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[Ned Flanders]

We should reward someone for vigilante justice? It's one thing to defend yourself while being attacked or something like that, but stalking and killing people who robbed you is lawless, whether they threatened you or not. They didn't threaten his daughters and then remain at the house in order to do so, they made threats, took what they wanted and left. You can't justify stalking and killing them under our laws. I don't want to second guess his reaction, as there is no telling how I would react under similar circumstances, but regardless, what he did was wreckless and more importantly, lawless. Vigilantism is either acceptable or it isn't, and in our country, by our statutes, it isn't.

 

[iapetus]

Cool. If you'll excuse me, I'm just off on a murderous killing spree, just in case any of the people I gun down might do something bad tomorrow. When they catch me, I'll say that UltimateMarioMan said it would be okay.

Let me help you out. There is a METRIC SHIT TON wrong with the United States Justice system. This guy walking wouldn't even be in the top 500.

True, unfortunately. But "this other thing is also wrong" has always struck me as a lame excuse for doing the wrong thing, so someone who is guilty of murder should suffer the appropriate punishment for it. Mitigating circumstances can come into sentencing.

And don't give me that 'not premeditated' shit. He deliberately got in his car, drove them off the road, and then mowed one of them down in cold blood. "Ducked behind the dash and it all became a blur" my ass. If that gets someone off, then just close your eyes while you shoot someone and you're just fine.

 

[Late Stage Marxist]

This story is all kinds of awesome.

 

[Shouta]

I don't think he intended on killing them (which some of you are implying) as he points out near the beginning of the article. I did find it interesting that the article says he rammed the car (I somehow don't really believe that) though.

 

[ScientificNinja]

It almost sounds as though some of you are willing to show the robbers some measure of leniency just because they only 'threatened' to do stuff without actually doing any of it.

Maybe it's just me, but I tend to take people at their word. If someone put a shotgun to my face, told me they'd kill me and rape my daughters, I would take it very seriously and, given the opportunity, kill their asses for it. I'd look forward to a suspended sentence or good behaviour bond or something...

 

[Ill Saint]

Right, so the dudes say "hey, we're gonna rape your daughters... but later, after we drive off with your cash" -- and you, instead of calling the cops and getting the hell out of there, get in your truck, tail the guys for a while, ram their car a bit, dodge a few bullets, follow them as they're running off somewhere and mow one of them in half?

 

[iapetus]

Right, so the dudes say "hey, we're gonna rape your daughters... but later, after we drive off with your cash" -- and you, instead of calling the cops and getting the hell out of there, get in your truck, tail the guys for a while, ram their car a bit, dodge a few bullets, follow them as they're running off somewhere and mow one of them in half?

In self defence.

 

[Ill Saint]

In self defence.

Is that self-defence? to actively give chase after the guys drove off?

 

[Ned Flanders]

Is that self-defence? to actively give chase after the guys drove off?

I guess we're the only ones who see a disconnect there...

 

[ScientificNinja]

Is that self-defence? to actively give chase after the guys drove off?

better that than continue to live in fear. I love the cops and everything, but they do jack squat.

 

[iapetus]

Is that self-defence?

No, that's sarcasm.

 

[Bob White]

better that than continue to live in fear.

Yep.

"Some guys robbed me and one of them said he'd be back to rape my daughters. Oh well, I called the cops and they're hot on the trail. I can sleep easy tonight."

 

[firex]

So we're condoning vigilante justice now? (I hate to use this next sentence). WTF are the police for then?

911 is a joke! (not serious, but you made me think of it)

 

[Zaptruder]

Man 1, wreckless endangerment of public safety.

That kind of reactive over the top rage is just as much a problem in society as those punk kids.

With a lesser reactive trigger, that's some guy killing some dude for sleeping with his wife.

Ok think about this. What if he didn't do what he did and a day later the guys ended up killing innocent people in a botched robbery? This man did something few people would. He did something. If he is charged with anything the last shred of respect for the justice system will be destroyed.

Why don't we turn that around with the if's.

What if he got not only himself but his daughters killed after slamming into the robber's vehicles twice.

