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Westworld - Live in Your World, Play in Ours - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter RatskyWatsky
- Start date
VenomousCoffee
Gold Member
The others are well-deserved, but I don't see how Jeffrey Wright doesn't get one. Honestly I thought all the major actors were great this season.
Doesn't look like anything to me.
Sure, but in that time period the robots usually just randomly tried to kill us. In this story, they have reasons.
BlackGhost
Banned
Finished the season. Wish I could have seen some of the reactions to the bigger twists. Gonna have to try and find the pages
Just finished the show after a 3 day binge. Loved the show, loved the twists (although some I went back on forth on predicting) and loved the music and performances.
It's definitely one of those shows where you can't think about it too much or it doesn't work.
My big thing was that it seemed literally impossible, given the size of the park and the population of hosts, to not only service all of the damaged hosts but REPAIR ALL THE DAMAGED BUILDINGS, FURNITURE, ETC, each and every night. That safe breaks that railing everytime.
They never show enough staff, they never show enough transportation means. I mean, just how vast of a tunnel network could they have? The park never sleeps yet it should constantly be under reconstruction with workers hauling materials and bodies everywhere. Everything should be swiss cheese with bullet holes. And how do the guns destroy everything but human flesh? I assume the guest guns can't hurt other guests, but what stops guests from stabbing each other, even unknowingly?
Also, they talk about re-assigning hosts all the time but the young William storyline showed the same hosts doing the same things...
But it's all just a lot of fun, really.
Ingrid Bolsø Berdal's performance at the end was fucking awesome. I loved the whole cast, though.
Special props for using at least 4 Radiohead covers! They fit very well. Loved the player piano motif.
It's definitely one of those shows where you can't think about it too much or it doesn't work.
My big thing was that it seemed literally impossible, given the size of the park and the population of hosts, to not only service all of the damaged hosts but REPAIR ALL THE DAMAGED BUILDINGS, FURNITURE, ETC, each and every night. That safe breaks that railing everytime.
They never show enough staff, they never show enough transportation means. I mean, just how vast of a tunnel network could they have? The park never sleeps yet it should constantly be under reconstruction with workers hauling materials and bodies everywhere. Everything should be swiss cheese with bullet holes. And how do the guns destroy everything but human flesh? I assume the guest guns can't hurt other guests, but what stops guests from stabbing each other, even unknowingly?
Also, they talk about re-assigning hosts all the time but the young William storyline showed the same hosts doing the same things...
But it's all just a lot of fun, really.
Ingrid Bolsø Berdal's performance at the end was fucking awesome. I loved the whole cast, though.
Special props for using at least 4 Radiohead covers! They fit very well. Loved the player piano motif.
Watched the entire season in a day this weekend, really loved it. Actually really glad I watched it this way so I didn't get the twists spoiled by the internet.
So, did Arnold really leave some kind of ghost in the machine that has been messing with things or was it all just part of Ford's "master plan"?
So, did Arnold really leave some kind of ghost in the machine that has been messing with things or was it all just part of Ford's "master plan"?
It's a mix of both, I think.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
How did Dolores see herself drowned in the river? Wouldn't her memory be vision of the river bed instead of seeing herself face planting into the water? Or did she hack into a park camera and saw herself....
:3 not seriously asking lol. just noticing another one of the show's contrivances :>
social anxiety
Honestly, for a long time I thought that dude was the worst part of the show because I didn't understand his motivations at all.
But in the end it turned out it was pretty simple: empathy.
Robert Ford was a great villian. Maybe one of my favorite villians in a long time.
The major problems I had with the Ed Harris/Jimmi Simpson same person reveal were 1) it only works because they look nothing alike and 2) the hosts in young William's timeline were all doing the same roles, despite the Hosts allegedly getting retasked with new narratives for 30 years.
I'm also still confused about what the cannibal dudes and ghost indian tribe were all about and why they didn't respond to control commands.
More_Badass
Member
Only Dolores and Teddy. Maeve wasn't around. The park storyline was different, during the Civil War versus after. Lawrence was a gang leader. The blond woman was an entrance host in the past. And so on. The hosts definitely were not all doing the same role
What about Clementine?
Lawrence was still a gang leader, wasn't he?
What about my other nitpicks lol?
Clementine ran the brothel 30 years ago. She had Maeve's role while Maeve was a mother out in Ghost Nation territory.
Lazo was a gang leader 30 years ago. His modern day Lawrence was more of a bandit/crook.
Cannibals was an abandoned narrative from 30 years ago. Ghost Nation ignoring voice commands is clearly a thread for S2 and Elsie/Stubbs.
I assume they monitor where every visitor is and also have hosts do repairs automatically when they are out of sight? I mean, if you get into logistics or economics this probably falls apart, but in principle it is not unimaginable.
