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Why Dino Crisis remake simply doesn't make sense and what Capcom needs to remake instead.

Have you played and finished Onimusha and Dino Crisis games?


  • Total voters
    53
  • Poll closed .
I've played and finished Ghost of Tsushima, it was the most boring Assassin's Creed clone I've every played in my life. What Onimusha has is way more interesting and I already explained why it sort of didn't worked so well cuz of the very simplistic plot and rushed beginning, which can be fixes easily and drasticaly in remake.
Your opening post should have just stated that you want an Onimusha Remake more than any Dino Crisis Remake Capcom can put out and asked for vindication. Clearly with statements like this and the statement of your desire for outdated fixed camera angles (which cannot be bypassed with gameplay innovations) you do not care about what has more mass appeal.
 
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VulcanRaven

Member
There is literally no one who wants a Dino Crisis remake outside of these forums and that weird guy over at Reee. Games were just a RE asset swap. Capcom has 0 incentive to remake any of those games tbh.
Jurassic World movies are popular so I'm sure there is demand dinosaur games.

I think they are more than RE asset swaps. Dino Crisis 1 didn't have pre-rendered backrounds like RE games at the time.
 
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Aion002

Member
Thank you for this. I do agree with you that Dino Crisis will be much easier to Remake, cuz at least 50% of the work they already done in RE remakes - combat and everything else you do gameplay-wise. But that's the problem, it's just going to be a modern and much more action oriented RE clone with dinos just like it was a clone of RE with dinos way back when it was released originally. I mean, I get that for some it'll be fine and it's fine, but I think Capcom is done with it's just fine when it comes to their big releases and it's a different company now.

Is it a lot more fun to challenge yourself though? To try and figure out how to make something better and more complex? Onimusha is the right project for this and no, I don't agree with though who think that there's plenty of Onimusha like games right now, cuz there aren't any, there's plenty of bad or mediocre Assassin's Creed and Dark Souls clones made by Team Ninja (and they're continue making them), as well as one extremely well made and frankly amazing Sekiro, but Onimusha is different than all of them and is much closer to RE actually, but in medieval Japan and with it's own unique stuff RE simply don't have.

I haven't seen any attempts to clone Onimusha as well, do a similar combat system with the gauntlet, magic powers and stuff which is so much fun to use and reminds me of golden years of God of War before modern BS was released. There's no need to turn Onimusha into a Souls-like, cuz it already has everything in needs combat-wise (Warlords had deflection system long before From have made Sekiro btw), they just need to figure out how to make old camera perspective work with the combat they already have to minimize camera issues, add a few more things to the combat which they couldn't back then, modernize the control scheme and make it much less tanky and the stuff I already talked about in my post.

Idk, I just can't see Capcom going for a much safer routh instead of challenging themselves creatively after what they did with RE remakes. I mean, Dragon's Dogma 2 sort of looks a bit safe and way too simmilar to what original game was, but no one have played the game yet to say that Capcom haven't done anything to make everything what original game did very badly (side quests, character development and story) much better, so we have to hold off from from judging the game on that front until we can actually play it next year.
Yes, I agree that Onimusha is closer to RE than to Souls games. However, the old Onimusha combat doesn't "cut" anymore (yes the mechanics are good), it needs to be modernized and I don't think it's possible to do it without being inspired by From Software work (that took old mechanics, including those that were present on Onimusha and older games, to the current format), Team Ninja (Ninja Gaiden) and Santa Monica (God of War) , both had to adapt their games to the Souls standard, it's simply too popular (and good) to ignore it.

The greatest thing that FS did (gameplay wise) wasn't creating new gameplay mechanics, it was taking great gameplay mechanics and adapting them to modern gameplay standards in a way that works incredibly well.

Now, about Capcom taking the safer route... Well, I think that Pragmata is their biggest bet on a new thing, it seems like a triple A game with lots of new stuff from them. I am hoping for the best.
 

Dacvak

No one shall be brought before our LORD David Bowie without the true and secret knowledge of the Photoshop. For in that time, so shall He appear.
I voted for Dino Crisis, because we don’t need more samurai-y games, but we could always use a few extra dinosaur games.
 

