Doctor Who Series 8 |OT| We've fucking time-travelled, yes?

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Just got home, after the episode in the theater we were all talkin about it in the dinner meetup, had a great time with the people there.

About the episode, it was really good, and all the people in the theater seemed to love it, Capaldi included.

The only thing I didnt like to much was the camera on the fight of clara and the paternoster vs the automatons. Its like they didnt know how to move so they moved the canera a lot.

Apart from that, incredible time and capaldi was freaking fantastic. Clara and the paternoster were also awesome (some of the girls in the group at the meetup hated clara, but it same like they already hayed her from before)

And the intro of strax in the theater was incredible. It describes all the doctors and his regenerations. People were laughing without stop during it.
The death of sixth doing static bycicle and the ears of eccleston and chin of matt jokes were hilarious.
All glory to strax!

And seems kuwabara already posted his review. Why doesnt it surprise me one bit.
 
SpacePirate Ridley said:
And the intro of strax in the theater was incredible. It describes all the doctors and his regenerations. People were laughing without stop during it.
The death of sixth doing static bycicle and the ears of eccleston and chin of matt jokes were hilarious.
All glory to strax!
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do you know if there's a way to see those intros?
 
Hopefully they get better. But I didn't really feel like they needed to spend almost what felt like a third of the episode reassuring us Peter Capaldi was actually the Doctor and we should all be okay with it.

Some of it felt really off but I did enjoy Capaldi/Coleman's chemistry at the very least. The rest of it felt like it could've used another pass though.
 
xandaca said:
A lot of people really do seem to like it based on the script spoiler thread. For me (and I'm going to be as vague as possible but will black it out anyway as there's a spoiler of sorts in there),
the idea behind the story - aka what the Doctor is theorising about at the start - is kind of baggy to begin with, never nailing down exactly what it is he is hoping to achieve or what connects his initial theory with the part that drives the action, a particularly overdone cliche of childhood fears. The story thereafter bobs back and forth between different locations, playing the same note over and over again and intercut with Clara and Danny's situation, which does not ring true for a second in terms of how people, even nervous people, interact with each other. Same problem, albeit to a slightly lesser extent, as the Danny scenes in Into The Dalek.

Anyway, AND THIS IS A GENUINE IF UNSPECIFIC SPOILER, the ending expects us to buy that much of what happened up to that point was complete coincidence, making almost the whole episode a particularly meandering, directionless way for Moffat to write another of his series defining moments, which comes out of nowhere and does not inform or change the audience's appreciation of the character and his actions in any way other than a nice link back to a recent episode. It also feels like that point could've easily been reached without 90% of the stuff leading up to it. SPOILER END.

What I meant by my Love & Monsters comment was more that I suspect people like it because it's a bit experimental in parts, and does a Major Character Moment at the end, though for me the whole thing is far too loose in terms of storytelling and motivation and the key final scene is totally unearned and lacking justifiable context within the episode or bigger picture. In other words, it made me feel like I'd wasted 2/3rds of my time watching it - and I don't think it's ever explained how the pre-titles bit with the chalk and board happened either.
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while you've definitely thought through your reply i still can't agree based on the grounds of:
it's a more philosophical episode. it's not really about the fears (in the same way vincent and the doctor was not about the giant chicken monster), but instead exploring the doctor. whenever other writers attempt to shed some light onto the doctor's character (moffat included, previously), they give him lines about hating himself or how he's afraid or power mad or whatever, but then never really characterises those traits.

listen is a lot about the doctor's own insecurities (shown incredibly on the nose by crying in the barn, but nicely linked into the day of the doctor), but also his narcissism and thirst for knowledge. the doctor as an explorer has been very relaxed in the reboot when he had often been characterised as curious to a fault, this was shown in listen through his pontificating and monologuing, and ultimately putting himself at risk to prove a theory which ultimately came back to his own insecurities from a childhood memory.

and even then, it's never truly known if he was right or wrong, because it doesn't really matter. it's not wrapped neatly in a bow, it showed the doctor could be wrong, scared, insecure, dangerous, and even driven to madness on a quest for knowledge and self-assurance instead of just talking about it. it humanised a doctor that has (so far), been very alien. so what if the threat didn't go anywhere? it was always background dressing. it was the ultimate anti-monster of the week episode

... and i'm sure moffat will revisit the concept and drive it into the ground like he has with every interesting idea he's come up with...

no excuse for that love and monsters comment though. that was undeniable crap.
 
