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[fortified_concept]

How many coups against the non-ruling lower class have there been?

Many. One is happening right now in my country.

 

[Zozz]

Im laughing my ass off, this is so much win.

 

[ConfusingJazz]

:lol

Didn't he go nuts in the thread that got him tossed? I haven't read the whole thing myself, but I was told he went bonkers.

He went nuts in a lot of topics he shouldn't have gone nuts in. People think he got banned for a thread he created, when he got banned for derailing threads left and right and not understanding why people were pissed that he was doing that.

 

[Rekwest]

I still rather live in Venezuela, those girls are hot.

Women no girls,or you are a Pedo bear?

 

[mre]

He went nuts in a lot of topics he shouldn't have gone nuts in. People think he got banned for a thread he created, when he got banned for derailing threads left and right and not understanding why people were pissed that he was doing that.

He loved to fuck up threads about Segall or Snipes. Personally, I think he hated B-grade action stars, but what do I know?

 

[ConfusingJazz]

Many. One is happening right now in my country.

What is happening in Greece right now that can be considered a coup?

EDIT: You know what? Fuck it, I am going to go play Victoria 2 and do my own coups and socialist revolutions.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

He loved to fuck up threads about Segall or Snipes. Personally, I think he hated B-grade action stars, but what do I know?

Really? I never saw those ones. Why did he say about Saegal and Snipes? Of all the things to go crazy about. :lol

 

[water_wendi]

The truth is RiskyChris didnt derail threads.. people infatuated with him did. Just like they did here.

Many. One is happening right now in my country.

Well thats good to hear.

 

[xbhaskarx]

Greece. Currently middle class.

I don't know if anyone in Greece can be considered middle class given that they have a quarter-million dollars of debt for each working adult.

 

[Shawsie64]

Im friends with a few girls that came to Australia to get away from Venezuela, their parents still live there and are worried about them everyday =/

 

[fortified_concept]

What is happening in Greece right now that can be considered a coup?

A "socialist" party that had promised better social security for the people less taxes for the middle and lower classes, suddenly "realized" there are no money invited in the IMF, decided to give billions to banks, tax the hell out of the lower and middle class without even touching the rich, cut pensions, cut salaries and even force lower salaries for workers of the private sector (nothing to do with the country's expenses but they did it anyway). They've also purposely brought our health care system and education on the brink of collapse for corporations to take over. Using fearmongering and lies they did the exact opposite of what they promised and the people are enraged to the point there's talk of revolution.

 

[Deku]

The context of the discussion revolves around the article claiming that Venezuela's economy shrunk. My reply was that in socialist economies these numbers don't mean shit and that a big part of the reason their economy shrunk is the worldwide fuckups by the capitalists, something the article "forgets" to mention.

It very much does matter. Socialist economies still require a market to generate wealth which is them, supposedly redistributed fairly to all.

Venezuela was riding high under the petrol price boom from 2004-2008 but as prices has come down its economy has collapsed, with no other diversified interest to replace it.

 

[Socreges]

There was some offtopic preaching along with my reply but yours wasn't any better either. Remember this part?

That offtopic preaching is ontopic by virtue of being a reply to your offtopic preaching!

Yes of course I should have known the original name in spanish of the organization. Or, you know, you could have been less cryptic. FFS.

That's not cryptic. That's the acronym people use, even in English. Like with FARC.

 

[empty vessel]

It very much does matter. Socialist economies still require a market to generate wealth which is them, supposedly redistributed fairly to all.

Venezuela was riding high under the petrol price boom from 2004-2008 but as prices has come down its economy has collapsed, with no other diversified interest to replace it.

So is your argument that Venezuela's economy would be fine and more "diversified" if Chavez had never been elected? That argument seems extremely simplistic and almost naive. Venezuela has always depended on oil, as many other countries, whatever their economic system, depend on certain resources they are particularly rich in.

