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[Anton Sugar]

Today's PA comic pretty much hits it on the head, sadly.

lol

 

[TUSR]

You're supposed to be out of the loop. The story is from the perspective of your character, who has been dead for centuries. To expect them to know almost everything about a situation they were forced into is quite asinine, in my opinion. The beginning of your story starts when your Ghost revives you.

Also, read the grimoire cards and a lot of the questions in the OP are addressed through them. It isn't hard to read them as you earn them. Just keep your phone next to you.

This is not right, in the sense you have to use your phone to read Grimoire cards.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

The Awoken represent the majority in the Reef, but they are not the only race there. They don't care about outsiders, regardless of race.

It would have been cool to have a line of dialogue or something to at least acknowledge that, though.

It's sort of like Pandaren in Mists of Pandaria. If you create a Pandaren, you are from the Wandering Isle, a place separated from Pandaria. So even Padaren players are treated as outsiders when visiting there.

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

We're not asking for more bullshit exposition about what happened before we came along all that much, it'd just be nice to have some of the basics of a story. You know, logic, character development, a sound structure.... Just one of those things would've made the story much better.

The only arc any character has in the game is a hunter's arcblade.

The ultimate goal is to revive the Traveler and reclaim the territories lost in the Golden Era, which have since been taken over by hostile alien races, who also happen to be encroaching on the city as well, which is the last human stronghold. Sounds logical to me. Seems like people were expecting a linear campaign with what I'm gathering here.

 

[atr0cious]

Also did they ever fix the jarring transition when you're in a group and the cinematic only shows you at the end of the mission?

 

[CrimzonSamurai]

I think the level of story currently in the game is adequate, it's clear that they have plans for future expansion. It's a loot game and I think the story is just as detailed as anything else in that genre. Diablo 3 would be equally "what the fuck are they talking about" story-wise if it hadn't had Diablo 1 and 2 to precede it.

I mean, Half Life has about as much or less story than Destiny and I love that franchise and, as far as I know, people generally accept the lack of plot details as "part of the weird sci-fi mystery."

I could be wrong, but regardless I like the story they have in Destiny so far. Even if I have to read it on a website during work hours instead of having it in-game. I do that with Wikis for tons of other games anyway.

 

[ShinMaruku]

No game will ever have the literary distinction of Candide. Probably why I was never miffed about the story. I mean form the beginning Halo's story was shit too (Is still kinda shit to me but that's another story)

Medium is not mature enough for you to expect any great story. Also the people in games now aren't the story tells you would want anyway. Just how I feel.

But I am loving how some people are tearing into this game. Shows how bad hype is and people still get excited.

 

[jett]

I don't understand what happened there. It feels unfinished. Seriously unfinished, as if they just stopped working on it one day and stopped giving a fuck. When it comes to story, narrative and charaters this game is unmitigated garbage.

 

[foxtrot3d]

I don't know how it works when developers hire writers, like how do they find them and how they know if they're good enough, but I could imagine sort of a "writer's audition" and they probably hired Destiny's lead because he wrote a paragraph that sounded very deep or something.

But like just about every single line in the game it's more like 2deep4u than it's anything substantial.

I shaked my head so many times. At first I was confused but towards the end of the campaign it was pretty obvious the writing was completely clueless. A very basic principle for writing is that when you tell a story you need to make it clear what's going on, who are the characters, and who wants to do what and such. In Destiny nothing was clear. The intro left me with questions and the ending left even more of the initial questions left unanswered.

I doubt it was the writers fault that much, COD routinely hires big name writers and the games always have mediocre to crappy stories because the reality is the designers care more about the gameplay. With COD, and as we can see with Destiny, the designers cared more about gameplay and putting you into coll situations. So, what happens is they say "we built this Venus level except Venus is now a garden world, write something up explaining why this is and how the player got there. Okay?" The Story is nothing more than a piece of flimsy context to explain how and why you got from the ice planet to the fire planet.

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

This is not right, in the sense you have to use your phone to read Grimoire cards.

I would have liked to have seen them implemented in game, sure, but I'm not that bothered by it.

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

I highly disagree with that. Ghost thinks Vex being able to time travel is ridiculous, yet the grimoire / details of the Vex on the website tell us immediately that the Vex can time travel. That in and of itself means the grimoire is for the player, but the characters in the game and the story we're playing obviously don't have access to this info.

