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[The Great Gonzales]

Is fludd even useful?
Everyone I know that played Mario liked Dr just because he didn't have it.

It has a few specific and situational uses, like keeping people away from a Smash Ball, but otherwise it's pretty useless. I like that Mario has it, since it better represents his character than the Tornado, but it wasn't well-implemented. Hopefully the custom moves, which can give it more force or make it do damage, will improve it.

 

[IntelliHeath]

The guy is banned and gave me no avatar.

Chill out lmao

Okay, I will send a private message to Jedi Link since we are friend on SmashBoard so I should have your avatar soon.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

But it's not really ESRB leak if the rumor is right. Correct me if I'm wrong with the information. He is one that made the video so he might not have full information but I'm more likely to be wrong about 3DS version.

They could be DLC characters or connectivity-unlocking between Wii U and 3DS. Who know.

Holding back Ice Climbers, Lucas, Wolf and Chorus Boys for the WiiU, and then patched to the 3DS later is still a great idea and I could totally see them doing that.

I think we're looking at 4, not 5 characters. I don't think Snake will be back as originally thought, and this gives Mii Fighters a spot on the CSS when custom moves are turned on, without random button shenanigans.

 

[Berordn]

If the game was data mined and they found Ice Climbers, we probably would have heard from the ESRB leak, as unused content is required to be mentioned.

And I'm still not convinced Ice Climbers aren't in. The Polar Bear is pretty convincing evidence.

Unused content that could bump up the rating. Unless Ice Climbers got a gritty reboot where their main gimmick is ripping off flesh with ice picks, they're very much suitable for all audiences.

The concern with that is a Hot Coffee situation where explicit content is left on disc.

 

[Scooter155]

seems like we are stuck on "stuff we already inferred from the trailers" land until release

Ah, the leak already covered this

Oh boy guys, just because we spoiled the info for ourselves doesn't mean they have to change what they had planned for PotDs... as far as I know a spectator mode with betting functionality hasn't been confirmed at all outside of the leaks.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

It has a few specific and situational uses, like keeping people away from a Smash Ball, but otherwise it's pretty useless. I like that Mario has it, since it better represents his character than the Tornado, but it wasn't well-implemented. Hopefully the custom moves, which can give it more force or make it do damage, will improve it.

The Tornado was a Mario World reference and in Smash 4 they could have made it a Galaxy reference (maybe make it slower and with more of a hop than a hover). It fits Mario just as well as Fludd does.

Oh boy guys, just because we spoiled the info for ourselves doesn't mean they have to change what they had planned for PotDs... as far as I know a spectator mode with betting functionality hasn't been confirmed at all outside of the leaks.

It was in the Direct Trailer

 

[Boss Doggie]

Huh, 192 pages already?

Also Jedi Link got banned?

 

[Jawmuncher]

It has a few specific and situational uses, like keeping people away from a Smash Ball, but otherwise it's pretty useless. I like that Mario has it, since it better represents his character than the Tornado, but it wasn't well-implemented. Hopefully the custom moves, which can give it more force or make it do damage, will improve it.

Doing damage I think will help making it actually useful.

--------------------------

I really hope Ike's "I fight for my friends" is alive and well in SSB4.
Nothing was better than playing with friends winning the match and hearing that.

 

[SuperSah]

Okay, I will send a private message to Jedi Link since we are friend on SmashBoard so I should have your avatar soon.

Christ, you're so damn persistent that it's not even funny.


And no thanks, I'll wait for the guy to give it to me himself.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Fludd would be so much better if it turned into the Hover Nozzle when used in mid air.

 

[BGBW]

I remember the "leak" that mentioned the horseshoe boxing glove as used by Aran Ryan as a Punch-Out item.

That could be pretty cool as a reference.

 

[VandalD]

Doing damage I think will help making it actually useful.

If it doesn't make enemies flinch and give them another UpB attempt, it wouldn't only be an improvement, yeah.

 

[The Great Gonzales]

The Tornado was a Mario World reference and in Smash 4 they could have made it a Galaxy reference (maybe make it slower and with more of a hop than a hover). It fits Mario just as well as Fludd does.

