Season 3. That's still the strongest start (and end) of a Korra season to me.
Legend of Korra Book 4: Balance |OT| A Feast of Crows
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Season 3. That's still the strongest start (and end) of a Korra season to me.
D
Deleted member 231381
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I think Season 3 had a weaker start and middle than Season 1. It finished okay, but I wouldn't describe the season as much more than lukewarm. Season 4 has certainly started stronger, perhaps the best start of any Korra season.
Chezzymann
Member
Yeah, after season 3 being so good I'm not worried about season 4 turning to crap.
I feel like we're getting less information per episode these days. It leaves me with less to say on each episode.
Korra still defines herself and the avatar as how much ass she can kick, but that's nothing new. It's a wonder how all this shit keeps happening to her over and over again, but she never questions if she should place all her value in physical strength.
I don't know if Toph would like it in the swamp. Mushy earth makes it hard for her to see. But maybe that's the point, what with the spiritual journey and all.
Still hate how the spirits are basically digimon now. The whole "The planet is trying to help you" stuff made sense with how Aang got help from spirits, but if spirits are creatures of their own minds and will that isn't necessarily connected to the planet, why do they give a shit? Also, spirits can now sense energy of another spirit. We have officially entered into DBZ territory, if we hadn't been there before.
Korra still defines herself and the avatar as how much ass she can kick, but that's nothing new. It's a wonder how all this shit keeps happening to her over and over again, but she never questions if she should place all her value in physical strength.
I don't know if Toph would like it in the swamp. Mushy earth makes it hard for her to see. But maybe that's the point, what with the spiritual journey and all.
Still hate how the spirits are basically digimon now. The whole "The planet is trying to help you" stuff made sense with how Aang got help from spirits, but if spirits are creatures of their own minds and will that isn't necessarily connected to the planet, why do they give a shit? Also, spirits can now sense energy of another spirit. We have officially entered into DBZ territory, if we hadn't been there before.
NipplesAndToes23
Member
Korra is definitely going through some stuff.
Sometimes in stories like this, you need to have a character in the world say something to convey an idea you as the writer are trying to get across.
They probably could have done it better with perhaps an internal monologue of Korra's...
I mean, they pretty much spelled out the same concept when
Korra was walking up the dune trying to reach Raava and it turned out to be a mirage.
Influence in this case means borderline lifted wholesale, and that's not a good thing not just because creativity reasons, but because I don't really think it fits the Avatar universe.
In TLA, we only got a glimpse of the spirits, but none of them were like this. We saw 1. Koh The Face stealer 2. Wan Shi Tong, The owl serphant of knowledge 3. A monkey that trolled advise into Aang and another monkey that got it's face stolen by koh 4. Panda guardian spirit that turned into a giant terrifying monster and 5. a gigantic wolf walking in the background. Also the lion turtle, if we're going to count them. These Spirits had a certain alienness to them, and they came off more than merely being strange. They felt like creatures who saw things and thought in a way that humans did not or could not, for the limited appearances they made. Koh begrudged Aang for a wrong Kuruk had done. The panda cared more about a forest than human beings. Wan Shi Tong loved to collect knowledge, but would not allow it to be used (though admittedly, it's not like the Gaang advocated their cause). These spirits purpose in the story wasn't just to help Aang, even if we don't know what that purpose truly was.
LoK...like, 90% of the spirits are just pandering to the audience with cuteness and helped the avatar for seemingly no real reason.
Miyazaki is an excellent film maker, but if they were going to take spirituality cues from him, they should have paid less attention to the design and more to how he crafted them for the individual stories. Both Spirited Away and Princess Mononoke have spirits within them, but that you can't take the designs like Yubaba and Kamaji and put them in next to Moro and the Forest Spirit. The former is more whimsical and wierd while the latter is more fantastical and mystical. Haku is the only one that might work in both, but even then....
