Windom Earle
Member
Agreed, let's leave it at that. Next time please word your post differently (saying "something looks bad in motion" can mean a lot of things) so I can instantly ignore it.
The Wii U and its ability to produce amazing visuals.
- Thread starter delta25
- Start date
Agreed, let's leave it at that. Next time please word your post differently (saying "something looks bad in motion" can mean a lot of things) so I can instantly ignore it.
ChronotriggerJM
Member
I don't even own a Wii U but I've no shame in saying it's got great looking games. I think the graphics are mostly wasted on games like Smash Brothers, but that's sort of the nature of the game, it just pans out too far to tell.
The high frame rates also do wonders for the games in motion. Regardless of what people say, Mario Kart looks great on a TV.
The high frame rates also do wonders for the games in motion. Regardless of what people say, Mario Kart looks great on a TV.
Spieler Eins
Member
The art direction is generic at best. After a certain point in 3d World, all you're looking at is monotone walls at one side of the screen and either lava or blue goo. Even before that, it hardly has any details whatsoever and what the hell is going with that plastic looking Mario?
It's more impressive to get a gorgeous game like Sonic Generations built at even 30 fps (which had me perplexed first playing it not even two years ago, not realizing for two or three seconds I could actually control what felt like claymation at first) than this thing at 60. Mario Kart would have been a better example, but then again, that game looks like what 3d World should have been.
Gotdatmoney
Member
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I think the art direction of the galaxy games wouldn't work for 3D world since its more of an obstacle course compared to the galaxy games trying to build a more organic world then throw platforming into it. I think 3D world looks great, the use of colour and especially the autumn levels look great. And the last world looks so great and was a more unique theme for mario games.
Sonic generations like I said was pretty but it achieves that by running like shit. I don't find it worth the level of praise you're giving it to achieve generations graphics if it has to run poorly and at half the frame rate to do so. (great game though) MK8 looks closer to generations but has no AA at the benefit of double the framerate and the IQ isn't good. I find 3D world better looking the MK tbh.
This thread man. Downplaying WiiU's graphical accomplishment by posting load-ass Gifs of Drive Club. Remind me Killzone 2 era where Gifs were everywhere. Bad stuff.
But yeah, Nintendo games look spectacular and not to mention 60 fps. I'll take that over any polygonal effect or HDR lightning effect any other system has.
But yeah, Nintendo games look spectacular and not to mention 60 fps. I'll take that over any polygonal effect or HDR lightning effect any other system has.
Heh. I just got a PS4 and GTAV over Christmas. I like the game. I'm not arguing about that, but driving in the country I was surprised at the amount of pop-in and aliasing problems it also has. i.e. the grass literally grows in front of your eyes.
Nintendo does some amazing stuff graphically and artistically though. I don't really understand the sentiment here that something isn't graphically difficult or amazing if its not 1.) realistic and 2.) running on the latest most greatest hardware ever. People (especially console devs) have been doing amazing stuff with shitty hardware for years. They deserve props for it. Many of them seem to like doing it. i.e. the challenge of "X is impossible on that hardware" is an alluring one.
Windom Earle
Member
A downsampled 4k screenshot of Dark Souls 2 will look good to anyone. Downsampled 4k footage of it running at 20fps will not. How a game looks in motion is extremely important, and a racing game at 30fps doesn't look good to me. Sorry. *shrugs*
Phew, I've heard Driveclub fans are touchy but christ.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Herein lies the problem - you don't know what I'm talking about.
It's really amusing when somebody tries to redact how a discussion started, while all the relevant posts are in the very same thread, quoted time and again.
What's 'uncanny' about it?
I'd say they did a terrific job of showing a wet road. In most race games wet roads look like giant pools, or seem to have a water coating applied to a perfectly even surface.
The depicted unevenness in the road makes it look very realistic.
Windom Earle
Member
Oh come on man. I am fine with you not wanting to play 30fps racers. It's just not something that makes sense to debate IMO, so I'd rather not waste time with it.
I don't think the Wii u hardware wise is anything special. Nintendo, since the NES era, have been good at taking the resources they have and using good art style and technical wizardry to consistently produce gorgeous looking games. Even on handhelds their games look stellar. Of course HD has been very helpful at elevating their visuals exponentially (not so helpful to thier release schedule). Nevertheless I would give more credit to the art team behind their games than the actual hardware itself.
It's very dated hardware. There's no special X factor at play here -- it's weak hardware, and that's it. The best you can say about it is that it may not be as weak as some think, or may not be as weak as PS360.
That said, if you make art assets that look good and colors that look good, then they'll look good. The extent that games look good on Wii U has to do with the developers doing a very good job of choosing how to utilize limited resources and coming up with great art direction. Looking at Mario 3D World and Captain Toad, take note of their decision to make the levels very small chunks of land floating in space. This is them cleverly utilizing limited resources to make the most eye popping visuals possible.
