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Initial Thoughts on Borderlands V Destiny

Got Borderlands2 recently on the Steam sale.
The graphics are amazing, ui designed for pc, perfect kb/m controls.
The shooting feels really good and satisfying. In the UVHM mode the game really begins to shine and offer a challenge.
All six classes have significant differences between each other.
Lots of bosses with a good chance of dropping legendary weapons. The bosses can be farmed.
Excellent coop play.
The only complaints I have are tiny tina(why) and that loot drops are free for all in coop which isn't always fun.
I don't know why people here say they spent more time in a menu looking at weapon stats from drops than playing, because all the weapons are color coded like Diablo.

Looking forward to Destiny, will get a PS for it!
Borderlands pre sequel is looking good on pc.
 
Tigress said:
It is doable in Solo. I noticed in all the waves and stuff you have to deal with, there are spots that you can shoot at the enemies, retreat and recoup your hp for a bit, and come back out. There's always a spot that they just won't follow you past (or only one or two will making them a lot more manageable. And it's easy to keep them in front of you and not surrounding you when you find that spot too).
Click to expand...

See?

Strategy.

I never experienced or needed to act or think like this in Borderlands. Both Borderlands were pretty easy to beat...I can't even recall a difficult fight except
when you had to fight a twisted version of Mordecai's pet.
. But that fight was only difficult because there was no cover and the enemy was able to in and out of the battle location.
 
Is this just a generalized Borderlands vs Destiny thread?

If so, to me both Borderlands games wins hands down for giving you options to play the game as you see fit:-

1. Always offline SP with a toggle for drop in MP at anytime. (Destiny is an always online experience, even for the SP segments.)

2. LAN MP (You can count the number of AAA MP games released in the past decade or so that have this MP option in one hand)

3. Online MP (a standard requirement for all shooters released in this day and age.)

coldone said:
I hated Borderlands 2.

- Un-real engine with such a low FOV. Really really annoying

FOV was the biggest disaster... I dont care how much fun the loot is. I just can't play games with short draw distance and low FOV to cover the engines deficiency.
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Superior PC version allowed you to tweak to FOV to a fishbowl-like 110 if you wanted. No complaints from me here.
 
Borderlands was pretty decent and I never finished Borderlands 2.

Yet I probably put around 20+ hours in the Destiny Beta and I'm still having fun.
 
VariantX said:
I like act of shooting stuff far more in destiny than in borderlands. Targets always try to run for cover, regroup, and then try to flank you, rather than just sit there and take it like they do in Borderlands.
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Don't mistake the AI's cowardice for intelligent behavior.
If a Destiny enemy is aware of cover points in the area, it will do absolutely everything to hide behind its box, even with 90% full shields and facing a nearly dead player. If they spawn away from the location the game is trying to repopulate, the whole pack will march on forward to that location even if you try to engage them, running straight through grenades, not phased by all the bullets getting lodged in their butts.
If it doesn't have a designated hiding spot, it actually will stand in place as you empty a clip in its face. This seems to be the default behavior of bosses and special enemies, which makes them look really, really dumb, even compared to the fodder enemies.
 
If I had to choose (solely from what I have experienced in the beta), I'd agree that Borderlands is more fun, diverse, well-thought-out and feature rich, and will probably remain so even after release. At best it's a tie, and that would require Destiny to go balls to the walls with after-beta-patches and a sizeable overhaul of the underlying instancing tech, gameplay mechanics and social aspects.


*) There are fundamental problems inherent in the RPG&Shooter combo whombo, and neither game even tries to do something about it. Biggest problem is the AI, or complete and utter lack thereof, sucking out the fun in normal grunt fights and leading to boss monsters being nothing more than roid-boosted grunts (bullet sponges with some adds and a better weapon or two), a moving and fighting gear check. Couple that with the RPG elements strongly removing skill from the shooter equation since you'll simply run out of time or bullets against monsters of sufficiently higher levels, no matter the skill. Add to that the unappealingly/minimalistically presented fetchquests and/or killquests sucking any joy out of the game beyond a certain initial freshness. Both also share unappetizing and clunky GUIs, admittedly with Destinys "faux mouse" / HTML4 / "everything is a square" interface readily besting Borderlands annoyingly obtuse setup.



