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[Vanity Fair] Jessica Simpson's IQ 160, up there with Einstein, says mom

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Chittagong

Gold Member
http://extratv.warnerbros.com/dailynews/extra/0704/07_07b.html
Jessica the Genius?
Jessica Simpson gets catty and cozy, when she poses for next month's Vanity Fair. But does America's favorite "Newlywed" play up her role as a ditzy blonde for the cameras? In the article, Editor Krista Smith writes that Jessica may actually have an IQ up there with Albert Einstein.

In fact, Jessica's mom says her daughter's IQ is in the 160s. "The genius IQ is from Tina Simpson," Smith revealed. "I do think the ditziness is played up a bit on MTV. I think it's edited in a very clever way."

But Jessica's TV ratings are what MTV keeps track of. And the network is extremely pleased with the success of her show, which is now in its second season.

lg1a.jpg


I think her mom's and the reporters IQs are not up there with Einstein.
 
On the show she didn't know who General Robert E. Lee was. I guess memorizing facts doesn't neccessary have anything to do with your IQ, but come on.
 

MIMIC

Banned
Little do we know that this thread will morph into an IQ-comparison contest. Unless I've pre-empted the show of sagacity. :p

BTW, her IQ is backwards. It's supposed to read '061.'
 
D

Deleted member 1235

Unconfirmed Member
Idle Will Kill said:
On the show she didn't know who General Robert E. Lee was. I guess memorizing facts doesn't neccessary have anything to do with your IQ, but come on.

It's not even remotely related.

I personally think the ability to memorise things is related to intelligence in some way, but not knowing history doesn't make you unintelligent, just ignorant of some things.
 

border

Member
I can believe it, certainly. She's probably just playing up for the cameras all the time, so the idiots out there will watch. Idiocy is her gimmick, and MTV generally hasn't minded presenting false BS in their celebrity reality shows.
 

Stele

Holds a little red book
That would make her of the top .1% percentile of the population. I don't fucking think so.
 

Mason

Member
Stele said:
That would make her of the top .1% percentile of the population. I don't fucking think so.

IAWTP

You can't just 'cleverly edit' her stupidity. She is a dumb bitch and that's all there is to it.
 

Ghost

Chili Con Carnage!
She didnt know Tuna was a fish, but her IQ is 160? Nick Lachey must be crying himself to sleep (after the awesome sex) knowing that he's married to jessica simpson and HE'S the dumb one.
 

MIMIC

Banned
You don't even have to watch "Newlyweds" to be able to question this alleged claim of high intellect. If you've ever seen her interviewed, she clearly doesn't appear to have an above-average IQ.
 
Mason said:
IAWTP

You can't just 'cleverly edit' her stupidity. She is a dumb bitch and that's all there is to it.

Sure, it's debateable if she's "dumb." But a "bitch"... ? Show some tact, asshole.

If this bitch is in X3 or X4 as rumoured I will personally hunt down and murder Bryan Singer.

Same goes for you.
 

Loki

Count of Concision
HalfPastNoon said:
Sure, it's debateable if she's "dumb." But a "bitch"... ? Show some tact, asshole.

Lonestar a crusader for decency and decorum!? What's the world coming to. :p What happened, did she give you a pair of her shoes or something? ;)
 

teh_pwn

"Saturated fat causes heart disease as much as Brawndo is what plants crave."
"IQ is a load of shit"

Agreed.

Even if an IQ test were perfect, it only tests your intuition and ability to learn.

It's like benching a computer's processor and nothing else. Not long term memory, short term memory, gained knowledge, willpower, etc.

Even so, I've seen IQ tests and they were jokes. They made references to common sayings and stuff when IQs are all about your ability to learn completely new things.

IQ != Knowledge
IQ = your ability to obtain knowledge
 

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
How reliable are those online IQ tests?

I dont want to get into a penis contest, but I normally get around the same score on all of those.. so just wondering if that is close to accurate.
 
I was watching the newly wed show one time and she kept saying gah at everything that she thought was disgusting. Gah gah gah gah, her friends kept telling her gah is not a word and she kept saying it.

Wtf is gahhhhhhhhhhh? 160 my ass
 

NLB2

Banned
catfish said:
I personally think the ability to memorise things is related to intelligence in some way,
You were right up to here. What is intelligence if not the ability to learn and what is learning if not the memorization of facts?
 

