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[Vermillion]

African American annoys me. I have no affiliation to Africa.

Black is fine.

Africa is pretty far back in my lineage as far as I know. I'll do a full check one day, but.

 

[MorisUkunRasik]

Wait, that's bad? Oriental means, well, from the orient, it's one of those "transparent" words from Spanish. I would have make that mistake unknowingly o.o

Don't use it. It was never even accurate and very vague since it means 'east'. What race or ethnicity is the middle east to Japan?

 

[GoldenEye 007]

Africa is pretty far back in my lineage as far as I know. I'll do a full check one day, but.

That's really the thing. I mean ok, 3-400+ years ago my distant relatives were brought to the Americas against their will. I get it.

But now? Immediate family and their ancestors? I'm American and identify as such. The continent of Africa has little practical relevance to me.

Maybe in the future I will consider doing some exploration. But until then, America it is.

 

[CrankyJay]

Sounds about right for New York.

Sounds about right for everywhere? What's special about NY's ignorance?

 

[Scrooged]

wikipedia doesn't even count as a source for a high school paper but you're going to cling to that as if negro wasn't even used derogatorily in spanish too?

again. there's a possibility you might be wrong

i'm just saying. its there.

you can keep telling minorities when exactly they started to become offended by things though. i'm sure they don't know shit.

I'm sorry, I didn't realize this was a formal debate. Give me a break.

Is the fact that the term was embraced by MLK Jr. and Frederick Patterson (founder of UNCF) not enough evidence for you?

 

[Gordon Shumway]

Sounds about right for New York.

Sounds about right for everywhere? What's special about NY's ignorance?

Ha! Fl vs NY..

 

[CrankyJay]

Ha! Fl vs NY..

My man!

 

[Kelpie]

Wait, that's bad? Oriental means, well, from the orient, it's one of those "transparent" words from Spanish. I would have make that mistake unknowingly o.o

I was taught that oriental can be used to describe things like rugs or vases but the word shouldn't be used to refer to people.

 

[Big Baybee]

I'm sorry, I didn't realize this was a formal debate. Give me a break.

Is the fact that the term was embraced by MLK Jr. and Frederick Patterson (founder of UNCF) not enough evidence for you?

What is your point? Fact is, they are no longer acceptable ways to address black people. What exactly are you complaining about?

 

[Angelus Errare]

You can say just "Asian" or "Hispanic" without being racist though.

You can totally come off as racist while saying those if you use them in a condescending manner. Ex.

"You Asian people are so smart"

or

"You Hispanic people are always complaining".

It's still apples to oranges because you'd never call African Americans "African" and omit America unless you're being an ass on purpose.
Likewise you'll never refer to Asians by skin tone (yellow) like you do with blacks.

 

[MIMIC]

Colored is better than Negro? Now I feel like I'm behind, too. Can someone give me a tier list or something?

Heck no....at least, not to me. For me, it goes:

African-American (acceptable and PC; the way to go whenever in doubt)
Black (widely considered acceptable)
Person of Color (acceptable; pretty dated term though)
Negro (unacceptable)
Colored (unacceptable)
N-word (obviously unacceptable)

EDIT: I'd say "colored" is worse than "negro" because the former is pretty much referencing segregation ("Colored Only", "Colored Served in Rear", etc)

 

[Camp Lo]

Heck no....at least, not to me. For me, it goes:

African-American (acceptable and PC; the way to go whenever in doubt)
Black (widely considered acceptable)
Person of Color (acceptable; pretty dated term though)
Negro (unacceptable)
Colored (unacceptable)
N-word (obviously unacceptable)

That's what you get called right before you're tased in your butt ass and arrested.

 

[Gordon Shumway]

That's what you get called right before you're tased in your butt ass and arrested.

Shit's not funny, but you got me laughing..

 

[Scrooged]

What is your point? Fact is, they are no longer acceptable ways to address black people. What exactly are you complaining about?

