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Trump Poised to Lift Ban on C.I.A. ‘Black Site’ Prisons

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smokeymicpot

smokeymicpot

Beat EviLore at pool.
Exile20 said:
As I said before, tommorrow he is going to do some more shit and we will forget todays shit.

That is his plan to bombard the public with as much shit as possible everyday so by the time you get angry enough at one thing, you are appalled at the next.
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Today is the day of the wall. They leak out the plan for the next day in the am or during the briefing. So this might be tomorrows or something else.
 
W

wenis

Registered for GAF on September 11, 2001.
There's no way his opponents will end up in these sites. Absolutely no way a facist will do that.
 
W

whytemyke

Honorary Canadian.
Sad thing is he probably thinks black site prisons are the ones with mostly black inmates and this is him reaching out to poor/urban communities.
 
A

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
It's amazing how much shit he's causing in a week.

You'd think the US was just conquered by North Korea or something, instead of just having a new president.
 
UberTag

UberTag

Member
mackattk said:
Torture works if you just want to get people to say what you want them to say. I guess for Trump that would be good enough.

This man is going to go down as one of the worst, most destructive presidents in US history.
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One of? I'm not sure you intended to include those two extra words.
This is just Day 6, incidentally.
 
D

Dehnus

Member
smokeymicpot said:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/25/us/politics/cia-detainee-prisons.html?smid=tw-share

WASHINGTON — The Trump administration is preparing a sweeping executive order that would clear the way for the Central Intelligence Agency to reopen overseas “black site” prisons, like those where it detained and tortured terrorism suspects before former President Obama shut them down.

President Trump’s three-page draft order, titled “Detention and Interrogation of Enemy Combatants,” and obtained by The New York Times would also undo many of the other restrictions on handling detainees that Mr. Obama put in place in response to policies of the Bush administration.

The draft order does not direct any immediate reopening of C.I.A. prisons or revival of torture tactics, which are now barred by statute. But it sets up high-level policy reviews to make further recommendations in both areas to Mr. Trump, who vowed during the campaign to bring back waterboarding and a “hell of a lot worse” – not only because “torture works,” but because even “if it doesn’t work, they deserve it anyway.”

A White House spokesman did not immediately respond to an email inquiring about the draft order, including when Mr. Trump may intend to sign it. But the order was accompanied by a one-page statement that criticized the Obama administration for having “refrained from exercising certain authorities” about detainees it said were critical to defending the country from “radical Islamism.”

In their place, Mr. Trump’s draft directive order would resurrect a 2007 executive order issued by President George W. Bush. It responded to a 2006 Supreme Court about the Geneva Conventions that had put C.I.A. interrogators at risk of prosecution for war crimes, leading to a temporary halt of the agency’s “enhanced” interrogations program.
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What is it with Republicans and being evil? Yet at the same time blaming others of "being evil" for doing the same thing. Seriously, what is their problem? There is nothing pragmatic about their ultra evil levels.
 
L

Lime

Member
Obama's decision to prevent all accountability for torture, civil or criminal, bears some responsibility for letting Trump bring it back.

When President Obama took office in 2009, he put in place an executive order designed to prevent the abuses that took place during the Bush administration, which used waterboarding, extended sleep deprivation, standing in painful ”stress positions" on broken feet or legs, and the forced ”rectal feeding" of detainees carrying out hunger strikes over their conditions.

The executive order barred any ”officer, employee, or other agent" of the US government (whether military, CIA, FBI, or any other agency) from using any interrogation method that is not among those methods listed in US Army Field Manual, which contains detailed rules and guidelines for a wide range of procedures important to soldiers serving in the field. Since waterboarding and other ”enhanced interrogation techniques" favored by the Bush administration are not part of the Army Field Manual, they could no longer be used.

The problem is that those restrictions were part of an executive order, not an actual law passed by Congress, which means they could easily be overturned by the next president with an executive order of his own.

To prevent that from happening, the Obama administration worked with the Republican-controlled Congress in 2015 on legislation to make the rule about following the Army Field Manual part of actual US law. The legislation had strong bipartisan support, passing the Senate in an overwhelming vote of 91-3. It was meant to ensure that future presidents couldn't change the rules without going through Congress — but it contained a major loophole.