Loki

Count of Concision
Umm, IQ tests are most certainly not "useless", as some here are saying. What you're perhaps alluding to is the fact that it may or may not measure what it proposes it does, which is "G" (general intelligence, defined as sort of a global intelligence). But in terms of its utility, well, there is no other psychological assay which yields such consistent, well-documented results which correlate highly with a plethora of valuable attributes and advantageous situations.


For instance, higher IQ has been statistically proven to be positively correlated with such desirable and noteworthy qualities/situations as: income level, level of education (these first two could possibly be confounding variables, but the rest cannot be), longevity, lower incidence of health problems, fewer automobile accidents (yes, this is true), personal evaluations of self-worth/happiness and a whole host of other things.


Now, whether or not the "IQ test" truly measures what it intends to, which is ideally intellectual capacity/potential, is another story. But I doubt that anyone would argue the merits of being on the better end of the above situations/qualities; since IQ is positively related to these in a statistically significant way, it is indeed quite valuable in its own right, as it's clearly measuring something useful. These relational effects hold across the various sorts of IQ tests, including the standard Stanford-Binet and the more modern Raven's Matrices.


Also, if you encountered an excessive amount of english, in terms of whole phrases, they were likely analogies and/or metaphors designed to assess your logical abilities as they relate to language. A typical IQ verbal portion goes like so:

They ask you to define/describe a given word in the allotted time. There is a maximum of two points awarded for each word, with partial credit allowed based upon certain keywords being employed by the subject while defining/describing the target word. So, for example, a word on the low end might be something like "breakfast"; if you say "first meal of the day", you get full credit (2 points). If you say "eggs" or some such, or "meal" alone, you get one point. The words get progressively more "difficult", though even on the high end they're not terribly obscure; the second to last word on the IQ test we administered was "ominous". If you say "scary", or "danger looming", you get 1 point. Only if you say "foreboding" do you get the full 2 points. "Compensation" was the last word on the spectrum; if you said "remunerate", pat yourself on the back, because that was beyond even the 2 point response for that word. :p


Point being, that many of these words are not difficult. What it is measuring is not so much what you know-- after all, if you gave most people the word "ominous", and gave them unlimited time to define/describe it, many would undoubtedly produce the word "foreboding". The rapidity of that speech production is what's crucial, however; on the verbal portion of an IQ test, they're measuring how quickly one makes mental connections, as well as the person's ability to articulate a wide range of thoughts and ideas with speed and accuracy.


I know all this because I did some work with my cognitive psychology professor during this summer, and he administered these IQ tests to a group of exceptionally high IQ students at my university (all 140+); in each instance, the speed and ease with which these "high IQ" students flew through the verbal section was remarkable as compared with those with IQ < 120. To use "ominous" again as an example-- you may have said foreboding, but did you say it with almost no discernible elapsed time after you heard "ominous"? The highest IQ student tested (156) produced "foreboding" nearly the instant that "ominous" was uttered.


Obviously, the mathematical/spatial portion of the test deals with different concepts (such as mental rotation, image constancy, pattern recognition etc.) which employ different mental representations and strategies; in this portion, there are often no time limits (within reason), yet people frequently have a harder time with it. The small percentage of adults who predominantly utilize visual images as mental representations (as determined by other psychological tests) tend to fare much better on this portion as compared with the majority of people, who use semantic/propositional information for memory, and have to be goaded into relying on images; so instead of it being their strong point, so to speak, it's their "backup plan". For those select few, however, the visual representation is the primary (and hence the most developed and acute) method of memory recall and encoding.




Just FYI. :)
 

Loki

Count of Concision
NLB2 said:
You were right up to here. What is intelligence if not the ability to learn and what is learning if not the memorization of facts?

I disagree. All one needs to memorize gobs of facts is a good memory, which, though useful, is not generally considered to be "intelligence". Mnemonists (those who have near-photographic memory for lists of items and numbers) are seen as more of a separate category altogether, rather than as true geniuses intellectually speaking.


