Support NeoGAF

[Funky Papa]

XCOM 2’S PROCEDURALLY GENERATED MAPS – IGN FIRST

It talks about how EU had randomized maps but they weren't good so in the end they hand-crafted them and how the procedural maps works in XCOM 2.

Also different terrains:

I'll have to read that later, but those maps look great.

 

[epmode]

The original game had a "quilt" style to the procedural map generation as well. From the sound of things, this game will do a better job of mixing it up.

 

[McNum]

So... Like the original X-Com did it? It had tiles that were used randomly for each mission. This sounds very similar. Kind of what I hoped Enemy Unknown would have done, but it's good to see XCOM 2 going back to what worked in the original.

 

[TC McQueen]

So... Like the original X-Com did it? It had tiles that were used randomly for each mission. This sounds very similar. Kind of what I hoped Enemy Unknown would have done, but it's good to see XCOM 2 going back to what worked in the original.

IIRC, they couldn't get it to work in UE3 for whatever reason, especially once they factored in the destructability.

 

[McNum]

IIRC, they couldn't get it to work in UE3 for whatever reason, especially once they factored in the destructability.

Ah. But UE4 has something like this as one of its party tricks, right? Modular level design, or something like that. I'd assume they've upgraded to UE4, at least. Could also just be them going crazy with UE3, it's been three years since Enemy Unknown, so who knows?

 

[Rentahamster]

Absolute scientific proof Rules of Nature goes with EVERYTHING

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZwlC4lSID8

Now for Guile music.

 

[Xplatformer]

Control scheme????

Still supporting the 360 controller 100% percent on PC?

 

[epmode]

Control scheme????

Still supporting the 360 controller 100% percent on PC?

No word yet. I preferred a controller in XCOM as well but that was mostly because the keyboard and mouse support was so wobbly.

It would be nice to have an option either way but only if controller support has a separate UI and the game design doesn't require a mouse.

 

[Poodlestrike]

The procedural generation sounds great!

I've also realized it'll be a boon to custom map availability; designing a whole map is hard, designing a quarter map strikes me as... considerably easier, which means we'll probably get more user-generated content than we otherwise might.

 

[Fragamemnon]

Yeah, one of the big benefits to this kind of approach is that custom creators should be able to craft their own parcels w/ appropriate metadata so that the map generator can understand and place/populate them properly. It was the kind of system I was hoping they would adopt (see my earlier post in the thread) and I'm excited for it.

Well, excited for barns, orchards, and wheat fields with fences.

 

[epmode]

Yeah, the article implies that modders will be able to add content to the procedural map pool. That's more than I expected we'd get, especially with environmental destruction.

 

[Poodlestrike]

Yeah, the article implies that modders will be able to add content to the procedural map pool. That's more than I expected we'd get, especially with environmental destruction.

Wonder if they'll pack in a full blown mapmaker?

 

[Sciz]

If you're gonna do procedural maps by stitching prefab pieces together, that's absolutely the way to go. Torchlight's longevity improved enormously once people started making custom chunks.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Yeah, if the plot and parcel system is open to modders, well...

This is going to be great.

 

[Sober]

Or if modders could make entirely new tilesets ... oh yeah.

 

[CMDBob]

The procedural generation system sounds awesome. So much hype for this game.

Plus, from how I understand it, it's actually pretty similar to how the original X-COM did procedurally generated maps (it took these big chunks of map and stitched em together).

 

[Raitaro]

Is it a banable offense if I (am undoubtedly late to the "party" to) say that this game feels like a big slap in the face of everyone who supported the previous game on consoles? If so, I apologize but it's really been bothering me.

I bought two copies of XCOM, Enemy Unknown for PS3 and Enemy Within for 360 and I would have happily bought this new game on any console as well. That said, I would not have bothered getting invested in this series for the first time if I had know about the sequel going PC exclusive since I hate not being able to play new iterations in a series I like. Not everyone can afford a gaming PC or has room for one, in case someone points that out.

I think these kind of situations where publishers/developers simply ignore or even shit on part of their fanbase, even when the reasons for it are of a technical nature (like here, apparently), are quite a worrying trend in modern gaming. People would revolt if a sequel to a book suddenly would not come out in paper format, or when a movie sequel skips DVD altogether, but apparently we gamers simply have to put up with it.