Agent_4Seven

Tears of Nintendo
I read your post OP. I don't really agree with your premise, dinosaurs are always popular and the Dino Crisis setting has a high ceiling. Just because it's been totally and vastly underused by Capcom doesn't mean that potential doesn't exist. and I also think that, from an Americlap point of view, it has far more market potential than the Japanese quasi-historical setting infused with supernatural elements from Japanese folk tales.
It's not that Capcom haven't tried to do this in the past, I already said that they did in OP with DC3 and failed completely. RE5, 6 and REV2 were bad if not terrible, but have they failed as much as DC3 did back in the day? Have they? I've been there and saw everything, but even RE6 wasn't that bad as a not RE game. I just don't see how action oriented RE clone with dinos can be relevant in today's day and age, I just don't see any appeal let alone huge sales and lasting power. My movie comparison clearly showed that movie industry can get away with even more shit than the last Jurassic Park trilogy, I mean... Transformers before Bumblebee ... but gaming undustry can't sustain complete creative disasters and doesn't work like that, it can't just bet on graphics and expect great sales.

We've seen a few example of complete failures of a different kind and I won't be pointing my finger at anything specific, I'll just say that there was great concepts and with great visuals and good character work, but with bad, repetitive and boring gameplay which you can't even explain and for who it was made. At least when it comes to stupid and brainless af movies you can tell for which audience they were made, and I'm not saying that people are stupid and brainless... it's just for some let's say compelling story that makes sense, great character development and other shit like that simply doesn't matter and they just want to have fun and there's nothing wrong with that, plus it's 90 to 120 min of your time at best and not a huge time commitement, but games are completely different beasts.
After all... Ghostwire Tokyo...
Well that was a complete failure right from the start, I saw it a mile away as soon as they showed gameplay and then overall reception pretty much confirmed it. Really bad example, man, you can do better :)
Your opening post should have just stated that you want an Onimusha Remake more than any Dino Crisis Remake Capcom can put out and asked for vindication. Clearly with statements like this and the statement of your desire for outdated fixed camera angles (which cannot be bypassed with gameplay innovations) you do not care about what has more mass appeal.
I'm not against Dino Crisis remake, if they'll make one, I'll buy and try to play it, it's just it doesn't make sense to waste their time, money and tallent on a super safe RE clone but with dinos, which original Dino Crisis 100% is and remake won't be different. Also, mass appeal for action games almost killed RE, so it's for sure not a major deciding factor here I'm afraid. Also, I explained why I think the way I think and it's not just cuz I like Onimusha more that Dino Crisis, even though I do.
Jurassic World movies are popular so I'm sure there is demand dinosaur games.
They're popular for completely different reasons than the first two movies were. It's like saying that Transformers, Expendables or Resident Evil (live action) movies are popular - see what I'm getting at with this?
Yes, I agree that Onimusha is closer to RE than to Souls games. However, the old Onimusha combat doesn't "cut" anymore (yes the mechanics are good), it needs to be modernized and I don't think it's possible to do it without being inspired by From Software work (that took old mechanics, including those that were present on Onimusha and older games, to the current format), Team Ninja (Ninja Gaiden) and Santa Monica (God of War) , both had to adapt their games to the Souls standard, it's simply too popular (and good) to ignore it.

The greatest thing that FS did (gameplay wise) wasn't creating new gameplay mechanics, it was taking great gameplay mechanics and adapting them to modern gameplay standards in a way that works incredibly well.
They don't need to be inspired by From games, amongs everything else, Capcom just need to stay true to what original game did great, just like original God of War games worked way better as a game, before modern Sony turned into boring af Santa Barbara with annoying af kid which I hate with passion and decided to be inspired by something God of War didn't need at all. Original Onimusha already has everything it needs to be fun even today with all PS2 design limitations and it's short playtime, all they need to do is add even more to it, gore, dismemberment, different finishers based on where enemy is and which power or weapong you used, new powers etc. and they need to find a workaround for camera issues and make modern controls work with old camera perspectives, cuz otherwise they'll end up making DMC clone and that's not what Onimusha is and needs to be. I'm sure they can make it work and it'll take time, but all great things take time to make with passion.
Now, about Capcom taking the safer route... Well, I think that Pragmata is their biggest bet on a new thing, it seems like a triple A game with lots of new stuff from them. I am hoping for the best.
For fuckin' sure, man! Even though we can't tell what it is and can't even think or imagine what it'll be, that's a great example that clearly shows that they aren't afraid to make something completely new or be challenged during game development, that's why I think they can make amazing if not masterpiece level Onimusha remake. But Dino Crisis is going to be the safest route for them cuz there's not a lot they need to do to make it happen and it'll be much easier for them to make modern RE clone with dinos, but there's a lot more risk here and I already explained why, but you're free to disagree with me of course😌
 
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MiguelItUp

Member
I'd go the both route, honestly.