I think the second half of the episode was much better than the first. I was not all into the episode until the HoboDoc scene, and everything restaurant scene onwards was great.

Capaldi doc is pretty cool once he get out of Matt Smith mode. Also, this was the first time I've liked Clara.

Also, I liked Clara getting hit in the face with the newspaper.
 
Sober said:
Hopefully they get better. But I didn't really feel like they needed to spend almost what felt like a third of the episode reassuring us Peter Capaldi was actually the Doctor and we should all be okay with it.

Some of it felt really off but I did enjoy Capaldi/Coleman's chemistry at the very least. The rest of it felt like it could've used another pass though.
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Yeah kind of a mixed bag, but then we haven't really had a great new doctor introduction since Rose (Eleventh Hour loses me entirely at the end with that dumbass indulgent speech)

Oh well. Still looking forward to the rest of the season. Just...please...no more victorian england, okay?
 
The Technomancer said:
Yeah kind of a mixed bag, but then we haven't really had a great new doctor introduction since Rose (Eleventh Hour loses me entirely at the end with that dumbass indulgent speech)

Oh well. Still looking forward to the rest of the season. Just...please...no more victorian england, okay?
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What!? Eleventh Hour is up there as my top 5 Who episodes. At least of New Who.
 
Mariolee said:
What!? Eleventh Hour is up there as my top 5 Who episodes. At least of New Who.
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Yeah I know its an unpopular opinion. It just started Matt Smith right off on the path of being an intimidating badass genius, a choice that I would find just as insufferable almost every time they played it up in the future
 
Enjoyed
• Clara, for pretty much the first time ever. Whatever they've changed, it's working.
• Capaldi. Already liked him from before Doctor Who, and he's good here.
• New titles. Not sold on the music yet (lacks power, or something) but the visuals are nicely conceived and well executed.
• Cinematography. I thought this looks quite nice for the most part.
• Everyone else is already saying it, but Jenny is just dreamy.

Didn't Enjoy
• Endless Jenny/Vastra/Strax schtick. For the hundredth time, yes, I know you're freakin' married. And look, Strax is bad at understanding humans! Almost as funny as it was in every other appearance he's ever made.
• Slapstick. Is this really necessary? You don't have to hit Clara in the face for the newspaper joke to be funny. You don't need to add a comedy "BOING!" sound effect for Vastra knocking the Doctor out to be effective. This isn't the Looney Tunes.
• Plot. Kind of a mess. Callbacks to episodes well over half a decade ago, stuff with the Dinosaur that turned out to not really mean anything... this could've been rethought and pruned back to a neater 45 minutes, I think.

I enjoyed it, but I probably wouldn't call it a good story. A promising start in other ways, though.
 
Pretty enjoyable episode. Not sure how much I enjoyed it to be honest. Will have to watch again to really know but right now I'm really positive on Capaldi and his interaction with Jenna Coleman.
 
I think the emphasis on the marriage of Vastra and Jenny again is for the benefit of new viewers. I know several people who were drawn in by the spectacle and Capaldi is their first doctor. It's all new to them.
 
bndadm said:
I was too busy putting imagination to work when I saw her run in with ruffled hair and clothes.
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PaulloDEC said:
Enjoyed
• Clara, for pretty much the first time ever. Whatever they've changed, it's working.
• Capaldi. Already liked him from before Doctor Who, and he's good here.
• New titles. Not sold on the music yet (lacks power, or something) but the visuals are nicely conceived and well executed.
• Cinematography. I thought this looks quite nice for the most part.
• Everyone else is already saying it, but Jenny is just dreamy.

Didn't Enjoy
• Endless Jenny/Vastra/Strax schtick. For the hundredth time, yes, I know you're freakin' married. And look, Strax is bad at understanding humans! Almost as funny as it was in every other appearance he's ever made.
• Slapstick. Is this really necessary? You don't have to hit Clara in the face for the newspaper joke to be funny. You don't need to add a comedy "BOING!" sound effect for Vastra knocking the Doctor out to be effective. This isn't the Looney Tunes.
• Plot. Kind of a mess. Callbacks to episodes well over half a decade ago, stuff with the Dinosaur that turned out to not really mean anything... this could've been rethought and pruned back to a neater 45 minutes, I think.

