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[Duderz]

"Exactly. His standard of suckage. AC is pretty much what I was referring to - total failure. Good job ripping songs from FF7 Piano Collections and The Black Mages and not doing much of your own damn compositions. Also the rock in a lot of parts sounded amateur-ish."

I guess a difference of opinion, here. I thought that the music was the movie's strongest point by far. But, I can definitely see the amatuer-sih part. One-Winged Angel sounded a little silly, but having heard it in More Friends, it sounded much better.

Let me put it this way: I hated the FFVII soundtrack because of the 8-bit quality synth, but everytime I hear FFVII Piano Collections or orchestrated, it just sounds so much better.

 

[ikalugar]

FF11 is a really well made and polished game whether you like the style or not, and I am a big fan of FF: Crystal Chronicles too. Those are two games that are somewhat out of the ordinary for square. If FF12 turns out good and we get a Mana game or two I think it will be a quality stretch of games.

 

[Blackace]

So you're telling me Enix has more money to spend than Sony? If they could pour all of that money into PS3 development... then seriously... buying Square should have been a cakewalk.

I am telling you what happened.. if it doesn't fit within your reality there is not much I can tell you...

 

[Solid]

They tried their damnest to get every drop of cash they could from the movie. Hence the extras.

ah akey, thats what i thought. well they got me to buy it

and yeah the movie sucked (i actually feel asleep the first time i saw it), but somehow i still feel proud over the dvd. ff-whore i guess

 

[RevenantKioku]

Depends if you're a masochist or not. Do you like nails driven through your nipples? Then chances are SMT:N is the game for you!

DDS1 was alright but nothing fun. Fun games usually don't constantly shove random battles in your face and then reward you with one cutscene 10 hours later.

You try to rip FFX and SMT:N new ones, even rag on the DQ series a bunch, yet what do you favor RPG wise? Wild ARMs?

 

[Diablos]

Why does Sakaguchi always get so much credit? The last FF related thing that guy directed was TSW which did damage to Square.

Anyway Chrono Trigger was directed by Kitase. Sakaguchi and Horii were just supervisors on it.

Well, let me clarify. I know they weren't key roles in the development of those games. But what I'm trying to say is that if THEY are gone, you can bet a lot of the people that contributed to games like Chrono Cross are gone as well.

I am telling you what happened.. if it doesn't fit within your reality there is not much I can tell you...

I'm not arguing with you, I'm just trying to figure out WHY Sony was unable to buy Square. I can't understand how they could have less money available to buy them, whereas Enix had more. It just makes no sense. Sony is one of the biggest corporations in the world. Enix makes Dragon Quest.

Had it not been for Square there's a good chance Sony would not be where they are today. I seriously think FF7 is the spark that ignited the explosion that is their ongoing victory in the console market.

 

[DarknessTear]

You try to rip FFX and SMT:N new ones, even rag on the DQ series a bunch, yet what do you favor RPG wise? Wild ARMs?

Wtf? When did I rip FFX? You are one confused person. And yes, Wild ARMs is better than both of those but only personally.

 

[Jonnyram]

Why does Sakaguchi always get so much credit? The last FF related thing that guy directed was TSW which did damage to Square.

"Now that Sakaguchi is making games for the 360, he must suck!"

Sakaguchi was probably not allowed to touch anything after TSW bombed so hard. It's about time we saw what he is capable of. You can't just brush the entire FF series under the carpet as some kind of fluke.

 

[DarknessTear]

"Now that Sakaguchi is making games for the 360, he must suck!"

Sakaguchi was probably not allowed to touch anything after TSW bombed so hard. It's about time we saw what he is capable of. You can't just brush the entire FF series under the carpet as some kind of fluke.

Hay guys we all lived together in the same orphanage and didn't notice each other during our travels. :lol

 

[Diablos]

Sakaguchi-san going to 360 exclusively is a dumb move, IMO.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Wtf? When did I rip FFX? You are one confused person. And yes, Wild ARMs is better than both of those but only personally.