But just because there are more Onimusha games than Dino Crisis, I'd like to see what they could do with Dino Crisis.

That being said, I also wouldn't mind them returning to Onimusha either.
 
Don't really care for the series, it was cool for it's time, and a modern update would no doubt be cool too.

But I will take another game with Leon' the Professional in it.
 
Original Onimusha already has everything it needs to be fun even today with all PS2 design limitations and it's short playtime, all they need to do is add even more to it, gore, dismemberment, different finishers based on where enemy, new powers etc. and they need to find a workaround for camera issues and make modern controls work with old camera perspectives, cuz otherwise they'll end up making DMC clone and that's not what Onimusha is and needs to be. I'm sure they can make it work and it'll take time, but all great things take time to make with passion.
I guess Dawn of Dreams is not Onimusha enough for you either. Just a DMC clone...
 

Doom85

Gold Member
I think we could use more posts like this personally.

Austin Powers No GIF


I’m still mentally recovering from that Scotty guy writing a door stopper-sized book about why Chrono Trigger is apparently the most philosophically deep piece of fiction to have ever graced humanity…
 

VulcanRaven

Member
How many copies did exoprimal sell? I think you are overestimating the market for these games.
That didn't look like a normal dinosaur game. I think there is more interest for single player survival horror dinosaur games than scifi online shooters.
 
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IDKFA

I am Become Bilbo Baggins
Onimusha had a remaster. A basic one, but it's more than Dino Crisis has had.

Dino Crisis makes sense as it's resident evil, but with Dinosaurs.

Onimusha is a big departure from the RE formula and honesty it's also a little souls-like.

We need Dino Crisis to be remade!
 

NeoIkaruGAF

Gold Member
There’s a difference between a message board post and writing a mini novel. As Stephen King basically said in his book “On Writing” regarding what to do when finishing a first draft: “edit that shit down!”
Ah yes, he's definitely one to talk about that :messenger_winking:
 

Hollowpoint5557

A Fucking Idiot
I didn't read more than half of the first sentence and literally laughed out loud as I scrolled by all of it. Good for you on having the passion to write that much about literally anything. I don't think there I anything in life I care enough about to write that much.

But Dino Crisis is the answer.
 

Agent_4Seven

Tears of Nintendo
I guess Dawn of Dreams is not Onimusha enough for you either. Just a DMC clone...
I haven't played that one, but I know about it. You can clearly see camera issues which are far worse than what original game has, not only that but they're extremely similar to what modern God of War games suffering from and that's a HUGE red flag already. Old camera perspective allows you to see way more on the screen when you're in more open spaces, but then you're starting to have issues in more tight locations and it can be fixed with better enemy encounter designs, enemy placements, what Diablo and Diablo-like games are doing and even Baldur's Gate 3 - they're allowing you to see more by removing parts of environmental detail and objects closer to the character and camera. So it's not like Capcom need to reinvent the wheel here, all of the techniques to counter shit like this were available for at least 2 decades, they just need to find a way to make it work in a more complex game. Also, I don't think that Dawn of Dream should be the game in the series they need to take some inspirations from, the first two (and maybe parts of 3) is the one and only way to go here.
That didn't look like a normal dinosaur game. I think there is more interest for single player survival horror dinosaur games than scifi online shooters.
First, they need to invent survival horror game with dinos, cuz there's none and Dino Crisis games are not it, even the first one.

I guess at this point only Saber's Jurassic Park game can prove your point, but given what I know about Saber and that the next year is almost a red line for them... I would't count on them personally, even though I can't wait to finally play Space Marine 2 and their new car game looks very interesting. None of the dino games did shit for the gaming industry or for the devs for that matter over the last however many years though in modern gaming. I think if you care about dinos, you know about which games I'm talking about. Horizon games can sort of be counted as games with dinos, but could real dinos bombard you with missiles, energy blasts, giant lazers, burn you with fire while also not being giant robots? Yeah, heh, no way in hell.
 