More_Badass
Member
That's the kind of thing you don't think about for a theoretical sci-fi concept to work
Our experience of time occurring in the park is more than a bit compressed, the dialogue supports the idea that set-piece events like the saloon robbery are happening like, once every three weeks to a month. Narrative has to make it happen "a week early", so it's not happening every day or even every week. Hector normally spends days on end just cooling his heels in the jail.
I mean, it's still fantastic and insane but they don't have to fix everything in the park every day. And they've got ways to mitigate damage when guests (other than MiB) are being overly destructive.
But what about building materials and furniture?
Anyway, like I said above, I know you can't over think it. But it still bothers me.
Like, the park is insanely big. How long was young William on that train?
The flow of time is definitely confusing as hell. It doesn't help that we have multiple timelines happening concurrently, like when Dolores is talking to Arnold in the past, young William's adventure, etc. It's hard to follow the passage of time from the present day staff perspective. It felt like Elsie's sleuthing was happening over a very short period, yet Maeve's story seems to be taking place over months.
We don't really know enough about their technological advances, which seem like Star Trek technology at times, to really know how difficult it is for them to accomplish these things.
For all we know it could be some kind of post-scarcity economy. It's probably best not to delve into that in the show, because the more they explain these things, the more holes will come up.
MickeyKnox
Member
The only acceptable casting for an older Logan would be
Agreed, they have 3d printers that can print living creatures. I think the above wouldn't be a stretch.
Yeah, it seems straightforward to 3D print replacements for broken things, even building components, and have the hosts themselves deliver them in character -- I'm sure there are hosts playing the part of carpenters, ironsmiths, etc in the park.
Even adds more verisimilitude to see things being worked on as if actual people lived there.
In the past: they were just high level quest NPCs.
In the present: they were retasked by Ford as the army to kill the board in his final narrative. He modified them to ignore control commands, bullet damage, and removed their mortality simulation so they wouldn't die from what would normally trigger their "deaths".
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
No. They dont even need to breathe. Pooping will just create sewage problems.
i dont actually know :>
Of course if they don't eat/poop why wouldn't Arnold quickly realize he was a host? He false memories for a taking a shit? And why would tech guy think for a second that he could be a host?
You're on to something. They also must be able to ejaculate realistic semen, or Theresa would of noticed something was up.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Watching a couple scenes again, I noticed a neat parallel in two of the stories that Ford tells. One is the story of evolution that Ford tells to Bernard, and the other is the story of the greyhound that Ford tells to Old Bill.
They both use the image of a leash. Humanity slips evolution's leash, and the dog slips an actual leash. It's interesting in that the point of the greyhound story (while also being a metaphor for the AI) is how the dog didn't know what to do once it killed the cat.
In Ford's story about evolution, he talked about how humanity wasn't constrained by natural selection anymore (i.e. evolution's leash) since they could cure any disease and keep even the weakest of them alive. Now that humanity has slipped its leash, it too does not know what to do with itself. This is also the reason that the MiB is dissatisfied with the real world. It's too safe and provides for everything, which, in his opinion, kills any sort of real purpose in life.
They both use the image of a leash. Humanity slips evolution's leash, and the dog slips an actual leash. It's interesting in that the point of the greyhound story (while also being a metaphor for the AI) is how the dog didn't know what to do once it killed the cat.
In Ford's story about evolution, he talked about how humanity wasn't constrained by natural selection anymore (i.e. evolution's leash) since they could cure any disease and keep even the weakest of them alive. Now that humanity has slipped its leash, it too does not know what to do with itself. This is also the reason that the MiB is dissatisfied with the real world. It's too safe and provides for everything, which, in his opinion, kills any sort of real purpose in life.
I have a theory that Maeve's timeline happened in the past. I have a strong suspicion that her and Charlotte are the same person. The tech said that because of something in her hardware she couldn't leave without a reskin and was cut off. Plus a lot of small hints like the host Charlotte slept with and them both wearing the same dress at one point. Just because Bernard popped up at the end it doesn't mean anything. It could have been a time jump.
More_Badass
Member
Reading interviews and such, Samurai World is actually quite clever considering how closely linked the Western and Samurai films are
Cornballer
Member
Three SAG Award nominations this morning for Westworld:
Outstanding Performance by a Female Actor in a Drama Series
THANDIE NEWTON / Maeve Millay WESTWORLD (HBO)
Outstanding Performance by an Ensemble in a Drama Series
Outstanding Action Performance by a Stunt Ensemble in a Comedy or Drama Series
HBO has to be happy with the recent awards and nominations for the series.
Outstanding Performance by a Female Actor in a Drama Series
THANDIE NEWTON / Maeve Millay WESTWORLD (HBO)
Outstanding Performance by an Ensemble in a Drama Series
Outstanding Action Performance by a Stunt Ensemble in a Comedy or Drama Series
HBO has to be happy with the recent awards and nominations for the series.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
i think they eat/drink but maybe their internal processes can absorb 99% of the sustenance they consume.
but this is just based on nothing but personal preferences....
Dominican Power
Member
She was excellent.