If I may be so presumptuous as to share my own thoughts and experiences as they relate to these matters:

I can fairly easily memorize large amounts of facts in rapid fashion. If I read a text twice, I can pretty much recall verbatim every important fact or argument presented therein. Now, that doesn't make me intelligent imo-- that just means that I was lucky enough to be blessed with good memory. Fortunately for myself, I also happen to be quite intelligent. ;) Now, what I tend to recognize as "intelligence"-- both in myself and in others-- is the ability to synthesize vast amounts of information and independently find interesting and novel relationships among them. I suppose you could sum it up as "insight", but that's much too short a word to describe something so profound. And that's not only my opinion, but the opinion of society in general; one can see this most easily by examining the sort of people held in esteem for their intellect-- men like Kant, or Einstein. They both were able to "think outside the box" (i.e., they had flashes of brilliant insight which synthesized and expanded upon previously held theories). That capacity for creative, unique, and brilliant thought is where true intelligence lies, in my opinion (and in the opinion of intelligence researchers as well). Now obviously, none of us are Einstein or Kant, but a person of higher intelligence will necessarily be able to function in those aforementioned capacities to a much greater degree than someone of merely "average" intelligence.

So no, I don't believe rote memorization of facts to be in any way equivalent to intelligence, except for perhaps providing a broader knowledge base which the intelligent person then draws upon in order to creatively express his or her intellect in unique ways. Intelligence is a higher order process which stands "above and beyond" mere acquisition of knowledge imo. They're qualitatively different things; "intelligence" is massively parallel, by analogy, whereas bulk learners tend to be more serial and orderly in their mental processes.


Just my two cents. :)
 

dskillzhtown

keep your strippers out of my American football
Take this for what it is worth, but I do know some people from her hometown and who knew her growing up. They tell me she is very smart and on TV that is jstu an act. I am thinking that is the truth judging how much work she is getting. Another thing you have to consider is that her dad is running her career, always has. In his mind I am sure he is thinking, "The dumb Blonde has always worked, why not with Jessica?" Even if her 15 mins are almost up, she has accumilated alot of money in a very short time.
 
After all the IQ tests I've taken, I wouldn't say that any one of them challenged my intelligence.

In my opinion, the best example of an intellectual challenge is being faced with a problem, not a question. Questions can always be argued, while a problem can only have one solution (albeit, many ways to reach it). You need to make the right links between the elements.

A hard math exam (math contests) is what challenges my intelligence.

But if you know how the focus on a problem, you will always end up by solving it.

So, for me, intelligence has something to do with how hard you can focus on something not how fast you can bark the right answer. This is why people with great illuminations know how to free their minds. Like Einstein who played the bass, he said he focused on his music to free his mind and stated that some of his most brilliant insights came to him while playing his instrument.
 

Loki

Count of Concision
Date of Lies said:
After all the IQ tests I've taken, I wouldn't say that any one of them challenged my intelligence.

In my opinion, the best example of an intellectual challenge is being faced with a problem, not a question. Questions can always be argued, while a problem can only have one solution (albeit, many ways to reach it). You need to make the right links between the elements.

A hard math exam (math contests) is what challenges my intelligence.

But if you know how the focus on a problem, you will always end up by solving it.

So, for me, intelligence has something to do with how hard you can focus on something not how fast you can bark the right answer. This is why people with great illuminations know how to free their minds. Like Einstein who played the bass, he said he focused on his music to free his mind and stated that some of his most brilliant insights came to him while playing his instrument.

You seem to be referring, in an oblique way, to critical thinking skills and creative thinking when applied to the problems at hand. I agree that this quality/skill is a very important measure/feature of intelligence; I alluded to it in my second post above, about intelligence not being the capacity for mere memorization and spitback. While researchers do have IQ tests that are more akin to the process you're describing, they are more cumbersome and not as reliable (in terms of their results being reproducible); in addition, the results from "traditional" IQ tests positively correlate with better performance on these more abstract tests, so, again, IQ is clearly measuring something of import-- whether or not it's what researchers suppose (general intelligence) is a matter for debate. :)
 

Pellham

Banned
whether you believe in IQ or not, there's no way Jessica Simpson has a 160 IQ unless she cheated. Unless it's the norm for high IQ blonde airheads to get B's and C's in high school, be in regulars classes, and drop out.
 
whether you believe in IQ or not, there's no way Jessica Simpson has a 160 IQ unless she cheated. Unless it's the norm for high IQ blonde airheads to get B's and C's in high school, be in regulars classes, and drop out.
I have no idea what her IQ is, but I had a 2.6 in high school, a 2.7 as an undergrad and scored in the 99th percentile on the MCAT, so it's definitely not out of the realm of possibility. I don't know how smart I am, but I'm surely not stupid.
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
I could believe it...though if it's really 160 she should try her hand at something that might exercise her intellectual talent more often! A superficial lack of intellectual capacity by no means indicates fundamental dumbness...Einstein himself didn't appear to be very bright at all growing up etc.
 