Robert Chesney, professor and associate dean at the University of Texas School of Law, explains on the Lawfare blog that there's nothing explicitly stopping the secretary of defense, who is appointed by the president, from changing what's in the Army Field Manual. Indeed, the law actually requires the Defense Department to "complete a thorough review" of the field manual every three years.

This means that the new secretary of defense could potentially push the Army to alter the Field Manual to include things like waterboarding in its list of approved interrogation techniques, thereby making all the safeguards President Obama put in place essentially meaningless.

Now, to be clear, this doesn't mean the US military or the CIA would actually be willing to use waterboarding, even if ordered to do so. Former top military brass and national security officials rejected Trump's comments during the campaign about potentially ordering the military to torture people and kill the families of suspected terrorists. (Trump later backed away from the latter idea, which would be a war crime.)

Current senior officers have been careful not to comment about Trump specifically to avoid wading into US domestic politics. But they've made clear that they're just as opposed to waterboarding or targeting the families of terrorists.

Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Joseph Dunford, while explicitly refraining from discussing Trump directly, told the Senate Armed Services Committee in March that ”Those kinds of activities that you described are inconsistent with the values of our nation." Former CIA director Michael Hayden, who also led the National Security Agency from 1999 to 2005, told HBO's Bill Maher in February that if Trump were to order such actions once in office, ”the American armed forces would refuse to act."

Current CIA director John Brennan, speaking at an event at the Brookings Institution think tank back in April, stated, ”If a president were to order the agency to carry out waterboarding or something else, it'll be up to the director of CIA and others within CIA to decide whether or not that direction and order is something that they can carry out in good conscience," he said.

”As long as I'm director of CIA, irrespective of what the president says, I'm not going to be the director of CIA who gives that order. They'll have to find another director," he added.
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http://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...-speech-torture-drones-nsa-surveillance-trump
 
B

BowieZ

Banned
I just do not understand the purpose of this.

Is Flynn behind this? Bannon?

Is it just anti-Obama spite?

Is it part of a gaslighting campaign?
 
J

Jumeira

Banned
What criteria must one hold to be a prisoner of these black sites? Because you just had to look a certain way to be thrown into GitMo. This is terrifying for a lot of brown people who can be locked away for no reason.
 
RPGCrazied

RPGCrazied

Member
BowieZ said:
I just do not understand the purpose of this.

Is Flynn behind this? Bannon?

Is it just anti-Obama spite?

Is it part of a gaslighting campaign?
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Probably all of the above. They did just hire 2 more Breitbart people. Lol, a conspiracy theorist website running the show.
 
T

Tovarisc

Member
Jumeira said:
What criteria must one hold to be a prisoner of these black sites? Because you just had to look a certain way to be thrown into GitMo. This is terrifying for a lot of brown people who can be locked away for no reason.
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Just be terror suspect, afaik. Basically same as GitMo, just even less oversight for what happens there.
 
UberTag

UberTag

Member
Tovarisc said:
Just be terror suspect, afaik. Basically same as GitMo, just even less oversight for what happens there.
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I suppose encouraging the American people to rise up against the tyranny of their own government is enough to label someone as a "terror suspect", right?

I guess we can expect to see Meryl Streep and Madonna wind up there in short order.
 
A

Addi

Member
It's sad that you need a president to deem torture illegal or not. It should be common sense not to torture. One could hope that CIA responded like this: "Well, thanks mr. President, it's ok to have the option I guess, but we're pretty much done with that", but there are probably crazies everywhere just waiting to torture again.
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
https://twitter.com/BraddJaffy/status/824278749805998082

McCain is standing firm that the law forbids returning to torture, implies lawsuit

They can probably do blacksites but if they become torture places or even if the US allows others to torture still could violate the law.

Addi said:
It's sad that you need a president to deem torture illegal or not. It should be common sense not to torture. One could hope that CIA responded like this: "Well, thanks mr. President, it's ok to have the option I guess, but we're pretty much done with that", but there are probably crazies everywhere just waiting to torture again.
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You don't

Congress has forbid torture.
 