The Korra writers just lifted SA's aesthetic because it's popular, but they didn't think to how it would work within their world, and for that reason it's failing.
Icyflamez96
Member
I haven't read any comments for the last 6 pages. I'm waiting until 7 to watch it with 4 other friends. Can someone without spoilers just tell me if it was good?
Brawndo Addict
Banned
Toph is like the perfect teacher for Korra personality wise. If Toph can't get Korra to rethink the 'smash everything' approach, no one can.
how? Wasn't Korra passed out/knocked out when Toph found her? How many footsteps could she have heard when Korra was in a state of torpor? Or for that matter... In the swamp. It's not exactly like walking on solid ground.
He's also hocking home Depot products. I guess endgame hit him harder than any of us thought.
It was one of the worst this show had to offer.
Shhhhhhhhhh
Moral Panic
Member
Depends what you want out of the show. For me it didn't tick the right boxes but others seem to have enjoyed it.
I have to agree on the point that they seemed much rarer and more significant. Like, before Korra, I assumed that there were like, 100 spirits total or something. Each of them being a mythological level beast to the people of the world. The face stealer? Fucking. Cool. Dude appears for one scene, but that guy had a menacing and unsettling presence. Even the more helpful spirits seemed rather dismissive of Aang's troubles.
Korra Alone was an okay episode. It has a lot of fanservice, but is a slow burn. Its purpose is to show how much Korra is struggling, and it relies on well worn cliches to get that point across.
The writers continue to use AtLA as a crutch - I'm just ready for them to put the past comfortably in the rear view and get on with current events. Kuvira and the drama surrounding the metal clan/earth Kingdom is easily the most interesting element of the season so far. The more the focus is on them to flesh things out, the better.
The writers continue to use AtLA as a crutch - I'm just ready for them to put the past comfortably in the rear view and get on with current events. Kuvira and the drama surrounding the metal clan/earth Kingdom is easily the most interesting element of the season so far. The more the focus is on them to flesh things out, the better.
Yes but that was as an aesthetic influence. The spirits introduced during Korra and Wan era are quite different from those we first encunter in Aang's era which is kind of jarring on the relationship with spirits and the land, let alone their relationship with humans.
Prophet Steve
Member
AtLA has very little been used as a crutch in the show. I don't know how prominent the role of Toph will be, but in season 3 you had very little that had to do with AtLA. Except for Zuko, but it isn't like he was very involved.
There have always been hints that there is an entire pantheon of spirits but we've never really seen much of the spirit world until Korra Book 2.
Hei Bai (the panda spirit) from A:TLA is the guardian of a single forest. There's an entire menagerie from the tiny scrubs to the god-like Raava/Vaatu.
Not that I don't believe you (I mean that sincerely btw, i realize it seems sarcastic), but could you point to a piece of dialogue that hints at this? I'm drawing a blank.
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
A swamp? Pretty overt imho.
This episode is awesome.
-Korra's healing process sucks. And hey, stop being mean against Katara!
- D'awwww Naga
- All those letters from Asami, Mako and Bolin. I laughed seeing those child-like drawings of Bolin. Classic.
- Korra being depressed was really... something. Varney did a great job with the VA.
- I laughed way to hard because of that Aang pic. Love it.
- Korra getting beat by a bunch of scrubs. Harsh.
- Ending of the episode was oooommmgggg it's Toph!
- Twinkletoes <3
- D'awwww Naga
- All those letters from Asami, Mako and Bolin. I laughed seeing those child-like drawings of Bolin. Classic.
- Korra being depressed was really... something. Varney did a great job with the VA.
- I laughed way to hard because of that Aang pic. Love it.
- Korra getting beat by a bunch of scrubs. Harsh.
- Ending of the episode was oooommmgggg it's Toph!