Loki

Count of Concision
Richard Cranium said:
I have no idea what her IQ is, but I had a 2.6 in high school, a 2.7 as an undergrad and scored in the 99th percentile on the MCAT, so it's definitely not out of the realm of possibility. I don't know how smart I am, but I'm surely not stupid.

Hey Richard, what's up? Long time no speak. :) Man, 99th percentile? So you got a 38+, I would imagine? That's great-- good for you. Did you start med school yet, or was the MCAT just an exercise in intellectual masturbation. ;) Btw, I sent you a PM at Opa-Ages if you ever head back over that way. Catch you later, and best of luck with everything. :)
 

darscot

Member
IQ is a wierd thing most of the online tests are a sample of the real deal. Also normally when you do one in the real world it's with a whole bunch of other test. They usually hammer you with a whole barage of them.

The test is very valid and it is a good yard stick. If it wasnt you wouldnt see so many companies doing them. One flaw they have is they can kinda be studied for. Studied may be the wrong word but you can practice and build your score. I did a bunch of interviews all with tests and you get into a mode were you can really rock them after you a do a bunch close together. Another flaw they have is if people find out your score they tend to either be intimidated by it or the badly stereo-type you.

I suspect her score has been hyped a bit. However it wouldn't shock me if it was true. Just because you have the CPU doesn't mean you use it.
 
Hey Loki. Glad to see you remember me. Quite surprised, actually. Yeah, I scored a 40, and I just turned my application in. Hopefully they'll be able to overlook my undergraduate grades, but my health professions advisor says there's really no way to tell how they'll react to my application. Secondaries are a pain in the ass, though since I applied to so many schools.

How are things going with you? Last I remember, we were in a similar position a couple of years ago.
 

Loki

Count of Concision
Richard Cranium said:
Hey Loki. Glad to see you remember me. Quite surprised, actually. Yeah, I scored a 40, and I just turned my application in. Hopefully they'll be able to overlook my undergraduate grades, but my health professions advisor says there's really no way to tell how they'll react to my application. Secondaries are a pain in the ass, though since I applied to so many schools.

How are things going with you? Last I remember, we were in a similar position a couple of years ago.

Holy cow, a 40!? Jeez...congrats. And here little old me is shooting for a mere 35+ (96-97th percentile). I'm taking it next August, so my fingers are crossed. :) Yeah, I'm finishing up pre-reqs this year and taking the MCAT next August, though it increasingly looks like I'll need to take the extra year before I apply (which I didn't want to do). If I decide to do that, then I'll just take the MCAT next April (a year from this coming April). I'm in a similar situation regarding the undergrad GPA, which is why I'll likely take the extra year, which would bring my cumulative up to ~ 3.3, with my BCPM (bio/chem/physics/math) at about a 3.9, which should be sufficient. But we'll see...


From what I hear, with your undergrad GPA, you shoud've just done a post-bacc program for a bit and then applied when you have some better grades under your belt. But a 40 is very hard to overlook, though the disparity between the GPA and MCAT score may raise a few eyebrows. But I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. :) At worst, you'll have to do a post-bacc and can reapply in a year or two (if you so choose).

But anyway, this is off-topic, so shoot me a PM either here or at OA when you get a chance. Take care. :)
 

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
"Compensation" was the last word on the spectrum; if you said "remunerate", pat yourself on the back, because that was beyond even the 2 point response for that word. :p

what was the two point response? "remunerate" is only a good synonym for one of the several uses of "compensate." "compensate" is a much broader word. seems a bit arbitrary, really.
 

Loki

Count of Concision
drohne said:
what was the two point response? "remunerate" is only a good synonym for one of the several uses of "compensate." "compensate" is a much broader word. seems a bit arbitrary, really.