C

CrunchyB

Member
jfkgoblue said:
We just did that last Saturday lol.
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Not really. Turnout was good, but a bunch of people holding signs with funny memes during the weekend were easily ignored by your politicans. You will need to do it for an extended amount of time and it must be disruptive or they will never take note.
 
N

NH Apache

Banned
smokeymicpot said:
McCain responded.
http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/press-releases?ID=240E4B4E-4EC6-4FE1-B183-E063B51BADF2

STATEMENT BY SASC CHAIRMAN JOHN McCAIN ON REPORTS OF EXECUTIVE ORDER DIRECTING REVIEW OF INTERROGATION POLICIES


“The President can sign whatever executive orders he likes. But the law is the law. We are not bringing back torture in the United States of America.
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You get em John. For whatever else you think of this man, he knows first hand how bad it is.
 
Whompa02

Whompa02

Member
>Says Obama doesn't fix Guantanamo and did a terrible job (he reduced the amount of prisoners there to about 40).

>Creates mini Guantanamos throughout CIA network...

Trumpets, please defend this.
 
N

Neoweee

Member
Xe4 said:
Disgusting. Just plain gross. Fuck you Trump.




Yup, all that needs to be said. I'm going to repeat this for the next four years in the hope somebody realizes how fucking stupid they were being.
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It may help for 2020, but a new generation of young assholes will throw the 2032 election.
 
A

Ahasverus

Member
tumblr_myliv5k1mv1qg1mbqo3_r3_250.gif


Now used unironically :(
 
G

Garlador

Member
As disgusted as I was with him pre-election, as rotten of a human being as he portrayed himself to be, and as valid and concerning as all my fears felt at the time...

... I am still utterly flabbergasted that Trump has risen to the occasion and demonstrated he is, against all odds and reality, even WORSE than I had feared.
 
S

siddx

Magnificent Eager Mighty Brilliantly Erect Registereduser
Remember during the elections when trump promised to do this? Remember when he also said would do all the other despicable things he is doing right now? Remember when dumb fuckheads in the center kept trying to pat our heads and tell us it was just talk and that he would never actually go through with any of it? That all our fears weren't legitimate and we needed to calm down?
 
L

Lime

Member
And remember who the Republicans and Democrats just confirmed as the director of the CIA:

Pompeo is a far-right Kansas Republican who has in the past defended CIA officials who engaged in torture, calling them “patriots.” Last week, he left the door open to torture by acknowledging in his written responses to the Senate Intelligence Committee that he would be open to altering a 2015 law prohibiting the government from using techniques not listed in the Army Field Manual.

As a member of Congress, he repeatedly appeared on the radio program hosted by anti-Muslim activist Frank Gaffney, and has portrayed the war on terror as a conflict between Islam and Christianity. He has also claimed that “Islamic leaders across America [are] potentially complicit” in terrorism because they supposedly don’t speak out against it, which is not true.
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In addition to his stances on torture and Islam, Pompeo has also come under fire for his views on surveillance. In a 2016 op-ed in the Wall Street Journal, he attacked a 2015 law that that he voted for, which ended the bulk collection on phone records by the NSA. The op-ed calls on the government to collect “all metadata” and “lifestyle” details on Americans.
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n June 2015, Rep. Mike Pompeo, a Kansas congressman, headlined a “God and Country Rally” at Wichita’s Summit Church. “To worship our lord and celebrate our nation at the same place is not only our right, it is our duty,” he began. Pompeo’s speech was a mishmash of domestic culture war callouts and dark warnings about the danger of radical Islam. He cited an inflammatory prayer that a pastor named the Rev. Joe Wright once delivered before the Kansas State Legislature: “America had worshipped other Gods and called it multiculturalism. We’d endorsed perversion and called it an alternative lifestyle.” He lamented government efforts to “rip faith from our schools” and then segued immediately into a discussion of the jihadi threat: “This evil is all around us.” Pompeo concluded by describing politics as “a never-ending struggle … until the rapture.”
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Like Trump, Pompeo has been a fierce critic of efforts to rein in the CIA’s torture program and a champion of keeping Guantanamo Bay open. While in Congress, he was a frequent guest on the radio show of famously paranoid Frank Gaffney, a man disinvited from the right-wing Conservative Political Action Conference after claiming that the Muslim Brotherhood had infiltrated its parent organization, the American Conservative Union. (In the Trump era, Gaffney has been brought in from the cold: After the election, the New York Times reported that he was informally advising Trump’s inner circle on national security hires.) Gaffney once called Pompeo “one of the most intelligent men I know in public life,” and the two see the world similarly. In February 2015, they spoke about President Obama’s use of the term “violent extremism” instead of “radical Islam,” a linguistic choice that some on the right see as a secret message of solidarity with jihad. Gaffney suggested that Obama might be conveying “an affinity” for ISIS’s cause, if not all its tactics: “the raising up of the Muslim Ummah, a grand rebalancing of America’s role in the world.” Pompeo relied, “Frank, every place you stare at the president’s policies and statements, you see what you just described … every policy of this administration has treated America as if we are the problem and not the solution.”
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http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...rump_s_pick_for_the_cia_wants_a_holy_war.html