- Twinkletoes <3
You came up with that theory on your own. That was never official canon. I've read your personal justifications for a lot of what happens in ATLA, so as to not call them Deux Ex Machina moments, but that's still all in your head. The idea of spirits being individuals was clearly establish in ATLA also, strengthen by the fact that Bryan and Mike are big fans of Miyazaki.
That we didn't see more spirits in ATLA is hardly a reason to believe that we are seeing too many in LOK, especially since the reason we have seen a lot of those tiny spirits is because of the portals being opened (both in Wan and Korra's time), contrary to Aang's time, when only bigger/powerful/guardians spirits were presented to Aang. Aang's travel to a Spirit World swamp on his way to meet with Koh hinted that the Spirit World is bustling with it's own rich diversity of life or spirits, so their appearance in LOK didn't surprise me. It could be a bit lazy on the animator's part to simply repeat character models or draw silly Digimon-like creatures, but that's beside the point in terms of the mythology.
Also, there were some great discussions a couple of pages ago about how ATLA, not Korra, made the Avatar important simply because of its physical and spiritual force, through the power of the Avatar state (with some help from energybending at the end, in the case of Aang). It was during your off-days here when you were busy with school work, I think.
I tell you that because of your comments about how Korra still sees her role as the Avatar as being purely physical prowess. I don't agree, but if so, ALTA didn't show a lot to contradict that.
To be fair, it wasn't explicitly stated one way or the other.
Veelk is upset that his idea of spirits were not what is actually the case, while I'm content because what is shown in korra is exactly how I imagined the spirit world would be.
Ultimately, the creators made their choice. I don't think being upset that ones own head cannon was not actually canon is a reasonable argument. To say that the show is failing at its approach to spirits, or that it doesn't fit - well I can't say I agree with that at all.
Yeah, I think that's it.
*I added this following paragraph to my previous response to Veelk, but just in case it's not seen back there*
That we didn't see more spirits in ATLA is hardly a reason to believe that we are seeing too many in LOK, especially since the reason we have seen a lot of those tiny spirits is because of the portals being opened (both in Wan and Korra's time), contrary to Aang's time, when only bigger/powerful/guardians spirits were presented to him. Aang's travel to a Spirit World swamp on his way to meet with Koh hinted that the Spirit World is bustling with it's own rich diversity of life (er...spirits) so their appearance in LOK didn't surprise me. It could be a bit lazy on the animator's part to simply repeat character models or draw silly Digimon-like creatures, but that's beside the point in terms of the mythology.
GentlemanCrow
Member
That episode was the first in ages that hasn't rubbed me the wrong way. I suppose it could have been spread over two episodes. A nice focused episode. Some cool imagery and the script and dialogue delivery didn't leave my eyes rolling. Bolin's verbose letter writing was probably the first time I've chuckled at anything he's done. Hopefully they can end the series on a high after floundering for so long.
Chezzymann
Member
It was one of the best episodes the show has to offer.
I'm finally catching up with the season 3 episodes that finally aired on TV.
WTF is Asami ALWAYS caked in makeup?
She was just waken up in the middle of the night with blood red lipstick and eyeshadow.
When she's entering what she knows is a fight, any time of day.
It's weird, and distracts whenever she's in a scene.
WTF is Asami ALWAYS caked in makeup?
She was just waken up in the middle of the night with blood red lipstick and eyeshadow.
When she's entering what she knows is a fight, any time of day.
It's weird, and distracts whenever she's in a scene.
Stylebender. Duh.
What other purpose does Asami serve other that being the eye candy of the show?
And making Satch go crazy, of course.
The fact that the swamp pulled Aang down itself and gave it visions, and the whole episode was about how any kind of divisions are illusions....yeah, the show never out and said it, but I've yet to hear an alternative that gives another plausible explanation. And even if you dismiss my view as just speculation, then the problem still remains that the spirits are acting without any kind of sense or reason. It just happens that now TLA is joined in that flaw and things like the lion turtle become whole DEM's instead of having way too obscure justifications for their own good.