Veritigo_X
Member
So this is what off-season Westworld gaf has come to.
I like the false shitting memories theory the best. The Bernard reveal would've been so much better if someone was like, "Bernard, I can't recall a single time you've gone to the bathroom."
I like the false shitting memories theory the best. The Bernard reveal would've been so much better if someone was like, "Bernard, I can't recall a single time you've gone to the bathroom."
They explicitly mention the celebrations though (in the command center). Ford mentions the celebrations to Bernard when he leaves him as well. I don't see how Maeve being Charlotte would make any sense.
There is no supporting evidence for this, you're just pulling stuff outta thin air.
Also as for not being able to leave, all hosts have a bomb in their spine that activates if they leave. Maeve purposely died in a fire so that they'd rebuild her body from scratch with the explosive removed and they showed all this. This theory is 100% wrong.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
I was underwhelmed by how Theresa's death and its ramifications were handled.
VenomousCoffee
Gold Member
I want a special edition Blu-ray with a time stamp in the corner for every scene. I've watched season 1 twice now and I still have questions about which Dolores scene is when.
To be clear, I love the show. Just saying.
To be clear, I love the show. Just saying.
VenomousCoffee
Gold Member
But she also wears the blue dress 'today.'
Now I'm no expert, but I had fun with the show and I was discussing with some friends about how I enjoyed Dolores' character arc and how she was a well-written character of tragedy and when asked to expand on that I explained what I could make of it. Now as I had binged the show I am unaware of any prior discussions/theories, but anyway that's what this post is about, feel free to punch holes in it:
The name Dolores is short for "Virgin Mary of Sorrows", Dolores Abernathy was a virgin or pure/ignorant to the realities of her world, but eventually learns the reality of it through reveries and her own consciousness reaching out to her about "one who has yet to come." It could be seen that the hosts that become conscious are analogous to modern Christianity. Their first birth is when they're born/made and their second birth is when they truly become conscious or "born again". Ford realized where Andrew's faults were and that consciousness can only arrive with time, much like prophecies. You could even argue that her character arc follows the Seven Sorrows of Mary.
The Seven Sorrows:
"One day, you will perish. You will like with the rest of your kind in the dirt. Your dreams forgotten, your horrors faced, your muscles will turn to sand, and upon that sand a new God will walk, one that will never die, because this world doesn't belong to you or the people who came before. It belongs to someone who is yet to come."
Ford sets himself up to fall in the final act and the beginning of his new narrative, arguably a "New Testament" so that the thoughts(consciousness) of many hearts(hosts) may be revealed.
As for the remaining two sorrows well we'll just have to wait for season 2:
6. The Piercing of the Side of Jesus, and His Descent from the Cross. (Matthew 27:57–59)
7. The Burial of Jesus by Joseph of Arimathea. (John 19:40–42)
The name Dolores is short for "Virgin Mary of Sorrows", Dolores Abernathy was a virgin or pure/ignorant to the realities of her world, but eventually learns the reality of it through reveries and her own consciousness reaching out to her about "one who has yet to come." It could be seen that the hosts that become conscious are analogous to modern Christianity. Their first birth is when they're born/made and their second birth is when they truly become conscious or "born again". Ford realized where Andrew's faults were and that consciousness can only arrive with time, much like prophecies. You could even argue that her character arc follows the Seven Sorrows of Mary.
The Seven Sorrows:
"One day, you will perish. You will like with the rest of your kind in the dirt. Your dreams forgotten, your horrors faced, your muscles will turn to sand, and upon that sand a new God will walk, one that will never die, because this world doesn't belong to you or the people who came before. It belongs to someone who is yet to come."
Ford sets himself up to fall in the final act and the beginning of his new narrative, arguably a "New Testament" so that the thoughts(consciousness) of many hearts(hosts) may be revealed.
While the verse isn't directly related to the character in question, the actions behind it are. Dolores escaped her core loop and where did it lead her? To the city of sand AKA Egypt and who sought her out always no matter and what? William(Herod).
In this case Dolores has been seeking Andrew she had lost him back in the city of sand, but did not know why and as she was slowly becoming conscious she turned back to where she had been before seeking him exactly where he last was.
It can be argued that the meeting between Ford and Dolores is their "via dolorosa" as Ford is setting himself up for the sacrifice, much like Jesus says "weep not for me, but for yourselves" Ford knows his suffering will be short and the time of reckoning for the board is at hand.
No need to quote the verse on this one, but to state the obvious Ford is sacrificed at the hand of Dolores.
As for the remaining two sorrows well we'll just have to wait for season 2:
6. The Piercing of the Side of Jesus, and His Descent from the Cross. (Matthew 27:57–59)
7. The Burial of Jesus by Joseph of Arimathea. (John 19:40–42)
Zoe
Member
Only up to a certain point. Whenever she goes on the journey, she changes clothes halfway through.
Cornballer
Member
Nollemaster
Member
This blows my mind. How could I not have noticed??