chromatic9
Member
Euro/US Dollar are almost equal.
Greece might need a weaker currency to attract business and tourists.
Greece might need a weaker currency to attract business and tourists.
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Trump's reported EU amb: EU antidemocratic, harmful to US, Greece could ditch for $
- Thread starter Sickboy007
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Well, "people" said that the Euro would break down since its inception - for every year. It's just crazy that such a person should become the ambassador. You can just feel the contempt of Trump, because he couldn't do his mafia-style businesses in Europe, due to the high standards in the EU.
They got fucked by their own elites and its a tragedy (no pun intended), but don't delude yourself thinking there is an "easy way". There is not and that was the hard lesson Syriza had to learnt.
And Malloch can stay in his university and fuck off, thank you very much.
You and people like you are the reason EU is currently a place filled with nepotism. If you know the fact that Greece had cooked the books then you must also be aware that at the time everyone, including the people lending the money, knew of that as well. Never said Greece is a victim, but the EU is certainly a villain in the whole PIGS situation.
Orniletter
Banned
Absolutely.
I'm definitely in favour of a Germany-esque debt renogiation after the country has shown that it is on the right track and accumulated goodwill.
People forgot just how dickish greek politicians behaved back when the crisis was in full swing (threatening to print euros, the whole referendum stunt that amounted to fuck all, Eurobonds etc.)
Trollolololol
US/Germany relations have been exceptionally good before the puppet came into office and has made no sense ever since. If Greece ditched the Euro nobody would freak out. If Greece adapted the Dollar everybody would be laughing their asses off.
What a freak show this White House is.
US/Germany relations have been exceptionally good before the puppet came into office and has made no sense ever since. If Greece ditched the Euro nobody would freak out. If Greece adapted the Dollar everybody would be laughing their asses off.
What a freak show this White House is.
gutter_trash
Banned
Trump admin are Russian tools n fools.
Why break from 70 years of foreign policy to make the US and EU weak? Russia that is why
Why break from 70 years of foreign policy to make the US and EU weak? Russia that is why
I don't see the EU as the villain here. The very concept of the Union was bent to help Greece - you don't subsidize other countries. Greece has systemic problems which would break the country apart if they just got rid of the EU and the Euro. Russia will not come to help and the US wouldn't do that, either. You can also forget about Turkey, lol. And with the EU: well, Greece got the best conditions possible, other nations don't get a free money card for such a long period of time. And the amount of money in the drain is just staggering.
Personally, I would want to see the EU moving towards a stronger union in which every country helps each other. But especially Greece doesn't want a EU with stronger ties to each other. So it's a lose-lose situation which can only be solved if the Greece people and its government started to really work towards those solutions. Spending more money will not help. This was actually the very source of Greece's problems.
freeofgreed
Member
A big problem with what happened with Greece is that they had very little monetary control over the Euro. So switching to a currency they'd have even less control over is suppose to help them how?
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
We shouldn't waste time arguing about who is to blame for the situation.
We need to find solutions.
The key thing for Greece to understand is that the lifestyle they've grown accustomed to is not sustainable with the economy they have. Significant cutbacks to quality of life are literally inevitable.
Yes, ist common knowledge that austerity doesn't lead to growth, but in the case of Greece austerity is needed to get rid of excess spending that would under no circumstances be sustainable by Greeces economy.
We need to find solutions.
The key thing for Greece to understand is that the lifestyle they've grown accustomed to is not sustainable with the economy they have. Significant cutbacks to quality of life are literally inevitable.
Yes, ist common knowledge that austerity doesn't lead to growth, but in the case of Greece austerity is needed to get rid of excess spending that would under no circumstances be sustainable by Greeces economy.
I'm not sure why the "because Russia"-"argument" makes tinfoil-hat nonsense acceptable on gaf, when we have more than 20 years (at least since Reagan) of indications that the US hates the EU from an economic perspective - and not only once tried to undermine it. It is only logical. Strong-arming some bumfuck-5 million inhabitants country into some unfavourable deals is way easier than negotiate with a block bigger than the US, both in terms of inhabitants and GDP.
I know blaming some shady overlord who resides somewhere in Siberia is easier... but completely avoids the issue that this is also in the interest of several US think tanks and politicians.
The US has no allies nor friends, only interests. I hope Europeans will realize this before it's to late to strengthen the Union - which is more necessary then ever.
The lifestyle they've become accustomed to is one of depression, their economy has has been in one for half a decade+.