Sigh.

I'm happy for any XCOM fans who are able to play this game on PC though. A bit jealous as well.

Edit: to be clear, I'm not port begging as such, just reacting to the fact that XCOM now seems to represent the trend of deeming it acceptable that game sequels can change or skip platforms in such a drastic and unexpected way that some fans are left in the cold.

 

[Xamtheking]

Is it a banable offense if I (am undoubtedly late to the "party" to) say that this game feels like a big slap in the face of everyone who supported the previous game on consoles? If so, I apologize but it's really been bothering me.

I bought two copies of XCOM, Enemy Unknown for PS3 and Enemy Within for 360 and I would have happily bought this new game on any console as well. That said, I would not have bothered getting invested in this series for the first time if I had know about the sequel going PC exclusive since I hate not being able to play new iterations in a series I like. Not everyone can afford a gaming PC or has room for one, in case someone points that out.

I think these kind of situations where publishers/developers simply ignore or even shit on part of their fanbase, even when the reasons for it are of a technical nature (like here, apparently), are quite a worrying trend in modern gaming. People would revolt if a sequel to a book suddenly would not come out in paper format, or when a movie sequel skips DVD altogether, but apparently we gamers simply have to put up with it.

Sigh.

I'm happy for any XCOM fans who are able to play this game on PC though. A bit jealous as well.

It didn't sell well enough on Consoles compared to PC sales
That's the plain and simple truth

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I'm very excited for this. I've been playing the game the last couple weeks and I'm very ready for an update.

I didn't realize it was going to be a PC exclusive though. Which is fine, since I don't plan on purchasing any next gen console anyway. And hopefully that choice will allow them to make the right design choices, that don't work well on consoles.

Map procedural generation is a must. While there are a lot of maps between xcom and the expansion, when you're playing a long game like marathon or long war... my god you see the same maps so many times. Multiple entry points don't even begin to alleviate that issue.

I hope they include the choice of a radar being on every map, and not just some council missions, since it can help get your head around your character positioning better. I really hope they work on the UI a lot more than what they have on the screenshots, which just look like a reskin.

I also hope they have much more choice in grand strategy, like long war does. Well, maybe even beyond what long war does since even that mod seems to have limits as to what is smart to aim for early and mid game. Since XCOM is on the offensive side, I hope we have a lot of choice for which missions to take, where to move the mobile base, etc.. There is also a lot of moral gray areas they can enter that a force like theirs might confront in a guerrilla war.

Foremost, I think the way they are adding stealth elements, and ways to approach combat is probably the most important thing they are doing right. Since in XCOM every mission kinda boils down to search and destroy. This should allow for a lot more approaches to combat.

Well, I'm excited for this game. XCOM is easily my favorite strategy game of last era.

 

[Nzyme32]

Just read the procedural generation article. Sounds absolutely awesome!

Is it a banable offense if I (am undoubtedly late to the "party" to) say that this game feels like a big slap in the face of everyone who supported the previous game on consoles? If so, I apologize but it's really been bothering me.

I bought two copies of XCOM, Enemy Unknown for PS3 and Enemy Within for 360 and I would have happily bought this new game on any console as well. That said, I would not have bothered getting invested in this series for the first time if I had know about the sequel going PC exclusive since I hate not being able to play new iterations in a series I like. Not everyone can afford a gaming PC or has room for one, in case someone points that out.

I think these kind of situations where publishers/developers simply ignore or even shit on part of their fanbase, even when the reasons for it are of a technical nature (like here, apparently), are quite a worrying trend in modern gaming. People would revolt if a sequel to a book suddenly would not come out in paper format, or when a movie sequel skips DVD altogether, but apparently we gamers simply have to put up with it.

Sigh.

I'm happy for any XCOM fans who are able to play this game on PC though. A bit jealous as well.

Edit: to be clear, I'm not port begging as such, just reacting to the fact that XCOM now seems to represent the trend of deeming it acceptable that game sequels can change or skip platforms in such a drastic and unexpected way that some fans are left in the cold.

Well I think it is understandable to be vexed when you are a fan of something and then it seemingly moves on to other platforms for undisclosed reasons. You can find out about those reasons tomorrow though via IGN, and perhaps it might actually make some sense.