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Doom85

Gold Member
Ah yes, he's definitely one to talk about that :messenger_winking:

Hey, he’s at least getting shit done. One of the things he emphasizes is just writing period every day, doesn’t matter if you like what your wrote after you go over it.

There was an interview with him and George R.R. Martin (Game of Thrones) together and King was saying he makes sure to write at least 1,000 words every day to stay in practice and Martin was surprised by this and said he could never do that as that would be too much as he’d not have enough time in the rest of the day to make sure he was satisfied with what he had written.

If I was King and heard that, I would have turned to Martin and said, “George, you do understand that with the first draft of a novel, I repeat, the FIRST draft, it’s okay if it has issues that can be fixed once you’ve finished said draft…right?”

Martin:

sweating key and peele GIF


Yeah, I highly doubt we’ll see those last two books come out, at least not in his lifespan. I really suspect Martin is somewhat obsessed with perfection and it messes up the traditional writing process that would make things easier for him. Even if he was close to finishing, well it was revealed most of the hated moments/scenes in the final season of the show were taken from how Martin said it would happen in the final book, so now he either has to release it knowing a lot of people are going to hate it, or redo a ton which means that shit ain’t hitting stores in any near decade.

talking george r.r. martin GIF by South Park
 

Švejk

Banned
I've had a discussion about this with my son awhile back.. To keep it short, it simply wouldn't work in the new REmake style.
To make dino fights in that style would be too slow control wise, because dinos are generally bigger and faster. It would need to be more a top down shooter or something closer to DC2 style arcade shooting.
And dinos are just not as terrifying as JP trailblazed back in the 90's. They're almost considered goofy (again?) now .. I think Capcom saw that, and changed gears and made Exoprimal.
 
Well I actually did attempt to read all of that! Although I got a bit lost along the way.

I disagree for one very big reason. Jurassic Park Box Office numbers. It's a billion dollar franchise the first of the recent ones did 1.5 billion.

The gaming world is staving for a high quality AAA Dinosaur game. If it can hit big in film it can hit big in Games too.

As for gameplay I think capcom could take alot of the ideas they used in RE2 remake and apply them to a dino game.

As long as the dinos look and sound good, are satisfying to shoot and scary that’s enough.

If the core gameplay is survival horror the shooting gameplay doesn't need to be deep as it carried by other mechanics. Resident Evil 2 remakes shooting mechanics are pretty basic but it's survival mechanics are deep and well thought.

This reminds me of Larian saying how can anyone say an AAA crpg wouldn't sell when nobody's released one.
 
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I mean, there’s some gold in there, sure, but far, far more misses than hits. That said, I would pay good money for a ‘Lawrence of Arabia’ Telltale Games, but maybe that’s just me…
Yeah sure! Spiderman was never a big hit until Insomniacs Spider-Man.

It's all about the quality and polish. A raptor in the RE Engine that animates like Jurassic Park will sell itself.

Getting there is another thing but who said it will be easy.
 

Agent_4Seven

Tears of Nintendo
Uh... Onimush HD sold well? Don't remember that
It doesn't matter, it's a 23 years old game. It's like releasing original Resident Evil 2 3-4 years before RE2R to see if it's worth doing a remake, which is stupid and pointless. It's either you're doing it, or you don't, there's no middle ground here.
 
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Gojiira

Member
Man the people throwing out ‘Resi clone’ for Dino Crisis are just utter wankers, you realise DC had a ton of innovations right? It was a very ambitious game,calling it a clone is just stupid and grossly misrepresents it. For one it had fully 3d rendered levels, not pre-rendered like RE. Second it had a tracking camera NOT static camera like RE. Third ability to move and shoot. Fourth Enemies who could track your blood and open doors….
It was a huge step forward from RE. DC2 is the game that returned to static, pretendered backgrounds.

Anyway DC1 more than deserves a remake, more so than any other Capcom franchise. For one they can push the a.i more than they have previously, Dinos using pack behaviour or using the environment around them would be incredible. Second, nothing is tenser than knowing the enemy is faster than you, it makes every encounter much more frightening which works in the games favour. The plot was already excellent, perhaps expand on the branching paths. Either way fuck OP and the ‘clone’ morons :)
 
i think they'd ruin either game if they were to remake them. I have Zero faith in capcom at this point. Leon is such a pussy in RE 2 and 4 remake.
 

