I don't mind Clara leaving, though that's not because I think she's bad (I've been enjoying her, and I believe she's going to do a great job this season), but because I'd like them to go through companions faster than they did with say Amy. Moffat is not particularly good at building up stories for long stretches of episodes, so I bet he'd benefit from companions having much shorter tenures.
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Doctor Who Series 8 |OT| We've fucking time-travelled, yes?
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infiniteloop
Member
My general thoughts on Ep 3 in the spoiler leak thread:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=125740010&postcount=98
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=125740010&postcount=98
BigWeather
Member
Good choice! Blink (as mentioned) or Girl in the Fireplace would be good choices as well.
Moffat had said he didn't want to do that again, and that introducing both a new Doctor and a new companion in The Eleventh Hour was incredibly hard to figure out -- and that was a script he spent over a year on! Never mind the casting process.
I just don't think that a showrunner, in the middle of their tenure, has enough time or sanity to establish a new Doctor AND a new companion at the same time.
BigWeather
Member
Yeah, that's true about Blink -- too Doctor-light for a proper intro. Vincent and the Doctor or Girl in the Fireplace would be my two choices, maybe decide on whether you want to introduce 10 or 11. Both have nice historical hooks and an emotional heart. Vincent has the better companion -- never was much of a Rose fan. Though Mickey is in Girl, so that's nice.
The first 6 were left on a server anyone could access. 3 are out so far.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Would you prefer The Watcher? How about Kanye?
What's great about this gif is it makes about as much as sense as either the Watcher or Kanye
or the Valeyard
I'll only be sorry to see Jenna go if this year her character actually develops. Considering how terrible character development has been during Moffat's tenure with the exception of Rory - and even then he was still largely a plot device like 90 percent of Moffat's sidekicks - I'm slightly skeptical.
I'll be sad as hell to no longer see her, though.
IdreamofHIME
Member
They're quoting the Mirror, who have no source...except some 'BBC insider'. Their article is also hideously written.
Her quitting could bring as end to her time as Clara? What? What else could it do?
it also says she will be one of the longest serving companions ever...that's not true.
...and this is from a BBC source?
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Yeah, that bothered me too. Weren't Nyssa and Teagan around from like Doctor 4 until the last season of Doctor 5? And weren't Zoe and Jamie around for the entirety of Doctor 2?
ClivePwned
Member
Not quite.
Jamie was in the series nearly three years, Zoe just one year. Jamie would have appeared in more episodes than any other companion since they made 40 or so eps a year in the 60's.
Tegan was in 4th Doctors last story and for all bar two of the 5th Doctor's stories. (about 3 years). Nyssa was about two years.
Sarah Jane Smith was just over three seasons.
Jo Grant was three full seasons
K-9 was probably the longest (In various versions) at around 3 1/2 years.
Brigadier was a regular (though not in every story) from 68 to 75
Clara being there for 18 or so months is a decent run for the entire series.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
I did like what I saw of Jenna in S8E1, I still won't be sad about her leaving.
Best way to kill her off though, in my opinion? Have the Great Intelligence make one final attempt on The Doctor's life, and have Clara die saving him. As if it was predestined from the very beginning. She was warned she'd die after all.
Best way to kill her off though, in my opinion? Have the Great Intelligence make one final attempt on The Doctor's life, and have Clara die saving him. As if it was predestined from the very beginning. She was warned she'd die after all.
I feel like killing her off would be far too cliche an exit for her character. How many times has she died? I'd prefer if she just decided she was done.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
I feel like the actual list of companions who actually died as in stopped heart functions is very small.
Even if it's just by New Who standards she's smack bang in the middle
How many days? You could go straight to Deep Breath. Really live on the edge!
Clara's problem, in the immortal words of Harry S. Plinkett, is that 'she doesn't have a character'. She's cute and awesome at everything and then some, but those two things aren't enough to give her a personality. Heck, I find her more attractive than any of the previous companions, yet I don't find her nearly as charming because I just don't believe/care about her character.
But that's just Moffat sucking at character development, so whatcha gunna do. Rory is the only Moffat-era companion I feel was legitimately great.
Rory <3
But that's just Moffat sucking at character development, so whatcha gunna do. Rory is the only Moffat-era companion I feel was legitimately great.
Rory <3
Napoleonthechimp
Member
I've slowly been going off Doctor Who. I honestly it is largely because of how overblown the fandom has become.
It used to be this British product that we proudly exported out to everyone, but now it seems to be something shaped by American sensibilities. And that kind of bugs me a little bit.
It used to be this British product that we proudly exported out to everyone, but now it seems to be something shaped by American sensibilities. And that kind of bugs me a little bit.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Honest question: do you think Peter Capaldi would have been cast if it was so influenced by American tastes?
googleplex
Member
Companion rakings
1. Donna
2. Rory
3. Wilfred
4. Amy
5. Rose=Clara
6. Mickey
7. Martha
googleplex
Member
It's amazing how anyone could let a Fandom ruin something for them.
