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What's wrong with Square?

Diablos

Member
Despite their corporate goals, Square managed to only put out one good game for the PS2 - and that is FFX. It's really cute that they are with Enix and now Taito, but at the end of the day, it obviously does nothing for gamers seeing as how there aren't too many games from Square or Enix on the PS2 right now.

We were talking about this in #ga last night. All of the PSX Square games were listed, then the PS2 games. It's amazing how much, it seems to me at least, that Square did not care about games this gen. They had FFX, they launched their online game (and spent way too much time marketing it), and FFXII has gone through delay after delay and IS STILL NOT OUT YET. To date, only one single player FF (FFX-2 doesn't count IMO, sorry) has been released for the PS2, and the console is near the end of the road. But back in the PSX days, wow, they had lots of awesome games. The PSX Square released new titles like Parasite Eve. PS2 Square released The Bouncer. :lol

Their PS2 track record is pretty crappy gamewise. They'd be better off scraping FFXII for the PS2 altogether, redoing the textures, beefing up the models and releasing it for PS3 at this point. After waiting all of this time... what's another year or two? I'm serious! FFXII will be released shortly before, during, or possibly AFTER the PS3's release. That's ridiculous. Who would have thought it would have been delayed THAT long? The PSX enjoyed three really good FF's IMO, plus FF Tactics. And games like Chrono, Parasite Eve, Xenogears. Four FF games plus a lot of other awesome games. What does the PS2 get? FFX, a crappy "sequel" to it that was frowned upon by many loyal Square fans, and an online RPG that is anything but the traditional FF. We didn't even get Chrono Break. I couldn't wait to read more info about it, but that will never happen. The next Chrono was one of my most anticipated PS2 games. I guess the guy that said "see you on the PS2" during the developer's ending in Chrono Cross is a liar.

Square can't keep doing this. If their PS3 games are released like this, I don't know how they expect their fans to remain loyal to what they do. Square got their ass kicked this gen, IMO. Games like MGS have dethroned FF as THE game to get excited for. And if MGS4 is any indication, Square is getting their ass kicked again. Everyone else is already gearing up for the next gen, and then there's Square, still trying to get FFXII out! :lol It's just ridiculous to see something so terribly planned and delayed so many times from a company that used to work like a machine when it came to pumping out awesome games (FF7, FF8, FF9, FFT, Chrono, Parasite Eve, Xenogears...) Square must think it's still 1997-1998 and they have the gaming world in the grasp of their hand. I think they need a reality check.
 
Dragon Quest gives you the middle finger for that only one good game on the PS2 comment...BTW I think Square Enix had more PS2 titles out than you think.
 
I think you mean "What is wrong with Enix", given that Square and Taito were (essentially) both bought out by them.

(Yeah yeah, I know, "Square Enix"...)
 
Titles over 85% at Gamerankings

PS2
1. Final Fantasy X 90.8%
2. Kingdom Hearts 87.0%
3. Final Fantasy X-2 86.3%
4. Final Fantasy XI 85.3%

PS1
1. Chrono Cross 93.0%
2. Vagrant Story 92.5%
3. Final Fantasy VII 92.2
4. Final Fantasy IX 92.1%
5. Final Fantasy VIII 89.8%
6. Final Fantasy Anthology 88.3%
7. Final Fantasy Chronicles 88.2%

They should release more collections!
 
krypt0nian said:
Ibut I'll never understand the FFX-2 hate.

What is there not to understand... the game sucked... badly...
 
Merging with your biggest competitor is what is wrong with Square.

The Enix and Square rivalry was beneficial to both companies because it pressured them to release quality games in a timely manner.

But I think the merger is more of a symptom, and not a cause.. The era of quirky little Square games is pretty much over. The market does not seem to be receptive to such games anymore =(
 
argon said:
Merging with your biggest competitor is what is wrong with Square.

The Enix and Square rivalry was beneficial to both companies because it pressured them to release quality games in a timely manner.

Merge? hahah you mean bought? right? because Enix runs that company.. Square isn't the same Square because they are Enix...
 
Blackace said:
What is there not to understand... the game sucked... badly...
Yeah, seriously. I hated FFX the first time I played it (much like FF8), but the second time, I really liked it. I was being too picky in what I expected (much like FF8). So after beating FFX again, I was like "wow, what an awesome story and ending." I quickly went out and bought FFX-2. Popped it in... WTF. After that awesome ending that left awesome possibilities for a sequel... this is what we got? :lol What a trainwreck! We go from a serious cinematic ending, Yuna coming off as being one of the most distinguished FF characters ever, to her dressed up like a slut and singing pop songs. RIGHT.
 