Now, do not get me wrong. I most definitely had fun leveling my Warlock to level 8 (cap) and "beyond" (skill unlocks), and it's not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination, but I, personally, will not be purchasing a copy of Destiny for my PS3. Since I'm an owner of both Borderlands 1 and 2 for multiple platforms, this makes my personal ranking clear... I guess. Or it could be that Borderlands came first and occupied that particular nice as far as I'm concerned. Who knows.
 
Flipyap said:
Don't mistake the AI's cowardice for intelligent behavior.
If a Destiny enemy is aware of cover points in the area, it will do absolutely everything to hide behind its box, even with 90% full shields and facing a nearly dead player. If they spawn away from the location the game is trying to repopulate, the whole pack will march on forward to that location even if you try to engage them, running straight through grenades, not phased by all the bullets getting lodged in their butts.
If it doesn't have a designated hiding spot, it actually will stand in place as you empty a clip in its face. This seems to be the default behavior of bosses and special enemies, which makes them look really, really dumb, even compared to the fodder enemies.
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You're also taking it very literal. If you zapped anything with a barrage of bullets, they wouldn't take time to just get out of the way. The plasma pistol in Halo slowed down enemies with rapid shots. Their alien race might also live under a creed that dedicates them to dying in combat.
 
CTLance said:
*) There are fundamental problems inherent in the RPG&Shooter combo whombo, and neither game even tries to do something about it. Biggest problem is the AI, or complete and utter lack thereof, sucking out the fun in normal grunt fights and leading to boss monsters being nothing more than roid-boosted grunts (bullet sponges with some adds and a better weapon or two), a moving and fighting gear check. Couple that with the RPG elements strongly removing skill from the shooter equation since you'll simply run out of time or bullets against monsters of sufficiently higher levels, no matter the skill. Add to that the unappealingly/minimalistically presented fetchquests and/or killquests sucking any joy out of the game beyond a certain initial freshness. Both also share unappetizing and clunky GUIs, admittedly with Destinys "faux mouse" / HTML4 / "everything is a square" interface readily besting Borderlands annoyingly obtuse setup.
Click to expand...
Well put, especially the bolded.

Also, every boss battle in Destiny's alpha and beta felt the same. Large, slow moving enemies with fucktons of hit points and instakill power attacks on cooldown, with a few requisite rounds of minions spawned in to provide some variety and ammo resupply.
 
Whenever I play Borderlands I feel like I'm playing a game for a child. (the fart-caliber jokes are just one contributing factor here)

Destiny feels just riiiight. :)
 
NullPointer said:
Borderlands still wins for me because I do enjoy the humor and art style, as well as the game's focus on single player and co-op (rather than PVP), the pace of loot and upgrades and the depth of the class trees. Its also completely playable offline.

I'm a huge fan of Halo, but never once did I stop and think that those games would be improved by adding in MMO-esque RPG leveling and player hubs filled with dancing randoms.

I've had fun with Destiny and am sure it'll be a solid game that will do well, but personally I'd be a lot more excited for a new Borderlands.
Click to expand...

This is very close to how I feel. One of the things I liked about Borderlands is that I can play it offline and go at my own pace and try to find loot and upgrades or jump into random games for a more challenging experience. I have played Halo for years now casually with friends and when I found Borderlands it was something different. I love Halo but I don't like MMOs, so I'll have to wait and see if I'll like that aspect of Destiny.
 
I think The Crucible is completely fine. I like this better than borderlands as well, even after just the one mode in multi and one planet from the alpha and the beta.

I don't feel it's too unbalanced, and if you are getting one-shotted....you either got sniped with a headshot, shotgun at close range, rockets, vehicles, or a special. Which is par for the course in that department.
 
CTLance said:
Both also share unappetizing and clunky GUIs, admittedly with Destinys "faux mouse" / HTML4 / "everything is a square" interface readily besting Borderlands annoyingly obtuse setup.
Click to expand...
Borderlands' menus are clunky, but at least they don't make checking inventory feel like wearing a blindfold.
Losing all situational awareness whenever you open the inventory might be the most annoying thing about Destiny and it's such a huge UI design sin that even From Software understood that a thing like this should not exist in a game that can't be paused.
 
Eh, after playing several hours on Borderlands 2, I got burned out on it. I played Destiny beta for like 8 hours and a half, and I still haven't get enough of it.

The activities are a lot of fun for me, and I can see consuming so many hours into the game.
 
TheTwelve said:
See?

Strategy.