You're a Who Hipster.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
No, I just think when they have a TV show dedicated to Capaldi's announcement (for example) then it starts to become a bit OTT. The other British people I know personally found that event in particular to be kind of ridiculous.
But the BBC did it because the American audience is a big cash cow. And they'll continue to do things like that for the same exact reason.
No, his casting doesn't bother me at all and I also don't think it is impacted by American tastes. What I really dislike is how the BBC - funded by British taxpayers - seems to be making a fair amount of money off the back of international audiences. All the big American centric marketing they seem to be doing seems geared towards achieving that.
I was under the impression the BBC were supposed to be non-commercial.
googleplex
Member
Dude Who is huge all over the world. Not just America.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
paradox121
Member
You do know that's how BBC Worldwide exists right? The BBC as an entity is far from just existing in the UK. It's a huge worldwide corporation that sells its programmes internationally in order to keep itself running.
Arguably if Doctor Who hadn't been so embraced by international audiences it would probably be off the air again.
Hot Coldman
Banned
BBC has an American broadcasting arm called BBC America. They also have a merchandising arm called BBC Worldwide, which handles stuff like Top Gear annuals and Doctor Who toys. Because taxpayer money can't go towards funding international schemes or non-broadcasting ventures, BBCA and BBCW have to be commercial by their very nature. Hence why they engage in more pro-active marketing.
You're a Doctor Who fan who uses the internet a lot, exposing you to American marketing more (you're on an American site now, for example), so naturally you're also being exposed to this marketing. But for most taxpayers, they're probably not noticing the more "OTT" stuff.
Oh, and that money doesn't really go back into the show. When they wanna do US location shoots, BBC America helps fund that, but that's about it. For the most part, the TV show is entirely influenced by taxpayer money, and the rest is superfluous.
tl;dr: BBC isn't commercial, BBC America has to be commercial, the two exist independently of each other, you'e noticing the effects of their collaboration.
Yeah, Martha was pretty bad, and Mickey was completely useless, but the latter in particular was still a bit endearing. Clara is just bland and cold. At least that's what Moffat's writing does to her character.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
I think it really started to irritate me when a couple of years ago the trailer for Doctor Who played on an American comic con event before it was aired in the UK. In fact I don't think it was ever shown here in Britain.
When international audiences get priority over the very people who (indirectly) fund the show... Well, that's when I feel that getting annoyed is justifiable. If they want to pull this stuff off then spin the show off onto whatever commercial entity the BBC has running and fund the show directly that way.
When international audiences get priority over the very people who (indirectly) fund the show... Well, that's when I feel that getting annoyed is justifiable. If they want to pull this stuff off then spin the show off onto whatever commercial entity the BBC has running and fund the show directly that way.
First time I've ever heard this. I disagree entirely. And why not have a show to announce the new Doctor? There was a lot of hype. If they moved production to America or had an American Doctor or something then you'd have a point. Also, they're doing a world tour, not an American tour, it's huge now compared to when Matt was announced. I don't understand how these could put you off the show especially when they're not really related to the show itself.
Wasn't the vast majority of that show just a bunch of minor British celebrities chatting about the show? Doesn't exactly strike me as something made with US viewers in mind. If anything I'd say it was squarely aimed at British fans.
That had nothing to do with favouring one country over another though. If for some reason Comicon had been held in London, or Sydney or Toronto they'd have done the exact same thing.
I'd be happy with this. The Girl That Dies.
She made her choice, after all. It's only right she lives, and does, by it.
As for first episodes, it has to be the Eleventh Hour. No other episode sets up what Dr Who actually is. Blink provides some good time travel scenarios, but doesn't introduce what the show really is week after week.
It gives a weird alien with a magic box and a wand. Then it strips it all back and takes them away. It shows that the Dr gets companions, and the kind of person they will be. It shows that he is an incredible genius, but completely flawed (he was late, imagine how different both his and Amy's lives would be if he really had have been 5 minutes ). It shows that he gets out of impossible situations, then speaks with authority down to the bad bad aliens; and that he's been doing this for a long long time.
After watching that, anyone should be able to jump into any other Dr Who episode and find their bearings pretty easily. The same could only be done off the back of Blink without a lot of commentary by an experienced viewer.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
Then they should have showed it at the same time in Britain. But they never did because somehow exclusivity is a part of the comic con way and if it was shown elsewhere then they wouldn't get to do it again (I believe Moffatt said something to that effect).
Well, fuck 'em.
When they start investing some of that commercially acquired money into the show (I'd wager they're legally not allowed to - hence the budget that never increases) then they can do what they please.
JonathanEx
Member
Some money goes back in to the show in that it goes back in to the BBC as a whole, and some goes back in through funny methods - things like prequels are often funded by them, or specific things they can cofund (like the America two-parter). But it can't all go back in because of BBC rules.
While I disagree that they've gone too far in the America stuff (like the 12th announcement, the only difference really between it and the 11th was that it was more shiny floor and was live - the Confidential special was just for Matt's reveal), the Comic Con stuff did feel off. But the whole exclusive and weird culture round Comic Con is nonsense to me.