Eh, guess you didn't rag on FFX. My slip up. Still, MegaTen dumps all over WA in so many ways it's silly. But that's neither here nor there.

Hay guys we all lived together in the same orphanage and didn't notice each other during our travels. :lol

Which was well explained in the scope of the game world. If you don't like it that's one thing, but it's not like they just pulled the bit out of their asses with no reasoning.

 

[DarknessTear]

As far as I know the old guy has plans on doing shit for other consoles too.

Eh, guess you didn't rag on FFX. My slip up. Still, MegaTen dumps all over WA in so many ways it's silly. But that's neither here nor there.

Oh sure it does. My mistake. I guess games that aren't fun are way too cool for school amirite?

 

[Blackace]

Sakaguchi-san going to 360 exclusively is a dumb move, IMO.

Sony should just buy him!

 

[Jonnyram]

Hay guys we all lived together in the same orphanage and didn't notice each other during our travels. :lol

Scenario Writer (Square Co., Ltd.) Kazushige Nojima

Sakaguchi-san going to 360 exclusively is a dumb move, IMO.

He's making a DS game too

 

[Diablos]

No way.

Sony should have bought Square before all of this happened, is what I'm trying to say.
They could buy Squeenix now, but even then it wouldn't be like it used to.

 

[Prince of Space]

Hay guys we all lived together in the same orphanage and didn't notice each other during our travels.

Um, what's your point? Sakaguchi had almost nothing to do with FFVIII.

 

[Solid]

Sakaguchi-san going to 360 exclusively is a dumb move, IMO.

dont worry, he'll come crawling back. they all do

 

[DarknessTear]

Scenario Writer (Square Co., Ltd.) Kazushige Nojima

Well as far as I know he evaluated this crap.

 

[Doom_Bringer]

He's making a DS game too

That game probably got canned! We only saw some art from it and haven't heard about in months...

 

[Diablos]

dont worry, he'll come crawling back. they all do

He can't afford to crawl, he has to make a mad dash.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Oh sure it does. My mistake. I guess games that aren't fun are way too cool for school amirite?

Different tastes. You obviously dislike MegaTen and DQ series, but they both have the top tier battle systems in my mind, and I really find that fun. OMG TEH HORROS.

 

[psycho_snake]

Waste of $50. You just reminded me, I need to put that on eBay. Not that I'll get my $50 back, but hey, $5 or $10 is better than nothing.

Diablos, I had quite a bit of respect for you, but you have lost all that now! KH is one of the best PS2 games out there. The thing that is wrong with Square-enix is that they have yet to release KH2, which by the looks of it will be even better than the original and thats a hard task to accomplish

 

[Blackace]

No way.

Sony should have bought Square before all of this happened, is what I'm trying to say.
They could buy Squeenix now, but even then it wouldn't be like it used to.

They can't buy them.. hahah they couldn't before. and they tried... oh they tried.. now they really can't buy them.. Enix would never let it happen.. Sony doesn't have the money laying around to buy them.. I don't know how many ways I can tell you that they can't buy them, but they can't buy them..

 

[SolidSnakex]

"Now that Sakaguchi is making games for the 360, he must suck!"

Sakaguchi was probably not allowed to touch anything after TSW bombed so hard. It's about time we saw what he is capable of. You can't just brush the entire FF series under the carpet as some kind of fluke.

I've never liked Sakaguchi's games. It has nothing to do where he went to, it has to do with him being overrated.

You can't really blame Square for not wanting him to touch anything after what he did with TSW. Although if you take that away, between 1992 (FFV) and 2001 (TSW) he didn't direct anything either.

 

[Diablos]

Blackace: You must know something I don't. Like, specifically, how Enix has more money "laying around" for buying other companies than Sony.

 

[Prince of Space]

KH was a very poorly executed idea. Sure, it looks great but DAMN did the level design and combat suck.

KHII looks to be improving on these (at least from the impressions and the E3 demo I played) but it's got a good ways to go.