Square Enix did NOTHING well this generation. FFX was a big dissapointment :/

Still, I'm hoping for FF12... FF9 was released after the PS2 was out, right? So what's so bad about FF12 releasing 2006-2007?
 
Diablos said:
Waste of $50. You just reminded me, I need to put that on eBay. Not that I'll get my $50 back, but hey, $5 or $10 is better than nothing. :p

WTF?

Credibility -1934324879205894574817580497580497589042175849025etc....
 
Solid said:
Titles over 85% at Gamerankings.

PS2
1. Final Fantasy X 90.8%
2. Kingdom Hearts 87.0%
3. Final Fantasy X-2 86.3%

PS1
1. Chrono Cross 93.0%
2. Vagrant Story 92.5%
3. Final Fantasy IX 92.1%
4. Final Fantasy VIII 89.8%
5. Final Fantasy Anthology 88.3%
6. Final Fantasy Chronicles 88.2%

They should release more collections!

Final Fantasy 7 is at 92.2% which brings the PS1 total to 7.
 
Square Enix took this generation to experiment with other platforms besides focusing specifically on the PS2.

They got behind mobile gaming and online gaming initiatives... of course that's going to take away from the amt of platform titles that come out...
 
SatelliteOfLove said:
Mistwalker studios FTW.

Yeah.. but they need to make some games first before I start pimping them...
 
Enix bought Square, huh? I thought it was the other way around. Or at the very least, they did a legitimate "merge" in that no company is more powerful than the other, they act as one. Looks like they are, but Enix is leading the parade. What a shame. That explains a lot. Square has more influence globally; I'm surprised Square was so easily convinced to merge.

Isn't Mistwalker making games for 360 only?
 
What Mistwalker has shown looks like crap anyway. Also Uematsu sucks now so I doubt he'll do much better with a small team and some guy who wants to make his games emotional.
 
I agree wholeheartedly, Diablos.

Square hasn't released anything near the quality of Vagrant Story or even Chrono Cross this generation, and Enix hasn't released anything near the quality of Valkyrie Profile...but that's more Tri-Ace than anything else.

FFX had some strong points, FFXI is supposed to be a good MMORPG (But I've never played it), Radiata Stories was fun to play (at least I'm enjoying it), and DQVIII looks to be the RPG of the year, but it seems Atlus has been releasing some pretty awesome RPGS on a more rapid basis, what with DDS 1 + 2, SMT:N, etc.

Now that I think about it, this whole gen has been pretty lackluster for the genre for me, at least from the East.
 
Diablos said:
Enix bought Square, huh? I thought it was the other way around. Or at the very least, they did a legitimate "merge" in that no company is more powerful than the other, they act as one. Looks like they are, but Enix is leading the parade. What a shame. That explains a lot. Square has more influence globally; I'm surprised Square was so easily convinced to merge.

Isn't Mistwalker making games for 360 only?

Enix bought them... they were wounded after the movie bombed so badly.. Enix swooped them up..
 
I hated everything Square did this gen, including and especially FFX. I was a huge Square fan in the SNES days, still a big fan in the PSone days (although not liking FF8 or FF9 so much) but they lost me this gen. I can't see myself buying a Square game based on hype and reputation again. I'll rent all their new releases first.
 
Duderz said:
but it seems Atlus has been releasing some pretty awesome RPGS on a more rapid basis, what with DDS 1 + 2, SMT:N, etc.

Depends if you're a masochist or not. Do you like nails driven through your nipples? Then chances are SMT:N is the game for you!

DDS1 was alright but nothing fun. Fun games usually don't constantly shove random battles in your face and then reward you with one cutscene 10 hours later.
 
Holy shit what a horrible thread.

One good game this gen? Kingdom Hearts is trash? You officially lose.

Never mind that FFX-2 is good, but not everyone likes it for whatever reason. It's a very NOT serious, but fun, RPG.

FFXI: hate it or love it. But considering it's very popular and got good reviews, I'm going to say it goes in the "good" category. And I don't even like it.

FFTA, while generally hated here I think, was a pretty good game. I replayed it recently and it's fun. No where near the awesomeness of FFT, but a good portable game. KH:CoM is good too.

Plus we still have FFXII, DQ8, and KH2 within the next 10 months. I'd say it's pretty good to be a Square (Enix) fan right about now.

But yeah, they definitely were BETTER last gen. A lot better. This happens to all companies. Capcom was in a state of "What's wrong with them" a while back. Then they managed to SAVE some of their biggest franchises in the past year: Mega Man X, Resident Evil, Devil May Cry, not to mention the other good stuff they've done.

Don't worry about it, they're fine. :P Go get DQ8 and KH 2 this winter and you'll be happy (if you don't suck).
 
Wow, Diablos, you just gave us every Square-related thread in one!