While I disagree that they've gone too far in the America stuff (like the 12th announcement, the only difference really between it and the 11th was that it was more shiny floor and was live - the Confidential special was just for Matt's reveal), the Comic Con stuff did feel off. But the whole exclusive and weird culture round Comic Con is nonsense to me.
I wonder if they'll get all six of those work-prints out before the episodes air
That entire episode of Confidential was dedicated to the build up to the 11th Doctor announcement. The Capaldi thing, annoying as it may be is a logical extension of that.
It's complete horse-shit, the con can easily stand on it's own so there's no reason to do it other than to feed the egos of people who manage to get tickets. But the Comic-con organisers will keep doing it for whatever reason until the con inevitably grows too big and dies.
Comic-Con footage is exclusive because that's part of the appeal of going to con; it's how they get people to attend year after year.
Hating something that used to be small but now is big for exactly that reason is ridiculous to me. Hipster cliches aside, why would anyone be annoyed that more people are now enjoying the thing that you enjoy?
Hating something that used to be small but now is big for exactly that reason is ridiculous to me. Hipster cliches aside, why would anyone be annoyed that more people are now enjoying the thing that you enjoy?
I'm personally happy to see more people get into Doctor Who.
I know people who whine about losing that niche show only they and a couple of friends like, and in some tiny way, I feel them. But in the end, more fans is a good thing.
I know they're funded by taxpayer money, but I didn't know they dont really rake in international earnings to be pumped directly into either the show or BBC
I was annoyed like most people here about not seeing footage of The Day of the Doctor that was shown at Comic Con. Looking back now, I'm okay that they held off on revealing the trailer until closer to the day of release. I got to watch The Day of the Doctor with as little footage seen as possible, keeping it all fresh.
They seem to have followed a similar trend with Series 8 marketing, minus Comic Con exclusivity.
/International viewer.
I know people who whine about losing that niche show only they and a couple of friends like, and in some tiny way, I feel them. But in the end, more fans is a good thing.
I know they're funded by taxpayer money, but I didn't know they dont really rake in international earnings to be pumped directly into either the show or BBC
I was annoyed like most people here about not seeing footage of The Day of the Doctor that was shown at Comic Con. Looking back now, I'm okay that they held off on revealing the trailer until closer to the day of release. I got to watch The Day of the Doctor with as little footage seen as possible, keeping it all fresh.
They seem to have followed a similar trend with Series 8 marketing, minus Comic Con exclusivity.
/International viewer.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
It doesn't work like that. The profits from Doctor Who are poured into other BBC shows and don't necessarily lead into a budgetary increase for the show that does the best commercially (same with Top Gear). If anything Doctor Who is better for the BBC asa whole because they have more money to fund other programs, especially at a time when they are being squeezed elsewhere.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Nah I understand finding various fandoms offputting. In a conversation about conventions I once said "I love Doctor Who but I don't think I want to go to a place filled with other people who love Doctor Who". And I don't mean that as an insult or something, its just that my general experience with "fandoms" is iffy
peanutbutterlatte
Member
More entertaining than Strictly Come Wanking or whatever else the Beeb are limping to the barn with these days.
I appreciate Who getting a bigger audience, partially because it means we'll be closer to Lego Doctor Who...
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Last summer one of the kids I was working with made this. I think the minifig in particular is really good
The Real Abed
Perma-Junior
Just ignore Napoleon. If he wants to drop Who because of stupid misguided beliefs then let him. It's not going to affect you and it's not going to make the show any less popular or successful.
JonathanEx
Member
I think it's fair to question the tone of promotion of the show... most of us might disagree, but it's a fair question. But episode 1 feels very much like Doctor Who and perfectly British to me. Which is good.
Right away from the subject though, I picked up the Doctor Who Mag's 50th special guide thing (this one). I don't tend to buy the mag - bluntly too much stuff I don't care about to justify buying, like classic series stuff or reviews. I quite like these guides, but they veer waaay to much in to anal detail rather than interesting articles at the time and so form more like a historical document (on this day, this scene was filmed on set 3A after a 4'33" interview with BBC Radio Fish in which Greg Fnarg stood in for Rachal Vogon), and complies other sources rather than does its own interviews. There's lots of interesting snippets - particularly with the script revisions though, mentioning jokes or scenes that got rewritten and cut, a few lines, and the several versions of getting Peter Cushing references in to the 50th Anniversary.
Right away from the subject though, I picked up the Doctor Who Mag's 50th special guide thing (this one). I don't tend to buy the mag - bluntly too much stuff I don't care about to justify buying, like classic series stuff or reviews. I quite like these guides, but they veer waaay to much in to anal detail rather than interesting articles at the time and so form more like a historical document (on this day, this scene was filmed on set 3A after a 4'33" interview with BBC Radio Fish in which Greg Fnarg stood in for Rachal Vogon), and complies other sources rather than does its own interviews. There's lots of interesting snippets - particularly with the script revisions though, mentioning jokes or scenes that got rewritten and cut, a few lines, and the several versions of getting Peter Cushing references in to the 50th Anniversary.
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