Support NeoGAF

[CertifiedFP]

I thought that was an alien race from the new game.

That would be the Outsiders, and their tendency to run straight into a line of Assaults with CQC Specialist upon discovery, 100% of the time.

Edit: 4 to 6? Great, they're still treating it like an rpg combat system.

Eh, the way I heard it, the change from the 20+ man headcount (IIRC) of the old games is that they wanted to make it so that each individual soldier's actions mattered much more, and death be that much more penalizing in combat. Something that can't really be felt when you have a small army deployed into each fight.

 

[Falk]

I tried to get into Xenonauts. I really did. Then I realized I'd gotten so used to 6-man squads and the cover system that Xenonauts felt like a chore each round.

I'd definitely be up for a hybrid of the two, with maybe up to 8 or 10 soldiers (sup Long War) and AP instead of the two-turn setup, but at this point I think I have better things to do with my time than move 16 guys around looking for one last sectoid on the map.

Also as simplified as hit chances/cover system are in the new XCOM, it works, and with aiming angles it works beautifully.

 

[Sober]

I tried to get into Xenonauts. I really did. Then I realized I'd gotten so used to 6-man squads and the cover system that Xenonauts felt like a chore each round.

I'd definitely be up for a hybrid of the two, with maybe up to 8 or 10 soldiers (sup Long War) and AP instead of the two-turn setup, but at this point I think I have better things to do with my time than move 16 guys around looking for one last sectoid on the map.

Also as simplified as hit chances/cover system are in the new XCOM, it works, and with aiming angles it works beautifully.

New XCOM definitely plays a lot more like a boardgame, which is honestly fine by me. You can probably mod the game .ini wise to still give you a meatgrinder-y feel if you prefer that. I just find it odd that going to smaller squads you have the 2-action turn system when it would probably work better when you're managing like a dozen or more soldiers.

 

[Fragamemnon]

I'm fine with really small squads but I want the missions tailored to them so there's a reason why you are using small squads. I would also like eight or even ten man larger operations as well.

I'd also like to move away from the A-team all the time and either into squads or have some kind of system in place that you have to use a variety of troops and not just the same six or so over and over.

 

[K.Jack]

Gah, I hope they don't restrict Assault/Ranger to Shotguns, lest I find myself resisting very hard the urge to bench them for being liabilities.



Eh, suppose it wasn't the best choice of words for the specific set of bufoons I was referring to. Hard to resist when I'd been up for countless hours and had known the persons I had been referring to to have a history of outrageous and irrational, occasionally revisionist comments in the name of PC Gaming.

Advice: if it isn't happening on NeoGAF, don't bring the emotion and name-calling to the thread full of peaceful NeoGAF PC gamers.

 

[Eyeh4wk]

I'm really hoping Firaxis improve air combat. Something similar to Xenonauts would be ideal for me. I could play Xenonauts` air combat exclusively all day. If not they should just skip it.

 

[CertifiedFP]

but at this point I think I have better things to do with my time than move 16 guys around looking for one last sectoid on the map.

Could have sworn there was a mechanism in place to prevent the late-mission last-enemy hunt, like them gradually moving towards where most of your troops are, or something that outright exposes their position. Don't recall exactly.

I'm fine with really small squads but I want the missions tailored to them so there's a reason why you are using small squads. I would also like eight or even ten man larger operations as well.

I'd also like to move away from the A-team all the time and either into squads or have some kind of system in place that you have to use a variety of troops and not just the same six or so over and over.

Well, you don't transport a huge team around an enemy occupied city if you're going for guerilla warfare. As for that second point, there is the matter of the Fatigue system Long War introduced as well as wounded troops spending several days in the medbay where you can't use them. An evolution of that would probably help.

Advice: if it isn't happening on NeoGAF, don't bring the emotion and name-calling to the thread full of peaceful NeoGAF PC gamers.

Again, sorry. Looks like late-night on-phone me made a stupid post.