I've made like 5 posts in this thread and this is the second time I'm having to say that I know that the word is offensive now. My whole point was that the word used to be embraced by blacks before the 60s. Please just read the thread.

The younger generation during the civil rights movement moved away from the word in order to distance themselves from the past. Funny thing about language and words is that they can change over time and mean different things to different people.

 

[Enzom21]

Heck no....at least, not to me. For me, it goes:

African-American (acceptable and PC; the way to go whenever in doubt)
Black (widely considered acceptable)
Person of Color (acceptable; pretty dated term though)
Negro (unacceptable)
Colored (unacceptable)
N-word (obviously unacceptable)

EDIT: I'd say "colored" is worse than "negro" because the former is pretty much referencing segregation ("Colored Only", "Colored Served in Rear", etc)

Colored was the preferred term for black Americans until W.E.B. Du Bois, following the lead of Booker T. Washington, advocated for a switch to Negro in the 1920s.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_.../01/when_did_the_word_negro_become_taboo.html
As far as negro goes:

It started its decline in 1966 and was totally uncouth by the mid-1980s. The turning point came when Stokely Carmichael coined the phrase black power at a 1966 rally in Mississippi. Until then, Negro was how most black Americans described themselves. But in Carmichael's speeches and in his landmark 1967 book, Black Power: The Politics of Liberation in America, he persuasively argued that the term implied black inferiority. Among black activists, Negro soon became shorthand for a member of the establishment. Prominent black publications like Ebony switched from Negro to black at the end of the decade, and the masses soon followed. According to a 1968 Newsweek poll, more than two-thirds of black Americans still preferred Negro, but black had become the majority preference by 1974. Both the Associated Press and the New York Times abandoned Negro in the 1970s, and by the mid-1980s, even the most hidebound institutions, like the U.S. Supreme Court, had largely stopped using Negro.

 

[devonodev]

As a white person who hasn't been around many black people in my life, I thought negro was the word you used when you didn't want to be offensive. I wouldn't use it personally, but I didn't think there was a problem with it.

 

[Enzom21]

As a white person who hasn't been around many black people in my life, I thought negro was the word you used when you didn't want to be offensive. I wouldn't use it personally, but I didn't think there was a problem with it.

Not even remotely.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

Why is this argument about MLK jr keep showing up? He's not the final on black people. And he hasn't spoken a word in nearly 50 years. And black people are not the Borg with a singular mindset. And he hasn't been alive since 68.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

As a white person who hasn't been around many black people in my life, I thought negro was the word you used when you didn't want to be offensive. I wouldn't use it personally, but I didn't think there was a problem with it.

Well I'm glad you've discovered you shouldn't

 

[many places]

That's like using Oriental to describe an asian person in this day and age.

Isn't that just describing where they are from, the orient?

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

I've made like 5 posts in this thread and this is the second time I'm having to say that I know that the word is offensive now. My whole point was that the word used to be embraced by blacks before the 60s. Please just read the thread.

The younger generation during the civil rights movement moved away from the word in order to distance themselves from the past. Funny thing about language and words is that they can change over time and mean different things to different people.

And many have pointed out that you can't rely on this alleged 'embrace' because of the climate. Black's didn't have the right to name themselves. People moved away from it because of the offensiveness.

And I still call bullshit on black people embracing it. You're going to have to give a source on that.

 

[MorisUkunRasik]

Isn't that just describing where they are from, the orient?

Asian is the term you're looking for, the orient isn't exclusively defined by Asia.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

I've made like 5 posts in this thread and this is the second time I'm having to say that I know that the word is offensive now. My whole point was that the word used to be embraced by blacks before the 60s. Please just read the thread.

The younger generation during the civil rights movement moved away from the word in order to distance themselves from the past. Funny thing about language and words is that they can change over time and mean different things to different people.