 

[Fersis]

I was 'Pro Chavez' until i read Venezuela GAF opinions about him.

Hugs to my hermanos Venezolanos.

 

[empty vessel]

I was 'Pro Chavez' until i read Venezuela GAF opinions about him.

Hugs to my hermanos Venezolanos.

It might be kept in mind, these Venezuelan GAFers have computers, internet access, and speak English. They are unlikely to come from the overwhelming majority of Venezuelans that are poor and who, until recently, were mostly illiterate. In other words, there is a reason that Venezuela GAF has the attitudes towards the Chavez government it does that are not necessarily directly connected to what the Chavez government has done to better Venezuelan society as a whole.

 

[fortified_concept]

That offtopic preaching is ontopic by virtue of being a reply to your offtopic preaching!

And I was being ontopic with your ontopic preaching about my offtopic preaching. :lol The point is, yes I went offtopic but you went along with it and in the middle of the discussion you decided to remember that I had been offtopic a couple of posts ago. Anyway, as much as I enjoy for some reason this ridiculous discussion I think we should end it.

 

[Fersis]

It might be kept in mind, these Venezuelan GAFers have computers, internet access, and speak English. They are unlikely to come from the overwhelming majority of Venezuelans that are poor and who, until recently, were mostly illiterate. In other words, there is a reason that Venezuela GAF has the attitudes towards the Chavez government it does that are not necessarily directly connected to what the Chavez government has done to better Venezuelan society as a whole.

I tought about that.
But i have computers,internet acces and (kind of)speak english yet im 'officialist' (I like my government).

What im trying to say is that, i like the 'concept' of what Chavez is doing but since i dont live in Venezuela i cant argue against GAFFERS Venezolanos.

For instance: Ive seen a couple of gaffers saying 'bad things' about Argentina's current government which i dont agree.

 

[mantidor]

It might be kept in mind, these Venezuelan GAFers have computers, internet access, and speak English. They are unlikely to come from the overwhelming majority of Venezuelans that are poor and who, until recently, were mostly illiterate. In other words, there is a reason that Venezuela GAF has the attitudes towards the Chavez government it does that are not necessarily directly connected to what the Chavez government has done to better Venezuelan society as a whole.

You have to be kidding me :lol I warned about people like you like 10 posts before.

 

[Reneledarker]

Shame, how bad Venezuela is, Mexico is in a bad shape, but most of the violence is between narcs.
Here in my university UABC we have a bunch of students from Venezuela, most of them leave the country whit tourist visas, and once they got here they asked to be changed to student visas, pretty clever way to leave the country.

 

[Lonely1]

Well, Mexico's murder rate is still lower than countries like South Africa, Russia and Brazil....

 

[Zenith]

Yes of course I should have known the original name in spanish of the organization. Or, you know, you could have been less cryptic. FFS.

Or you could know something about the country. Considering you claim to know better than the people who actually live there.

They are unlikely to come from the overwhelming majority of Venezuelans that are poor and who, until recently, were mostly illiterate.

something something bourgeois something something oppressing the proletariat

 

[empty vessel]

You have to be kidding me :lol I warned about people like you like 10 posts before.

And that negates what I said how? Feel free to show me.

 

[Zenith]

And that negates what I said how? Feel free to show me.

Dismissing someone's argument because they speak English is retarded. You haven't the faintest idea what "true" Venezuelans are like.

 

[JDSN]

You are capable of using a computer and speaking english. You must obviously be rich since poor people are fucking dumb!

 

[fortified_concept]

Or you could know something about the country. Considering you claim to know better than the people who actually live there.

Oh for god's sake... So not only I should know the initials of the NGOs of each country I read about but I should know them by their original names? You're being ridiculous. :lol

 

[Evlar]

Dismissing someone's argument because they speak English is retarded. You haven't the faintest idea what "true" Venezuelans are like.

Hmm? That's an interesting claim.

