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[Deleted member 1235]

NZ can't decide whether to force a woman to take off her burqa in court to give evidence. Woman suggests she would rather kill herself.

Take it all off!

 

[DJ Sl4m]

She should be required to remove it to take part in the procedure, this isn't her native homeland and shouldn't be treated as such.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

That's what I reckon.

Our Muslim MP has also said that the burqa deal isn't even in the Quran (sp?)
Plus it's plain retarded to impose that kind of dress on yourself.

 

[ShadowRed]

How does her attire affect her ability to give testimony? I do believe they have mouth holes so she can speak. If this is her religious belief it shouldn't be trampled on because others don't like it. Would you feel the same if the courts wanted a Nun to remove her habit before testifying, or a Jewish person remove their Yamaka(sp, probably not.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

the arguement is that it won't allow jury/lawyers and all that to assess her expressions, the whole body language being a large percentage of communication.

Also burqas are much more stupid than a nuns outfit. but i guess thats neither here nor there.

 

[ShadowRed]

the arguement is that it won't allow jury/lawyers and all that to assess her expressions, the whole body language being a large percentage of communication.

Also burqas are much more stupid than a nuns outfit. but i guess thats neither here nor there.

I assume that NZ has a legal system basied on facts, so being able to assess her expressions is irrelivent to weather or not she is telling the truth. In theory the burqa should aid the legal system as it forces the jury to concentrate on her words rather than her "swarthy" middle eastern looks or other irrelivant factors. I think you betray your true feelings when you refer to the attire of people who worship another religious in derogotory terms. I'm not Muslim and I think that the burqas isn't a good idea, but if it's a part of somebodies culture and they accept it then that's them and I respect that. Just because I don't agree with it doesn't make it "more stupid" and the kooky attire that people in my religion wear.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

oh for sure based on facts, but when a lawyer is questioning someone, I would think they are trying to 'read' that person and change tact accordingly.

As for the burqa thing, I'm labelling it as stupid because it is demeaning and just has no place in todays world. I mean telling a women she will go to hell for showing her face? It's terrible. Part of their religion is nonsense, that's what the uptight men told the women when they fooled them originally.

Slavery was also part of A whitemans culture once, doesn't make it right.....

 

[ShadowRed]

oh for sure based on facts, but when a lawyer is questioning someone, I would think they are trying to 'read' that person and change tact accordingly.

As for the burqa thing, I'm labelling it as stupid because it is demeaning and just has no place in todays world. I mean telling a women she will go to hell for showing her face? It's terrible. Part of their religion is nonsense, that's what the uptight men told the women when they fooled them originally.

Slavery was also part of A whitemans culture once, doesn't make it right.....

Assuming the NZ leagal system is like the US' then the lawyer already knows the answers to his/her questions and is just leading the wittness along until they say what the lawter wants them to say or says something that the lawyer knows to be untrue at which point the lawyer will present the evidience that the witness is lying. You don't need to beable to read a persons body languege inorder to know if they are telling the true if you have a strong case.


As for the burqa for the record I agree with your assement that it's outdated and unneccesary, but the woman doesn't think so apparently. If she did and chose to take it off then I would support her, she doesn't so I still suport her. It's not up to me to tell her what to believe. The Catholic church is against women using birth control. I think that's stupid, but I don't support a law to force all Catholic women to be inplanted with birth control rods. Those Catholic women who choose to believe the church should be allowed to do so those that don't should be allowed to not believe. It's not my postion to force my morality on other people.

 

[MetatronM]

That's what I reckon.

Our Muslim MP has also said that the burqa deal isn't even in the Quran (sp?)
Plus it's plain retarded to impose that kind of dress on yourself.

The Quran is not the only source of Islamic law.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

The Quran is not the only source of Islamic law.

true, but I mean, I just pointed that out because the whole burqa deal has obviously been created by a bunch of mean, silly men. But now she and all the women that wear them think

"Because I don't want to show my face in public...I would rather kill myself than uncover my face and sit here.

"If I uncover my face then I would be in trouble with God."

I mean, is that even her choice to wear that thing now? I mean do whatever in your own country, but come over here and try and bend the laws to suit your silly ideas. well no sympathy.

 

[mrkapawutzis]

Slavery was also part of A whitemans culture once, doesn't make it right.....

But it wasn't ingrained in the religious beliefs, though I'm sure there were some who tried to spin it that way. Slavery was understood to be an economic neccesity during it's time, burqa's are understood to be a socio/religious phenomena.

 

[Lucky Forward]

I assume that NZ has a legal system basied on facts, so being able to assess her expressions is irrelivent to weather or not she is telling the truth. In theory the burqa should aid the legal system as it forces the jury to concentrate on her words rather than her "swarthy" middle eastern looks or other irrelivant factors.

But nearly every court case involves two sides presenting contradictory "facts", and the judge or jury must assess these versions of the truth and decide who they believe. Seeing a person's expression and demeanor is vital to this.

A year or two ago before his current legal trouble, Michael Jackson was in court after being sued by a concert promoter. The California judge made him remove his surgical mask when he took the stand to testify, revealing his collapsing, taped-together nose. While this certainly can't set a precendent for New Zealand, it shows that it's not an unreasonable request on the part of the court.

 

[RiZ III]

The Quran is not the only source of Islamic law.

Even though it claims to be.

 

[FightyF]

"If I uncover my face then I would be in trouble with God."

Uh...doesn't the Quran say that women can only show their hands and face in public? It's pretty strict, but not strict enough for the face.