It's also useful to keep in mind that as far as studios and games go, this is a fairly rare occurance (although it has happened a bit recently) but also Firaxis are pretty PC centric as a developer.

 

[Fragamemnon]

I'd like to take a moment and note that if you were a big fan of Enemy Unknown, regardless of platform, there's a pretty high chance that you'd be a fan of the strategy side of PC gaming in a more general sense, and it might be worth looking into at least a modest PC (which I'm pretty sure XCOM2 will want, it likely won't need something crazy beefy) and exploring the strategy side of the platform.

 

[BennyBlanco]

Wow. The maps look nice as hell.

This fall is gonna be crazy.

 

[Rentahamster]

I hope the game engine is scalable enough so that it'll look gorgeous on my beefy PC.

 

[Tain]

Ah. But UE4 has something like this as one of its party tricks, right? Modular level design, or something like that. I'd assume they've upgraded to UE4, at least. Could also just be them going crazy with UE3, it's been three years since Enemy Unknown, so who knows?

UE4 makes it easier to make a big procedural map, at least.

 

[Fireblend]

Edit: to be clear, I'm not port begging as such, just reacting to the fact that XCOM now seems to represent the trend of deeming it acceptable that game sequels can change or skip platforms in such a drastic and unexpected way that some fans are left in the cold.

To be fair, XCOM being released on consoles was the exception, not the rule, not only for the XCOM franchise but also for Firaxis games in general.

 

[AWizardDidIt]

Is it a banable offense if I (am undoubtedly late to the "party" to) say that this game feels like a big slap in the face of everyone who supported the previous game on consoles? If so, I apologize but it's really been bothering me.

While it probably won't make you feel much better, IGN has an article coming up tomorrow specifically explaining why they're focusing only on a PC release at the moment. The theory is that what they're trying to do with procedural generation and destructible environments wouldn't be possible on either console, but we won't know for sure until then. While I definitely understand how console players are upset at this announcement, I stand from the (perhaps privileged) position of a PC player who wants the game to be as good as it can be and would hate to see their vision for the game be compromised in order to release on other platforms.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Also, if you can afford a PS3, a 360, and (presumably) at least one next-gen console, you probably can afford a low-level PC that would run this game decently. It wouldn't be much more than any one of those consoles was at launch, and like Frag said, you'd probably find plenty of other PC games to enjoy on it too.

 

[Morokh]

There's more info coming today right ?

So far liking pretty much everything they talked about the game

 

[Sijil]

There's more info coming today right ?

So far liking pretty much everything they talked about the game

IGN is interviewing Jake Solomon today.

 

[Funky Papa]

I'm interesting in hearing about the whole exclusivity thing, but I'm fairly sure it's just PRspeak to cover the fact that the console version sold poorly, so it makes sense for them to focus on computers for the sequel and avoid any compromises by making the most of the platform.

Which doesn't bother me at all, given that I'll play the game on my PC, but still.

As for the whole gamepad thing, I'll use my mouse and keyboard as it allows for more control, but I was shocked by how well it worked with my Xbox 360 controller. I'd certainly appreciate if they could keep it as an option for the folks who preferred it.

 

[KKRT00]

I really hope that they design full interface around keyboard and mouse first and then try to get it to work on gamepad.
And i hope that we get TONS of indicators. Lack of information from UI was really annoying in EU.

 

[Funky Papa]

I really hope that they design full interface around keyboard and mouse first and then try to get it to work on gamepad.
And i hope that we get TONS of indicators. Lack of information from UI was really annoying in EU.

Oh yeah. Getting it right for keyboard+mouse users should be a top priority.

 

[peakish]

I bought two copies of XCOM, Enemy Unknown for PS3 and Enemy Within for 360 and I would have happily bought this new game on any console as well. That said, I would not have bothered getting invested in this series for the first time if I had know about the sequel going PC exclusive since I hate not being able to play new iterations in a series I like. Not everyone can afford a gaming PC or has room for one, in case someone points that out.

I think these kind of situations where publishers/developers simply ignore or even shit on part of their fanbase, even when the reasons for it are of a technical nature (like here, apparently), are quite a worrying trend in modern gaming. People would revolt if a sequel to a book suddenly would not come out in paper format, or when a movie sequel skips DVD altogether, but apparently we gamers simply have to put up with it.