I enjoyed it, but I probably wouldn't call it a good story. A promising start in other ways, though.
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Actually I think this summarizes my feelings pretty nicely. Clara seems working...more than she did. Capaldi is at least promising. Actual story was kinda rubbish
 
GavinUK86 said:
so only episodes 1 - 5 leaked right? did it ever come to light how?
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Yeah, 6 will probably leak soon though. They were left on a BBC server anybody could access, they were meant to be for a subtitling company. Only 6 of them though.

Also about The Girl Who Waited/Promised land thing, I'm almost completely sure they're just re-using sets.
 
So I've got to watch it again to check my hearing, but was it implied that we're finally going to find out who the girl in the shop (from Bells of St. John) is?
 
I wouldn't have minded the slapstick if it wasn't for the sound effects. Completely took me out of the episode when that happened.

Like the past regenerations I'll need a few episodes to really get to know the new Doctor, but Capaldi was by far the best thing about this episode.

New theme is fantastic.

I was wondering if Clara would cry....and she did. Stop making her cry!
 
I really appreciated the monologue the Doctor had while coping with his new form. Like, only hearing half of a conversation, it was amusing to try to piece together what he was thinking.

Also
fucking lost my shit at the skin hot-air balloon
 
Didn't get to see all of it (was on while I'm at work, watched a good deal on my break) but I liked most of what I saw. Capaldi is a fucking boss.
That whole "abandon Clara and make her cry" part though? Not cool show. Not cool.
 
Very good episode, although not quite top-tier due to the unevenness of the beginning. From the restaurant scene on it was fantastic. Lots of great lines in the script. The
Matt Smith phone call
was great, but unfortunately I had that spoiled for me in the previous thread.

Capaldi owned it. Will be interesting to see how his character evolves. Clara had some nice character development.

I thought the new title sequence was great and liked the new arrangement of the main theme.

GavinUK86 said:
loving the #doctorwho tweets. 17 year old girls saying "that was boring" and middle aged men saying "fucking epic". i'm glad the new who is targeting the correct demographic now.
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JonathanEx said:
And you know teenage girls are unable to watch something unless they fancy someone. Brain cells to enjoy things for other reasons don't develop until you hit 30.
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I found those posts on here after the UK airing interesting, the younger female fans in the US on twitter seem to be completely on board with Capaldi (and loved the premiere). It doesn't seem like the Doctor change is going to hurt BBC America's ratings in that demographic in the US at all.

I'd guess the big difference is the average fan in the US probably started watching on Netflix/Amazon Prime and binge-watched most of NuWho, has seen multiple doctors, and is probably going to be more invested in the show at this point. You'll get a lot more casual fans tuning in and out in the UK just because the show is so widely broadcast there.
 
Love Capaldi's Doctor. Simply fantastic characterization that separates himself from 11 but retains what makes the character.

Surprisingly, Clara actually became someone this episode too. She was complete rubbish last season but I'm really liking her so far.

I will agree with most other people in this thread though, the beginning wasn't good. I was bored blind. Restaurant scene on was great though.
 
mclem said:
Possibly the biggest laugh of the episode in the cinema.
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Same. Strax never fails.

