Vinny saved him with the demon voice.
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Giant Bomb #8 | It's a Hit!
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Vinny saved him with the demon voice.
I agree, feet on the table, where are his manners?
cuevas. PhD.
Member
I haven't checked this thread since yesterday morning. Wtf happened?
Mister Negative
Member
I mean, even if you think about staff reaction to it. With Leigh, it was all awkward glances at each other and "<>." They...didn't really bat an eye at shirtless Greg Miller who proceeded to knock over a big ol' pyramid of beer cans just because.
For the record, I don't have a problem with how Greg acted, really. That's what after-hours E3 is about. But if you look at the difference in how the community and staff reacted to the two situations, it's pretty striking.
YoYo Switch
Banned
I wonder what Dan and 'Striker think of all this. I don't think anyone could have predicted this type of reaction.
I think the difference is when Leigh was drunk she would not stop talking. Which was pretty annoying. Where as with Greg I don't really remember him hogging airtime. Not to mention Vinny helped quite a bit for Greg's drunkenness.
shadyspace
Banned
Greg Miller beat cancer.
Though in all honesty, I'm not sure bringing up Leigh Alexander leads to fruitful discussion.
I used to read sexy videogameland, and I found it pretty entertaining when she waxed philosophical about Metal Gear Solid or Haunting Ground, but as she got 'serious' she got pretty dull
AcademicSaucer
Member
edit: upon further review Is she surprised that women wanted to work there, or that anyone thought women wanted to work there? I can't tell!?
I remember her, wasnt she really drunk on a giantbomb live show ?
EdReedFan20
Member
I wonder if he'll wear that on Friday.
That doesn't sound too different than non-drunk Greg.
The point isn't that interesting though. Giant Bomb's staff, a relatively small gaming web site, is skewed towards the same target as the games they cover are, their audience, heck, even the developers of the games they cover.
Meanwhile people complain whenever that writer from Gearbox is on the panel but enjoy having ex-editor of Gamespot/Mythic Entertainment lady on (sorry, can't remember their names).
This sort of reductivness goes nowhere.
Plexirvones
Member
As cool as it would be to have more diversity on the Giant Bomb crew, I'm really excited about the two people they hired (full disclosure, I'm a white male). I often find it hard to say something when these situations arise, because I am a white male and I haven't been in the position of a minority. I do consider myself to be capable of empathy in situations like this, but of course I'll never be anything other than what I am. So I'll just try my best to say what my own personal feelings on the subject are.
As I said, I would love to see a woman on staff, or someone of a different ethnicity, or sexual orientation, or whatever. Diversity is never a bad thing. I have no idea what the hiring process is like for Giant Bomb. I know that the whole staff, and especially Patrick, has expressed interest in diversifying the staff at the site. I feel bad for saying this, especially since it seems like a rather controversial response, but I have to believe that they hired the new members based on their past work and the expectation that they will fit in well. I know about the rolodex issue, and I'm sure that always plays a part when hiring anyone, anywhere, but no part of me thinks that there was any kind of ill-intent to exclude a woman or any other minority. As Patrick has said, they're trying to do better. I think they ARE doing better, and hiring a white male doesn't mean they're somehow doing worse, or invalidating what they want to do in the future.
That's just my personal feeling on the subject. I have nothing but respect for Giant Bomb, and it's sad that the new hires are already the subject of some pretty hateful statements on both sides of the issue. I'm anticipating great content from Dan and Jason.
As I said, I would love to see a woman on staff, or someone of a different ethnicity, or sexual orientation, or whatever. Diversity is never a bad thing. I have no idea what the hiring process is like for Giant Bomb. I know that the whole staff, and especially Patrick, has expressed interest in diversifying the staff at the site. I feel bad for saying this, especially since it seems like a rather controversial response, but I have to believe that they hired the new members based on their past work and the expectation that they will fit in well. I know about the rolodex issue, and I'm sure that always plays a part when hiring anyone, anywhere, but no part of me thinks that there was any kind of ill-intent to exclude a woman or any other minority. As Patrick has said, they're trying to do better. I think they ARE doing better, and hiring a white male doesn't mean they're somehow doing worse, or invalidating what they want to do in the future.
