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[Interceptor]

Written where? Well besides the propaganda material you're supplied with of course



Pointing out without evidence? Unless of course you mean the same evidence the poster I quoted above is so graciously providing

We have clear evidence of palestinians attempting to form a unity government. We have clear evidence of israel's response to that. And then we have you and your rather dedicated band of zionist supporters repeating the same rhetoric and even providing us with IDF labelled propaganda drawings.

The the propaganda hamas supplied me with. It's their official Charta. Some of you should read more about both sides of this conflict and not only rely on graphic twitter feeds with no confirmation.

 

[boiled goose]

Are you kidding? You realize that Hamas gets weapons from Iran, which is currently working on nukes.



That's because Egypt decided to make peace with Israel.

If Hamas decides to stop kidnapping Israelis and killing them and firing rockets into Israel (you know, what started all this) then yes, they can make peace. But not until then.

See this is the other side of the problem. Israel should want peace no matter what. Punishing the citizens of gaza for hamas actions is not only unjustifiable it is inhumane.

I dont think the government of Israel wants real piece either.

Two state solution is necessary. Israel has the power and therefore the responsibility to lead.

 

[Chichikov]

It is irrelevant because I didn't even say Israel could not negotiate with those who at one stage called for their destruction, you just jumped to that conclusion. I only took issue with the idea that Hamas has said it will accept a two state solution and has given up the clause in its Charter that says 'destroy Israel' in no uncertain terms. Your response implicitly acknowledged that I'm right so thanks for that.

If you really want me to address the point you are keen on attacking - which I never made - I will simply say that if Hamas can, like Egypt, in future honestly give up its aim to destroy Israel and convince all concerned parties that they won't continue their terrorist activities then of course Israel should negotiate with them in peace talks that would lead to a Palestinian state. The Hamas of today is not the Egypt of yesterday. I'm not really interested in discussing the cease fire terms, we don't know if they were real.

I wasn't attacking you, I was responding to you.
But you did say they will never recognize Israel and that they will always work toward the destruction of Israel.
Unlike you, I don't have crystal ball and I can't predict the future, I do however believe that if you give Palestinians a viable state with decent living conditions, they wouldn't say - nah, fuck it, let's give it all away so we can attack Israel in a fight we will surely lose.

Again, Hamas can say what it fucking want, but it can't destroy Israel, they are not nice people, far from it, but they have not shown themselves to be irrational.

That's because Egypt decided to make peace with Israel.

If Hamas decides to stop kidnapping Israelis and killing them and firing rockets into Israel (you know, what started all this) then yes, they can make peace. But not until then.

Hamas is ready for a 10 years ceasefire under pretty damn reasonable conditions.

 

[Cheesecakebobby]

I wasn't attacking you, I was responding to you.
But you did say they will never recognize Israel and that they will always work toward the destruction of Israel.
Unlike you, I don't have crystal ball and I can't predict the future, I do however believe that if you give Palestinians a viable state with decent living conditions, they wouldn't say - nah, fuck it, let's give it all away so we can attack Israel in a fight we will surely lose.

Again, Hamas can say what it fucking want, but it can't destroy Israel, they are not nice people, far from it, but they have not shown themselves to be irrational.

Still incorrect, I said Hamas says they will never recognise Israel, which is accurate (if I really must find the youtube videos of leaders saying so I will but I imagine you already accept this). That doesn't mean they never will, but obviously they aren't saying 'yeah we might decide in the future that we will recognise those pig-apes after all'. Israel shouldn't be expected to make huge concessions based on the hope that maybe some day soon Hamas will completely change their mind and become besties, and recognising Israel will be absolutely necessary for any future peace deal so why even begin negotiations while they refuse to do so under any circumstances?

 

[neorej]

Are you kidding? You realize that Hamas gets weapons from Iran, which is currently working on nukes.



That's because Egypt decided to make peace with Israel.

