TRUTHFACT: MS having eSRAM yield problems on Xbox One
- Thread starter chubigans
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yup ... you'll see on Monday!
something fishy
Member
It'll be there in so form on both. Ea did not end online passes for no reason,
It's already been there for years on pc and games sell very well. Wiiu only if you want to avoid it totally.
Were you the one who said that? :O which thread was it?
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Hold on:
How do they know that all the consoles (which isn't out)that have been sold and connected to the internet? I'm sure there will be alot who don't have broadband internet
How do they know that all the consoles (which isn't out)that have been sold and connected to the internet? I'm sure there will be alot who don't have broadband internet
That about sums it up. The only thing even confirmed by the consensus of Gaf sources is that there were/are yield problems for a component, which let's be clear, is something that applies to many tech product launches. This was Major Nelson responding to concerns that the eSRAM yields would negatively effect the XB1's specs themselves, which he flat out denies. We don't have any reason to not believe him unless you categorically assume no positive statement by Microsoft can ever be trusted, (or unless you have personal contact with CBOAT and knowledge why the particular info he has is good). Merely repeating an unsubstantiated claim isn't new evidence, and the claim in the first place isn't based on evidence, but on trust. CBOAT's reputation is something important to keep in mind, and I do. That's why the eSRAM yield info seemed solid, but I get the impression that the rumors extending beyond that are a bridge too far. Contradictory info from behind the scenes followed by an otherwise unnecessary official response. By denying it, Nelson technically drew more attention to this claim than there would have been otherwise. If we're being perfectly cynical and the goal was to deceive, staying quiet would have made more sense.
When people not actually privy to any form of evidence won't accept any answer except one that reaffirms what they already think is true, there's a problem there. By definition, that's being unreasonable. Things will be clear when the product launches. Considering even the suggestion of this idea has already meant people have accused me of being a Microsoft shill (ha), I'm more frustrated watching this process than I really should be.
How are they supposed to develop (launch) games if they don't know the specs? How do you exactly imagine it? In September: "Hey devs, it's Microsoft here, we know you're shipping your game in 3 weeks, but just so you know we lowered the clockrate by 20%. Good luck hitting your performance targets." If MS does intend to lower the clock(s), they must inform the dev community now (or must have done it by now).
Agreed. It effectively kills private sales of games, and forces all used games into approved retailers.
Also publisher can opt out and not allow resale of games.
Overall it's crappy, not as crappy as I thought it was going to be, but it sounds like the console very well require an internet connection.
Pristine_Condition
Member
Not a single GAF "insider" has denied the eSRAM yield issue. Every "insider" speaking here has said it's true.
Even SenjutsuSage, who has vehemently defended the Xbone has said it is a real issue and as been a real issue for some time.
I don't know where you are getting the idea that an equal number of "insiders" have refuted it.
I think you made that shit up.
...and twitter is a "formal retort" now? No it's not.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
I like the initial sound of it, but giving the game once part makes me wonder if the original giver can get the game back, since they were the ones that originally gave the game away.
This is my biggest concern out of a list of things that I generally like, some even love. Microsoft has to be asked about this part, no doubt. Are they saying that if you have a physical disc game, you can only hand that physical disc to a one friend one time ever and then you can get it back no longer being able to give it to anyone else in the future?
Or are they saying that once you give it to that friend, it's theirs forever, and you can't get it back? Even though, if you do say to a guy, "hey, you can keep this game" then you better be damn sure you really want to never play that game again, I suppose. That's the only thing I want clarification from Microsoft on.
I want more details on being able to share your library with up to ten "family members," even on outside systems. That could be a value add, if it works like it seems.
Overall though, I think I'm having a similar reaction to you: it's not actually that bad, but it still annoys me in general (probably enough to dissuade a purchase for quite some time.)
This was answered further on in the conversation. For your benefit, it was referring to the down-clocking specifically. No, I didn't make it up.
Deuterium
Member
Huh?? What is the background behind this post?
Baron Aloha
A Shining Example
Was mentioned in the other thread, but family = same IP address. Its not like game sharing on the PS3.
Pristine_Condition
Member
An equal number of GAF "insiders" have refuted the down-clock?
I'm still not seeing that.
I only see one disputing it, and his credentials or reputation as a GAF "insider" aren't nearly as established as the others. He said it himself, this is his first time making an "insider knowledge" claim.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Jesus. It is only rubbish if the guy who is supposedly leaking has been right for every leak he has done in his membership here.
Stop thinking MS is being the victim here, Sony isn't either, and they will be called out too if they do DRM like MS.
It explicitly states family members can access those games anywhere. I suppose those XBL have to have the same 'primary' console, but it's not a big deal for me (I never planned to do anything like PS3's game sharing which always seemed very fishy to me anyway).
Down-clock is just a speculation, isn't it?
Schobeleth
Member
I'm curious how they can be more than double the power of PS4's too :\ a pretty bold statement when they have so much stock in repeating that same "THE CLOUD WILL MAKE UP FOR IT!!!" phrase
Even if "family" always lived under the same roof, NAT'ing is not the only way to structure a network. I have several public IPs. One for each device in my house, in fact.
Pristine_Condition
Member
He's a shill. Just not a shill by the old definition. Call him a neo-shill if it makes you feel better.
It's the very idea that you brought up, that Major Nelson is doing PR "on the side" -- this "unofficial" shtick that he has crafted over the years that defines him as a shill.
He's a PR mouthpiece, straight-up. But the fact that he tries to make it seem like he's just a guy doing this "on the side" is what makes him a shill, because it's an obfuscation of his real role. He's the most public and well-known community mouthpiece in gaming now.