Like, specifically, how Enix has more money "laying around" for buying other companies than Sony.

Dragon Quest.

 

[bob_arctor]

Just starting playing this, for the 1st time, just a week ago:

FFII SNES is my favorite traditional RPG, then Skies Of Arcadia. Does this top both? For years I heard it was so great (usually the battle was between this and Chrono Trigger for "best" among fans). So far I'm really digging it. I just met Edward (and his cheezy come-on's heh). Graphically, it's awesome, and while the music so far hasn't grabbed me like the FFII soundtrack, I'm sure it's just a matter of time.

 

[Blackace]

Blackace: You must know something I don't. Like, specifically, how Enix has more money "laying around" for buying other companies than Sony.

Enix didn't have to produce PS2 hardware as well as a number of other products that don't turn a high gross margin.. true Sony is worth a lot of money but they don't have access to that money because it is what the company is worth.. Sony isn't turning any heads with their gross margin that's for sure..

 

[Ceb]

Square Enix are doing pretty well financially nowadays. However, their current strategy isn't good for us gamers. The reasons:

1) "Three pillars" bullshit basically ensures that only FF, DQ and KH games get high budgets.
2) "Convergence" is good for the economy, but I'd rather take one high quality game product instead of many related ones.
3) Mobile games can suck it.
4) Waste of talent. FFXI has locked down Tanaka, for example. And why the hell is Tokita only doing Hanjuku games?

 

[Blackace]

Dragon Quest.

BINGO!! Someone did their homework

7 sold one million copies in a week.. and look at 7 do you think they made a little money form that?

 

[jett]

I've never liked Sakaguchi's games. It has nothing to do where he went to, it has to do with him being overrated.

You can't really blame Square for not wanting him to touch anything after what he did with TSW. Although if you take that away, between 1992 (FFV) and 2001 (TSW) he didn't direct anything either.

You know, that's not exactly fair. For example, between 1986 and 1996, Miyamoto didn't "direct" anything. And ever since Mario 64, he hasn't directed shit either. Just because they weren't credited with the title of director doesn't mean they weren't heavily involved in their games.

 

[RevenantKioku]

BINGO!! Someone did their homework

7 sold one million copies in a week.. and look at 7 do you think they made a little money form that?

DQ7's budget was about 2 nut-kicking hookers and an apple pie if I'm not mistaken.

 

[jett]

DQ7 rocks, bitches. :\

 

[Diablos]

Square Enix are doing pretty well financially nowadays. However, their current strategy isn't good for us gamers. The reasons:

1) "Three pillars" bullshit basically ensures that only FF, DQ and KH games get high budgets.

And this is what sucks. The days of Chrono, Parasite Eve, FFT, etc. are over.
It's a shame. I have a feeling we will never see these games again.
And yes, Square-Enix can stop making games for mobile devices. What a waste.

 

[soundwave05]

I don't know if it has to do with Sakaguchi leaving or not, but Square just hasn't been the same this generation.

During the SNES and Playstation era they had this ... "aura" about them. Everytime a new Squaresoft game came out you took notice, even with games like Parasite Eve which were flawed but still interesting.

Now all Sqaure does is Final Fantasy, and they've taken the series into a more generic direction ... can we lose the teenage metrosexual look and all the fruity colors? Even the new Zelda is more sombre/dark looking than Final Fantasy XII.

 

[RevenantKioku]

DQ7 rocks, bitches. :\

Oh, I loved DQ7. But I'm playing DQ4r right now, and even though it uses the same engine, it still feels like more money was put into it than 7.

 

[SolidSnakex]

You know, that's not exactly fair. For example, between 1986 and 1996, Miyamoto didn't "direct" anything. And ever since Mario 64, he hasn't directed shit either. Just because they weren't credited with the title of director doesn't mean they weren't heavily involved in their games.

Possibly, but we always hear that Miyamoto is still very involved with Nintendo games, the same can't be said about Sakaguchi. It just seemed like he was just "there". Especially after TSW.