What if he fucked up during the chase and killed innocent pedestrians and motorists?

 

[etiolate]

The reason this happened has to do with America's lack of enthusiasm for the justice system. The outcomes of tons of lawsuits and the OJ trial have had an affect on the psyche of the public. People just don't trust justice will be served. He could call the cops, cancel his credit cards, leave his house and hide. He wouldn't feel safe though and he'd worry about his possesions.

 

[Virgin Wii]

"Some guys robbed me and one of them said he'd be back to rape my daughters. Oh well, I called the cops and they're hot on the trail. I can sleep easy tonight."

There are a lot of replies like this in this thread. What you people don't seem to understand is that this was NEVER stated to be the case in the article. It said they threatened to rape his daughters, presumably as a consequence for not complying with their demands. The article doesn't say anything about them threatening to come back; the father was afraid they would (because he wasn't thinking) and that is it.

Under those circumstances, what he did was completely reckless and stupid.

 

[SteveMeister]

better that than continue to live in fear. I love the cops and everything, but they do jack squat.

Yes, that's why all our jails sit empty and it's complete anarchy on the streets.

 

[ScientificNinja]

Yes, that's why all our jails sit empty and it's complete anarchy on the streets.

Tell that to my insurance company, which didn't believe me when I explained the following: a couple of thieves CUT A WHOLE through the side wall of my secure high-rise apartment, made off with $12,000 of goods and the cops told me over the phone "we're not likely to find the culprits, so we won't bother coming around. Just leave your details with the lady at the switch. It might help if you checked out your local pawn shops - some of your stuff might turn up there".

Yep. At least nobody was harmed. I love the cops.

 

[Ill Saint]

No, that's sarcasm.

Ah, my bad... Sometimes It's hard to pick out here.
I missed your previous post too.

 

[Tea Master]

A medal of stupidity is what that man deserves. He risked his life and the life of innocent bystanders for nothing.

 

[RaymondCarver]

I'm about being just, but sometimes taking no action is the wrong choice.




hmm. I side with the father. His actions may seem rash, but have someone threaten your family. See how you react. Think about heathens hopped up on crystal meth coming back one night for that stereo, other items, and sticking it to your two daughters. I hope that after charges are filed against the man that they are dropped soon thereafter or are dropped in court.








Noone's yet mentioned that these kids will probably be raped in jail. I hope not. That's horrible, but as Kaijima says the truth here:

In my ethics, it is very simple - if you're good to people, you deserve good in return. If you fuck with people, you sign away your waver to safety and happiness and continued health. You pay your money, you take your chances. All the legal debate and ethical wrangling that happens after the dust settles doesn't change that.

The robbers signed away their right to safty and happiness. They're probably drug addicts, and their lives are horrible, etc., but my family would not hesitate to make the same decision in a simmilar situation. I think the law is on this man's side, and most of the cops probably agree with what he did. I have a bias, I know, but I also know lots o' cops.

 

[jett]

They fucking deserved it. It's a shame only one of them died.

 

[Freestyler]

Noone's yet mentioned that these kids will probably be raped in jail. I hope not.

Yes, I too wish for the best for these charming young children who are just so innocent. Sure, they were gonna rape two girls in front of their father, but god forbid someone rape them in prison!

That said, I'd pay to see that 'little' white baddy getting some action (not rape!), he's pretty tasty.

I can't believe some people want the hero to be charged with anything.

 

[Tenguman]

Eh, if someone shot at me from their car, it's open season on their asses if they are stupid enough to get out.

Man some of you guys sound like those libs that want to let criminals sue a homeowner for shooting at them when they broke into the house


anyway...murder? no...manslaughter...*maybe*

 

[iapetus]

I can't believe some people want the hero to be charged with anything.

Sorry, I'm slightly confused by your abuse of the word 'hero'. I take it you're talking about the murderer?