Which, again, makes the story incoherent and confused. The story itself doesn't understand what's going on.

Again, not a lot of people know that much at all. A very small amount of people survived The Collapse. Vast amounts of information were lost.

Edit: Double post, my bad.

 

[Opiate]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

 

[Afrodium]

I liked the story.

I was asking me who is this powerful mage called Traveler that changed the life of everybody and now all the guardians are trying to find him.

There are a good end that give you a taste of the universe with more races, planets, etc that I believe Bungie have plans to fill up at least this generation.

I really hope this is a serious post because it really exemplifies just how bad of a job Bungie did with giving the players information.

 

[WrenchNinja]

The Awoken represent the majority in the Reef, but they are not the only race there. They don't care about outsiders, regardless of race.

It would have been cool to have a line of dialogue or something to at least acknowledge that, though.

So more read the grimoire for context huh

 

[foxtrot3d]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

Well, it was marketed as having a very involved story with Bungie playing up their past Halo experience.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

That's a lazy excuse, and even still you're character is not "completely out of the loop," as a Guardian he would know what the The Traveler is and how Space Travel and all that works. Also, funny how a character "out of the loop" for centuries immediately knows how to operate all machinery and structures from the future.

The story is beyond crap, don't try and give them praise as some Dark Souls inspiration when they most definietly were not going for that. The fact that there are even actual cutscenes trying to tell a traditional story disproves that entire theory.

I don't know what Bungie or From Software were going for with either of their stories. All I know is that my experience with both games, story-wise, is comparable. And I like this method of storytelling much better than the linear exposition so common in this medium.

Honestly, I still don't know what the *%&# is going on in Dark Souls and I beat it several times. Part of the fun is uncovering different things over a time and piecing it together in your head with the help of clues here and there. Both games have very real feeling game worlds that I enjoy coming back to.

 

[BLCKATK]

A lot of the Grimoire Card lore would have been incredible if it was actually included in the game. Recently I found a Ghost Fragment called "The Last Word" that is talking about the Exotic Hand Cannon of the same name. It's really interesting as a back story to the weapon and actually makes me want to pursue it. If that kind of detail could have been put into more stuff, it would have been really satisfying.

It is what it is though. The story really does leave on an unsatisfying note. I'm just hoping I won't have to pay more to see more, but I think that is too optimistic.

 

[Inferno313]

The ultimate goal is to revive the Traveler and reclaim the territories lost in the Golden Era, which have since been taken over by hostile alien races, who also happen to be encroaching on the city as well, which is the last human stronghold. Sounds logical to me. Seems like people were expecting a linear campaign with what I'm gathering here.

Why does my Guardian just accept the crazy circumstances he's been thrown into and never question it? Why does he instantly know how to use every piece of futuristic weapon and machinary? Why does our Guardian choose to believe the words of some random Exo that he has no allegiance to? There's plenty of examples in the OP too. The characters in this game seemingly do not behave in a logical way.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

So more read the grimoire for context huh

That might help, but I kind of intuited that part based on the fact that the Queen had Fallen guards.

 

[nictron]

Ladies and gentlemen, The ArchitectTraveler.

 

[Bizazedo]

Again, not a lot of people know that much at all. A very small amount of people survived The Collapse. Vast amounts of information were lost.

Agreed, but then you're proving my point. You can't use the grimoire cards as anything other than points of interest for the player, outside of the game. It's irrelevant to the game's story.

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

It felt like they wanted it to matter based on earlier trailers. Then the live-action trailer ht, so maybe you're right.

 

[ultron87]

Was the player character a guardian before they died or just a random person who was fleeing to the Cosmodrome during the collapse?

 

[Inferno313]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

There's an entire "mission" in this game that consists of a 5-6 minute cutscene and nothing else. Games that don't care about their stories don't do that.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

well they keep forcing me to watch unskippable cutscenes and listen to bad dialogue, so I imagine so

 

[ShinMaruku]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

That's because the people who make those games don't have the faith in themselves to put out a proper story. I don't think story and good games are opposed , it's just that people who make games tell stories that they did at 12.