I'm following quotes back to your first post in the thread: you say negro was considered "perfectly fine" decades ago, then you say it was a word in spanish, then you cite wikipedia which shows you couldn't delineate between "accepted" and "were perfectly fine with," then you performed a triple-Salchow, then stuck the landing and became indignant that people took issue with you bringing this up in the first place.

If you acknowledge that language changes over time, why focus on that one sentence from the story? Why ardently defend your (flawed) point about negro being acceptable at some point in the past? Forgive us if we find this particular instance of defending historical accuracy seems suspect, and is definitely tangential to the story.

_______________

Not directed at you, but: there needs to be a guidebook to non-racist etiquette. It'll need annual editions, like the AP style book. And at the end, it says "now stop and realize: you shouldn't even have needed to look through this, did you?"

 

[oxrock]

I may be ignorant but I don't see what the hubbub is all about. The word negro may of originated from a time of slavery but as far as I know, it was the proper description of a black person and not derogatory. I'm fairly certain we're all aware of the term coined to insult people originating from Africa. It seems ridiculous to me that not only people take offense to its usage but that its become news worthy. It's a simple descriptor, the same as tall, wide,thin,light,heavy, etc. As far as I can see, it's only an offensive or negative term if you think or feel negatively about black people, otherwise its quite neutral. So without derogatory adjectives attached, I just don't understand why there'd be a problem at all.

 

[Camp Lo]

It just never ends.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Isn't that just describing where they are from, the orient?

Really strange you're that obtuse on that but rock an Utada avatar.

 

[Enzom21]

I may be ignorant but I don't see what the hubbub is all about. The word negro may of originated from a time of slavery but as far as I know, it was the proper description of a black person and not derogatory. I'm fairly certain we're all aware of the term coined to insult people originating from Africa. It seems ridiculous to me that not only people take offense to its usage but that its become news worthy. It's a simple descriptor, the same as tall, wide,thin,light,heavy, etc. As far as I can see, it's only an offensive or negative term if you think or feel negatively about black people, otherwise its quite neutral. So without derogatory adjectives attached, I just don't understand why there'd be a problem at all.

You're wrong it is nothing but offensive at this point. You don't get to decide what I or other black people find offensive.

 

[J10]

Please don't address me the way slave owners would have. Thanks.

 

[DY_nasty]

I'm sorry, I didn't realize this was a formal debate. Give me a break.

Is the fact that the term was embraced by MLK Jr. and Frederick Patterson (founder of UNCF) not enough evidence for you?

man please

i'm sorry i raised the stakes by laughing at your intention to bring wikipedia definitions into a discussion like this with a straight face. just know that you might be wrong about some things in your life and it won't fucking kill you

And many have pointed out that you can't rely on this alleged 'embrace' because of the climate. Black's didn't have the right to name themselves. People moved away from it because of the offensiveness.

And I still call bullshit on black people embracing it. You're going to have to give a source on that.

basically this

there's a lot of shit from that era that has either changed entirely or been left in the past. the fact that UNCF has been doing good work for all that time and has a name that says "we did good when it was hard for a long damn time"and is the only reason it hasn't been turned into something itself. the institution itself is historical. MLK using a white-given label in a speech where he was THE pacifist doesn't mean that some blacks in the crowd didn't sneer at it

*gasp*

not all black people liked MLK either. but keep telling them that he's their superman and the best that they could ever be. non-violent in the face of oppression, one of the good ones, etc

 

[JDSN]

I may be ignorant but I don't see what the hubbub is all about. The word negro may of originated from a time of slavery but as far as I know, it was the proper description of a black person and not derogatory. I'm fairly certain we're all aware of the term coined to insult people originating from Africa. It seems ridiculous to me that not only people take offense to its usage but that its become news worthy. It's a simple descriptor, the same as tall, wide,thin,light,heavy, etc. As far as I can see, it's only an offensive or negative term if you think or feel negatively about black people, otherwise its quite neutral. So without derogatory adjectives attached, I just don't understand why there'd be a problem at all.