Not to gang up too hard on this, but where do you draw the line on where publishers do wrong against their fanbase? Not everyone is interested in buying a new console, but many series are still moving on to XB1 and PS4, leaving people behind due to technical and (most probably) budget reasons and I think that gamers largely prefer this (as long as they own the newer platforms in question that is). I know that console -> newer console is a natural progression of a fanbase, but my point is that we're largely moving systems forward because of technical reasons, hence a lot of discussion about cross-gen games holding the newer platforms back. So how and when does a technical reason sufficiently motivate a platform decision?

If I'd stake a guess at anything it'd be that Firaxis has a set budget and, at least initially, wants to focus on creating their "vision" for the best possible game. It seems (at least to me) like a big part of this will be in tightly integrating mod tools into the game and that's not something that easily transfers to a console version. So at that point, how do you split your budget to make several different versions? How much time and money do you set towards integrating something that mainly will favour one of the platforms?

Like I said in my first post in the thread, I'm sad for console gamers who were looking forward to this sequel. But I think it's a bit unfair to label this as a slap in the face, rather than the developers wanting to do their best within their limits.

 

[Raitaro]

[Snip/]

Like I said in my first post in the thread, I'm sad for console gamers who were looking forward to this sequel. But I think it's a bit unfair to label this as a slap in the face, rather than the developers wanting to do their best within their limits.

In this case you might be right indeed. Making the game as best as it can be should always come first, perhaps even at the cost of platform (brand) consistency. Rationally, I can get behind that fully and wish more developers and publishers would follow that philosophy.

Emotionally speaking though, I'm simply a new XCOM fan who decided to take the plunge with Enemy Unknown on console and who will now have to miss the sequel. As such, for me it gets dragged down into a long line of similar disappointing release decisions such as Sega bringing out sequels to beloved games on just the first gen Xbox (Crazy taxi 3, Jet Set Radio Future), Square Enix localizing a series like DQ up to a certain game to then suddenly stop, Nintendo doing the same with Mother, and even up to Capcom seemingly not willing to release MH4 on Wii U even though some fans got into that series on Wii or Wii U with MH3, or them releasing just one middle iteration of a series on a platform to then not release its sequel again, like they did with Dead Rising 2 and 3.

The list of these things goes on and on and in general - even though most publishers have a solid reason perhaps for doing so based on time and money - I feel it always slaps a certain group of fans in the face. In my ideal, naive gaming world platform exclusivity and the permanent risk of games not getting localized would not exist. Instead quality and being loyal to fans would come highest, with new games in series that have established fan bases being released in such a way that pretty much everyone can have access to them, not just people who only own one platform or who are in just one territory. For most media this seems more or less guaranteed, just not for games; hence my earlier negative comments.

That said, we certainly don't have to make a big debate out of this as the issue is more complex than me being withheld certain games that I'm a fan of. Some will defend Firaxis' choice, some won't. Despite feeling disappointed as a console XCOM fan, I will definitely keep an eye out for the new XCOM and will try to play it in the future when I might have a PC again. In that regard getting any sequel at all is better than none of course.

 

[HariKari]

Has there been any mention of an official long war style mode?

 

[Moonstone]

To be fair, XCOM being released on consoles was the exception, not the rule, not only for the XCOM franchise but also for Firaxis games in general.

The first X-com/Ufo was released for Ps1

 

[Nzyme32]

Has there been any mention of an official long war style mode?

Not particularly, although Jake Solomon is a huge fan of the mod and there was mention of it being one of the several reasons for in depth mod support this time round

 

[Shake Appeal]

Speaking of which, I finally installed Long War and I'm not sure why I waited this long.

Oh, yeah. Because I am now going to lose several hundred hours of my life to it.

 

[Izcarielo]

Is it a banable offense if I (am undoubtedly late to the "party" to) say that this game feels like a big slap in the face of everyone who supported the previous game on consoles? If so, I apologize but it's really been bothering me.

I bought two copies of XCOM, Enemy Unknown for PS3 and Enemy Within for 360 and I would have happily bought this new game on any console as well. That said, I would not have bothered getting invested in this series for the first time if I had know about the sequel going PC exclusive since I hate not being able to play new iterations in a series I like. Not everyone can afford a gaming PC or has room for one, in case someone points that out.