If Hamas decides to stop kidnapping Israelis and killing them and firing rockets into Israel (you know, what started all this) then yes, they can make peace. But not until then.

I'm sure building settlements, taking land however and wherever they want, and treating Palestinians like second grade citizens has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

 

[Chichikov]

Still incorrect, I said Hamas says they will never recognise Israel, which is accurate (if I really must find the youtube videos of leaders saying so I will but I imagine you already accept this). That doesn't mean they never will, but obviously they aren't saying 'yeah we might decide in the future that we will recognise those pig-apes after all'. Israel shouldn't be expected to make huge concessions based on the hope that maybe some day soon Hamas will completely change their mind and become besties, and recognising Israel will be absolutely necessary for any future peace deal so why even begin negotiations while they refuse to do so under any circumstances?

So you can see into the future now?
And again, the point is getting peace deal with the Palestinian people, right?
You don't think a ceasefire with Hamas can advance that goal?
You really think these rounds of mini-wars are helping anything?
They haven't been able to stop the rockets and cost a staggering amount of civilian lives.

 

[Razgreez]

The the propaganda hamas supplied me with. It's their official Charta. Some of you should read more about both sides of this conflict and not only rely on graphic twitter feeds with no confirmation.

You still haven't provided evidence. Wikipedia on the other hand provides cited evidence to the contrary

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas_Covenant

In 2010 Hamas leader Khaled Meshaal stated that the Charter is "a piece of history and no longer relevant, but cannot be changed for internal reasons."[6] Hamas have moved away from their charter since they decided to go for political office.[7] In 2009 interviews with the BBC, Tony Blair claimed that Hamas does not accept the existence of Israel and continues to pursue their objectives through terror and violence; Sir Jeremy Greenstock however argued that they have not adopted their charter since they won the Palestinian legislative election, 2006 as part of their political program.[8] Instead they have moved to a more secular stance.[7]

So which is it then? Continue to spread blatant lies and misinformation or provide some evidence to the contrary?

 

[Freezie KO]

Suppose (suspend your disbelief) Israel agreed to Hamas terms and now we have liberated Palestinian territory, with Hamas either a part of the legitimate government or the government itself. Now with this in mind, can you tell us how Hamas can proceed to destroy Israel and accomplish their charter?

The last time Palestinians elected Hamas,there was an immediate schism. Who knows what will be left in the wake of another Palestinian election? Maybe Hamas seizes total control? Maybe the whole thing falls apart, and Palestine becomes just one more in a long line of failed Islamic states.

So given that uncertainty, let's say Israel gives into the list of Hamas demands: There are no tanks on the Gaza border, the border crossings are opened, and suddenly Hamas has an airport and seaport overseen by the same UN that is so politically swayed by its authoritarian member states, it can only manage to pass resolutions on Israel. That dysfunctional UN, the same body that sat by and watched Rwanda happen, is going to be accountable enough to make sure that Hamas doesn't attack Israel?

And it might not even be Hamas that starts the first attacks. Maybe it's unaccountable unknowns such as whomever killed the three teens. Or maybe it's just another Islamist cult that swings in and takes over. Considering the research (that you have posted before) that shows the Palestinians as among the most radicalized among Muslim nations, would it be shocking to see something akin to Iraq or Syria on a smaller scale happening right next door to Israel?

Hamas doesn't have to "accomplish" its charter of destroying Israel. What the list of demands does is open Israel up to attacks. The amount of damage done will be exponentially more costly to Israeli lives than it would be in the current status quo.

When Israel pulled out of settlements in Gaza, they got Hamas firing rockets. They're understandably worried about the same if they pull out completely of the West Bank. The difference between Israel and Hamas is that people call Israel "genocidal", but Israel has the capability to commit that particular crime but doesn't. Hamas uses the actual language of genocide and wouldn't bat an eyelid before running over Israel in its goal of having a Palestine "from the river to the sea," a goal that is shared by many in the territory.