Please refer to a black person as a negro in real life, im not taking about fabricated black friends or random people online that also pretend to be black and say its okay to use the word, go outside, find someone a ask them for directions for whatever the fuck while calling them negro.

You are incredibly ignorant in a purposeful manner, when you make the conscious choice to infantilize the plea of a group of people just so you can keep using a single damn word, dont be surprised when people call you a dick. Pretty ironic from the person that said:

I'm constantly battling myself not to use gay as a derogatory term. I'm actually very accepting of people being gay but for some reason I've been saying this ever since I can remember. I think it's just something stupid I picked up from my older brother as a child that never faded. Sometimes it just hits me out of nowhere when I say something that it's really insensitive and I try to adjust my active vocabulary. It doesn't happen overnight unfortunately.

Why not show the same empathy and restrain in this case? What makes it so fundamentally different? Because some of your posts in the past about this subject have been....problematic.

 

[Zoc]

I'm white, but I think it's pretty easy to see why black people would find the word negro offensive. It's the same reason words like eskimo, indian (for Native Americans), chinaman, gypsy, etc, are offensive now: those are all words white people made to describe others, rather than words people chose to describe themselves. Of course they don't want to keep hearing those names after they've chosen new ones for themselves.

 

[Ahasverus]

I was taught that oriental can be used to describe things like rugs or vases but the word shouldn't be used to refer to people.

Don't use it. It was never even accurate and very vague since it means 'east'. What race or ethnicity is the middle east to Japan?

Thank you. This is really NEWS to me. There are simply things that aren't clear enough in language, some context awareness is neccessary.

 

[Stinkles]

Sounds about right for everywhere? What's special about NY's ignorance?

They are also ignorant about how ordinary their pizza is.

 

[Adam_Roman]

This is the second story about race that's blown up nationally from the Buffalo area in like, 3 months. Gotta love being a Western New Yorker...

 

[Bucket Mouse]

But what do you call your black people?

Well, if it comes up, we use "black" too, but that would obviously be in regards to their race/ethnicity, not nationality.

"African American" is really the only one. I've always said that I was "Hungarian," my wife says she's "Italian." Obviously we were both born here in the US so we're technically neither. I guess you can't call someone "African" though.

You might self-identify that way, but I think most people would just see that you're both white and refer to you as "Americans". As Angelus pointed out, Asian American, Hispanic American and Native American are all terms that are still in regular use to categorise those ethnic groups.

With regards to your other post, I can certainly understand why you'd think "Asian" feels more acceptable/less racist than calling a black person an "African", especially in light of the unique significance of black history in American culture. However, if you think about it, simply calling someone who was born in the USA with Chinese heritage an "Asian" has a distancing effect and downplays their American nationality. They are "other".

 

[ShinobiFist]

A lot of my black peeps hate being called African American. I never heard any black person use that term at all besides political folks in NYC. I remember some white girl I use to know from Columbia University that both of her parents where born in South Africa(she is born in the states). When people ask where she's from she replied "I'm African American" The reason people asked is because she has an accent. But I tell you, the faces people had when she says that...Amazing.

 

[Bigfoot]

Asian is the term you're looking for, the orient isn't exclusively defined by Asia.

As far as I know, Oriental is an okay term in Canada. Many Asian restaurants use the term Oriental describing its food or in the restaurant name.

 

[MorisUkunRasik]

As far as I know, Oriental is an okay term in Canada. Many Asian restaurants use the term Oriental describing its food or in the restaurant name.

Oriental is fine when describing rugs or pottery etc, not people.

 

[DY_nasty]

Please refer to a black person as a negro in real life, im not taking about fabricated black friends or random people online that also pretend to be black and say its okay to use the word, go outside, find someone a ask them for directions for whatever the fuck while calling them negro.