 

[Socreges]

We should reward someone for vigilante justice? It's one thing to defend yourself while being attacked or something like that, but stalking and killing people who robbed you is lawless, whether they threatened you or not. They didn't threaten his daughters and then remain at the house in order to do so, they made threats, took what they wanted and left. You can't justify stalking and killing them under our laws. I don't want to second guess his reaction, as there is no telling how I would react under similar circumstances, but regardless, what he did was wreckless and more importantly, lawless. Vigilantism is either acceptable or it isn't, and in our country, by our statutes, it isn't.

That's where I stand.

You can't allow people to break the law for revenge against someone who did likewise. I don't care how poor the system is or what the circumstances were. Appliance needs to be uniform and consistent.

 

[Ill Saint]

I'll third that.

 

[Heezzi]

From reading these replies, I'm glad none of you are breeding.

 

[Fowler]

This has nothing to do with anything, but... Kyle Gibson? Didn't he rape Nicole Palmer in Season 1 of 24?

 

[duckroll]

Awesome! From the responses in this thread, I can deduce that it would probably be possible to borrow a large sum of money from a person, proceed to chase him down in my SUV, ram him, run him over tearing his body into two, and as long as I have two teenage daughters that will testify that he tried to rob me and threatened to rape them, I'M A HERO!

Sure you might now proceed to argue that such were not the circumstances, but how would you know in any case. Do you know the persons involved in ANY of these news cases? What's the victim going to do? He's not going to testify, he's TORN IN TWO!

The key point everyone keeps ragging on is "OMFG THE GUY THREATENED TO RAPE HIS DAUGHTERS" which at this point is pretty much his word against theirs. While the fact that they robbed him is very clear (there's evidence), you really can't go tear someone in two for something they said. What's going to happen next? Someone tries to pickpocket me and I beat him to a pulp in the middle of a crowded mall then proceed to rip his eyeballs out and then claim that he said he was going to stalk me and rape me in the ass? Vigilante crap should never be supported ever.

I have no sympathy for the dead guy in this case if what he did was true, but I will also have no sympathy for the father if he lands his ass in jail as he SHOULD.

 

[Gek54]

Hypetheticaly speaking, if you drove by and gave someone the finger and they got all pissed off and ran you off the road. Would you be just in shooting a gun at this person if you felt they were threatening your life with their car?

 

[Ninja Scooter]

i saw this guy on CNN yesterday and the story he gave is that he followed them to get the plate numbers and was on the phone w/ the cops at the time, and the robbers started shooting back at him, shattering his windsheield. At this point he ducked under the dash, lost control of the car and ran over one of the guys.

 

[Kabuki Waq]

The Dad is a hero if someone threatened my family in that way you better believe i would want them dead.

 

[iapetus]

i saw this guy on CNN yesterday and the story he gave is that he followed them to get the plate numbers and was on the phone w/ the cops at the time, and the robbers started shooting back at him, shattering his windsheield. At this point he ducked under the dash, lost control of the car and ran over one of the guys.

So, in his favour, he's not very good at lying.

Edit: Had to go back and respond to a few more quotes:

He could call the cops, cancel his credit cards, leave his house and hide. He wouldn't feel safe though and he'd worry about his possesions.

Right now, in the GA-sanctioned spirit of righteous vengeance, the robber's friends and family are probably planning to kill the guy for what he did to him. Wouldn't that be nice?

Man some of you guys sound like those libs that want to let criminals sue a homeowner for shooting at them when they broke into the house

No, though if a homeowner deliberately uses unreasonable force against a criminal I'd expect to see them punished by the law for it. Suing is ridiculous, and very American.

But that's for a clear-cut case of self defence. Newsflash: if you have to chase them down, ram them off the road and run them over it doesn't count as self defence any more.

 

[Socreges]

i saw this guy on CNN yesterday and the story he gave is that he followed them to get the plate numbers and was on the phone w/ the cops at the time, and the robbers started shooting back at him, shattering his windsheield. At this point he ducked under the dash, lost control of the car and ran over one of the guys.

Though from the article in this thread:

O’Neal got in his Dodge Durango and trailed the four suspects along Route 29, eventually ramming his truck into the rear of their car.

Sgt. Pedro Medina said O’Neal rammed into the suspects car a second time, at which point the alleged gunman, a Hispanic male, fired two shots from the rear of the car.