 

[avatar299]

Oh for god's sake... So not only I should know the initials of the NGOs of each country I read about but I should know them by their original names? You're being ridiculous. :lol

or you could have done some simple research. *shrugs*

 

[fortified_concept]

Let's settle this once and for all. So tell us Venezuelans who post here and don't like Chavez, were you part of the poor majority of the country?

or you could have done some simple research. *shrugs*

What does that even mean?

 

[avatar299]

It means what I said. If you don't know what something means, look it up before looking like a fool.

 

[HK-47]

So you avoid to reply to any of these questions. I think I've made my point...

You don't have a point and you ignore everyone else's.

 

[empty vessel]

Dismissing someone's argument because they speak English is retarded. You haven't the faintest idea what "true" Venezuelans are like.

I haven't dismissed anybody's argument, nor did I claim to know what "true" Venezuelans are like (I'm not sure I even know what that means). Feel free to address what I said on its own terms.

You are capable of using a computer and speaking english. You must obviously be rich since poor people are fucking dumb!

A computer--even access to a computer--is a form of wealth. And so is speaking English in a developing country like Venezuela.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Venezuela#English

Nowhere did anybody make a claim about intelligence.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I haven't dismissed anybody's argument, nor did I claim to know what "true" Venezuelans are like (I'm not sure I even know what that means). Feel free to address what I said on its own terms.



A computer--even access to a computer--is a form of wealth. And so is speaking English in a developing country like Venezuela.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Venezuela#English

Nowhere did anybody make a claim about intelligence.

even in the poorest schools they teach english. holy living fuck on a stick, owning a computer now makes you a millionare. Jesus fucking christ. I swear some of you just love to argue and don't actually believe what you type! talk about the ultimate contrarians.

 

[water_wendi]

even in the poorest schools they teach english. holy living fuck on a stick, owning a computer now makes you a millionare. Jesus fucking christ. I swear some of you just love to argue and don't actually believe what you type! talk about the ultimate contrarians.

empty vessel and fortified_concept are so transparent its not even funny. They are without a doubt the biggest neocon capitalist supporters ive ever seen on the internet.

 

[fortified_concept]

It means what I said. If you don't know what something means, look it up before looking like a fool.

I skimmed through the search results for ovv+venezuela and found nothing. I didn't know I have to waste time because someone is being cryptic to appear more knowledgeable on a forum. When someone asks me what the initials of something I mentioned mean I have the courtesy to immediately explain it to him instead of playing games.

even in the poorest schools they teach english. holy living fuck on a stick, owning a computer now makes you a millionare. Jesus fucking christ. I swear some of you just love to argue and don't actually believe what you type! talk about the ultimate contrarians.

You do realize there are different standards of wealth and class between different countries, right?

 

[xbhaskarx]

It might be kept in mind, these Venezuelan GAFers have computers, internet access, and speak English. They are unlikely to come from the overwhelming majority of Venezuelans that are poor and who, until recently, were mostly illiterate. In other words, there is a reason that Venezuela GAF has the attitudes towards the Chavez government it does that are not necessarily directly connected to what the Chavez government has done to better Venezuelan society as a whole.

:lol :lol

 

[empty vessel]

even in the poorest schools they teach english. holy living fuck on a stick, owning a computer now makes you a millionare. Jesus fucking christ. I swear some of you just love to argue and don't actually believe what you type! talk about the ultimate contrarians.

I'm not sure who you are responding to, because it doesn't address anything I said.

You do realize there are different standards of wealth and class between different countries, right?

A lot of people have severely distorted perceptions about how most people live, even within their own societies (and even in relatively wealthy societies). For example, according to this, 31% of Americans do not use the internet at home. Of those, 39% cited the reason as its cost. And this is the richest country in the world. It's strange to think, but posting on the internet is itself a pretty good indicator of relative wealth vis-a-vis the rest of the world. The distortions of perception occur because most people's social world is limited to their own class.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I skimmed through the search results for ovv+venezuela and found nothing. I didn't know I have to waste time because someone is being cryptic to appear more knowledgeable on a forum. When someone asks me what the initials of something I mentioned mean I have the courtesy to immediately explain it to him instead of playing games.