Anyway, my objection was not seeing too many spirits, but the way they're portrayed. I'm just talking about them being cutesy "I just want to help you because I wuv you." creatures that don't show any of the alienness that the previous spirits of TLA had. I don't even mean they have to be menacing, just show something that acknowledges that they're more than glorified hamtaro's.
As far as physical prowess goes, it's a part of life and therefore a part of the avatar. However, that's...anything. My typing on this keyboard is a physical act in a way, but the meaningfulness of it is not in the keystrokes, but the words that are produced that I use to communicate with you. Same thing with the Avatar. The bending is just a means to an end, to understand the four cultures on an intuitive level, so as to better keep balance. And keeping balance can take the form of stopping someone physically, but the 'avatarness' of such an act comes from the meaning of the action. So it's not to say that Korra stopping those two theives would have been an unworthy aspect of the avatar, but she has consistently demonstrated she thinks it's the only aspect of it that matters. She's going to fighting rings, doing all sorts of physically demanding tasks, all in order to prove somehow she's still the avatar. I don't think she understands that the best act as the avatar that she performed was to just talk to that one guy on the bridge to offer wisdom, and we need her to learn that is the important part of the avatar.
Let me explain:
To say that the spirits of avatar are merely copies of Miyazaki films is kind of disingenuous as the fantasy presented in Studio Ghibli films draws upon Shinto tradition.
(I'm no religion expert but this is what I got
According to Shinto belief, kami (translated very roughly into English as "spirits" or "gods") are manifestations of anything from trees and rocks to powerful forces of nature or to particular trades. (aka animism) So you'll have incredibly powerful kami that represent creation itself to kami which guard over a river or forest to minor kami that are just the essence of a single tree, rock, animal etc.
Shintoism states that there are a countless number of kami as they are present literally everywhere but, of course, only the most powerful have names and are revered by people.
Cloud Strife
Member
Let me explain:
To say that the spirits of avatar are merely copies of Miyazaki films is kind of disingenuous as the fantasy presented in Studio Ghibli films draws upon Shinto tradition.
(I'm no religion expert but this is what I got
So you'll have incredibly powerful kami that represent creation itself to kami which guard over a river or forest to minor kami that are just the essence of a single tree, rock, animal etc.
Shintoism states that there are a countless number of kami as they are present literally everywhere but, of course, only the most powerful have names and are revered by people.
That seems fair. I wasn't part of the Miyazaki discussion really, I'm just saying I want more of the big spirits.
Pegosaurus
Banned
great episode tonight!
really enjoyed seeing what Korra had been up to, even though it was pretty sad. Can't wait for next week.
really enjoyed seeing what Korra had been up to, even though it was pretty sad. Can't wait for next week.
Brawndo Addict
Banned
I'm not sure why you assume the spirits have no reason or sense for wanting to help Korra. If anything, the default way of thinking is to help others, I see no reason why that wouldn't apply to spirits like it does to humans. Everyone likely feels a connection to the Avatar simply because of the Avatar's role and importance to the world at large. Korra is an especially big deal because she reopened the portals. If Korra walked up to some farmer's house and was like "Hi, I'm the Avatar and I'm low on supplies, could you please help?", I don't think we'd get upset if the farmer doesn't explicitly say "I know how important the Avatar is to the world, and it is for that reason that I am now going to offer you food."
Book 2 had unusual spirit designs, so the fact they're more cute now isn't that big of a deal to me. I agree they could tone it back, but it would be equally weird if they were all intentionally bizarre looking.
And I think we have a tendency to overemphasize Aang as being representative of all Avatars. Aang's spirituality was more because of his Air Nomad culture, not because of any Avatar specific personality trait. It's not like Kyoshi or Kuruk were particularly spiritual folks, although Roku was. There was a lot of missed potential though for a Roku-Aang type relationship with Korra/Kyoshi. Korra would have identified with her, and Kyoshi could have helped correct or at least caution Korra about the fist-first method and how it may not be the best solution. Korra eschewed the past lives thing all the way to the point of eliminating it entirely, and I think Korra had more to benefit from their counsel personal development wise than Aang did.