Right, I wasn't trying to argue that the Tornado didn't have anything to do with Mario at all, but that in Smash, I prefer FLUDD (at least, I prefer the concept,) because it gives Sunshine some more representation.

Really, though, it's a bit of a moot point because Mario didn't lose the Tornado, it just moved from his down special to his down air. I don't know why I didn't make not of this in my original post, but I should have.

 

[OmegaSmash]

Is fludd even useful?
Everyone I know that played Mario liked Dr just because he didn't have it.

The Cape does everything FLUDD does but better. Even the range bonus from FLUDD is worthless.

 

[Scooter155]

It was in the Direct Trailer

Neato (however you pronounce that) was specifically calling out the PotD for covering info from the leak.
I really don't remember the betting being mentioned in the Direct Trailer, but I could easily be remembering that part wrong.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Christ, you're so damn persistent that it's not even funny.


And no thanks, I'll wait for the guy to give it to me himself.

Yeah, I can be very persistent with people that wouldn't be honorable with their bets and deals. I have a good feeling that you wouldn't keep your word with Jedi Link anyway.

 

[SuperSah]

Yeah, I can be very persistent with people that wouldn't be honorable with their bets and deals. I have a good feeling that you wouldn't keep your word with Jedi Link anyway.

Yes, because Jedi Link has been here to deliver.

Like I have to please you anyways.

 

[Mr. Smiley]

Really, though, it's a bit of a moot point because Mario didn't lose the Tornado, it just moved from his down special to his down air. I don't know why I didn't make not of this in my original post, but I should have.

And by becoming a down air, Tornado lost a lot of its usability and power while what we got in return isn't at all suitable replacement. That maybe fine if you crave references in a character but that feeling evades quickly when you realize the character's moveset is worse off with it.

 

[Jawmuncher]

Yeah, I can be very persistent with people that wouldn't be honorable with their bets and deals. I have a good feeling that you wouldn't keep your word with Jedi Link anyway.

Damn you're going to make sure that bet happens. Guess we'll see what goes down on his return. Whenever that is.

 

[MxBxM]

Mario without fludd was my favorite. I dont see why he couldnt keep the tornado and or gotten a better move like the butt stomp

 

[munchie64]

Woah, why was Jedi Link banned?

 

[Prevolition]

Oh man. Would have been awesome for fludd to have his different hovers from suneshine. If Palutena can get new moves(?). Then I'm not sure why they didn't change Mario's Fludd variants.
Sakurai Bias is strong.

That would give Mario multiple recovery moves...

 

[Mysterious]

Yeah, I can be very persistent with people that wouldn't be honorable with their bets and deals. I have a good feeling that you wouldn't keep your word with Jedi Link anyway.

Why do you care? It was a bet between him and another individual; no need for you to get involved. The other poster shouldn't have gotten himself banned if he wanted to still participate in this avatar bet.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Holding back Ice Climbers, Lucas, Wolf and Chorus Boys for the WiiU, and then patched to the 3DS later is still a great idea and I could totally see them doing that.

I think we're looking at 4, not 5 characters. I don't think Snake will be back as originally thought, and this gives Mii Fighters a spot on the CSS when custom moves are turned on, without random button shenanigans.

Perhaps, I hope that it wouldn't be THAT long for Wii U to be out.

 

[VandalD]

Mario without fludd was my favorite. I dont see why he couldnt keep the tornado and or gotten a better move like the butt stomp

What if it was between fludd and counter?

Spoiler

Fludd.

 

[Qurupeke]

I finally found the leaked footage. Bowser Jr. looks way better than what I expected. Unique and interesting despite being a character that I dislike.

Shulk looked cool too. I haven't played Xenoblade (yet) but I thought that he would be a rather slow but powerful swordsman like Ike. Thankfully, he's nothing like that.

Ganondorf was disappointing though. He looks different but, yeah, still a clone.

 

[Storm Kyleis]

They're not cloney enough! Lol. I wouldn't be surprised if they show up again in some way. It's not helping Lucas that he's still Japan only. We don't have any of those characters left now, right? Even Chorus Kids would be from the first international Rhythm Heaven.

Unfortunately, yes.

Every veteran so far has had an ample amount of work done to them. New animations, new special effects (slashing effects, magic effects, etc), and variable rebalance. Even if they didn't get new animations, every veteran has additional special effects for most, if not all, of their moves, so every veteran required a bit of work.