 

[Decado]

Eh, the way I heard it, the change from the 20+ man headcount (IIRC) of the old games is that they wanted to make it so that each individual soldier's actions mattered much more, and death be that much more penalizing in combat. Something that can't really be felt when you have a small army deployed into each fight.

If that's the case they are makign the game too easy. 4 to 6 is too few for a tactical game.

 

[Delta Assault]

I feel like a 6-8 member squad is the sweet spot. Once you go past that, it really does come to feel more like a chore. 6-8 allows for enough tactical flexibility to cover all the angles while still providing for a quick enough gameplay-per-turn experience.

There's no way they're gonna go back to 16 men and taking half an hour to march everybody out of the dropship.

 

[CertifiedFP]

If that's the case they are makign the game too easy. 4 to 6 is too few for a tactical game.

I don't know about you, but "too easy" is when an individual unit's mishap doesn't matter much because there's 47 other units around to cover for his fault.

4 to 6 means that one soldier missing a shot means that you've got 5 or less attempts left to make up for that mistake. And that's assuming you don't make mistakes on your other troops or miss with them as well.

 

[Eyeh4wk]

I prefer small squads as well, just to keep the aliens turn short. I'm remembering the old xcom late game and the aliens took their sweet time moving back and forth. (Xenonauts have this problem too).

 

[firebranded]

WTF, I was all set to pre-order this on PS4. Played 3 on Plus, Bought it because I loved it, planned on getting EW eventually. I'll have to get this once I get a PC a few years down the road, only have a basic laptop currently. Seriously, they could've made this work better than X-com did on PS3, what the hell 2k.

 

[CertifiedFP]

WTF, I was all set to pre-order this on PS4. Played 3 on Plus, Bought it because I loved it, planned on getting EW eventually. I'll have to get this once I get a PC a few years down the road, only have a basic laptop currently. Seriously, they could've made this work better than X-com did on PS3, what the hell 2k.

We've gone over this before. Enemy Unknown bombed on consoles, and didn't see real popularity until it got on PS+. Enemy Within barely sold 100k units for consoles in its opening month, whilst at the very least on PC 300k people play the Enemy Within version of Long War.

Then there's the matter that this probably started development during a time when the success or failure of the 8th gen consoles was an unknown variable. Sorry, but you're going to have to join the PC Gaming Masterrace like the rest of us. And then there'll be no turning back. /evillaugh.wav

That, or see if this is a case of Take2's approach to next-gen consoles thus far of releasing on anything but PS4/Xbone and talking about how a game is designed all around the non-PS4/Xbone platforms it's on, before releasing a new version for said consoles and getting people to double-dip, or even triple-dip, as we've seen with GTA V and Borderlands Pre Sequel.

 

[firebranded]

We've gone over this before. Enemy Unknown bombed on consoles, and didn't see real popularity until it got on PS+ - Enemy Within barely sold 100k units for consoles in its opening month, whilst at the very least on PC 300k people play the Enemy Within version of Long War.

Then there's the matter that this probably started development during a time when the success or failure of the 8th gen consoles was an unknown variable .

That's the only thing that keeps me cool, it still sucks for me as I'm having to make due with a laptop that won't play it good if at all.

Sorry for the outburst, just that I really thought it was a given with the architecture for PS4 at least when the rumors started with Advent. Guess I'll join you guys down the line again lol!

 

[Falk]

If that's the case they are makign the game too easy. 4 to 6 is too few for a tactical game.

I'd say in the majority of UFO Defense I played, I rarely moved more than 8 soldiers every turn barring the first few. One, because it was too tedious (hell getting everyone out of the Skyranger alone was tedious) Two, because those tended to be the best guys, and since they were the ones who saw combat, it inadvertently became a rich get richer situation unless one of them kicked the bucket, or something went horribly wrong.