I say all of this out of love, because I play Wii U all the time. But, yeah. Nintendo is good at making good looking games.
also: I find the people saying Driveclub doesn't look that good to be amazing.
That said, if you make art assets that look good and colors that look good, then they'll look good. The extent that games look good on Wii U has to do with the developers doing a very good job of choosing how to utilize limited resources and coming up with great art direction. Looking at Mario 3D World and Captain Toad, take note of their decision to make the levels very small chunks of land floating in space. This is them cleverly utilizing limited resources to make the most eye popping visuals possible.
I say all of this out of love, because I play Wii U all the time. But, yeah. Nintendo is good at making good looking games.
also: I find the people saying Driveclub doesn't look that good to be amazing.
M°°nblade;145447696 said:
No wet road, at an incline like that, would look like shiny glass. That's what he's talking about. It looks like the road is coated in reflective film or glass, not water. It is way to visually clean vs. reality... which is exactly part of falling into the uncanny valley.
You're going to get water films on flat roads, or on flat roads under heat/strong sunlight where you get the illusory coating. This road isn't flat, and the water should be rolling and creating a very different, uneven reflection/refraction combination. The DC gif is not at all representative of a real scenario where actual physics are in affect, not made-up graphical homages.
It's not worth debating because we both know that in a parallel universe where Mariokart wasn't 60fps, Ysiadmihi's post wouldn't exist.
M°°nblade;145447696 said:
What's 'uncanny' about it?
I'd say they did a terrific job of showing a wet road. In most race games wet roads look like giant pools, or seem to have a water coating applied to a perfectly even surface.
The depicted unevenness in the road makes it look very realistic.
No. Sorry. Have you ever driven in a car before when it's raining? Christ. Please post more memes though so we can take this worthy debate further.
EDIT: I'm beginning to think that you guys just don't know what "uncanny valley" refers to. Hint: It doesn't mean that the graphics aren't technically impressive.
It's a cutscene shot isn't it? I might be remembering wrong but I thought this had some aliasing in the trailer. Would've looked a lot smoother if it was CGI or something.
Mr_Antimatter
Member
Good art direction can go a long way. I think a lot of developers would do better to use more stylized art and bright colors in games, instead of the usual drab realistic approach.
it's not pre-rendered and it's not a bullshot (it's captured from video, not a screenshot)
It is a cutscene graphics, but the one of the right seemed also from a cutscene (don't know if they use the same model in the game)
Are there any games that use physics to simulate this effect gravity has on wet surfaces?
It's a road, not a river.
Even with an incline like that, from that distance you're barely going to see water roll of the hill with a naked eye as opposed to a static look unless it's poring really hard or you're looking at the gutter where the water accumulates. It's just going to glitter a little bit more.
Correct, 'uncanny valley' means the graphics cause a response of revulsion.
So tell me, are you sure that the way the rain looks really causes you abhorrence, a sense of loathing, intense aversion, repugnance, repulsion, horror or a sudden violent feeling of disgust and you're not just nitpicking?
And yes, I got my driving license 10 years ago, and I live in a country where we have a maritime temperate climate with significant precipitation in all seasons. Does that make me expert enough for your likings to have a valid opinion on the subject?
I think there's more than simple artistry going on here. I think Nintendo is the only developer making WiiU games in ways the machine was intended such as utilising edram for amazing textures and shifting CPU functions to GPU. I'm sure there's also fixed function hardware in there for lighting and other things.
Have you even watch FFXV trailer?
pinkurocket
Member
Lol, those Driveclub gifs.
The Wii U can still hold it's own next to the other current gen consoles despite having less power, is what OP was saying. Obviously other consoles will have more technically impressive graphics, but that's not really the point.
The Wii U can still hold it's own next to the other current gen consoles despite having less power, is what OP was saying. Obviously other consoles will have more technically impressive graphics, but that's not really the point.
Pennywise83
Banned
GC (Resident Evil 4), GBA (Final Fantasy Tactics Advance), Wii (Monster Hunter Tri), DS (like, every Square Enix game), 3DS (Resident Evil Revelations, Youkai Watch) disagree with you.
Theognosis
Member
That's how I see it, too. The Wii U has unique hardware features that other machines couldn't pull off without taking a framerate hit. The lighting is just incredible at 60 fps. It's just too bad people try to downplay its strengths and come up with shitty posts about 30 fps racers (btw, Drive Club will look aged when a 60 fps iteration is introduced in a few years). I think they're just trying to justify their purchase. They were led to believe that the Wii U is inferior and the PS4 is the most powerful machine this gen. The truth is somewhere in between.
M°°nblade;145449940 said:
Isn't that the point?
If it's raining so hard that a weathered road on an incline looks like glass, you wouldn't be able to see shit through your windshield anyway.
M°°nblade;145449940 said:
More "sense of unease", or if I want to be really loose with the definition, how about it appears "uncanny"
(gasps)
Do you think enumerating deliberate misinterpretations is persuasive?