It's very possible that if anyone's cut, it's because they didn't have the time/resources allocated at the beginning to 'rework' every single veteran. Then, at the end of development, they had free time, and separated some alternate costumes into new characters to fill some extra character slots.

I wouldn't be surprised if, in initial development, Dr mario, and pittoo were just alt costumes/voices for mario/pit, like lucina may have been. They were later split off, had some variable tweaks, left the animations all intact, and gave us 3 'new' characters. Also explains why they're in the 'clone corner', because the rest of the roster was already designed/organized.

This implies that Lucas and Wolf were planned to be cut from the beginning, right?

It's definitely possible, but it feels wrong to me to cut characters from already under-represented and niche series. When they had to make cuts in Brawl they choose a Mario rep, a Zelda rep, two Pokémon rep and a Fire Emblem rep. Mario fans got Wario instead, Zelda fans got Toon Link, Pokémon fans got Squirtle, Ivysaur, Charizard and Lucario, Fire Emblem fans got Ike. Everyone was (rightly) disappointed for the cuts, but we got plenty of newcomers from the same series to make up for the loss. As a big EarthBound fan, though, there's just no upside to Lucas getting cut. Star Fox fans wanted Krystal as a fourth rep, and are ending up with two. We're just losing two beloved characters without any compensation, while the second most represented series is getting two newcomers.

I know, it's a matter of popularity -- it's not like there are a lot of Lucas and Wolf supporters around. But if they were deemed worthy enough for Brawl, I don't think they should be dropped now.

 

[R0ckman]

But Kid Icarus still hasn't had even one boss

You haven't played uprising then.

 

[Neiteio]

Oh boy guys, just because we spoiled the info for ourselves doesn't mean they have to change what they had planned for PotDs... as far as I know a spectator mode with betting functionality hasn't been confirmed at all outside of the leaks.

Of course. Where did I say they shouldn't officially reveal it or elaborate on it?

 

[Fireblend]

I finally found the leaked footage. Bowser Jr. looks way better than what I expected. Unique and interesting despite being a character that I dislike.

Shulk looked cool too. I haven't played Xenoblade (yet) but I thought that he would be a rather slow but powerful swordsman like Ike. Thankfully, he's nothing like that.

Ganondorf was disappointing though. He looks different but, yeah, still a clone.

I am really, really happy and surprised about Bowser Jr. He even looks like main material to me, specially if I can also play as Larry Koopa.

 

[Kouriozan]

If IC, Lucas, and Wolf really are gone,I wonder how they'll be used in the game? ATs? Trophies? It would be weird for them all to not appear in the game in any form.

Ice Climbers for Smash Run ennemies.
Lucas for Assist Trophy.
Sakurai for licking salty tears.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Ice Climbers for Smash Run ennemies.
Lucas for Assist Trophy.
Sakurai for licking salty tears.

Wolf for background dialogue right?

 

[Jawmuncher]

Unfortunately, yes.


This implies that Lucas and Wolf were planned to be cut from the beginning, right?

It's definitely possible, but it feels wrong to me to cut characters from already under-represented and niche series. When they had to make cuts in Brawl they choose a Mario rep, a Zelda rep, two Pokémon rep and a Fire Emblem rep. Mario fans got Wario instead, Zelda fans got Toon Link, Pokémon fans got Squirtle, Ivysaur, Charizard and Lucario, Fire Emblem fans got Ike. Everyone was (rightly) disappointed for the cuts, but we got plenty of newcomers from the same series to make up for the loss. As a big EarthBound fan, though, there's just no upside to Lucas getting cut. Star Fox fans wanted Krystal as a fourth rep, and are ending up with two. We're just losing two beloved characters without any compensation, while the second most represented series is getting two newcomers.

I know, it's a matter of popularity -- it's not like there are a lot of Lucas and Wolf supporters around. But if they were deemed worthy enough for Brawl, I don't think they should be dropped now.

Yeah the fact that we got cuts ans no replacements I agree is what makes things worse.
You summed up my exact feelings on the matter with your post. Really hope DLC is planned for the cut veterans.

 

[Kouriozan]

Wolf for background dialogue right?