I never experienced or needed to act or think like this in Borderlands. Both Borderlands were pretty easy to beat...I can't even recall a difficult fight except
when you had to fight a twisted version of Mordecai's pet.
. But that fight was only difficult because there was no cover and the enemy was able to in and out of the battle location.
Click to expand...

Honestly? It is almost the same strategy you can use in Borderlands 2. Except you only recover shields, not hp and you can control that recover in shields by what shield you use.

That and I think the boss fights are better in Destiny to tell the truth. I will admit it seems Borderlands two likes to trap you and you just have to deal with the boss vs. letting you find ways of escaping or a spot you can stand your ground easier from. But it just means you have to find different strategies.

I don't know, the variety and customizableness seems better in B2. And me coming more from some one who prefers RPGs maybe that's why I like B2 better. Destiny seems more pure shooter and less of that customizableness (and looting) that I like of B2. As well as the many different types of weapons as well as encouraging you not to rely too much on any one weapon (element resistant monsters, you'll run out of ammo if you only rely on one weapon).


I'm willing to wait to see if Destiny offers more in the full game, but honestly the story missions seem short and since I can't seem to see there is much to explore or find other than getting through the story mission, they're not that replayable. I mean I enjoy the big area they let you wonder around in that other than an arrow pointing the way isn't just a path you follow but if there's nothing to find and it's just all desolate, what's the point of wondering off and getting sidetracked (that's probably another thing that me as some one who prefers RPGs it shows in which game I prefer. I like it when a game encourages you not to just follow the main path)?

Also, I was kinda hoping for more things like upgrading armor and weapons (and finding stuff you can use to upgrade with, crafting...). And more focus on looting (which I love about B2) and finding different weapons. All of these things I am not sure isn't in the game so I'm holding off on my judgement til I learn more of the full game.

But if they have a lot of the type mission I was describing, that would be pretty awesome and it is fun to do in a team. I just hope the storyline is either pretty long and this was a small taste, or they have a lot of those co op missions that they will keep adding more. Otherwise for me the game won't be worth it. I don't mind the chapters are short, it means I don't feel like I have to commit a long time in any one game session. But if they are that short I hope there is a lot of them.

And I really hope the fact that you gather materials means there is crafting/upgrading in the game (that tends to suck me in). I guess you can see where I come more from some one who wants more of a RPG with shooting elements (it's probably why Fallout is my favorite series ;) ). Yeah I know that's not Destiny and it's not aiming to be that, but I really liked the balance that Borderlands 2 did between the two. And that is why I suspect this argument between which one is better is more an argument of what type game you prefer ;).

That and I think Destiny falls flat when it comes to making me care about story and characters. What characters even stand out in Destiny? They're all just there to serve their purpose for you. And the story is really hard to care about. Handsome Jack on the other hand makes a very interesting villain (he's one of my favorite villains ever), even at one point making me hate him even though I am really amused by how much fun he takes in being an asshole. And I love Scooter's sister, she's a fun character too in my opinion. B2 I think did a way better job of giving personality to the characters. Even the nameless mobs that rush you are really amusing in the things they yell as they come at you (the mobs in destiny just seem to serve as things to shoot at).
 
Its a bit early to evaluate Destiny.

They are both different enough but both scratch that coop itch.

Borderlands has that humour, Destiny on hard strike zone is more chaotic (but we only have 1 strike mission in Beta so....)

Both would have benefited from 60 fps on console.

Roll on Mass effect 4.
 
Playing Destiny Beta on my main psn with a few others and I'm not seeing the hype at all. The game feels pretty damn generic so far except the supercharged power that's fun to land in pvp. Least it has better gunplay though otherwise think I'm gonna keep my $60.
 
v4skunk84 said:
The only complaints I have are tiny tina(why) and that loot drops are free for all in coop which isn't always fun.
I don't know why people here say they spent more time in a menu looking at weapon stats from drops than playing, because all the weapons are color coded like Diablo.
Click to expand...

Wait. People don't like Tiny Tina? She was one of the few NPCs I liked in the borderlands franchise.

Also, just being color-coated doesn't mean one color is automatically better than another. A green gun could give you the accuracy and power you want, where as the "better" blue one could have less accuracy and power but a higher fire-rate and the ability for the gun to talk to you. If you go for controlled one shot head shots, I'd take the green one any day.
 
I can't believe you compared Borderlands' awful dueling to Destiny's PVP. I can't.

Then you continue to ignore us in OT1 who corrected your misconception of how PVP even works in Destiny and how you don't need to grind gear to step foot inside the Crucible.