I wouldn't say that. We have empathy because we are social animals. A creature does not need to concern itself with socialization for the purposes of survival (which I'm sure many spirits wouldn't) or even reproduction (again, many spirits are presumably immortal), empathy would be a pretty useless trait for them. I'm sure they'd have a connection to the avatar and seek to help, but that doesn't necessitate good things for Korra. For example, a spirit could come along, see Korra's disconnect to Raava, and think that the next life would reconnect them. So the spirit would then try to strangle Korra on the spot, all the while knowing it was doing it's best service possible to the Avatar. And it'd be true too. And empathy is particularly a point of contention when discussing various creatures of many mythologies.
I don't see Aang as the representative of all avatars so much as I see him as the pinnacle of them, how they should be, and that's kind of hard to beat because he saved the world, while other avatars lived in more peaceful times where such a sacrifice wasn't necessary. Kuruk and Kyoshi, we barely know them. We had a few conversations with them total, and they could have been spiritual in other ways. Spirituality doesn't necessarily mean pacifist, I hope you know. There's a story about Zen how a great teacher cut a cat in half to prove a point to students about zen. We'd need to see a full story of their lives to have an idea of who they were.
Admiral Woofington
Member
Or she went crazy. After not going on a life changing adventure with Zuko
Catching up on a bunch of posts that were made while I was at work.
Boo this man.
Some people hyperventilate over any reference to the original show. Bryke have shown enough self-restraint with the ATLA references that I don't feel comfortable calling it fanservice (though spirit!Iroh felt like pandering), but it feels like a lot of fans just shut down and start squeeing whenever an ATLA character makes an appearance. Which is great for them if they enjoy it that much, but it does make for a lot of unearned praise of the writing sometimes.
Out of the main Krew, Asami has actually put the least amount of distance between herself and her earlier life, whether you're measuring it by geography or life decisions. It doesn't really make any sense (to me, ofc) for her to be the only major character not to have her personal history explored. I don't really think that she's defined by her actions as an adult, either. She has such a poorly defined character that her role in the show is pretty much entirely defined by her usefulness to the other characters.
I can't speak for Veelk, but for my part, the spirits in Korra seem far less alien and far more human-like in their personalities and behavior. Childlike, sure (to go with the chibi designs), but not all that different from humans. The spirits in "Beginnings" were probably the most human-like of them all, which is part of the reason why I wasn't a big fan of the impact of "Beginnings" on the franchise's mythology.
Boo this man.
Suki is awesome.
Some people hyperventilate over any reference to the original show. Bryke have shown enough self-restraint with the ATLA references that I don't feel comfortable calling it fanservice (though spirit!Iroh felt like pandering), but it feels like a lot of fans just shut down and start squeeing whenever an ATLA character makes an appearance. Which is great for them if they enjoy it that much, but it does make for a lot of unearned praise of the writing sometimes.
Out of the main Krew, Asami has actually put the least amount of distance between herself and her earlier life, whether you're measuring it by geography or life decisions. It doesn't really make any sense (to me, ofc) for her to be the only major character not to have her personal history explored. I don't really think that she's defined by her actions as an adult, either. She has such a poorly defined character that her role in the show is pretty much entirely defined by her usefulness to the other characters.
I can't speak for Veelk, but for my part, the spirits in Korra seem far less alien and far more human-like in their personalities and behavior. Childlike, sure (to go with the chibi designs), but not all that different from humans. The spirits in "Beginnings" were probably the most human-like of them all, which is part of the reason why I wasn't a big fan of the impact of "Beginnings" on the franchise's mythology.
Atraveller
Banned
shira dropped the bomb and ran away smh.
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