I agree that, at times, the desired responses seemed somewhat arbitrary-- both in the responses sought as well as the fact that, as you alluded to, most words have multiple valid interpretations, which would thus necessitate different answers. For "compensate", though I don't recall the exact phraseology, the 2 point response wasn't a single word, but rather a phrase; I believe it was something like "to make an appropriate payment", though I could be a bit off (this was 4 weeks ago). Though obviously, the other connotations of "compensate", such as "offsetting an undesirable quality", are equally valid; in some cases where multiple senses were present, the responses accounted for all of the most frequent understandings/uses of the word in common vernacular. I believe that whether or not they admitted of alternate definitions/descriptions had to do with how common the second and third usages are. I think you'd admit that the "payment" conceptualization of "compensate" is more frequently employed than some of its other meanings.

As for why I said that "remunerate" was "beyond" the 2 point response, well, it's because I saw the 2 point response, realized that it involved the sense of "payment", and felt that "remunerate" would be a more succinct expression of the concept they were looking for (and a more "high level" word, to boot). It was totally a subjective opinion of mine to say that it was "beyond the 2 point response", because, in actuality, "remunerate" wasn't even on the list of acceptable responses, though the sense of it was. :p


As for why certain words such as "ominous" required a response of the somewhat high-level word "foreboding", well, I would imagine that the theory behind it is that of semantic networks, where we construct parallel, integrated semantic relationships between words in our neural network as per connectionist models of consciousness and perception. So, for example, we could have "animal" at the top of the hierarchy in one node (activated neuron); below this might be "mammal", and then below that, "bird". At the very bottom, you'd have specific examples of birds such as "robin" or "pigeon" (the degree to which, and speed with which, one recognizes these lower order elements as members of the preceding "category" has to do with so-called "necessary and sufficient" and "defining" features; it actually largely parallels Plato's "real and ideal forms" line of reasoning, but I digress :p).

Now, the speed with which one can produce a word or recognize an image or word as being a certain element which is connected to other members of the hierarchy is largely dependent upon one's expertise. So if you are asked whether a "robin" is a bird, you are quick to respond in the affirmative. If you're asked whether it's an "animal", you'd also be quick to respond (though not as quick as for "bird"; these reaction times vary on the order of milliseconds, but hold across subjects, and thus are legitimate); now, if you're asked whether "robin" is a mammal, the lag in response time would be dramatic, as most people simply don't have the expertise needed to rapidly make that connection (i.e., they don't have a clear conceptual understanding of the necessary and sufficient features, and the defining features, of the class "mammals"; beyond that, it's only infrequently encountered in speech or writing as well, which further hinders performance). Now, a zoologist would not suffer nearly as much in this regard as a lay person, because his mental construction of "mammal" is sufficiently fleshed out through constant use and experience with the word in a wide range of circumstances, and so he would suffer little, if any, lag when identifying a robin as a mammal.


Expertise moves the "base level" for semantic recall down further. Picture a branch diagram with animal at the top, and below that "mammal", and then "bird" and specific instances of birds as described. For the average person, the base level is that of "animal" (when speaking of land-dwelling creatures). Technically speaking, when one hears the word "robin", the spreading activation should more quickly reach "mammal" when travelling up from the bottom towards "animal", yet we witness precisely the opposite effect; this is because the node containing "mammal" is murky and must be thoroughly scanned to produce a connection. As our brain is "scanning" the mammal node, the spreading activation continues to spread; believe it or not, it gets all the way up to "animal" before the scanning of "mammal" is anywhere near completed, which is why we are quicker to recognize a robin as an animal than as a mammal.


Now, as this seemingly unrelated example shows, "expertise" has a profound effect on the rapidity of articulatory ability. Relating it to something like "ominous", as discussed before, is fairly straightforward (though somewhat beyond the scope of what I just described). Someone who is thoroughly familiar with the word "ominous", and has seen it and used in various contexts, possesses sufficient expertise in that semantic area; as such, the mention of "ominous" sends activation (i.e., nerve impulses) to all the possible conceptions of "ominous", be they single words like "foreboding" or whole phrases such as "a looming danger". The most highly activated "node" will be the one which is subsequently produced by the speaker; expertise, in this example, switches "foreboding" from a somewhat muddled node (which would be passed over because the connection wouldn't be quick enough to counteract the production of a more easily activated node) to an easily activated node just like all the others. Everything else thus being relatively equal, mental economy factors come into play (which are beyond the scope of this post, seeing as how I'm about to head out to see "I, Robot" :p), and these dictate that the most succinct and applicable word is produced.