 

[jett]

Possibly, but we always hear that Miyamoto is still very involved with Nintendo games, the same can't be said about Sakaguchi. It just seemed like he was just "there". Especially after TSW.

After TSW he was unofficially "retired". But before that he was certainly involved in the games he produced.

 

[Ceb]

You know, that's not exactly fair. For example, between 1986 and 1996, Miyamoto didn't "direct" anything. And ever since Mario 64, he hasn't directed shit either. Just because they weren't credited with the title of director doesn't mean they weren't heavily involved in their games.

OK, let's take a fair look at his role at Square then...

Overlooked the development of FFVI. This was most likely his one and only real "mentor" role in the series.

Came up with a couple of story concepts for FFVII, collected easy money.

Came up with the idea for Parasite Eve (?). Overlooked the development.

Didn't have anything to do with FFVIII.

Came up with some basic story concepts for FFIX. Did some bullshit "return of Sakaguchi" promo tours for game journos.

Didn't have anything to do with FFX.

 

[jett]

Like I said, his work at Square pretty much ended after TSW (technically FF7 was the last game he was seriously involved with ). I'm not saying he should take ALL the credit(btw I think Miyamoto is guilty of that ), but it's not like he did jacksquat before FF7/TSW.

 

[Razoric]

Isn't Mistwalker only exclusive throught the first 2 RPGs after then anything goes? Or are they officially a second party company to 360?

 

[Gaia Theory]

Sakaguchi-san going to 360 exclusively is a dumb move, IMO.

He is not exclusive to the Xbox360. His studio is also working on DS titles.

He has no allegiance to any manufacturer, his studio is independent - meaning they can choose who they develop for and to what extent they are involved.

 

[Willy Wanka]

Isn't Mistwalker only exclusive throught the first 2 RPGs after then anything goes? Or are they officially a second party company to 360?

They are only exclusive for these two games. I'm sure most of the anti-MS brigade will like Sakaguchi and appreciate his talent again when he is back making games on non MS hardware :lol

 

[RevenantKioku]

They are only exclusive for these two games. I'm sure most of the anti-MS brigade will like Sakaguchi and appreciate his talent again when he is back making games on non MS hardware :lol

I'm pretty sure there "exclusivity" extends only towards the design of the games. I think the development was in the hands of one MS studio. Not entirely promising. (I forget who that studio was, but they made only some worthless tripe prior.)

 

[SolidSnakex]

I'm pretty sure there "exclusivity" extends only towards the design of the games. I think the development was in the hands of one MS studio. Not entirely promising. (I forget who that studio was, but they made only some worthless tripe prior.)

Blue Dragon is being made by Artoon who's previously made Pinobee and Blinx.

 

[soundwave05]

I think merging with Enix was a bad idea for Square creatively.

Now all they do is schedule their fiscal calendar around when the next Final Fantasy is coming out or the next Dragon Quest is coming out and just alternate.

Also I do think Sakaguchi, like him or not, is a pretty ambitious guy. When he left, it seemed like Square lost some of their "balls".

 

[Blackace]

I think merging with Enix was a bad idea for Square creatively.

didn't have a choice...

 

[Vieo]

I liked the old Squaresoft and Enix better. IMO, Square is all about it's bread and butter now; Final Fantasy. Final Fantasy movies, Final Fantasy spinoffs, Final Fantasy ports, and Final Fantasy MMORPGs. And you'll see the occasional KH game pop up here and there. The old Square, SNES - PSOne, was pretty fantastic. Though, these days they're whoring out the FF name and slapping it on anything. I also liked Enix back in it's SNES days when we'd see their action-RPGs.

Although, I don't think I can blame them too much. With the rising cost of game development and casual gamers pretty much treating anything from Square that doesn't have the FF branding on it like stale bread, I think they've become afraid of taking risks. Although, they lose points in my book for not at least trying to develop new franchises on GBA/DS which could later be moved from portable to console as big budget titles with lot's of FMV that they love dearly. Instead, what do we get on GBA/DS? FF ports, FF spinoffs, KH, DQ, and a very shitty Sword of Mana. Revolution isn't even out yet and already a FF spinoff is in the works. I'd rather have Secret of Evermore 2, you assclowns.