Israel isn't going to agree to a position where they are more likely to face something akin to the second intifada by opening borders and allowing a militarized Palestine. Until the delusional Palestinian leadership understands that, a compromise for a "liberated" Palestine is going to continue to be difficult.

 

[Cheesecakebobby]

So you can see into the future now?
And again, the point is getting peace deal with the Palestinian people, right?
You don't think a ceasefire with Hamas can advance that goal?
You really think these rounds of mini-wars are helping anything?
They haven't been able to stop the rockets and cost a staggering amount of civilian lives.

Practically every single one of your questions is a strawman.

I said Hamas states they will never recognise Israel, NOT that I think they never will. Israel must base their evaluation of Hamas on the present, not the maybe-in-the-future.

I didn't say anything about a ceasefire not achieving any goals. Of course a ceasefire is the goal in the short term, all that is important is ensuring the safety of Palestinian and Israeli civilians. Something like the release of hundreds of terrorists might not help either goal.

I don't want mini wars either but I don't want one big war in which Hamas have 10 years worth of Iranian weapons to kill Israelis with, for example.

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

Seeing reports of Isreal using White Phosphorus. Waiting to confirm but the photos are damning.

 

[Chichikov]

Practically every single one of your questions is a strawman.

I said Hamas states they will never recognise Israel, NOT that I think they never will. Israel must base their evaluation of Hamas on the present, not the maybe-in-the-future.

I didn't say anything about a ceasefire not achieving any goals. Of course a ceasefire is the goal in the short term, all that is important is ensuring the safety of Palestinian and Israeli civilians. Something like the release of hundreds of terrorists might not help either goal.

I don't want mini wars either but I don't want one big war in which Hamas have 10 years worth of Iranian weapons to kill Israelis with, for example.

Is there any chance you're willing to speak about substance instead of fucking semantics and who said what?

But let's move forward and talk about the ceasefire, Hamas does not demand a wide open borders, it calls for internationally controlled borders.
It's possible they'll be able to smuggle more missiles than they have right now, I don't know, my guess is that they're not going to try to smuggle through Israel, but who knows.
They still aren't going to be able to destroy Israel, the level of risk they pose is pretty much what you're seeing now.
But the importantly point is that this ceasefire give you 10 years to show the Palestinian people that peace is preferable to attacking Israel. You make a Palestinian state that is less of a hell-hole, you give people something to lose, and they'll choose peace.

No, Hamas is not a perfect partner, Israel had a chance to deal with Fatah and was unwilling to dismantle settlements in the west bank, you keep occupying them they'll only going to get more radicalize.

 

[Freezie KO]

It's possible they'll be able to smuggle more missiles than they have right now, I don't know, my guess is that they're not going to try to smuggle through Israel, but who knows.

Do you at least understand why the actual people whose lives are at stake may not choose "who knows" over the status quo?

 

[Cheesecakebobby]

Is there any chance you're willing to speak about substance instead of fucking semantics and who said what?

But let's move forward and talk about the ceasefire, Hamas does not demand a wide open borders, it calls for internationally controlled borders.
It's possible they'll be able to smuggle more missiles than they have right now, I don't know, my guess is that they're not going to try to smuggle through Israel, but who knows.
They still aren't going to be able to destroy Israel, the level of risk they pose is pretty much what you're seeing now.
But the importantly point is that this ceasefire give you 10 years to show the Palestinian people that peace is preferable to attacking Israel. You make a Palestinian state that is less of a hell-hole, you give people something to lose, and they'll choose peace.

No, Hamas is not a perfect partner, Israel had a chance to deal with Fatah and was unwilling to dismantle settlements in the west bank, you keep occupying them they'll only going to get more radicalize.

There is no need for that language and you are the one who repeatedly misinterpreted my clear remarks and banged on about crystal balls.