There was the odd terror mission here and there where you'd leave people all over the place in to hopefully snapshot Chryssalids, but that's hardly what I'd call engaging tactical gameplay either.

p.s. Jagged Alliance 2 had a squad size of 6. You're welcome to call it a bad tactical game if you want.

edit: Also Silent Storm. No one should ever forget Silent Storm

 

[TuckingFypo]

Awesome news. The graphics seem to be getting a fair bit of hate but I really like the style. Also, am I the only person that prefers using the keyboard and mouse? When I went back to the console version, It felt really odd.

I might even preorder this and I haven't done that for quite a few years!

 

[KyanMehwulfe]

[*]Veterans will gain unique cosmetics to show how hardcore they are.

I like this one. I usually do this manually... give all new recruits a buzzcut and a fresh shave, force 'em wear a helmet.. default tan armor. As they rank up, they can wear a beret or cap, then grow out some hair, wear dark green armor. Top ranks get to grow a beard, wear black (or white later to match plasma guns). That sort of thing. Usually changes every game, just a sort of theme I come up with each time. So, added automatic options for vets will compliment that well.

 

[JBourne]

Looks great. Love how colorful everything seems.

 

[timetokill]

Awesome! Can't say I'm upset about the PC exclusivity as it makes it clear that they're going to support the mod community.

 

[Fragamemnon]

Kind of OT, but what on earth is beagle doing fighting a disc with ballistic weapons on his stream right now? Did he manage to mess up the strategic layer even worse than he normally does?

 

[Baalzebup]

I'd say in the majority of UFO Defense I played, I rarely moved more than 8 soldiers every turn barring the first few. One, because it was too tedious (hell getting everyone out of the Skyranger alone was tedious) Two, because those tended to be the best guys, and since they were the ones who saw combat, it inadvertently became a rich get richer situation unless one of them kicked the bucket, or something went horribly wrong.

There was the odd terror mission here and there where you'd leave people all over the place in to hopefully snapshot Chryssalids, but that's hardly what I'd call engaging tactical gameplay either.

p.s. Jagged Alliance 2 had a squad size of 6. You're welcome to call it a bad tactical game if you want.

edit: Also Silent Storm. No one should ever forget Silent Storm

You know things. Things that should never, ever be dismissed or forgotten.

 

[Eyeh4wk]

Kind of OT, but what on earth is beagle doing fighting a disc with ballistic weapons on his stream right now? Did he manage to mess up the strategic layer even worse than he normally does?

Perhaps he got his squad wiped out. In Long War there's a chance you lose your equipment when a soldier dies.

 

[Sober]

Kind of OT, but what on earth is beagle doing fighting a disc with ballistic weapons on his stream right now? Did he manage to mess up the strategic layer even worse than he normally does?

This is how the XCOM 2 canon comes to.

 

[Armaros]

This is how the XCOM 2 canon comes to.

So we play as Beaglerush in xcom 2 canon?

 

[Sober]

So we play as Beaglerush in xcom 2 canon?

You learn that the reason XCOM lost the first war was because they tried to gauss rush.

 

[Nzyme32]

WTF, I was all set to pre-order this on PS4. Played 3 on Plus, Bought it because I loved it, planned on getting EW eventually. I'll have to get this once I get a PC a few years down the road, only have a basic laptop currently. Seriously, they could've made this work better than X-com did on PS3, what the hell 2k.

It really depends on what they want to do with the game. The only reason for it to not be on consoles is if there is something they think will be integral to the game, is only possible via PC, and that they think they can make enough of a return on PC alone with such a set up. There will be specific answers on Friday when IGN do an article on it:

"And here’s another shocker: though XCOM: Enemy Unknown and XCOM: Enemy Within came out on PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, and PC, XCOM 2 is a PC-exclusive game. More on that on Friday in Why XCOM 2 Had to be a PC-Only Game."

 

[Fragamemnon]

You learn that the reason XCOM lost the first war was because they tried to gauss rush.