Squarenix. What a joke.

 

[Jonnyram]

I don't think people quite grasp the difference in development costs between a PS1 RPG and a PS2 RPG. We're also seeing a significantly smaller game market now than back then. You can't really blame Square for being conservative with what they make, especially after the TSW bomb right at the start of this gen. Enix saved their asses, and if they hadn't merged, Enix would have essentially kicked Square's ass this year and last... DQ8, Grandia III, Radiata Stories, Drag-on Dragoon 1 & 2 would all have been Enix games for starters.

The other thing to consider is that Square has been undergoing a lot of reshuffling this gen, further prolonged by the merger last year. They'll get back on the right track, eventually.

 

[Scott]

Output from both sides of Square Enix:

Square Side (Entire Generation)
• All-Star Pro Wrestling (PS2)
• All-Star Pro Wrestling II (PS2)
• All-Star Pro Wrestling III (PS2)
• Before Crisis: Final Fantasy VII (Mobile)
• Blue Wing Blitz (WSC)
• Brave Shot (Mobile)
• Brave Shot II (Mobile)
• Chocobo no Fushigi Dungeon (WSC)
• Code Age: Brawls (Mobile)
• Code Age: Commanders (PS2)
• Dice de Chocobo (GBA)
• Dirge of Cerberus: Final Fantasy VII (PS2)
• Driving Emotion Type-S (PS2)
• EverQuest II (PC) (Japan Only)
• Final Fantasy (WSC)
• Final Fantasy i (Mobile)
• Final Fantasy I & II: Dawn of Souls (GBA)
• Final Fantasy II (Mobile)
• Final Fantasy II (WSC)
• Final Fantasy IV (GBA)
• Final Fantasy IV (WSC)
• Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children (DVD, UMD)
• Final Fantasy VII: Snowboarding (Mobile)
• Final Fantasy X (PS2)
• Final Fantasy X: International (PS2)
• Final Fantasy X-2 (PS2)
• Final Fantasy X-2: International + Last Mission (PS2)
• Final Fantasy XI: Online (PC, PS2)
• Final Fantasy XI: Online: Chains of Promathia (PC, PS2)
• Final Fantasy XI: Online: Rise of the Zilart (PC, PS2)
• Final Fantasy XI: Online: Treasures of Aht Urhgan (PC, PS2)
• Final Fantasy XII (PS2)
• Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles (GC)
• Final Fantasy Tactics Advance (GBA)
• Front Mission (WSC)
• Front Mission 2089 (Mobile)
• Front Mission IV (PS2)
• Front Mission V (PS2)
• Front Mission Online (PC, PS2)
• Hanjuku Eiyuu (WSC)
• Hanjuku Eiyuu IV: 7 Nin no Hanjuku Eiyuu (PS2)
• Hanjuku Eiyuu DS: Egg Monster Heroes (DS)
• Hanjuku Eiyuu Tai 3D (PS2)
• Gekikuukan Pro Baseball: The End of the Century 1999 (PS2)
• Kingdom Hearts (PS2)
• Kingdom Hearts: Final Mix (PS2)
• Kingdom Hearts II (PS2)
• Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories (GBA)
• Makaitoshi SaGa (WSC)
• Musashi: Mobile Samurai (Mobile)
• Musashi: Samurai Legend (PS2)
• Nichibeikan Pro Baseball: Final League (PS2)
• Romancing SaGa (PS2)
• Romancing SaGa (WSC)
• Sword of Mana (GBA)
• The Bouncer (PS2)
• UNLIMITED Saga (PS2)
• World Fantasista (PS2)