It's interesting that you are accepting these claimed ceasefire conditions as bonafide fact, can I please have a link to the full list if they have been verified? I won't have time to reply from now on but I will do so later.

 

[Timedog]

Still incorrect, I said Hamas says they will never recognise Israel, which is accurate (if I really must find the youtube videos of leaders saying so I will but I imagine you already accept this). That doesn't mean they never will, but obviously they aren't saying 'yeah we might decide in the future that we will recognise those pig-apes after all'. Israel shouldn't be expected to make huge concessions based on the hope that maybe some day soon Hamas will completely change their mind and become besties, and recognising Israel will be absolutely necessary for any future peace deal so why even begin negotiations while they refuse to do so under any circumstances?

What are the huge concessions? Letting people live semi-normal lives? Do you think not letting people live semi-normal lives is going to help bring about peace? Has that worked for them so far?

 

[neorej]

Seeing reports of Isreal using White Phosphorus. Waiting to confirm but the photos are damning.

What? Source?

 

[Chichikov]

Do you at least understand why the actual people whose lives are at stake may not choose "who knows" over the status quo?

Because this blockade and those mini-wars did such a marvelous job protecting them,

There is no need for that language and you are the one who repeatedly misinterpreted my clear remarks and banged on about crystal balls.

It's interesting that you are accepting these claimed ceasefire conditions as bonafide fact, can I please have a link to the full list if they have been verified? I won't have time to reply from now on but I will do so later.

I don't accept anything.
I'm saying Israel current course of action of refusing to negotiate with Hamas, blockade and periodic rounds of escalation while hoping that this will somehow make the people of Gaza overthrow Hamas and instill a more Israel friendly government isn't working.
And it's causing a whole lot of deaths.
You have hundreds of people dead, most of them civilians, what the fuck do you think any of that is going to achieve?

 

[King_Moc]

What? Source?

There's photos all over twitter. Just search 'phosphorus'. I didn't see anything too graphic in the first few tweets, just skyline shots of it.

 

[Spacecowboy77]

Can someone explain why Hamas is refusing the Egypt cease fire offer?

It seems to me that Egypt just sits there doing nothing while people in Gaza are suffering.

They do have a border with them, right? Cant they at least help with the humanitarian crisis?

 

[OminoMichelin]

There's photos all over twitter. Just search 'phosphorus'. I didn't see anything too graphic in the first few tweets, just skyline shots of it.

I heard reports yesterday that mentioned the use of "white gas".

 

[StuKen]

Israel isn't going to agree to a position where they are more likely to face something akin to the second intifada by opening borders and allowing a militarized Palestine. Until the delusional Palestinian leadership understands that, a compromise for a "liberated" Palestine is going to continue to be difficult.

Its far more than a militarized palestine they cannot accept. Its one that is capable of even the slightest self determination. Israel demanded as part of earlier rounds of talks that any "state" would not have an army, final control over policing, control over airspace, ports, border crossings, water, power generation or sanitation. All these "state" functions would be under Israeli control, just like they are now. What is there to compromise on? Any agreement on those terms brings would have brought them to very same position they are in now. The only difference is they have imposed their terms for peace with the barrel of a gun. Israel will never allow for anything that could enable any amount of self determinism of the Palestinian people and with that anything that resembles a functional state. Only managed subjugation and periodic brutalization to teach them who's really in charge.

 

[Razgreez]

Can someone explain why Hamas is refusing the Egypt cease fire offer?

It seems to me that Egypt just sits there doing nothing while people in Gaza are suffering.

They do have a border with them, right? Cant they at least help with the humanitarian crisis?

The reason has been explained countless times. You're either pushing an agenda or being obtuse so which is it?

As for Egypt? Their military dictator receives funding from the US. Why would they bite the hand that helps them stay in power. Assisting the Palestinians would not be viewed too kindly by israel and, by extension, the US

 

[jakonovski]

Seeing reports of Isreal using White Phosphorus. Waiting to confirm but the photos are damning.

