shit, i haven't seen a single movie in the top 25...

 

[sankt-Antonio]

wait, terminator salvation is not in the top 25? shit list...

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

And I think you haven't seen nearly enough old movies to make these kinds of judgements. I might be assuming too much, but what you're saying indicates that you seriously lack either movie-watching experience or taste.

Scriptwriting, especially in Hollywood, used to be a hell of a lot better overall than what it is now. The very fact that old movies couldn't rely so much on action and visual grandeur made good screenwriting absolutely imperative. There's a reason so many of Casablanca's lines have become a part of pop culture vernacular. Movies by people like Billy Wilder and Ernst Lubitsch had some of the cleverest lines as well as turns and twists of plot you'll ever find. To Be or Not To Be is as witty today as it was in the 40s.

I saw Limelight yesterday, which was written by someone who is hailed first and foremost as a great slapstick comedian of the silent era. It features lines such as these:

Terry: I thought you hated the theater?
Calvero: I also hate the sight of blood, but it's in my veins.

Now how is that any worse than anything released today? And sure, old Hollywood movies tended to be different in terms of subject matter, characters and acting. But that doesn't make them inherently worse. And if it's realism you want from old movies - the kind of realism modern 'arthousy' films have - then there are plenty of European films that will suit your taste. In the top 25 alone are movies like The Bicycle Thief and L'Atalante.

And cinematography has been as splendid as it can be nowadays since the 1920s. Movies by John Ford, Orson Welles, Federico Fellini, Michael Powell and countless others contain some stunning imagery. There wasn't as much CG and bombast back then, but you'll encounter shot composition as gorgeous as any in plenty of old movies.

Watch 8 1/2. Then watch it again and again (the again part is important) and then tell me it isn't as funny, exuberant and profound as any 21st century movie. Or watch The Bicycle Thief and Umberto D and tell me they aren't as sad and affecting. There's nothing about these movies that makes them inferior in any way to anything that's new. And they're not just for old stuffy critics. They're movies worth watching by anyone who appreciates good things.

This is a pretty great post and should be quoted anytime a thread pops up about somebody not liking old movies. I don't agree that scriptwriting has gotten worse, but I agree that it's closed-minded to dismiss old movies just because they are different.

 

[RSTEIN]

I find it hard to believe there are 700 movies better than There Will Be Blood.

 

[Timber]

shit, i haven't seen a single movie in the top 25...

Not even the Godfathers? Get on it right away!

This is a pretty great post and should be quoted anytime a thread pops up about somebody not liking old movies. I don't agree that scriptwriting has gotten worse, but I agree that it's closed-minded to dismiss old movies just because they are different.

Thanks! And I failed to see it earlier but I just now saw your post about McCabe. I'm going to drink some tea first and then type up a response.

 

[eggandI]

But does it really matter? Do lists like these and your own personal taste have to coalign perfectly? This list doesn't purport to be some kind of infallible authority. It's there to point out movies that are well-loved to those who haven't seen them. How come every time we see a list we need to criticise it - even if we acknowledge subjectivity - instead of being thankful that it's made available to us? I found out about this site about two years ago. At the time I'd seen about 200 of its entries; right now I'm just over 400. Many of the movies that without the list would've taken me much longer to become aware how have become some my favourites, and have been wonderful and memorable experiences. Lists aren't just there to shoot down your taste and tell you you're wrong. The same goes for critics. They can serve to enrich you as long as you'll let them.

I'm starting to sound pretty sappy right now but it does bother me somewhat that folks would rather bicker about than celebrate good art.

They don't have to coalign, not at all. I have no problems with any of the movies and their place on this list. Was I giving the impression that I did? Not what I intended. And I think the title does matter because "influential" is something that's harder to shoot down than "greatest" thus it doesn't cause as much bickering because XX is #3 while XY is #45.

I think someone would be hard pressed to deny the influential potency of films like the Godfather and Citizen Kane.

About critics.. movie reviews to me are about as useful as their video gaming counterparts, not at all. So, I won't even get into that

Anyways this is a minor thing really. It's a good, long list. Good for people who haven't already seen classics like 7 Samurai.