 

[Bizazedo]

That might help, but I kind of intuited that part based on the fact that the Queen had Fallen guards.

Well, the Grimoire states that she took over the House of Wolves (expansion name!). So it actually doesn't indicate that all races are welcome. I think I read that in the grimoire?

If my memory is correct on that, and it might be, the grimoire contradicts an interpretation you made in-game from what the game presents you.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Was the player character a guardian before they died or just a random person who was fleeing to the Cosmodrome during the collapse?

Maybe all revived guardians are dead gamers.

 

[foxtrot3d]

I don't know what Bungie or From Software were going for with either of their stories. All I know is that my experience with both games, story-wise, is comparable. And I like this method of storytelling much better than the linear exposition so common in this medium.

Honestly, I still don't know what the *%&# is going on in Dark Souls and I beat it several times. Part of the fun is uncovering different things over a time and piecing it together in your head with the help of clues here and there. Both games have very real feeling game worlds that I enjoy coming back to.

Except Dark Souls is completely different. The mysery aspect of Dark Souls is front and center, the story is not told in any traditional sort of way. There are very few cutscenes and few characters to interact and speak with, everything is told primarily through the enviornment. Destiny on the other hand is presented in the fashion of a traditional linear game, there is no sense of mystery looming over head. From the very start you are awoken by a Dinklage-Bot who never shuts up, constantly telling you this thing about the world and that thing. Then you meet up with other important people in the world and you get traditional cutscenes where the give you further flimsy explanations and talk about things you know nothing about.

Again, the mystery element and enviornmental story is just not there. This is just traditional linear story telling done VERY BADLY.

Maybe all revived guardians are dead gamers.

Even a dead gamer can dream...

 

[Frog-fu]

I cringe whenever they say "the Darkness" - just terrible.

 

[jaaz]

Is this really supposed to be a story driven game? IDotA2 also has a terrible story, but that's mostly because they don't want it to have a good story. The lion's share of the most popular games these days don't have stories or only pay passing lip service to a narrative.

Your comment lives up to your tag line, unfortunately.

I've come to accept that not every game will be TLOU. I bought Destiny and I'm enjoying it. I think that's likely because I wasn't expecting a Shakespearian story. And boy, I wasn't disappointed.

 

[ShinMaruku]

They should have ripped off the Darkness. Then you'd know why the traveler is ded.

 

[Forsythia]

'Read the Grimoire' is a fucking lazy excuse. That info should've been in the game. When trying to make an epic (lol) story, and something like Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, you don't halfass it by directing players out of the game.

So far as I can tell, it's just an overly serious and dramatic story only Bungie can tell. They're trying way too hard to create an epic story. It's boring, it makes no sense and there isn't even a bit of humour. So fucking bland.

 

[WrenchNinja]

They should have ripped off the Darkness. Then you'd know why the traveler is ded.

Because he loved Jackie Estacado?

 

[Vespene]

It's a damn shame because there was a lot of potential. Between the pretentious use of pronouns and the abysmal Grimoire system, this is the most botched story execution in recent gaming memory.

 

[jaaz]

'Read the Grimoire' is a fucking lazy excuse. That info should've been in the game. When trying to make an epic (lol) story, and something like Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, you don't halfass it by directing players out of the game.

So far as I can tell, it's just an overly serious and dramatic story only Bungie can tell. They're trying way too hard to create an epic story. It's boring, it makes no sense and there isn't even a bit of humour. So fucking bland.

The "Little light" banter was kinda of funny though.

It's clear to me they either ran out of time for launch or made a conscious decision to save more content for DLC.

 

[ShinMaruku]

Your comment lives up to your tag line, unfortunately.

I've come to accept that not every game will be TLOU. I bought Destiny and I'm enjoying it. I think that's likely because I wasn't expecting a Shakespearian story. And boy, I wasn't disappointed.

Wisest comment I seen here. On any game I would not expect Candide, I know who are making these games and none of them are bards, they may wish they were bards but they ain't.

Because he loved Jackie Estacado?

Look at my avatar. That is the light in the darkness. Darkness and the Light are both wacko.

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

Agreed, but then you're proving my point. You can't use the grimoire cards as anything other than points of interest for the player, outside of the game. It's irrelevant to the game's story.



It felt like they wanted it to matter based on earlier trailers. Then the live-action trailer ht, so maybe you're right.