You are incredibly ignorant in a purposeful manner, when you make the conscious choice to infantilize the plea of a group of people just so you can keep using a single damn word, dont be surprised when people call you a dick. Pretty ironic from the person that said:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=42918834&postcount=111

Why not show the same empathy and restrain in this case? What makes it so fundamentally different? Because some of your posts in the past about this subject have been....problematic.

lol wow

 

[Enzom21]

Please refer to a black person as a negro in real life, im not taking about fabricated black friends or random people online that also pretend to be black and say its okay to use the word, go outside, find someone a ask them for directions for whatever the fuck while calling them negro.

You are incredibly ignorant in a purposeful manner, when you make the conscious choice to infantilize the plea of a group of people just so you can keep using a single damn word, dont be surprised when people call you a dick. Pretty ironic from the person that said:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=42918834&postcount=111

Why not show the same empathy and restrain in this case? What makes it so fundamentally different? Because some of your posts in the past about this subject have been....problematic.

Ahh... another one. He would never actually call a black person a negro and based on his posting habit, I doubt he knows any black people.

 

[oxrock]

Please refer to a black person as a negro in real life, im not taking about fabricated black friends or random people online that also pretend to be black and say its okay to use the word, go outside, find someone a ask them for directions for whatever the fuck while calling them negro.

You are incredibly ignorant in a purposeful manner, when you make the conscious choice to infantilize the plea of a group of people just so you can keep using a single damn word, dont be surprised when people call you a dick. Pretty ironic from the person that said:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=42918834&postcount=111

Why not show the same empathy and restrain in this case? What makes it so fundamentally different? Because some of your posts in the past about this subject have been....problematic.

Someone went and did some good digging, haha.

Please refer to a black person as a negro in real life, im not taking about fabricated black friends or random people online that also pretend to be black and say its okay to use the word, go outside, find someone a ask them for directions for whatever the fuck while calling them negro.

You are incredibly ignorant in a purposeful manner, when you make the conscious choice to infantilize the plea of a group of people just so you can keep using a single damn word, dont be surprised when people call you a dick.

Firstly, I don't feel that a random black person chosen solely for their proximity to my current location should be a representative to the entirety of the black population. But most importantly, I'm tired of people having to tip toe around what others may take offense to. It's pretty ludicrous. I demand that henceforth people stop referring to potatoes as potatoes because they're largely associated with a negative stereotype pertaining to the Irish. To avoid possibly making the Irish uncomfortable from this day forward, we should really call "potatoes" dirt nuggets from now on.

dont be surprised when people call you a dick.

Speaking of being insensitive, referring to someone as a "dick" and/or using that term in a derogatory manner is offensive to men. Men as a people have suffered through enough without having their genitalia shoved in their face.

Why not show the same empathy and restrain in this case? What makes it so fundamentally different?

Because in that case, calling somebody "gay" when you're upset with them is an obvious attempt to be insulting to that person. Now if someone really is gay and I'm using that descriptor while describing them, then it's not an insult. It's simply a part of who that person is.

Because some of your posts in the past about this subject have been....problematic.

I think the first post you linked isn't overly radical. If you dress in a fashion representative of "thug life" people are going to draw that mental association, possibly responding to you more aggressively than someone dressed as an "upstanding citizen". That's not to say that I endorse that possibility, but I don't inherently believe that everything in the world can be contributed to racism. As to the second link, can you dispute it? Native Africans were in the business of selling other rival native Africans to the whites. It was business to them. Does pointing out historically accurate facts upset black people now too?

 

[thetrin]

You can totally come off as racist while saying those if you use them in a condescending manner. Ex.

"You Asian people are so smart"

or

"You Hispanic people are always complaining".

It's still apples to oranges because you'd never call African Americans "African" and omit America unless you're being an ass on purpose.
Likewise you'll never refer to Asians by skin tone (yellow) like you do with blacks.