That's just my personal feeling on the subject. I have nothing but respect for Giant Bomb, and it's sad that the new hires are already the subject of some pretty hateful statements on both sides of the issue. I'm anticipating great content from Dan and Jason.
Drunkensamurai
Member
The problem is that there aren't that many minority or women in game journalism.
Jimmyfenix
Member
There's a huge difference between Greg's and Leigh's behavior. Leigh didn't allow any conversation to take place without interjecting with her worthless comments. She practically screamed every word she said. And lest we forget "Fuck Boston" being thrown out there like a dozen times.
This is how she acted the entire time. Note how she can't go three seconds without chiming in.
Greg performed some drunken antics but he didn't bring the whole show to a screeching halt.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
I think people who discount the importance of diversity and insist on hiring only "the person most qualified" don't have a very practical definition of "most qualified." I think there are very few objective measures that can accurately predict how a person will perform on a job. We all diligently write out our schools and GPA and work history on our resumes, and those all help to a certain extent, but they are not nearly accurate enough. Once you get past a certain general level of competence it's pretty ridiculous to say Candidate A will objectively be a better worker than Candidate B because A worked for a slightly more prestigious company or had a slightly higher GPA or went to a slightly higher ranked school. In a general sense those things help, but they could never hope to tell you the full story.
Her lone redeeming moment of that show.
The internet
YoYo Switch
Banned
Everyone loves Carrie though. I used to like Paul Barnett
Was it Paul Barnett who told the amazing vomiting in a hotel room with a shirtless, pantsless member of the European press story?
TadThuggish
Neo Member
Important to note that, without the first inkling of 4chan harassment, I sent Samantha Allen a reply noting that saying "fuck off" probably hurt her point that I actually agree with. As kind as I could put it, without name-calling or defending those who were trolling and harassing. I got blocked for it. Then I saw that she wrote this. I don't know how it's not personal.
Are people hacking Drew's home web cam now? The GB community is really going way too far
ThreePiMatt
Member
Except the problem is that the people out there saying the truly vile stuff, the rape threats, etc are only going respond positively to being "called out." They can't be shamed, they can't be taught why what they're doing is wrong. They are very purposefully looking for a reaction and you are all too willing to give them one. They should be ignored and removed from the conversation. GAF bans those people, Giant Bomb bans those people. But Reddit, Twitter, Youtube comments can't be moderated in the same way. Block them, ignore them, and move on. There's not a whole lot else you can do.
There's also the question of what the job even is; a lady is much better qualified to expand Giant Bomb's audience to a more female demographic than Dan is.
Jimmyfenix
Member
Maybe , it could have been Justin McElroy with that story. He has had strange meetings with European press!
ReignofSparrows
Member
How many times are people going to bring up Greg Miller as though 'drunk' is some great equalizer with how Leigh acted? Someone said a while back that being drunk doesn't yield the same result - some people are happy goofballs and some people are belligerent and obnoxious. You can find enough sexist bullshit in the community without making up your own logical fallacies to downplay how awful someone was on the Bombcast.
mattiewheels
And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
I remember people in the E3 thread were complaining that Vinny was being obnoxious by making Greg have the demon voice. Like what? I think Greg used up all the obnoxiousness that evening by then.
I suspect she didn't appreciate being mansplained to at a time when she was already amped up by catching shit tons of vitriol and hate. You may have thought you were being calm or reasonable but you almost certainly came off as patronizing at best.
Adults don't not know that sometimes getting angry causes them to lash out in self-defeating ways.
YoYo Switch
Banned
This is pretty much the case.
So obviously the issue is personal to her, but you yourself don't have to take her reaction or her blog post personally.
yeah all sins are forgiven
but pls don't invade the last segment of an e3 cast again tho
AcademicSaucer
Member
wow , thats really sad to read, im sorry she feels that way
As the dust settles on twitter, it's nice that quite a few people are cross-promoting each other's work out of solidarity for the women and minorities who aren't getting cut any breaks.