I think these kind of situations where publishers/developers simply ignore or even shit on part of their fanbase, even when the reasons for it are of a technical nature (like here, apparently), are quite a worrying trend in modern gaming. People would revolt if a sequel to a book suddenly would not come out in paper format, or when a movie sequel skips DVD altogether, but apparently we gamers simply have to put up with it.

Sigh.

I'm happy for any XCOM fans who are able to play this game on PC though. A bit jealous as well.

Edit: to be clear, I'm not port begging as such, just reacting to the fact that XCOM now seems to represent the trend of deeming it acceptable that game sequels can change or skip platforms in such a drastic and unexpected way that some fans are left in the cold.

I think this is the same every pc gamer felt when all the centric pc developers consolized almost every game they had and became a console developer focused studio.

 

[afternoon delight]

Mods, procedural generation- SOLD. Didn't buy the expansion pack for EU but I'll bite for this.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Just a reminder:

Dan Stapleton ‏@DanStapleton 8h8 hours ago
Lots of people have asked, so here's the answer: Firaxis will tell you why #XCOM2 is PC exclusive tomorrow on @ign at 9am Pacific.

("Tomorrow" is now today.)

 

[Bert]

Guess it'll have to join Sim City and Football Manager as the only things I play on my Mac. Shame really because it works great on touchscreen devices. And I enjoyed it on PS3 and would've liked the chance to take my squad with me or something similar.

Can not wait for this though, one of my all time favourite games.

 

[Nzyme32]

Guess it'll have to join Sim City and Football Manager as the only things I play on my Mac. Shame really because it works great on touchscreen devices. And I enjoyed it on PS3 and would've liked the chance to take my squad with me or something similar.

Can not wait for this though, one of my all time favourite games.

Once again this is the assumption that the game is identical to the previous version or should be restricted to that to be on a console. There is likely much more to the decision which they are going to explain today

 

[Ushay]

Just a reminder:



("Tomorrow" is now today.)

Exclusive is such a loose term these days. I'm 99.9% positive this will eventually come to consoles (X1, PS4). Proabably when the expansion hits. It sold well on all 3 platforms last time.

I can see why they went PC first though for the sake of focus and making a polished games. Which is the right move imo.

 

[Hopeford]

Why XCOM2 had to be PC exclusive. Basically they don't rule out a console release eventually, but they say they don't have the resources to work on anything but a PC version given they are using a heavily modified Unreal Engine 3.5.

 

[Shake Appeal]

No gamepad support at launch.

And:

As for the chances of XCOM 2 making its way to Xbox One and PlayStation 4 at some point in the future, Solomon wouldn’t rule it out, but it won’t happen any time soon. “We're certainly not opposed to that, but I can assure that's something we're not even discussing yet,” he said.

 

[twobear]

Why XCOM2 had to be PC exclusive. Basically they don't rule out a console release eventually, but they say they don't have the resources to work on anything but a PC version given they are using a heavily modified Unreal Engine 3.5.

That's fine for me. I dunno if my PC will be able to run it tbh.

 

[Firebrand]

No gamepad support at launch.

Goddammit.

 

[Remachinate]

Why XCOM2 had to be PC exclusive. Basically they don't rule out a console release eventually, but they say they don't have the resources to work on anything but a PC version given they are using a heavily modified Unreal Engine 3.5.

That was a complete non-article. Is anyone else bothered by this drip-feed of information blatantly designed to inflate IGN traffic?

 

[Arulan]

“When we have our meetings, when we talk about stuff, we only talk about PC,” said Solomon. “We talk about ‘What is the experience like on PC? What does the mouse feel like in this experience?’” The most obvious change resulting from those conversations is how the team is optimizing the interface to be mouse-and-keyboard friendly, moving UI elements and grouping them logically so that buttons we’re likely to press one after the other aren’t placed on opposite sides of the screen. “It will certainly be recognizable, but there isn't one UI widget that's the same,” said Solomon. We’ll also see more tactical information (such as detailed explanations of why your chance to hit is increased or decreased) displayed on the tactical interface, since Firaxis can now count on players sitting closer to their PC monitors and being able to read smaller text. And though Firaxis plans to add it in the future, the current plan is to launch without gamepad support.

Sounds good to me.