Yeah that explains it. Gauss rush is really awful. The weapon line is incredible (even after the change to quenchguns) but you need the workshop block and air game to support the high alloy costs.

 

[Reebot]

It really depends on what they want to do with the game. The only reason for it to not be on consoles is if there is something they think will be integral to the game, is only possible via PC, and that they think they can make enough of a return on PC alone with such a set up. There will be specific answers on Friday when IGN do an article on it:

"And here’s another shocker: though XCOM: Enemy Unknown and XCOM: Enemy Within came out on PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, and PC, XCOM 2 is a PC-exclusive game. More on that on Friday in Why XCOM 2 Had to be a PC-Only Game."

Its probably a good idea to focus solely on a PC release right out of the gate, and I don't think a simultaneous console launch is in the cards whatsoever. But a couple years down the line? Console port almost guaranteed.

These games are markedly better on PC though so I'm not waiting; the promise of widespread mod support is pretty exciting too.

 

[Nzyme32]

Its probably a good idea to focus solely on a PC release right out of the gate, and I don't think a simultaneous console launch is in the cards whatsoever. But a couple years down the line? Console port almost guaranteed.

These games are markedly better on PC though so I'm not waiting; the promise of widespread mod support is pretty exciting too.

There's no telling really. If they suddenly throw in some weird mechanic that is focused on mouse and keyboard type response like a MOBA, then it would make a bit more sense as to why they might do something like this. Out side of that sort of stuff, I don't see why they would make the fanfare about it being PC only. I don't think anyone does that kind of stuff without money being thrown around such as on the consoles. A good example is Dirt Rally. All they say is they are focusing on PC first but are open to other things later. This is different in its messaging

 

[Arjac]

PC only?

I am sad

well, whenever you feel sad about that, remember one thing

some people may never get to play a Persona title

Spoiler

not legit anyways

, from your avatar I'm guessing you're not some people

 

[BoosterDuck]

some people may never get to play a Persona title

Spoiler

not legit anyways

, from your avatar I'm guessing you're not some people

 

[Reebot]

There's no telling really. If they suddenly throw in some weird mechanic that is focused on mouse and keyboard type response like a MOBA, then it would make a bit more sense as to why they might do something like this. Out side of that sort of stuff, I don't see why they would make the fanfare about it being PC only. I don't think anyone does that kind of stuff without money being thrown around such as on the consoles. A good example is Dirt Rally. All they say is they are focusing on PC first but are open to other things later. This is different in its messaging

True, that is a possibility. I get a greater impression that they're just (wisely) pandering to the market. "PC only" and (shudder) "master race" sentiment is really getting steam, especially online; the reddit board for "PC master race" regularly hits top numbers. Emphasizing this as a PC only game ensures they get a lot of credit right out of the gate from the core audience they want to attract. A console port years later won't effect that much at all and would be a pretty logical way to milk some extra cash.

 

[HK-47]

Yeah that explains it. Gauss rush is really awful. The weapon line is incredible (even after the change to quenchguns) but you need the workshop block and air game to support the high alloy costs.

I think the reason was they put off building the second workshop to long. Didnt get dem rebates.

 

[hemtae]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/status/605471960672444416

 

[Jintor]

I'm not really criticising visual fidelity, just the art style.. take for example stuff like The Banner Saga, Endless Legend/Space, Klei stuff... they all have interesting-imaginative lore and design.

XCom is always this cookie-cutter bland generic sci-fi

I disagree - XCOM's brand of generic sci-fi is really nice-looking.

But it could be better.

 

[epmode]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/status/605471960672444416

I like this Jake Solomon guy. Hire Julian Gollop as a freelance designer for the expansion/sequel IMO.

 

[LurkerPrime]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/status/605471960672444416

That's awesome. I think XCOM's in good hands with Jake & co. After all, the originals will always be there.