But I'm seeing a slightly worrying trend - it's all written.
Aren't they listening to one of the most important and frequently repeated pieces of advice out there? Video content, regardless if it only gets a couple views, is incredibly important to EiC's. Even Danny said his shitty youtube channel helped land him the gig at GamespotUK and admits to not being a good writer.
Having amazing prose is great, but it's not going to get you far with video outlets like Giant Bomb (and the increasing amount of places copying their style). Applicants are not doing themselves any favours by thinking it's 1998 and being so insistent on the written word. Would anyone begrudge Jeff for refusing to hire someone who doesn't already make regular videos?
So far the only video content I've been exposed to which is created by women is Sore Thumbs, which isn't a bad effort, but neither of the hosts applied.
But I'm seeing a slightly worrying trend - it's all written.
Aren't they listening to one of the most important and frequently repeated pieces of advice out there? Video content, regardless if it only gets a couple views, is incredibly important to EiC's. Even Danny said his shitty youtube channel helped land him the gig at GamespotUK and admits to not being a good writer.
Having amazing prose is great, but it's not going to get you far with video outlets like Giant Bomb (and the increasing amount of places copying their style). Applicants are not doing themselves any favours by thinking it's 1998 and being so insistent on the written word. Would anyone begrudge Jeff for refusing to hire someone who doesn't already make regular videos?
So far the only video content I've been exposed to which is created by women is Sore Thumbs, which isn't a bad effort, but neither of the hosts applied.
She probably blocked you because she was tired of people using the common derailing tactic, the tone argument, against her.
I don't really agree with that, it gets called out all the time, and its been called out in this case. As I said there are giant bomb community members on both sides of this. I think its simply a matter of willful ignorance and having no intention of engaging in civil discourse.
Ding ding ding! This is definitely true, the people that were hired have extensive amounts of experience that is readily viewable online.
There are definitely venues more receptive to text articles, but giant bomb certainly leans towards video.
thechristoph
Sir!
The future of discussing video games on the Internet.
#nowhitemale
I think Maddy Myers did actually apply.
TadThuggish
Neo Member
I've always seen mansplaining as an EXCUSE ME LADY BUT THIS IS HOW THE WORLD REALLY WORKS sort of thing, especially about gender rules and not just common wisdom in general. It sucks that being a man and generally helping is suddenly termed that. I know I mostly operate in a bubble. I don't know who was pointing out the hypocrisy and defending her attackers but good lord, it sure wasn't me. Considering I didn't get to be a sexist asshole you'd think she'd at most ignore it, but right now I think she's working under the impression that anyone who doesn't agree with her is "The Enemy." It makes me feel mad as a person who's been on the sidelines waiting for everyone to be calm!
At the same time, the whole thing makes me really sad. It seems like she has a ton a ton a ton of issues that are getting projected onto Giant Bomb instead of actually being about Giant Bomb itself.
You missed the internet.
Hmn, I suppose that is one way to put it. However just because the world is that way and currently works under those conditions doesn't mean you shouldn't be able to push back against it in whatever avenues you have available to you in order to affect change (especially in relation to an issue which I don't think is a stretch to say extremely relevant in this day and age). In this case this is the avenue that she's working with and using the tools available to shape that discourse (for better or worse).
If her contention or even the methods by which she is rationalising her argument offend or anger you take a step back and realise those emotions are only there if you choose to engage in that discourse. If it means waiting it out while the storm rages that's what you gotta do, but jumping in the fray now with even polite suggestion that she should change the way she acts is an exercise in futility. Do yourself a favour and watch a happy quicklook.
MrTroubleMaker
Member
thanks!
lolIn all the commotion no one posted the wonderful picture Danny tweeted
Nnnnoope. Announcement of the new hires went over very smoothly, it's quite remarkable, actually.
This article is snarky and aggressive, but read re: your plea for calmness.
http://www.derailingfordummies.com/derail-using-anger/
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