It could happen. EU has already voiced their concerns about this possible ambassador so they are on record about being against him.
Palette Swap
Member
That guy's talk about destroying the EU should land him on a watchlist. A thorough search of his person every time he enters the EU doesn't sound unreasonable.
VendettaRed07
Member
What would swapping the euro for the USD do?
Isn't Greece's problem that because they aren't using their own currency they couldn't inflate themselves out of a recession?
Isn't Greece's problem that because they aren't using their own currency they couldn't inflate themselves out of a recession?
Sidewinder
Member
Well said, but Russia would gladly accept a broken EU. Man I hope that this hostile Trump presidency will at least bring the EU countries closer than ever. We'll soon see how that goes with elections in Netherland and France.
freeofgreed
Member
Eh not really. I mean just last year Obama advocated strongly that the the UK stay in the EU and that the block was better as a whole. I don't see why he'd say that if he wanted the demise of it, as the UK leaving will do far more damage to the EU then an anti EU ambassador would. Not denying that there are definitively parts of the EU the US would like to change, but our foreign policy has definitely been pro-EU. This anti-EU sentiment coming from Trump's ambassador definitly has to do with his Russian ties.
Frozenprince
Banned
So this idiot wants us to prop up Greece, a money sink with a non functional government?
What a brilliant businessman, I can't believe he went bankrupt multiple times.
What a brilliant businessman, I can't believe he went bankrupt multiple times.
Frozenprince
Banned
Because this is nonsense. A federal Europe is good for everybody, and the US has known this during its last administration.
Trump applauded BREXIT and UK choosing to go for it, he loves what is happening over here.
Obama was against BREXIT, but he isn't in power anymore and leading US's message and position.
PdotMichael
Banned
Was there ever an argument made that the EU is overly bureaucratic for real?
PdotMichael
Banned
I don't anyone is trusting Trump and the USA right now
It's a bit slow like any other so not a great argument and people seem to think any regulations are 100% negative and EU has a lot but mostly for positive reasons, to make it easier for everyone in the bloc.
I think they have some bonkers thing were they have meetings in Brussels but then have them in another place for some reason another week which sounded extremely wasteful when I read it. Can't remember the details though. Maybe good reason or not and it is ridiculous.
Costs a fortune, 209 million or something. Can't find out if they scrapped it yet, there was talk.
This is the problem of every EU economy who ain't Germany and maybe France.
Muppet of a Man
Member
.
QuicheFontaine
Member
The whole idea of Greece going over to the dollar is asinine, but the US wouldn't be "propping up" Greece if they did it. The dollar is a freely tradeable currency - any country can adopt it as their currency if they want. For example, Panama, Ecuador and El Salvador all use the dollar.
It's not a great idea, since you effectively lose control of monetary policy. This was discussed quite a bit during the lead up to the 2014 Scottish Independence Referendum, since Scotland were talking about retaining sterling after declaring independence.
They should realize that burning furniture for heat is too rich for their pocket
It is. It's a hugely cumbersome institution that works slowly and inefficiently. But that's always going to happen when you're trying to please 28 Member States with very different political cultures and levels of commitment to the European project. The EU is both a crappy institution and also the most important and worthwhile international institution that's ever existed. Over the last 50 years it's made some amazing strides in creating a genuine common market and equality legislation that's the most advanced in the world.
There are justifiable reasons to be discontent about the EU and the order of the West generally. He's right to say it's a good bet to short the Euro. The point about the CAP is completely well-founded. EU labour markets are overregulated, which has an adverse affect at the bottom end of the labour market. The EU's response to migration and immigration generally is incompetent on basically every level and has never been fully thought through. The EU is institutions are undemocratic (barring the EP but nobody gives a shit about the EP) and has responded to every major crisis with a blinkered short-sightedness that is completely unsustainable and will quite possibly lead to the dissolution of the EU in the next decade. The treatment of Greece and Ireland over the course of the financial crisis has been nothing short of shameful and inhumane.
It's a strange thing where Trump and Trumpists have actually hit on an important critique of the modern world order, but for all of the wrong reasons. It's an administration that is genuinely too stupid to even begin to grapple with the problems its facing. It's like a drunk guy stumbling around in the dark and falling face first into a lightswitch. I mean, you turned on the light and all but I'm certainly not going to expect you to repeat the feat, or indeed be able to rewire my house's entire electrical system.