IDKFA

I am Become Bilbo Baggins
Man the people throwing out ‘Resi clone’ for Dino Crisis are just utter wankers, you realise DC had a ton of innovations right? It was a very ambitious game,calling it a clone is just stupid and grossly misrepresents it. For one it had fully 3d rendered levels, not pre-rendered like RE. Second it had a tracking camera NOT static camera like RE. Third ability to move and shoot. Fourth Enemies who could track your blood and open doors….
It was a huge step forward from RE. DC2 is the game that returned to static, pretendered backgrounds.

Anyway DC1 more than deserves a remake, more so than any other Capcom franchise. For one they can push the a.i more than they have previously, Dinos using pack behaviour or using the environment around them would be incredible. Second, nothing is tenser than knowing the enemy is faster than you, it makes every encounter much more frightening which works in the games favour. The plot was already excellent, perhaps expand on the branching paths. Either way fuck OP and the ‘clone’ morons :)

People calling it a RE clone have never played it.

Onimusha is great, but it had a remaster a few years ago. Dino Crisis hasn't had any love for decades. That's why it needs to be next for the remake treatment.
 

TidusYuna

Member
No reason to argue over this one. A remake for both Dino Crisis and Onimusha will eventually be made. But since Dino Crisis was originally released first, I think they will do they Dino Crisis remake first.

But Capcom may still keep milking the Resident Evil remakes. They can still remake RE5, RE6, and Code Veronica.

It may bring joy, it may bring fear, but let us embrace whataver remake they bring.
 

bigdad2007

Member
Can I have a third option where we get some of the classic PS1 games in collections on modern platforms with QOL improvements/better textures?

I would love for example a Dino Crisis or Resident Evil collection in the vein of the Tomb Raider Trilogy that is coming out soon.

The RE remakes are fun, but they are so updated they are different games.
 

Killer8

Gold Member
Your post is far too long to read it all, so I don't know if you address any of what i'll say. The way forward with a Dino Crisis remake is a focus on distressing action. Dinosaurs are fast creatures so it makes logical sense for the action to be extremely unnerving when it happens. You know, that burst of energy when a velociraptor spots you from across the room. There should of course still be an emphasis on exploration and the slow build atmospheric downtime. I could even see some mild stealth at play (think the kitchen scene from Jurassic Park), which Capcom kind of dabbled with in the RE4 remake. When shit hits the fan though, the action should be panic inducing. That would be welcome not only because Dino Crisis 2 already set a precedent for the series moving in a more action-orientated direction, but also because creator Shinji Mikami originally envisioned the series as 'panic horror' rather than 'survival horror'.

Designing your game on the back of a couple of descriptive words like 'panic horror' can be very instructive as it basically makes a lot of the decisions for you. There is kind of little point really discussing all of the nitty gritty of what a dream DC game should be, like what gameplay mechanics we'd want or how the world is designed or whatnot. All that the designers of a prospective reboot/remake should have on their mind is "does it create panic?", and if their design creates it then they've succeeded with the game. People were highly skeptical of RE7 at first because of the first person perspective but the concerns ended up being irrelevant. The 'survival horror' spirit of the game was nailed incredibly well through its design, and despite it being a big departure for the series, it simultaneously felt more like a classic RE game than anything released since REmake. So there is room for even radical changes in a new DC as long as it keeps the same feeling.
 
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Why do people think these long ass rants are of any interest to 99% of us? They don't need to remake Dino Crisis because the RE franchise makes a lot more money, that's why.
 
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Shut0wen

Banned
I loved the series to death but i think a full blown reboot is needed then a remake, literally completed 3 years ago under 5 hours, think you could complete it in less then 6 first time but they should reboot the game and change the story so atleast they could think of doing sequels, i dont blame capcom for making the third game in outta space because the 2nd game left the series no where to go at the end, personally id rather have power stone remake or westernize canon spike
 

March Climber

Gold Member
OP wants a modernized Onimusha remake/sequel over Dino Crisis.