Enix Side (Post Merger Only)
• Actraiser (Mobile)
• Aleste (Mobile)
• Dragon Quest i (Mobile)
• Dragon Quest II (Mobile)
• Dragon Quest V (PS2)
• Dragon Quest VIII: Journey of the Cursed King (PS2)
• Dragon Quest & Final Fantasy in Itadaki Street Special (PS2)
• Drakengard (PS2)
• Drakengard II: love red, ambivalence black (PS2)
• Fantasy Earth: The Ring of Dominion (PC)
• Full Metal Alchemist & the Broken Angel (PS2)
• Full Metal Alchemist II: Curse of the Crimson Elixir (PS2)
• Full Metal Alchemist III: Heiress to the Gods (PS2)
• Grandia III (PS2)
• Heavy Metal Thunder (PS2)
• Radiata Stories (PS2)
• Slime Morimori: Dragon Quest (GBA)
• Slime Morimori II: Dragon Quest (DS)
• Star Ocean: 'Till the End of Time (PS2)

Few disclaimers:
• I limited Enix's output to post-merger stuff to keep the focus more on the Square side of the company.
• Since handhelds don't exactly have set "generations," I just limited things starting with the Wonderswan Color, and ending with the last of the 2005 releases, Slime Morimori II.

Other than that, I put the list together fairly quickly, so there may be some mistakes (especially in Japanese titles), a few missing games, and a few Mobile titles in the wrong column (I have no idea which side makes half of these). Feel free to throw some corrections out there, or add onto the list if I forget anything.

After waiting all of this time... what's another year or two? I'm serious! FFXII will be released shortly before, during, or possibly AFTER the PS3's release. That's ridiculous.

And? Final Fantasy IX was in the same situation, as it was released after the PS2 in both territories... Far as I can tell, it did fine, so what's the problem with FFXII repeating that?

The next Chrono was one of my most anticipated PS2 games. I guess the guy that said "see you on the PS2" during the developer's ending in Chrono Cross is a liar.

Yes, no Chrono Break is a very big disappointment, but with a few staff members moving on, and that Division being busy with PlayOnline, Final Fantasy XI, and their 2007 MMO, it's not surprising that we didn't see anything.

And given how much money that Division brings in, I'm thinking Square Enix will keep them focused solely on PlayOnline for next generation, as well.

Square got their ass kicked this gen, IMO. Games like MGS have dethroned FF as THE game to get excited for.

What.

The square side of Enix is a big disappointment. At least they found new ways to milk FFVII.

Newsflash: Polymorphic Content (aka: "new ways to milk FFVII") = Enix's idea.

If you're going to bitch about something, at least put the blame where it really belongs.


All of that said, I'll throw my opinion into this as well:

I definitely agree that SquareSoft's output has been in a decline this generation, but I don't agree with everybody on how much of a decline it has been. I mean, The Spirits Within bombing, the fiasco that is this so-called "merger" with Enix, and the focus on Mobile and Polymorphic Content (though you can shove these in the "fiasco" bit, as these are from the Enix side), etc have certainly hurt the company in more ways than one.

The new content focuses, especially, have to be the biggest stickling points for us, the gamers. While PlayOnline, SqEx Mobile, Polymorphic Content, and the "Three Pillars" focus are fantastic moves for Square Enix's pocketbook, all they mean to gamers is "Less original content." So instead of Kitase/Nomura focusing on bringing back something like Parasite Eve, they're focused on FFVII and KH; instead of Chrono titles, we get a Division dedicated to POL; instead of a handful of new seperate Mana, Code Age, etc games, we get single game concepts broken up into a dozen projects, etc etc... It's frustrating, no doubt, and to call it disappointing would be the understatement of the century.

All that said, like I stated in the first place, I don't agree with how drastic this decline has been. Everybody saying things like: "Square Enix is worthless," "They haven't released a single worthwhile game this generation," "The only good game they've brought out was FFX," etc... In my eyes? All exaggerated. I mean, sure, their output pales in comparison to last gen's, but how in the hell does that suddenly translate to there being nothing worthwhile from the company at all?

Oh right, it doesn't.