Spaghetti said:
*snipped for brevity*
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I can certainly appreciate that side of the episode, hence my comment about why I think the reason a lot of people like it is because it's more experimental. However, while the intention is admirable,
that doesn't excuse the fact that what narrative strands there are barely make any sense and rely on patronisingly stupid coincidences to pull a fast one on viewers when the episode could've made its point far more easily and concisely without any of the overcomplicated, underwritten and rather clichéd gumpf beforehand. Moffat's the polar opposite of RTD in that he works best when his stories are focused and plot-driven, yet attempts to be clever or mess with the form tend to involve throwing a lot of convoluted nonsense at the wall to see what sticks before getting to the one or two scenes where he actually lays down his point. RTD, by contrast, frequently came up with great concepts and twists on the 'typical' Who expectations, but couldn't fill out a plot to save his life. 'Listen' feels like Moffat wrote it backwards from that final scene, coming up with increasingly haphazard and loosely connected ways of justifying it as the endpoint of an episode, filling out the gaps with run-of-the-mill 'scares' and timey-wimey nonsense for no other reason than an episode of Who seemingly has to have those, with his attempt at subverting the cliche being incoherent and illogical (and, in the case of the bedroom, contradicted within the same scene) to an insulting degree. It may not have anything as singularly atrocious as L&M's paving slab blowjob joke, the generally embarrassing sight of the Abzorbaloff wadding down the street or be anywhere near as boring as that episode, but if the workprint is anything to by, it will almost certainly be among my least favourite of the modern Whos. I admire the intent at examining the Doctor's fears and self-doubt on a deeper, perhaps more contemplative basis, but on all available evidence (script + workprint), the execution looks a total shambles to me and only serves to massively emphasize the biggest deficiencies in Moffat's work.
 
That scene legit made me smile :)

Great transitional episode.

Anyone else notice Capaldi and the lady at the end were wearing the same ring, Capaldi on his left hand ring finger and her's on her middle finger?
 
So , i just finished watching it and .... i'm not that happy.
I'm not convinced yet on the new doctor. It's not that this performance as the doctor isn't great, i think it was alright , BUT THE SCRIPT and dialog were REALLY low.
I really hope the next episode will be more "intense" because i like the characters , i like the new sub-plot i'm just annoyed by how it's handled.

Very weak story IMO

And they managed to do a more harmless dinosaur than in jurasick park 2, congratulations ! he was even afraid of big ben !
 
I thought it was a decent episode. It was a little odd, but that's not saying much considering this show.

I'm looking forward to this new Doctor.
 
First 30 minutes were a bit hesitant. According to a BBC America 'inside the doctor' bit, it was the first episode filmed, unlike The Eleventh Hour, which was the fourth of that season. Loved it once it got going.
 
The Giant said:
We have seen The Promised Land before.

The Girl Who Waited



Deep Breath

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If that's true and not just sets being reused, then
the woman meeting the robot is Clara after being left by the Doctor and becoming the Second Girl Who Waited? It would make too much sense because the woman did mention that 'my boyfriend must have roughed you up.'

As to the actual episode, I liked what I saw of it -- it felt a bit like the 10th Doctor but more understated. I'm going to the theater Monday to see it. Hopefully it's not a waste of money.
 
I might be misremembering but I swear Clara remembered that the Doctor regenerated because I could swear she remembered all her incarnations saving each Doctor up to and including Smith's.

The Smith call was a little overindulgent but to be fair he didn't really do a sendoff for Clara when he regenerated and opted for ghost Amy instead.

Clara no longer being defined only as the impossible girl is nice too.
 
Have you ever drank Ribena without water in it?

Just straight syrupy Ribena.

Episode 4 is like that, but with Moffat tropes instead of Blackcurrents.
 
infiniteloop said:
Have you ever drank Ribena without water in it?

Just straight syrupy Ribena.

Episode 4 is like that, but with Moffat tropes instead of Blackcurrents.
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Looking forward to hearing people's opinions on this when it airs, I've seen some people say it's the best episode since the show came back then in this thread comparing it to Love & Monsters.
 
Sober said:
It's really hard when it is Moffat.
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I would be down for a Moffatism heavy episode if they were infrequent occurrences. As it is I'm sick of all the victorian influences, hoards of "creepy" monsters chanting "creepy" phrases that aren't creepy, the Doctor making a big dramatic speech about how awesome he is, and whatever insufferable idea he has of female sassiness and canniness that leads to characters like River and Vraska who I find ultimately shallow for all of the so clearly designed in "progressivism" of their thin characterizarion
 
The Technomancer said:
I would be down for a Moffatism heavy episode if they were infrequent occurrences. As it is I'm sick of all the victorian influences, hoards of "creepy" monsters chanting "creepy" phrases that aren't creepy, the Doctor making a big dramatic speech about how awesome he is, and whatever insufferable idea he has of female sassiness that leads to characters like River and Vraska
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None of those occur in the episode.
 
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