What OP has to accept is that the quite a bit of the GAF audience will dislike it. Why? Because it will have this camera angle:
leon_parries_plagas.gif

1S84Sc.gif


And it will have this angle because Onimusha is not Nioh, nor Rise of the Ronin, nor Ghosts of Tsushima. The fights in Onimusha are usually 1-2 enemies at a time, maybe 3-5 max, but mostly intimate fights in tight corridors.
 

Muffdraul

Member
I've bought Dino Crisis 1 twice. I've finished it zero times. I always peter out at about 75%. I did finish 2 and even 3, believe it or not. I had to play it on Easy i.e. unlimited continues, but I beat it. If you ignore the ridiculous broken combat and focus on exploring the ship and solving its transformation puzzles, it's actually fun.

Meanwhile I've finished all of the Onimusha games multiple times. New Onimusha would be great, but I'd settle for more remasters. I have no hope even for that, though.
 

Allandor

Member
I guess it just doesn't make a lot of sense. When it came out Jurassic Park was a phenomenon. Nowadays prehistoric creatures don't get that much attention. Yes, a good game, series or movie could start that again (just like the zombie years that lie behind us) but I don't think Capcom is able to start something like that.
 

yurinka

Member
(well, except maybe Ghosts 'n Goblins Resurrection, but I doubt it was a huge time, money and manpower investment for them)
It wasn't a remake, it was a new entry in the series.

Now, a lot of you can say that - Hey, Agent, but they also turned Dino Crisis into something no one asked for and almost killed the series with the third game! Doesn't it warrant another turn around? To which I say - yes, I know about what Dino Crisis 3 did, but as far as the Dino Crisis IP as a whole is concerned, it simply does not automatically justifies Dino Crisis remakes and that Capcom needs to make them (or at the very least the first one to test the waters) and you're not considering other options beyond just your selfish needs.
Action horror gmes sell, dinosaurs sell, hot red haired chick sells.

That game "action horror game with a red haired chick and dinosaurs" pitch did work back then and could perfectly work nowadays. See Horizon Zero Dawn, remove the futuristic part and replace open world with action horror reusing the RE remake engine, camera, controls, etc. Get the main story and setting, keep these 3 pillars of the game and rework everything else.

This game would sell and would get good reviews.

(Strider, Bionic Commando games, yes, even the one Grin made imho), some not so good
Bionic Commando Rearmed, the Grin one, was awesome. The 3D one was a sequel. The new Strider game wasn't a remake.

That was a spinoff reboot, not a remake.

Do you think killing stupid and boring dinos with guns will be compelling in the 2020s?
Yes, games like Ark and Horizon are super successful games.

Honestly, I can't see how you can beat the potential Onimusha
Horizon and Ark are way more successful than all Onimusha games combined. But I think an Onimusha remake would work too. 5 years ago Capcom was (pretty likely starting to) work on a "new Onimusha title" but ended being the upcoming Kunitsu-Gami: Path of the Goddess. Maybe during development they thought it was deviating too much from the original, or that they needed more new IPs.
 
blasphemous, but i wouldnt be mad about a RE engine, re4-style onimusha remake.

slow, clunky, atmospheric, and lots of melee moves/finishers.
 
Personally, I think a couple of smaller games like a new or HD remake of Darkstalkers, a “Ultra” HD edition of SFIII Alpha, Lost Planet, Dead Rising reboot in the Resident Evil universe, or maybe something out of left field like Auto Modelista!
 

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
No way in fucking he’ll I’m even reading 1/10 of that.
CWNu.gif


Seriously what’s people writing this looooong ass blog post in gaming forums? Who the f**ck was time reading all of that?

We recently got another one here…

tumblr_m9g0tsjEGv1rqfhi2o1_400.gif
 
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That's a wall of text. Honestly I like longer posts but this is too much. TL;DR basically OP wants Onimusha remake more.

I did vote on Dino Crisis, Onimusha and Okami, mentioned Code Veronica on the latest Capcop survey about reviving old IPs.

But I would want Dino Crisis the most.

They probably will do RE Code Veronica first with RE being on the top lately.

But then I would really want a DC after that. Maybe on next generation RE Engine Capcom announced. There should be improvements to the AI for Dinos to behave good- or at least better than mindless zombies. I think Dragons Dogma 2 will be the best test for this engine with different kinds of enemies than we previously had. Maybe even for Onimusha.

Anyways Onimusha got an remaster in 2019. And Dino Crisis not so much.
 
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