Assuming your Guardian chooses not to share this information with other people, sure. How are details about the story irrelevant to it, exactly?

Again, the mystery element and enviornmental story is just not there. This is just traditional linear story telling done VERY BADLY.

Care to elaborate how it is a traditional, linear story?

 

[Shoeless]

I think the issue with Bungie and the way they told their story in Destiny was that they didn't trust their audience. I had the same issue with the Halo series back in the day, but the problem is really magnified in Destiny. Bungie has created an impressively detailed world, with a ton of lore, but they put all of that into the grimoire cards. The story they actually tell to the players is pretty juvenile "my first sci-fi novel" or Hollywood blockbuster SF stuff, but anyone that actually takes the time to read the grimoire sees just how much of this world has been fleshed out.

Spoiler

They explain, for example, in the grimoire cards that the reason the opening cut scene had an astronaut with a rifle was because they already knew an "artifact" of some kind was on Mars, so they were deliberately seeking out the Traveler. They also explain some fascinating stuff about the Vex, and how they are capable of simulating worlds to the point where people researching a Vex prisoner suspect they might actually be one of the Vex's simulations and not real people at all.

There are some interesting nuggets of genuine literary SF embedded in those grimoire cards. I think Bungie was just scared it was too hardcore SF for a casual/Dudebro audience, and so just left it to the real story-hounds to dig up on their own. That's unfortunate, because the hints they drop about the collapse, the Darkness and even the rise of the City and Guardians all seem more interesting than the story we got in the game itself.

 

[BigDes]

So at some point will the traveler pop open and we find out what is inside it?

I am betting now that in a shock twist the Traveller ends up being the bad guy

 

[Afrodium]

The ultimate goal is to revive the Traveler and reclaim the territories lost in the Golden Era, which have since been taken over by hostile alien races, who also happen to be encroaching on the city as well, which is the last human stronghold. Sounds logical to me. Seems like people were expecting a linear campaign with what I'm gathering here.

But did I do any of that? I have no idea what my character accomplished at the end of the game. My major complaint about the plot of the game isn't so much that it's vague in the information it gives the player, but rather that almost nothing happens in it. The major plot beats of the game are as follows:

1) I am revived on Earth by a Ghost and find a ship to take me back to The Tower
2) I get to the Tower and am told that I should join other Guardians in a fight to 'save the Traveler'
3) I do some scouting on Earth and find out I need to go to the moon
4) I go to the moon and am told to go to Venus
5) I go to Venus and am told to find The Awoken
6) I immediately find the Awoken and am told I need to go to The Black Garden (don't worry about what The Black Garden is, it's really bad and I need to go there)
7) I kill a Gatelord so that the mean Awoken guy will let me into The Black Garden
8) I am told to go to Mars to find The Black Garden
9) I find The Black Garden and shoot some statues
10) The day is saved?

That's a bad plot. There's no character arcs, nothing changes from beginning to end, I don't even know if I saved the day at the end. Seriously, can someone tell me what was accomplished at the end of the game? Is The Traveler saved?

 

[show me your skeleton]

i wanted it to turn out that you are doing the traveler's awful work and you're off committing pan-galactic genocide rather than saving anything but i guess that's not the case.

 

[Opiate]

There's an entire "mission" in this game that consists of a 5-6 minute cutscene and nothing else. Games that don't care about their stories don't do that.

well they keep forcing me to watch unskippable cutscenes and listen to bad dialogue, so I imagine so

Ah, that is pretty conclusive then, thanks.

That's because the people who make those games don't have the faith in themselves to put out a proper story. I don't think story and good games are opposed , it's just that people who make games tell stories that they did at 12.

Well, exquisite mechanics and story push in different directions. That doesn't mean you can't make a game that is good and story driven, just that mechanics and story are often at odds. There are lots of ways to handle this problem, though. For instance, Bungie's previous game, Halo, helped alleviate the problem somewhat by essentially making two separate games; a single player, story driven game, and a multiplayer game.

 

[Figments]

Oh hey. This thread ISN'T dead.

I'll repost this from the OT. I'll come back when I'm not on my phone to make something a bit more relevant, but considering the following is a story based in Destiny, it's probably very relevant.

GUYS.