White phosphorus and flechettes, weapons designed to inflict maximum suffering on human targets. Completely useless in taking out fortified arms caches.

Israel is not even trying to do anything except kill people anymore.

 

[Joni]

Can someone explain why Hamas is refusing the Egypt cease fire offer?

It seems to me that Egypt just sits there doing nothing while people in Gaza are suffering.

They do have a border with them, right? Cant they at least help with the humanitarian crisis?

Hamas is related to the Muslim Brotherhood that was abolished and declared illegal by the current government. They aren't friends.

 

[Spacecowboy77]

The reason has been explained countless times. You're either pushing an agenda or being obtuse so which is it?

As for Egypt? Their military dictator receives funding from the US. Why would they bite the hand that helps them stay in power. Assisting the Palestinians would not be viewed too kindly by israel and, by extension, the US

Jesus Christ, you people are way too twitchy in your responses.

The only explanation I read in this thread was "Egypt doesn't like Hamas". That doesn't explain why the whole population of Gaza is hold accountable for their actions.

Hamas is related to the Muslim Brotherhood that was abolished and declared illegal by the current government. They aren't friends.

Thank you

 

[Interceptor]

White phosphorus and flechettes, weapons designed to inflict maximum suffering on human targets. Completely useless in taking out fortified arms caches.

Israel is not even trying to do anything except kill people anymore.

I heard they are using chemtrails as well in gaza. Goddamn. Just imagine any other country doing it.

 

[zeroOman]

Hamas is related to the Muslim Brotherhood that was abolished and declared illegal by the current government. They aren't friends.

Not just that... the Arab world is divided between country who against revolution in middle east and whom with the revolution.....

now the Saudi gov against revolution that was shown when they told Ben Ali to come and live in Saudi Arabia.... and again in Egypt revolution... when they kept holding to Mubarak gov and even said they welcome him there..... that why Qatar is hated by some of these country cause of Al jazeera who was the first media who kept following these revolution even after the gov start attacking them and closing headquarter, which after the coup the same thing happen cuz the new gov hate free-speech

That why gov like the Saudi and Dubai keep founding Egypt with alot of money why.... Do u need to ask!!!

Now all the opposition in Egypt who where against Morsi Left politics or hiding or joined the army gov.....

and if u watch the Egypt media u would see how they attack Hamas and say they are with the Israel to push Egypt to war or some plane to fuk Egypt peace it's the same ppl who were against revolution and "Who said the revolution is terrorist" or "And funded by the U.S. and Israel" are still there talking shit and kissing to the gov....

 

[TheContact]

Wait, what are those Obama-drones doing then in all sorts of countries? Shooting flowers? They are using drones on locations, where US just assumes that there may be a terrorist (which may just be a cellphone being around that location). Because fuck children + civilians.

So I guess you should have said "If any other country besides US and Israel did this..."

Drones aren't firing without some kind of on the ground confirmation of what they're shooting. Now I'm not saying misinformation doesn't happen but it's not like their only clue is what the pilots see in fuzzy heat patterns

 

[kmag]

Collective punishment is a war crime. This might seem like a minor thing considering what's happening in Gaza but http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=714385 lets not kid ourselves about Israel's behaviour as prison keeper.

 

[Dead Man]

Wait, what are those Obama-drones doing then in all sorts of countries? Shooting flowers? They are using drones on locations, where US just assumes that there may be a terrorist (which may just be a cellphone being around that location). Because fuck children + civilians.

So I guess you should have said "If any other country besides US and Israel did this..."

Of course. What the fuck is the point of this post? You think I approve of the drone usage? :/

 

[Doctor Ninja]

Let me say this as an Arab person who lives in the middle east.