Hope this explained things somewhat, even if you didn't specifically ask why certain things were so. :p
 

Pimpwerx

Member
IQ is indeed a wierd thing. I don't believe in the online tests, they're way too easy to cheat. I've only had to take one, and it was when I was in 8th grade. They chuck a bunch of different things at you. If you score high on one, you're pretty well-rounded IMO. But it's not a conclusive test by any means. That said, I seriously doubt Ms. Simpson scored a 160 on a real IQ test. All the fancy editing in the world can't hide true genius, and a score like that makes you a genius, period. Who knows, maybe off camera, she's solving massive Fourier equations and designing aircraft. I doubt it though.

BTW, I think IQ tests are male-biased. I'm confident that my spacial/math skills are what got me a high score. These are generally areas where women score lower. I just remember my IQ test being a bunch of puzzles and math. Some memory stuff too, although I'd fail that miserably now thanks to weed. Oh yeah, and my parent's never told me my IQ score until I was 16. I don't think you're supposed to know your score, or read the report if you're young b/c they fear it might discourage some kids, or make them lazy. You need it to get into gifted programs though. I forget what the cutoff is. A 160 is easily high enough for MENSA. PEACE.
 

ChumsGum

Banned
God I hated being in those "gifted" classes. Sure the level of learning was turned up a few notches but they forget these kids also need to develop valuable social skills, something they can't do very well when thrown into classes with geeks and dorks.
 

way more

Member
I have to ask, can you raise your IQ? From your description it sounds like verbal acuity is the strongest indicator. Noam Chomsky says that such a quality as well as intelligence is a innate quality. Chomsky is like the smartest guy I know, so is he right?
 

Loki

Count of Concision
Cyan said:
Great post Loki. One thing though-- birds aren't mammals. It takes longer when you're asked if a robin is a mammal because you have to find a negative connection. You move up from robin, find that bird has negative connections to several other things, and finally find that mammal is one of those things.

An interesting sidenote to this is typicalness. A person takes longer to identify a penguin or ostrich as a bird than they do a robin. A standard, more "typical" type of bird is identified as such more quickly. Thus, the hierarchical model can't be all that's going on.

Haha, a bird isn't a mammal-- shows you what my IQ is. ;) Poo-poo on me. :p

As you note, and as I described in my post with the notion of "necessary and sufficient" and "defining" characteristics of classes, a more "typical" type of bird, such as a robin, is identified as being a bird much more quickly than is an ostrich or penguin; the reason for this is that although all satisfy the "necessary and sufficient" criteria for being a "bird", only robin fulfills all of the ancillary "defining" characteristics. If one views the characteristics of "birdness" as a three-dimensional cube, with each dimensional axis representing the degree of conformity to one feature, then the "ideal" bird (such as a robin) will be located in the right upper corner, away from the viewer, with ostrich somewhere in the three-dimensional center of such a cubic schema. There is an indistinct line running through the cube which delimits just when we recognize an element as being a member of a category, though it cannot be precisely defined. Of course, the above is assuming only three necessary and sufficient and defining criteria per category (the three axes), but the example holds in principle.

Also as you mention, experience tends to have a strong effect on our mental associations, and can in many cases rearrange our conception of what constitutes a "defining" feature (necessary and sufficient features remain constant). So if one was raised in Alaska, for instance, one might believe that the defining characteristics of a bird were the ability to waddle and the possession of smooth skin; since ALL instances of birds share the necessary and sufficient characteristics, one would thus equate "penguin" with "bird" more readily than they would for "robin", as the penguin would exhibit more overall characteristics of the "ideal bird" due to the experientially influenced defining features. Hope that made sense. :p


And yes, the hierarchical model isn't the only thing at play, and it has been revised countless times over the years, culminating with the relatively recent development of more nuanced parallel distributed processing models (i.e., PDP, or "connectionist" models) that I don't feel like taking the time to explain. ;)


I have to ask, can you raise your IQ? From your description it sounds like verbal acuity is the strongest indicator. Noam Chomsky says that such a quality as well as intelligence is a innate quality. Chomsky is like the smartest guy I know, so is he right?