You do realize there are different standards of wealth and class between different countries, right?

I come from a third world country sir, I think I know what the standard of living is like.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I'm not sure who you are responding to, because it doesn't address anything I said.

it wouldn't matter, you'd just ignore what Venezuelans on this board and other people would say.

 

[empty vessel]

it wouldn't matter, you'd just ignore what Venezuelans on this board and other people would say.

I wouldn't ignore it. I would just consider it in the context of what I know about the demographics of Venezuela. Poor Venezuelans who only speak Spanish--the base of the current Venezuelan government and majority of the Venezuelan population--will never have a voice on an internet forum like GAF. It's important to keep that in mind, don't you think?

 

[BattleMonkey]

We have so many Venezuelans that work for us here in Florida, and none want to go back. Those who have failed to stay in the US have all fled to Canada and such.

 

[Funky Papa]

I wouldn't ignore it. I would just consider it in the context of what I know about the demographics of Venezuela. Poor Venezuelans who only speak Spanish--the base of the current Venezuelan government and majority of the Venezuelan population--will never have a voice on an internet forum like GAF. It's important to keep that in mind, don't you think?

What about poor Venezuelans who emigrate to Spain and hate Chavez's guts? Because we have them in spades over here.

 

[Evlar]

Surely we're not expected to believe ex-patriot communities- from any country- are a good source of neutral commentary on the politics of their home countries?

 

[elrechazado]

Surely we're not expected to believe ex-patriot communities- from any country- are a good source of neutral commentary on the politics of their home countries?

Surely you see the flaws in that logic. Think a bit about various expatriate communities throughout the ages, and what they might have said about the countries they were fleeing. Dismissing them just because they're expats is as asinine as accepting everything they say as gospel.

 

[empty vessel]

What about poor Venezuelans who emigrate to Spain and hate Chavez's guts? Because we have them in spades over here.

Poor Venezuelans typically don't have the resources to emigrate anywhere. I'm not saying there aren't exceptions to the rule, but they are exceptions nonetheless.

(This rule applies to the poor from anywhere. Even poor Americans typically don't have the resources to pick up and leave for other pastures.)

 

[elrechazado]

Poor Venezuelans typically don't have the resources to emigrate anywhere. I'm not saying there aren't exceptions to the rule, but they are exceptions nonetheless.

(This rule applies to the poor from anywhere. Even poor Americans typically don't have the resources to pick up and leave for other pastures.)

Oh, so he's lying because it doesn't fit your narrative. This just gets better and better.

 

[Shawsie64]

We have so many Venezuelans that work for us here in Florida, and none want to go back. Those who have failed to stay in the US have all fled to Canada and such.

Australia, US or Canada seem to be the popular choices

 

[avatar299]

Oh, so he's lying because it doesn't fit your narrative. This just gets better and better.

Think about it. This narrative makes perfect sense for someone defending Chavez, You can ignore everyone that left that country and opposes Chavez, by accusing them of being to wealthy.

 

[Masta_Killah]

Poor Venezuelans typically don't have the resources to emigrate anywhere. I'm not saying there aren't exceptions to the rule, but they are exceptions nonetheless.

(This rule applies to the poor from anywhere. Even poor Americans typically don't have the resources to pick up and leave for other pastures.)

So what about all those illegal immigrants coming from Mexico and central america? Aren't they also poor and lack resources? They seem to be fine with picking their things and migrating hundreds, if not thousands of miles to better opportunity.

 

[BattleMonkey]

So what about all those illegal immigrants coming from Mexico and central america? Aren't they also poor and lack resources? They seem to be fine with picking their things and migrating hundreds, if not thousands of miles to better opportunity.

You do know how Mexicans get into the country right? :lol