I do not hate Jews, never did. But I am sad to say that I am a minority here, a lot of people have grown to hate Zionists and in turn they started to put Zionism and Judaism together as if one cannot be complete without the other but that is not true, you don't need to be Jewish to be Zionist and don't need to be Zionist to be Jewish. My personal hatreds are against Zionism's crimes against humanity and not Jews. I just wanted to clear that out so nobody would claim that I am an antisemitic person.

What happens in Palestine is nothing short of a massacre and had been going on for nearly 50 years since the six day war in 1967 and maybe even before that. Israel made immense crimes against humanity and no one can deny that, but at the same time I am having a very hard time supporting Palestine when they're doing methods that clearly doesn't work. Violence and Jihadist ways of doing things does not work and will not work against Israel because they're a too powerful foe to fight against so they will never win when they're at a huge disadvantage.

The only solution to this matter is trying their best to make a peace treaty but is seems like neither side is interested in making one (Remember what happened to Rabin?). Fatah seems like they want to make a peace treaty but Hamas clearly doesn't which caused a long conflict between the two groups which caused Hamas to take over the Gaza strip back in 2007. Not all Palestinians support Hamas but a lot do because they think they're the only one who has the courage to fight Israel among the Arabs but they are thinking emotionally and not rationally. I get it, they say their loved ones die by the hands of The Israeli but violence didn't work and will not work. So a peace treaty is the only thing that could stop this but a lot of people would see this as giving up and it's a form of weakness. I see it that sometimes it is the right thing to do and a lot of nations have risen to be great after giving up in war, Germany and Japan are the prime examples.

This is my take on the matter and I hope I didn't sound biased.

That was rather insightful to read from a guy in the middle east. Indeed neither side giving up what they want is what made this a very long conflict.

 

[Razgreez]

That was rather insightful to read from a guy in the middle east. Indeed neither side giving up what they want is what made this a very long conflict.

It's a nice post if not filled with logical fallacies. Comparing Germany and Japan to Gaza is illogical since in neither situation were those who attacked them interested purely in the land they inhabited. Let's be clear, zionists want israel and to accomplish that there can be no palestine.

And please do not bring up the hamas charter which hamas representatives have clearly stated they do not abide by (and a simple google search can prove)

 

[Miles Quaritch]

White phosphorus and flechettes, weapons designed to inflict maximum suffering on human targets. Completely useless in taking out fortified arms caches.

Israel is not even trying to do anything except kill people anymore.

When did the flechettes news beeak? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

 

[yarden24]

The reason has been explained countless times. You're either pushing an agenda or being obtuse so which is it?

As for Egypt? Their military dictator receives funding from the US. Why would they bite the hand that helps them stay in power. Assisting the Palestinians would not be viewed too kindly by israel and, by extension, the US

every time someone asks a question you answer with a snarky remark before actually saying anything, it doesn't help the discussion.

 

[Razgreez]

every time someone asks a question you answer with a snarky remark before actually saying anything, it doesn't help the discussion.

You're going to have to provide the evidence of "every time". I've never been asked a question directly and have responded to very few directly.

It's more a case of doing a simple thread search rather than asking the same questions that have been asked and answered few pages back. If we all keep repeating the same statements, like paid zionist supporters are endeavoring to do, then it no longer becomes a discussion but a thread full of slogans

 

[Doctor Ninja]

It's a nice post if not filled with logical fallacies. Comparing Germany and Japan to Gaza is illogical since in neither situation were those who attacked them interested purely in the land they inhabited. Let's be clear, zionists want israel and to accomplish that there can be no palestine.

And please do not bring up the hamas charter which hamas representatives have clearly stated they do not abide by (and a simple google search can prove)

His main point was that violence will not help the Palestinians at all and never will so a peace treaty is the only solution. But Israel and Hamas won't do it.

 

[zeroOman]

When did the flechettes news beeak? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

I mentioned before....

 

[lenos16]

Man terrible news. Sometimes I think it's best to just give the two sides nukes. Mutually assured destruction has to keep them at bay from massacring each other right?