The general consensus amongst intelligence researchers is that no, you cannot raise your IQ to any appreciable extent, though small gains are possible. This rigid view is due to a belief in the pure heritability of IQ (that is, a "nature" rather than "nurture" perspective). There has been much criticism of this inflexible view (for both scientific as well as pragmatic reasons; see: the "self-esteem" movement ;)), and recent syntheses of these opposing viewpoints include the "gene to environment" and "plasticity" models of intelligence.

Briefly, the "gene to environment" (G-E) theory posits that yes, there are indelible genetic components to intelligence, but that our environments are in turn shaped by our genes as they are expressed both by ourselves and our parents. As an example, parents who are genetically predisposed to liking/playing music will pass those genes on to their children, who will also receive that same genetic inclination; yet the parents will also likely fill the house with music at every turn, and so the child will be raised in a musical environment; as a result, any love for music or musical aptitude which the child later displays can be viewed as resulting from the confluence of these genetic and environmental forces rather than solely one or the other. As another example, a child with a high innate IQ will necessarily be more inquisitive and eager to learn than will one with a lower genetic IQ; this will almost certainly influence parents' reactions to the child, and will likely lead to drastically different learning environments being created for that child, which will further strengthen their genetic propensity. Unfortunately, the G-E theory has been denounced as a simple nature theory wrapped in fancy rhetoric, which is a view I tend to agree with. Because when you distill this theory down to its essence, you realize that it is still asserting the primacy of genetic influences on behaviors and aptitudes (including IQ).

"Plasticity" theory is the view that innate intelligence (IQ) is not so much a "number", but rather a greater ability to adapt one's neuronal connections and representations to a variety of tasks and scenarios (this fits in nicely with the previous poster's conception of intelligence as problem solving ability); those with higher IQ have more "plastic", malleable brains (I say "brains" and not "minds" because this theory is as much concerned with neurophysiology as it is with cognitive psychology). This is viewed as a synthesis because of the role of environment in actually shaping our neuronal networks (IQ confers capacity for plasticity, but what ultimate form one's neuronal network takes is dependent upon the situation) as well as for other physiological reasons which I don't feel like delving into at the moment. It allows room for educational and generational effects on IQ (as evidence of these phenomena, realize that the average person's IQ has been steadily increasing over generations).


As for Chomsky, well, he didn't assert that one's linguistic aptitude was innate so much as that all people possess an inherent mechanism which facilitates language acquisition, which he unimaginatively dubbed the "language acquisition device", or LAD. Chomsky wasn't concerned with IQ, and never wrote extensively about it as far as I know; feel free to correct me if I'm mistaken in that regard. What he proposed is merely a starting point (i.e., possession of the LAD), and he never expressly defined what cognitive/neural modes/structures constituted the LAD (noteworthy is the fact that he originally conceived of it as a physical structure, iirc). So it's not entirely clear whether or not he viewed everyone's LAD's-- and hence their eventual linguistic ability and ultimately IQ-- as "equivalent" for the most part in terms of how they were composed and their relative quality.


Hope this helped some. :)
 

Chrono

Banned
mac said:
I have to ask, can you raise your IQ?

My cousin, who has a PhD in pscyhology I think, says that you can. However, looking at reality shows a different picture. Can, for example a B math student, practice hard enough to reach the national mathematics olympics? fuck no. :(
 

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
The online tests are bullshit. I can say this because I have been tested on more than one occasion with the real full test(s) and the online ones always place my IQ higher than it really is (the big thing the online tests simply can't process is processing speed, which does have an effect on the score and is an area where I personally am severely lacking).

I'm still a genius, though, so it's all good. :)

And no, you can't raise your IQ. It measures your natural ability to gain knowledge in relation to your age. So you ability will always increase, but it will always stay in the same proportion with your age. I know I got the same score at age 7 that I got at age 20.
 

tedtropy

$50/hour, but no kissing on the lips and colors must be pre-separated
Perhaps she's so damn smart that's she come to the conclusion that acting like a complete idiot is the true path to happiness. She is making millions off of her being a ditz...
 
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