It's a brilliantly-crafted persona. In the beginning it was effective because it made Xbox fans feel like they had an "inside" connection with the team.
But now it's something else. Simply look at how Xbox fans treat one of his tweets:
There's many, many more examples in the other thread. This clearly isn't a guy doing PR "on the side" anymore. The fact that he still claims that, and you and other Xbox fans still propagate the myth that he's "just a guy doing this on the side" while he's clearly not, is what makes him a shill. A shill is simply anyone who hides the true nature of their agency. And clearly, the Major matches that definition.
From the other thread-
>.<
How can you downclock something whose rate you haven't publicly announced? The only reason we have the 800 mhz number is from leaked documentation and sources. Major Nelson will NEVER say anything about downclocks or get close to talking about 800 mhz. He's going to back the fuck away from this discussion altogether.
Shit's being downclocked from 800. It is a very real option. Do you know why MS won't talk clock rates or CU's? Becuase the moment they do, it will slap you in the face how much more powerful PS4 is.
Manmademan
Member
Shouldn't be that hard to figure out. I went into his post history on a hunch, and- yup...junior member, has only ever posted in Xbox related threads. Can you guess the theme of his posts?
Yeah this was basically what I meant when I referred to him as a shill. It's probably not the best descriptor, but whatever. He is the director of programming (and does community stuff on the side), not a pr rep. The fact that he does PR under the guise of providing an inside look at development kind of grosses me out.
The downclock talk is easy to deny because there was never official answers on this. The only ones who know are the ones involved in development of the system. Just like deciding on hardware they are deciding on clock speeds. What makes this relevant is that clocks are being reduced to compensate for yield problems and not as an initial design.
Also this thread is amazing cause of CBOAT @truthfact fo life!
Also this thread is amazing cause of CBOAT @truthfact fo life!
So it's an option or a fact? The first sentence implies a fact.
The people I've talked to say its happening, but you can never state FACT. Things can change if yields improve or Microsoft decides against it. Until final everything is shipped- we won't know for 100%.
However, I don't believe a damn thing Senjutsu is saying since plenty of our fellow "insiders" have all parroted that clock rates are decreasing.
What about liquidboys claims?
Remember how devs were surprised by the fact that the PS4 had 8GB of RAM instead of 4? Don't for a second think that MS have told anyone what their final specs are. They're likely just doing a black-box testing of "get it to run on this box". You know the way no one knows the definite specs of the WiiU? Do you think it's a well-guarded secret by the devs? No, it's not told to the devs.
Even skilled people on GAF with detailed die photos can't conclude what the specs are, and even after launch, there's no word on this. From anyone.
Specs are pretty useless, anyway. How it runs is what's important.
And they don't have to inform the dev community. Knowing MS, they might be fine doing all developers one over and not even telling them their game will run 20% worse on the final hardware. I don't try to say that's what's happening, or anything. I'm just saying the devs are not in the know.
Adding to this, as a base, we are taking 800 mhz for the Xbox One. If the rate is anything below 800 hz at 12 cu's, we know things have been downclocked.
Fun historical fact- Alpha kits were clocked at 700 or 720 mhz because the GPU was more powerful than the real one to match the performance of 800 mhz at 12 cus.
Deuterium
Member
I did go into his post history. I only read back to March (there aren't that many)...I may have missed it, but I didn't find a post in which he made this claim. Again, admittedly, I didn't spend a whole lot of time...but I did a cursory check. Can you provide a link? Thanks in advance.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
The buttocks has spoken.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
I don't think so. He fit the pattern of the overzealous fan. Same with Dopeyfish.
Some of the others however......
How the hell specs are pretty useless? It's like not knowing what your current velocity or fuel reserve is when driving a car. Devs must know those specs if they're expected to build stable games with good performance.
Then I'm looking forward to devs confirming (or denying) change in the final specs soon-ish. They won't downgrade a month before the console is shipped.
He was probably banned for this post
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61351653&postcount=740
His defence of all things related to the Xbone hardware just looked like the ramblings of someone with over zealous brand loyalty. But he was doing the same in the DRM thread, justifying MS's anti-consumer business practises too.
He wasn't banned for that post since he posted in the Xbox One DRM thread today.
Mods might have missed it due to the speed of the thread and saw it later. It sure is a ban worthy post so me.
Pristine_Condition
Member
Bare in mind that MS were careful to not provide any performance related technical specs during the reveal. Just 8-core CPU, 8GB RAM etc.
http://newsbcpcol.stb.s-msn.com/amn...05de4683c867ee96/_h0_w628_m6_otrue_lfalse.jpg
The 1.2 TFLOP metric just comes from various leaks, not from MS.
So either MS didn't want to clarify performance because the figures would show the Xbone is weaker than the PS4, or they new that the specs were subject to change, due to production line issues.
http://newsbcpcol.stb.s-msn.com/amn...05de4683c867ee96/_h0_w628_m6_otrue_lfalse.jpg
The 1.2 TFLOP metric just comes from various leaks, not from MS.
So either MS didn't want to clarify performance because the figures would show the Xbone is weaker than the PS4, or they new that the specs were subject to change, due to production line issues.
Jinfash
needs 2 extra inches
Told him to downclock his overheating feels but he wouldn't listen.
Oh, boy. I remember those kind of posts. No matter how many times people tried to argue that dual APUs/SoCs aren't happening, people like him kept holding onto it.
Also stacking SoCs when stacked RAM is only in its infancy. Can't say he didn't have dreams.
Sony downclocked the PS3 at the 11th hour on the RSX this gen. Nothing is concrete ever.
While I don't understand tech stuff myself there has been a influx of posts trying to claim that the 8 GDDR5 RAM that the PS4 has is somehow not as good as the Xbones RAM setup.
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