 

[Chariot]

Man terrible news. Sometimes I think it's best to just give the two sides nukes. Mutually assured destruction has to keep them at bay from massacring each other right?

I really don't think that it would be a good idea to give Hamas nukes.

 

[Pollux]

Man terrible news. Sometimes I think it's best to just give the two sides nukes. Mutually assured destruction has to keep them at bay from massacring each other right?

No. Because neither side is led by a rational actor.

 

[Joel Was Right]

http://vimeo.com/50531435

 

[slit]

Man terrible news. Sometimes I think it's best to just give the two sides nukes. Mutually assured destruction has to keep them at bay from massacring each other right?

Religious fanaticism, irrationality and nukes do not mix well.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The reason has been explained countless times. You're either pushing an agenda or being obtuse so which is it?

As for Egypt? Their military dictator receives funding from the US. Why would they bite the hand that helps them stay in power. Assisting the Palestinians would not be viewed too kindly by israel and, by extension, the US

It's not that: Sisi is against the MB and other Islamists groups, so he doesn't want the Palestinian issue to fuel protests. Same reason other Arab states don't want this to be too much of a big deal in their territories. They don't want instability, especially at the border, otherwise the next thing you know some Egyptians capture an Israeli soldier, and then what? Egypt would like to see the Gaza strip under complete Israeli control for stability.

 

[TheContact]

http://vimeo.com/50531435

That was good

 

[Dopus]

When did the flechettes news beeak? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

Yesterday, and it's been mentioned in a number of places.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/20/israel-using-flechette-shells-in-gaza

 

[Yagharek]

Man terrible news. Sometimes I think it's best to just give the two sides nukes. Mutually assured destruction has to keep them at bay from massacring each other right?

MAD worked for the US and USSR since there were oceans either side of them. MAD doesnt work so well when the two belligerents are embedded within each other's geographical footprint.

Or, that hasn't been tested in practice yet and I hope to hell it never is.

 

[RamzaIsCool]

MAD worked for the US and USSR since there were oceans either side of them. MAD doesnt work so well when the two belligerents are embedded within each other's geographical footprint.

Or, that hasn't been tested in practice yet and I hope to hell it never is.

Pakistan and India?

 

[zeroOman]

So sad....

Kristen Chick ‏@kristenchick 46s
Interviewed members of the Abu Jamaa family in Khan Younis today. At least 24 members of the same family killed in one strike. #gaza

https://twitter.com/kristenchick/status/491192540935102464

 

[Yagharek]

There's still enough separation between the two where if only one side launched, the other wouldn't suffer serious fallout.

If Israel nuked Palestine or vice versa, that's an own goal. Everyone is in range of it.

(also, this is all I'll say on the matter since this is a more important topic than musing about MAD or WW3).

 

[Dash27]

I'm guessing this has been posted but, Bill Clinton summed it up well:

http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/th...economic-policies-bill-clinton-to-ndtv/330252

http://www.thetower.org/0719-bill-clinton-hamas-crass-strategy-is-to-kill-palestinians/

Hamas was perfectly well aware of what would happen if they started raining rockets into Israel. They fired one thousand and they have a strategy designed to force Israel to kill their own civilians so that the rest of the world will condemn them.

They (Israel) know when Hamas attacks them that Hamas has set up a situation which politically it can’t lose, because they (Israelis) can say ‘well if I attack them back they always hide behind civilians and I’ll kill civilians, and if I don’t we’ll look like fools letting somebody shoot a thousand rockets at us and not responding.’

In the short and medium term Hamas can inflict terrible public relations damage by forcing (Israel) to kill Palestinian civilians to counter Hamas. But it’s a crass strategy that takes all of our eyes off the real objective which is a peace that gets Israel security and recognition and a peace that gets the Palestinians their state.

 

[Real Hero]

They aren't being forced to kill civilians.