I like Borderlands 2 a lot. It's a very fun game, but from what I've played of Destiny I don't think they're going to be in the same league. The size and scale of Destiny is going to bring comparisons with MMOs rather than Borderlands.
 
Played Borderlands 1 and 2 on PS3, got the platinum for both. Liked 1 more than 2 (I put 130 hours easy into Borderlands 2 though. My friends LOVED this game, so when we all wanted to play something, It was always BL2.) due to the gun variety. In BL1, the guns felt like they had some difference, so you were sometimes still using a gun from 5 levels ago. BL2, enemies just kind of felt bullet sponge-y also meme humor and 80's pop culture references doesn't do it for me.

That said, I'm loving Destiny. Between the missions, the loot, getting my ass kicked in PvP, hanging out with other players in the tree at the Tower, getting one-shotted by the Mobile Walker, or just screwing around, I'm having a great time.

I especially love the sound. I'm playing with my headset on, and the little windchime-like sounds you hear when you're near a chest or spinmetal leaves is a nice touch.
 
Not a fair comparison, but I love both. Borderlands has this almost personalized southern backwater charm. I feel important to the world. Borderlands has a far superior quest system and UI. Not to mention the characters feel unique and have personality.

Destiny has what seems like an epic story, that's bigger than you but you play a crucial role. It has that Bungie charm. UI is beautiful but it needs transparency. Quests need to be launchable on the fly from exploring. I like the more robust PvP and it isn't fair to compare to borderlands as its PvP was more a dick waving contest than anything else. Destiny has serious competitive MP. Not gonna comment on loot because....Beta.

If I had to pick right now for only one it'd be Borderlands. Everything I've seen of Destiny SP wise is still lacking mostly due to that MMO thing they wanted. As one person hypothetically without XBL or PSN I can buy Borderlands and enjoy it as much as people with online services. Destiny I cannot. I get that it isn't that kind of game, but what is stopping it?
 
OP, I read your arguments and it really sounds like your a serious Borderlands fan and are getting a bit defensive there's a new kid in town.

Destiny has been great fun for me thus far, and we're basically seeing a tiny little slice of what will be in the retail game. I like the more mature theme, and we haven't even begun to see what kind of enemies will be in the game, the weapon variety, locations. Seems like you're jumping the gun.
 
boderlands was never for me, i didn't pick up its vibe. destiny is everything i could have hoped for and i've only played a limited alpha and beta version.
 
I had a lot more fun with Destiny beta than with the 2 Borderlands. Especially in B2, too much time spent looking for stuff in every trash can, too much time spent throwing stuff away because my backpack was always full, too much time spent walking around the same places just to find a certain number of drops, and all that backtrack after a mission is done... yawn.
I found B2 extremely boring, completed it only because i was playingin coop with friends. Also i didnt find it so funny as they say, especially the second one where every single joke is just about small people...
 
I adore BL2 (never played the first one), and while I agree comparing a beta (come on, its a demo:p) to full games that have been out a while is a bit off, this is absolutely something I've been wondering about. This thread has answered quite a few questions for me as I've been curious about similarities in the *feel* of play between the two games.

Love Halo and BL, so I cant wait to play Destiny.
 
Whenever I tried to play Borderlands, I would basically think "This would be pretty fun, if the quantity of loot was reduced by a factor of 20".

So, yeah, basically I really really like Destiny.

(Interestingly, I love Diablo! Something about the FPS format makes me really not want to have to deal with loot nearly as often)
 
VariantX said:
I like act of shooting stuff far more in destiny than in borderlands. Targets always try to run for cover, regroup, and then try to flank you, rather than just sit there and take it like they do in Borderlands. So something that would wear thin in alot of other games, stays fresh here for me. Its also true you dont get loot from damn near every other kill in destiny, but who cares when 90% of it is useless and is going to be sold anyway to make room for that 1 piece of loot you do need just to make room in your inventory. Borderlands does a better job of making the guns look vastly different from each other, and the more exotic ones have strange behaviors and projectiles. I really can't criticize this aspect fairly in Destiny yet since we don't have access to the final product though.
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I think I would have to agree with all you said. To me the shooting is everything. If the shooting feels off or like I am not shooting anything then I can't stand it. I hope the powers in the game don't get boring later on, but they also feel good for now.
 