Oh yeah, Fox's taunt in that one stage :lol

 

[PadWarrior]

Woah, why was Jedi Link banned?

Was probably using sith tactics

 

[superNESjoe]

Yes, because Jedi Link has been here to deliver.

Like I have to please you anyways.

I have no real place in this argument, but i feel like there should be a tag for people who don't honor avatar bets. I was ready and

Spoiler

un

willing to become Uncle Joey.

 

[WiiRevolution1]

Three people in a row just mentioned Sticker Star without saying a single negative thing about it. Never thought I'd see that in this thread.

I'm playing throught it now, and I don't see why everyone complains about the story. Only upto 2-2 but the story seems just fine, actually it seems even more varied and unique due to the worlds.

The battle system on the other hand...yeah...how can you even call it a RPG when there is no grinding to level up your character. Disgusting.

 

[FiddyShadeJ]

I always thought Fludd would be a neat addition to Smash since I really liked Sunshine but I'm not too keen on how he was implemented. Would've liked it as an item or a "Sunshine Mario" character, not as a replacement for the tornado.

 

[Fireblend]

I'm playing throught it now, and I don't see why everyone complains about the story. Only upto 2-2 but the story seems just fine, actually it seems even more varied and unique due to the worlds.

The battle system on the other hand...yeah...how can you even call it a RPG when there is no grinding to level up your character. Disgusting.

Yeah, the fact that battles are ultimately pointless is a huge, HUGE design flaw...

...but other than that I had no issues with the game. It was alright. It was also pretty good looking, and had some nice music.

 

[Loco4Coco]

Mario's Fludd should've had the other nuzzles as well.

 

[Mr Buddy]

I always thought Fludd would be a neat addition to Smash since I really liked Sunshine but I'm not too keen on how he was implemented. Would've liked it as an item or a "Sunshine Mario" character, not as a replacement for the tornado.

I totally agree with you. I could see Fludd being an item similar to how the Jetpack works in Smash 4. It would be in the Hover Nozzle the whole time, and when you grab it it gives you a hover jump

 

[The Great Gonzales]

Random idea that popped into my head: instead of Cook or Sword, Kirby's FS should be Mike Kirby. It's unique (unlike Sword,) and it works kind of like an FS in the Kirby games, wrecking everyone on the screen.

 

[superNESjoe]

I always thought Fludd would be a neat addition to Smash since I really liked Sunshine but I'm not too keen on how he was implemented. Would've liked it as an item or a "Sunshine Mario" character, not as a replacement for the tornado.

Unpopular Opinion Alert!

I always thought Yoshi should be an item in some way. I'm not against Yoshi being a character or for Yoshi being cut, I just think Yoshi should be represented as he originally was, an item/mount.

Then we can get Baby Yoshis that you have to feed to grow into mounts, and we can have finally see Ganondorf on his true steed.

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

I really hope Samus custom moves will be more than speed variations. I say this often but I would love for her to have different beams for her neutral B. Ice and wave maybe?

 

[Kouriozan]

R.I.P.

I liked his howling.

Spoiler

Nah, I still believe!

 

[Kinsei]

Random idea that popped into my head: instead of Cook or Sword, Kirby's FS should be Mike Kirby. It's unique (unlike Sword,) and it works kind of like an FS in the Kirby games, wrecking everyone on the screen.

That would be cool. I guess it would work like Tabuu's red rings attack?

 

[IntelliHeath]

R.I.P.

I liked his howling.

Spoiler

Nah, I still believe!

I never saw that message. I always get other messages frequently.

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

Baby Yoshi would've been a cool item, make it work like Munchlax where you carry it around and it can eat items and projectiles.

But no lie, I always thought a Mario riding on Yoshi as a character would have been amazing.

 

[Berordn]

Random idea that popped into my head: instead of Cook or Sword, Kirby's FS should be Mike Kirby. It's unique (unlike Sword,) and it works kind of like an FS in the Kirby games, wrecking everyone on the screen.

Mike would be awful if he couldn't use it three times. Might as well just whip out Crash.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Wolf is the only Star Fox character who I like (both in design and play style), it is a shame he got axed supposedly. I wouldn't have minded Falco being cut instead of him.