Also, in case anyone's unaware, Julian Gollop's working on Chaos Reborn right now. It's a sequel to one of his previous games from what I understand, and is currently in Steam Early Access.

 

[charlequin]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/status/605471960672444416

So awesome.

 

[Decado]

I'd say in the majority of UFO Defense I played, I rarely moved more than 8 soldiers every turn barring the first few. One, because it was too tedious (hell getting everyone out of the Skyranger alone was tedious) Two, because those tended to be the best guys, and since they were the ones who saw combat, it inadvertently became a rich get richer situation unless one of them kicked the bucket, or something went horribly wrong.

There was the odd terror mission here and there where you'd leave people all over the place in to hopefully snapshot Chryssalids, but that's hardly what I'd call engaging tactical gameplay either.

p.s. Jagged Alliance 2 had a squad size of 6. You're welcome to call it a bad tactical game if you want.

edit: Also Silent Storm. No one should ever forget Silent Storm

8 is more than 4 to 6

You're welcome to play JA2. You could deploy multiple squads on a map :\

Long War was a huge improvement over vanilla in part because you could deploy 8 soldiers.

S2 was a great game, but its scope was pretty limited and I'd expect more from XCOM 2.

 

[Falk]

8 is more than 4 to 6

You're welcome to play JA2. You could deploy multiple squads on a map :\

Long War was a huge improvement over vanilla in part because you could deploy 8 soldiers.

S2 was a great game, but its scope was pretty limited and I'd expect more from XCOM 2.

... You were quoting a post saying 20 soldiers.

For what it's worth (and I believe I mentioned it in a previous post) I think 8-10 is the sweet spot. 8 moreso.

 

[Decado]

... You were quoting a post saying 20 soldiers.

For what it's worth (and I believe I mentioned it in a previous post) I think 8-10 is the sweet spot. 8 moreso.

Okay. I was also pretty clear that I was referring to the 4 to 6 in the current game.

8 to 12 is good, depending on the style. Wish xcom had real-time w/pause movement outside of combat like ja2.

 

[The_Poet]

What a fantastic decision to make it PC exclusive.

90% of console owners will have a laptop which could play this anyway

 

[Repo Man]

Daymn! Just saw this thread last night so I thought I'd quickly try Enemy Unknown/Within which I've never played ( haven't played any x-com games ever ) and I have it on my Steam Library. I can't stop playing now, I got Witcher 3 and P-cars to play but I choose to play X-com because its just so fucking good and now there's a 2nd game coming this year and its a PC exclusive too! BRING IT!

 

[Gutss]

Yesssssssssssss!!!! but why no console?

 

[Nzyme32]

Yesssssssssssss!!!! but why no console?

IGN will answer that one on Friday

 

[TC McQueen]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/stat...71960672444416

You know, I'm really curious what engine XCOM 2 runs on, because UE3 was the cause of a lot of the weaknesses of XCOM: EU. I remember interviews with the developers and/or Jake Solomon where they flat out said UE3 couldn't handle procedural generation and the level of destructability they wanted.

 

[Funky Papa]

I thought this was nice

https://twitter.com/SolomonJake/status/605471960672444416

I knew XCom was in good hands since they unveiled the reboot by showing Solomon (I think that was him) giving a gameplay tour of OG X-Com to an artist (or was him a musician?) and laughing histerically at his squad being slaughtered right out of the transport.

He's definitely one of us.

 

[dunneh]

I loved it when Jake went undercover to 'sell' his Xcom:EU to people in a game shop:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zBTITxt09I

 

[Doomshroom]

What a fantastic decision to make it PC exclusive.

90% of console owners will have a laptop which could play this anyway

Why is this fantastic? You dont even know why they made the decision. I think its a stupid ass decision because i will never get to play it.

 

[Vaporak]

When are we getting some more info on the game. I read that there's going to be something on why it's PC only on Friday, but hopefully there's a gameplay demonstration or something before then.