ForsakenLotus said:
Surely you aren't serious? Comparing Call of Duty to Borderlands is like comparing grapes to eggplant because they are both purple. COD is a very tight, precise, fluid FPS. Borderlands is a clunky, super arcady and floaty shooter. Can you seriously compare an SMG that starts out with a reticule that is wobbling all over the screen in BL to any gun in COD? I'm sorry, but your view is just really, really weird. And I quite like Borderlands.

Also Destiny is on PS3 and Xbox 360, so you don't need to buy a new console.
Click to expand...

Look at it from this point of view: If I was going to compare the gunplay and overall gameplay feel of BL2, I'd compare it more to COD than Battlefield, Bioshock, Arma, Resistance, Halo, or Fallout. The time it takes to ADS, the feel of the shooting with a scope up, the general animations for everything, the amount of strafing allowed, deadzones, the virtually identical control scheme, it's pretty close to COD (especially the zombies mode on higher levels when you get bullet sponge enemies and guns aren't laser accurate).

Yeah, there's some pretty big difference like gun accuracy levels, actual bullet projectiles, no hit markers, and much higher enemy health, but otherwise there's a lot of simulates there in the core shooting to be close enough to me to compare it. At least to me, it feels pretty identical. Keep in mind that I'm not comparing every shooter on the market though. That list is pretty much what I stuck to.
 
CDV13 said:
I think The Crucible is completely fine. I like this better than borderlands as well, even after just the one mode in multi and one planet from the alpha and the beta.

I don't feel it's too unbalanced, and if you are getting one-shotted....you either got sniped with a headshot, shotgun at close range, rockets, vehicles, or a special. Which is par for the course in that department.
Click to expand...

That this is my only real gripe from playing the Beta. There are way too many ways to insta-die, which kind of favour a more "run and gun" game than strategy. Case in point, in older Halos it was a team effort to get to the special, be it rocket or sniper. You worked hard for your insta-kills. I don't find myself working hard for insta-kills in the PvP from the Beta (if that makes any sense).
 
Killing a group of people with a super feels fantastic and very satisfying. I love it and don't see it needing to be nerfed.

If someone uses their super on only you then laugh at them for wasting it.

Borderlands' special abilities are nowhere near as fun or exciting to use sadly.
 
I finished Borderlands and I'm probably 1/3rd into Borderlands 2. I enjoy the games and the loot hook definitely grabbed me but I certainly didn't love the first one or what I played of the sequel. It's fun but not anywhere near what I consider to be a great game.

Destiny's alpha made me a believer. Until that I was intrigued but not convinced because Bungie really didn't sell the game very well. Playing it made a complete difference and the beta only confirms it. The game just feels right and really well designed (but the true test for that will be the final product...). It's a world I want to be in because I want to see different locations, enemies, get better gear, better weapons, etc. And seeing the numbers of people playing the beta and their feedback, anyone believing this game will die when COD releases is completely crazy. if anything this is the biggest opponent COD ever had in regards to sales. I'm sure Activision will be glad it that...
 
Tigress said:
It is doable in Solo. I noticed in all the waves and stuff you have to deal with, there are spots that you can shoot at the enemies, retreat and recoup your hp for a bit, and come back out. There's always a spot that they just won't follow you past (or only one or two will making them a lot more manageable. And it's easy to keep them in front of you and not surrounding you when you find that spot too).
Click to expand...

I noticed this also but tbh that doesn't sound like strategy, that's just exploiting poor design, and really just makes the fight arduous and tedious more than challenging.

I wonder if Bungie should rethink the balance of the Strikes cos as soon as someone drops out they're impossible.
 
I've Platinumed Borderlands and Borderlands 2 on PS3 so I consider myself pretty well-versed in the franchise and I've been playing the Destiny beta like crazy. Borderlands has some great writing but - on console (specifically the PS3) - it plays like a slideshow. Destiny on PS4 is butter-smooth aside what I think is occasional screen-tearing. And having legitimate PVP battlegrounds instead of just duels is enormous in my opinion. I like the way the missions are structured in Destiny rather than MMO Exclamation Point Quests. Character is a no-brainer in Borderlands' favor, but Destiny makes you feel like a character is your own, and the customization is huge.
 
I enjoy Borderlands as a grindy loot game, I've put hundreds of hours into 1 and 2, but Destiny wins hands down. It's a better atmosphere, more polished, and feels better in movement and gunplay.

Never having to listen to claptrap is also an instant victory for Destiny.
 
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