I cannot count how many times someone has said my people are good at math. Drives me up the wall.

 

[DY_nasty]

why can't people just take their L and learn from it?

i mean... it should be easy to see by now that doubling down just makes you look like an asshole. being ignorant to some shit you've never had to deal with is forgivable. its too easy. but nooooo

just take the L oxrock. you'll be okay. i promise. learn something.

 

[SapientWolf]

The term "black" just rubs me the wrong way when it's used to categorize people. Even when it's used in a positive way. "Look at all the monumental contributions that blacks have made to modern society." What, are you talking about people or chess pieces? Same thing with "whites." "These policies are discriminatory against whites." Big deal, white gets to go first.

 

[Christopher]

The term "black" just rubs me the wrong way when it's used to categorize people. Even when it's used in a positive way. "Look at all the monumental contributions that blacks have made to modern society." What, are you talking about people or chess pieces? Same thing with "whites." "These policies are discriminatory against whites." Big deal, white gets to go first.

OK so what would you like to be defined when trying to use this categorical system apparently...

Black negro colored and African american all offended people apparently in this thread.

 

[Enzom21]

OK so what would you like to be defined when trying to use this categorical system apparently...

Black negro colored and African american all offended people apparently in this thread.

Yes some people don't like to be called certain things. I am sure most black people don't like being called negro or colored.

If you're so confused about what to call us, try using each of those descriptors the next time you arrest a black person and report back how they respond.

 

[vas_a_morir]

Guys, Scrooged has a Dan Akroyd avatar in a suit. I think he knows just a bit more about the word Negro than you.

Yo is that Combofiend?

 

[ISOM]

Wait, that's bad? Oriental means, well, from the orient, it's one of those "transparent" words from Spanish. I would have make that mistake unknowingly o.o

http://racerelations.about.com/od/understandingrac1/a/racialnamestoavoid.htm

Why “Oriental” Is a No-No

What’s the problem with using the term “Oriental” to describe individuals of Asian descent? Common complaints about the term include that it should be reserved for objects, such as rugs, and not people, and that it’s antiquated—akin to using “Negro” to describe an African American. Howard University Law Professor Frank H. Wu made the comparison in a 2009 New York Times piece about the state of New York banning the use of “Oriental” on government forms and documents. Washington State passed a similar ban in 2002.

“It’s associated with a time period when Asians had a subordinate status,” Professor Wu told the Times. He added that people link the term to old stereotypes of Asians and the era when the United States government passed exclusion acts to keep Asian people from entering the country. Given this, “For many Asian Americans, it’s not just this term: It’s about much more…It’s about your legitimacy to be here,” Wu said.

In the same piece, historian Mae M. Ngai, author of Impossible Subjects: Illegal Aliens and the Making of Modern America, explained that, while the term “Oriental” isn’t a slur, it’s never been widely used by people of Asian descent to describe themselves.

“I think it’s fallen into disfavor because it’s what other people call us. It’s only the East if you’re from somewhere else,” Ngai said, referring to “Oriental’s” meaning—“Eastern.” “It’s a Eurocentric name for us, which is why it’s wrong. You should call people by what (they) call themselves, not how they are situated in relation to yourself.”

Due to the history of the term and the era it evokes, it’s best to follow the leads of New York State and Washington State and delete the word “Oriental” from your lexicon when describing people. When in doubt, use the term Asian or Asian American. However, if you are privy to someone’s specific ethnic background, refer to them as Korean, Japanese American, Chinese Canadian and so forth.

 

[vas_a_morir]

http://racerelations.about.com/od/understandingrac1/a/racialnamestoavoid.htm

It's odd, though. If you were to refer to me as "Western" I wouldn't mind it. If it was in a place where they were speaking an East-Asian language, I'd understand why the term 'western' would make sense and be fair to use.

 

[Professor Beef]

Yo is that Combofiend?

It sure is. Click the image and you can hear him say it.