The black sites will be back in full force and they will especially target any Muslims
 
L

Lime

Member
NYCmetsfan said:
https://twitter.com/BraddJaffy/status/824278749805998082

McCain is standing firm that the law forbids returning to torture, implies lawsuit

They can probably do blacksites but if they become torture places or even if the US allows others to torture still could violate the law.



You don't

Congress has forbid torture.
Click to expand...

smokeymicpot said:
McCain responded.
http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/press-releases?ID=240E4B4E-4EC6-4FE1-B183-E063B51BADF2

STATEMENT BY SASC CHAIRMAN JOHN McCAIN ON REPORTS OF EXECUTIVE ORDER DIRECTING REVIEW OF INTERROGATION POLICIES


“The President can sign whatever executive orders he likes. But the law is the law. We are not bringing back torture in the United States of America.
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Read again: "We are not bringing back torture in the United States of America."

The black sites aren't on U.S. soil, so McCain's statement is vapid depending on your interpretation. Not only that, but Trump and the frickin' head of the CIA will do whatever it pleases them.
"
 
M

Man-is-Obsolete

Member
I've never felt so powerless. Like they know what they are doing is not popular, but they are going to ignore everyone and just blaze ahead. Screw just calling your representatives, that obviously doesn't work the way it used to. People need to get out there and get involved in their communities and educate people. Also we need to be a thorn in the side of the these creeps in a much more physical way. Appear at events they are attending, go to town halls, hold more rallies, etc.
 
smokeymicpot

smokeymicpot

Beat EviLore at pool.
Lime said:
Read again: "We are not bringing back torture in the United States of America."

The black sites aren't on U.S. soil, so McCain's statement is vapid depending on your interpretation. Not only that, but Trump and the frickin' head of the CIA will do whatever it pleases them.
"
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Yeah later on in the article.


“During both our personal conversations and his confirmation hearing, CIA Director Mike Pompeo repeatedly committed to me that he will comply with the law that applies the Army Field Manual’s interrogation requirements to all U.S. agencies, including the CIA. In response to written questions from the Senate Armed Services Committee, Secretary of Defense James Mattis said he ‘support using the Army Field Manual as the single standard for all U.S. military interrogations.’ I am confident these leaders will be true to their word.”
 
A

Addi

Member
Whompa02 said:
>Says Obama doesn't fix Guantanamo and did a terrible job (he reduced the amount of prisoners there to about 40).

>Creates mini Guantanamos throughout CIA network...

Trumpets, please defend this.
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Here the Trumpet logic: Obama promised to close Gitmo, he didn't. That makes him a liar.
Nothing to do with Gitmo itself, they probably all want it to stay open.
 
A

AJLma

Member
The sum of his plans will turn the US into a terror state. Trumps puppet masters are trying to re-arrange the power/economic structure of the US and are planning to forcefully deter anyone who tries to stop them.
 
F

Future

Member
fluffydelusions said:
Wish I could say I'm shocked but I'm not. I feel like I'm in an episode of black mirror
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Literally said he was for enhanced interrogation techniques before election son no one should be shocked. He's doing what he said he'd do, and trump voters/non voters/3rd party voters essentially dont give a shit anyway
 
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