Never knew that there were this many angry americans who still think they can bully their way in the world. Diplomacy is lost on these lost causes, and the US is going to pay an enormous price for allowing this to happen.
Because in the upcoming years, the US will no longer be seen as the representative of the West, but as an example of Democracy gone wrong. The rammifications will be huge.
Because in the upcoming years, the US will no longer be seen as the representative of the West, but as an example of Democracy gone wrong. The rammifications will be huge.
As a Greek, i laugh at the idea of adopting the dollar.... but at the same time i'm frightened that if a Greek political party were to propose such a thing.. people might vote for it..
Things become worse and worse every year and there does not seem to be light at the end of the tunnel. That's why personally, i voted no to the 2015 referendum, hoping that at the worst , we're out of the euro and back to drachma.
My mentality is we should face our shit instead of denying that it is there (while the pile gets even bigger) and take matters into our hands (although incompetent is the MOST polite word to use when i talk about every Greek political party).
Things become worse and worse every year and there does not seem to be light at the end of the tunnel. That's why personally, i voted no to the 2015 referendum, hoping that at the worst , we're out of the euro and back to drachma.
My mentality is we should face our shit instead of denying that it is there (while the pile gets even bigger) and take matters into our hands (although incompetent is the MOST polite word to use when i talk about every Greek political party).
soul creator
Member
the EU is driving towards socialism? News to me
Gordon Shumway
Banned
On notice, everyone!
Frankfurter
Member
Lol. You mean, unless you wanna pass a law for example?
I'm sure it's not exactly bright right now, but there seems to be light at the end actually. Greece is expected to grow significantly this year.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
Who is they? What sort of cutbacks?
The EU is a conciliatory move to Canada just passed CETA despite fierce pressure from far left socialists and far right nationalists. So I usually have been pretty anti-EU in the past, but they especially made note of the fact that Canada would struggle under a Trump administration that is protectionist and wanting to get rid of NAFTA. Every little bit helps.
It is crazy to see though. The Trump administration is so hostile to their closest allies. The Americans are going to come out of these 4 years hated by their closest allies, decline in every international relation and organization whilst being closer to Russia.
It is crazy to see though. The Trump administration is so hostile to their closest allies. The Americans are going to come out of these 4 years hated by their closest allies, decline in every international relation and organization whilst being closer to Russia.
They say this every year, but who knows ? I sure hope so..
Should clarify, I mean in terms of the democratic deficit. Very few people understand what an MEP does, almost nobody cares about MEP elections to the extent that it's a stretch to call the Parliament a genuinely democratic institution.
In addition, while Lisbon has expanded the areas governed by the Ordinary Legislative Procedure, the Council and Commission are still by far the more powerful institutions of the EU, both of which are undemocratic in the sense of no electoral link to some constituent base.
dragonelite
Member
Good thing trump didn't call this guy to ask if the dollar needed to be strong or weak.
Frankfurter
Member
People have the means to get themselves educated. If they don't understand that their vote for the EU parliament is of great importance... then that's their problem.
I agree that the EU still has some kind of a democratic deficit, but it's just not as bad as you make it out to be. Every country elected parties and/or presidents/prime ministers/chancellors and those then sent representatives to the council or Commission. If that is not democratic, then 90% of all democracies in the world actually aren't democracies.
The EU already let the sentient dog turd that is Farage in to it's institutions. Is this guy that much worse in his rhetoric?
The EU institutions (At least the ones I think you are talking about. The Council and Commission) are as undemocratic as a head of state naming his/hers cabinet/ministers.
The European Council is the heads of the member states governments. The European Commission is 1 per member country named by their government. It is not the fault of the EU system if the citizens of the member states don't take the European Parliament seriously and vote. The rest is your average run of the mill clerks/bureaucrats actually trying to implement the rules.
If we voted for each and every position of power nothing would get done.
Realistically the way how the Council and Commission are setup is the only way they are going to work. The Council is just making sure each legally elected government of a member state is equally represented. It would be stupid if the member in Commission had a different agenda as the member in Council could just vote no on everything and nothing would get done (read up on Qualified Majority) or just plain refuse to implement the new regulations. The EU doesn't have a police force or a military to enforce any rulings it actually makes. If the Council didn't have the veto rights it would be a major movement of power from the member states to the EU and a HUGE step towards an actual federation or whatever form of government it would be called (personally I think a more centralized actual federal government would be better but not going to happen anytime soon).
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