I'd like someone to read what I have so far for this Destiny fanfiction. Seriously.

It's sitting at 1200 words. More or less.

Please.

Don't ignore me, guys.

 

[RalchAC]

I doubt it was the writers fault that much, COD routinely hires big name writers and the games always have mediocre to crappy stories because the reality is the designers care more about the gameplay. With COD, and as we can see with Destiny, the designers cared more about gameplay and putting you into coll situations. So, what happens is they say "we built this Venus level except Venus is now a garden world, write something up explaining why this is and how the player got there. Okay?" The Story is nothing more than a piece of flimsy context to explain how and why you got from the ice planet to the fire planet.

That doesn't change some of the issues the game has. Like the lack of charismatic characters that push the story forward. And a clean you can identify.

Look at WoW. In the Burning Crusade you had well, the Burning Crusade and Illidan dudes. Both had clear leaders. In Wrath of the Lich King you have The Plague (Arthas) and Northern Mythology dudes/gods. Cataclysm has dragonsand the super dragon as the leader.

Destiny has an abstract concept as the baddie. I don't know shit about the leaders of the different baddies in the game.

Even JRPGs do this right. You meet Sin in FFX in the first few minutes. Shinra = bad in FFVII. A good chunk of JRPGs have bosses that are designed to kick your ass early into the game. I mean, it'd have been as easy as having a flash back fight at the start with setpieces and a giant dark dude for 5 minutes. It kicks your ass, you're about to die, you see the Traveller kicking that big dark dude ass, you die and you're resurrected by the Ghost afterwards.

Adding clear leaders for every single faction would have been nice. Make it so I want to do the strike and kick their ass.

Use some methods to tell the lore. As lazy as I think audio diaries have become in videogames in the past few years, that's better than telling nothing. I wish it had audio diaries.

But hey, at least I know the wizard came from the moon due to the ice bucket challenge video.

Some chains of Quest that just used some audio + random objective + audio when you finish and then you unlock a subquest that expand where the other left would have been nice.

 

[ElFly]

So those of us who’ve played, we know that the story starts with you being dead in a rusted out hulk of a car in the Russian Cosmodrome. Or maybe next to it. Hard to say. Ghost brings us back and is all “Hey, welcome back, but I just rez’d you in an area where we’re in deep shit. Let’s move so you don’t die again.”

We also don’t know why some humans have light and others don’t. How does Ghost know I was qualified to be a Titan? Maybe I was a pacifist toll booth attendant for all he knows? He could have found that old assault weapon and I could not have known how to use it? Yeah, the whole set-up has a lot of issues.

You were a russian car driver

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MzhLXWLTBA

You were able to watch a meteor falling in your general direction and just kept driving.

 

[DNAbro]

The worst point of the story for me was when the random hunter girl asks us if we heard of the black garden and our ghost replies "we've heard the rumors"

Excuse me? There is no we in that. No one in this goddamn solar system told us anything. We are just mindlessly doing things cause people are telling us to. We could just ask questions but the game doesn't allow that.

 

[Nicko]

On a semi-serious/interesting note, I thought this theory about "The Darkness" was actually somewhat interesting:

http://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/2gd9lr/i_overheard_a_fallen_dreg_say_something_and_now_i/

 

[ShinMaruku]

Well, tight mechanics and story push in different directions. That doesn't mean you can't make a game that is good and story driven, just that mechanics and story are often at odds. There are lots of ways to handle this problem, though. For instance, Bungie's previous game, Halo, helped alleviate the problem somewhat by essentially making two separate games; a single player, story driven game, and a multiplayer game.

True. But I think it's fairly obvious at this point we can't trust the designers to make the two work together.

 

[Anton Sugar]

So is there any actual exploration of sci-fi/sci-fi themes in the story? Outside of the weapons, armor, setting, spaceships, etc.

I found it fascinating that this was originally to be a medieval/fantasy game--it absolutely shows.

 

[foxtrot3d]

The worst point of the story for me was when the random hunter girl asks us if we heard of the black garden and our ghost replies "we've heard the rumors"

Excuse me? There is no we in that. No one in this goddamn solar system told us anything. We are just mindlessly doing things cause people are telling us to. We could just ask questions but the game doesn't allow that.

LOL.