-KH sux
-FFX-2 sux
-SE sux in general
-FFXII should be put on PS3 using pixie magic
-Enix who?

NAISU SHOT
 
Blackace said:
Enix bought them... they were wounded after the movie bombed so badly.. Enix swooped them up..
Damn. I never thought about that. The movie took like, what, five years to make? And it definitely did bomb. They never should've made it. Amazing what one failure can do to a company that had so much success. Are you sure this is the primary reason?

I'm surprised Sony didn't buy Square.

What has Square's team been reduced to? Sakaguchi and Uematsu are gone, right? No wonder nothing ever happened with Chrono. :(

This is all really kind of sad. Square was on top of the world during the SNES and PSX days.
I have a bad feeling about this though. I bet after FFXII the "Square" team will continue to shrink and be replaced by Enix people... and they'll try to still make a FF that way.
 
Blackace said:
Enix bought them... they were wounded after the movie bombed so badly.. Enix swooped them up..

They lost about $150 million because of that movie and Sony bought 18% stake of the company after the disaster :P and that deal was worth $120 million.

The main reason why Enix bought Square was because of rising game development costs.
 
Diablos said:
Damn. I never thought about that. The movie took like, what, five years to make? And it definitely did bomb. They never should've made it. Amazing what one failure can do to a company that had so much success. Are you sure this is the primary reason?

I'm surprised Sony didn't buy Square.

What has Square's team been reduced to? Sakaguchi and Uematsu are gone, right? No wonder nothing ever happened with Chrono. :(

This is all really kind of sad. Square was on top of the world during the SNES and PSX days.
I have a bad feeling about this though. I bet after FFXII the "Square" team will continue to shrink and be replaced by Enix people... and they'll try to still make a FF that way.

Sony tried to buy... actually Sony owned a big chunk of them 18 to 20%,.. then Enix.. scooped thme up..
 
Uematsu's compositions for Advent Children were up to his standard, IMO.

Sakaguchi has been so far out of the loop that I wouldn't count him out until his first games for Mistwalker.

Mitsuda did most of the music for Trigger and Cross anyway. And I agree that he would be the better choice over Uematsu.
 
Duderz said:
Uematsu's compositions for Advent Children were up to his standard, IMO.

Exactly. His standard of suckage. AC is pretty much what I was referring to - total failure. Good job ripping songs from FF7 Piano Collections and The Black Mages and not doing much of your own damn compositions. Also the rock in a lot of parts sounded amateur-ish.
 
Blackace said:
Sony tried to buy... actually Sony owned a big chunk of them 18 to 20%,.. then Enix.. scooped thme up..
Ok, right. But Sony is worth more than Enix could ever fathom. So in effect Sony "scooping up" Square should have been a drop in the bucket and much more challenging for Enix to undertake.
 
DarknessTear said:
Sakaguchi and Uematsu lost their touch. If a Chrono game was made it would be better off with Masato Kato and Mitsuda anyway.

Uematsu's AC stuff was terrific. Don't write the guy off yet.
 
Diablos said:
Ok, right. But Sony is worth more than Enix could ever fathom. So in effect Sony "scooping up" Square should have been a drop in the bucket and much more challenging for Enix to undertake.

Worth more.. and having the money are two different things.. now Sony owns abut 9%
 
so the spirits within bombed that hard? oh man, makes you wonder why they put so much effort in to the dvd. it got loads of extras and 2 discs.. i was under the impression movies that did bad in theatres didnt get this treatment?
 
Solid said:
so the spirits within bombed that hard? oh man, makes you wonder why they put so much effort in to the dvd. it got loads of extras and 2 discs.. i was under the impression movies that did bad in theatres didnt get this treatment?

They tried their damnest to get every drop of cash they could from the movie. Hence the extras.
 
Blackace said:
Worth more.. and having the money are two different things.. now Sony owns abut 9%
So you're telling me Enix has more money to spend than Sony? If they could pour all of that money into PS3 development... then seriously... buying Square should have been a cakewalk.

I'm gonna say something that might sound stupid, but Sony should just buy Square-Enix and set them straight. They know the western audience and many Japanese gamers want games like FF and Chrono more.
 
Diablos said:
What has Square's team been reduced to? Sakaguchi and Uematsu are gone, right? No wonder nothing ever happened with Chrono. :(

Why does Sakaguchi always get so much credit? The last FF related thing that guy directed was TSW which did damage to Square.

Anyway Chrono Trigger was directed by Kitase. Sakaguchi and Horii were just supervisors on it.
 
I agree with pretty much everything Diablos said. Square has been irrelevant to me this generation. I only own FFX and KH this gen. In contrast, I own nearly 15 Square titles for my PS1. Quite a change. :P

P.S. Kingdom Hearts is a disgrace to the Disney name. It's just shit.
 
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