And yes, I got my driving license 10 years ago, and I live in a country where we have a maritime temperate climate with significant precipitation in all seasons. Does that make me expert enough for your likings to have a valid opinion about the subject?
So no, you don't often drive in rain?
Also: it was a rhetorical question
The lightning is indeed the best thing about Wii U's hardware. It seems to manage it effortlessly.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Most of Nintendos 1st party games have very good art direction, but I don't think they're very impressive graphically. They look good, but thats because of art direction.
I don't think the WiiU has topped the best on Ps3 and Xbox360 yet, from purely technical standpoint.(Halo4, Uncharted 3, God Of War 3, Killzone 3, GTA V)
But does it really matter in the end? I don't think so.
I don't think the WiiU has topped the best on Ps3 and Xbox360 yet, from purely technical standpoint.(Halo4, Uncharted 3, God Of War 3, Killzone 3, GTA V)
But does it really matter in the end? I don't think so.
Maybe it was because of this
I was just merely responding to this nonsense
Windom Earle
Member
I don't think people are downplaying the U and the DC gifs started showing up in response to an insecure Nintendo fan dissing PS4/Xbone. Your post is weird.
Stuff like this is the fate of any topic that aims to be positive about Nintendo's consoles and the visuals in software for them.
Nobody has shrugged and let things slide on the internet for 25 years now. Don't expect different here
Windom Earle
Member
Nobody has shrugged and let things slide on the internet for 25 years now. Don't expect different here
lol
It's almost 2015 and people still struggle to deal with the Wii U lack of computational power compared to the other two consoles. Unbelievable.
3dworld and mk8 look great but they feature very simple scenes, also they are exclusives that comparison is pointless.
Nintendo is able to produce amazing visuals thanks to their art, not the Wii U.
3dworld and mk8 look great but they feature very simple scenes, also they are exclusives that comparison is pointless.
Nintendo is able to produce amazing visuals thanks to their art, not the Wii U.
jobrro
Member
The Nintendo games look great but I wish it had a bit more oomph. The Wii U is already larger than the OG Wii by a decent margin and pretty comparable to the PS4 (which has no power brick). I've read before the Wii U was toned down to fit in a more compact body... I would have much prefered it as maybe 1/3rd the PS4 in power even at a PS4 sized casing (but one year ahead) and essentially the games they are already putting out but in 1080p with some level of AA.
When it comes down to it I still enjoy the games when they come out regardless of their less than epic IQ so I guess Nintendo wins regardless.
When it comes down to it I still enjoy the games when they come out regardless of their less than epic IQ so I guess Nintendo wins regardless.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Thats not water.
Thats not Zelda.
I don't know why we always bring the quality of games into graphics talk, but Driveclub ironically has one of the best senses of speed in years.
You'd have to go back as far as Wipeout or Burnout to find something comparable.
This is mainly becaus eof the track design. We have high object desity close to the road, a lot of detailed foliage, but also a huge draw distance. So we see huge mountains in the background moving slowly and tons of little stuff close to us rushing by, what adds to the insane sense of speed is the narrow nature of many roads in Driveclub and the very good motion blur.
Driveclub might not be one of the meatiest racers in history, and it surely desevers some shit for its brokenness at launch and afterwards, but its still one of the best arcade racers in a long time. And thats not because its by far the best looking racing game out there right now, but because its just a very good game.
Technically : average / simple
-For mario = each "scene" is "simple" , the AI is very... classic , cases to handle is not like an open world or a game where the player can do multiple things to achieve the stage.
you have a "wallpaper" as background and some blocks to build the scene.
In that case, nintendo can give a good visual to the overall scene.
Visual : very good
It's finally the more important thing. The game looks very good.
In blizzard/ND/kojima/Some japanese studios productions, we have the same idea : use the advanced effects where it needs to ...
Well. Nintendo games have plenty of hardware resources to dedicate to illumination.
With just a few things happening on the scene, "low-poly" characters and objects, and levels based on squared terrain blocks insted of actual surface terrains, Wii U have a lot of power remaining for making that look beautiful with illumination tricks and art style.
With just a few things happening on the scene, "low-poly" characters and objects, and levels based on squared terrain blocks insted of actual surface terrains, Wii U have a lot of power remaining for making that look beautiful with illumination tricks and art style.
Not unless you have ... windshield wipers?
But wet roads aren't new tech. There's no sense in calling DC's wet roads a failed experiment when you're pointing at a state-of-the-art rendering imperfection that yet needs to be covered.
You might as well point at the wood nerve textures in Super mario for looking 'uncanny' flat, the lighting not bouncing properly (way too shiny) and details evaporating in the distance because of lacking AF.
http://images.vg247.com/current//2013/10/super-mario-3d-world-3.jpg
barneystuta83
Member
So much salt in here.
How many 'lazy dev's' posts do we get in every triple A game? Every PC game is 'not optimised'. 360 and PS3 cross-gen titles? What a waste of resource. And "my next gen" game is dumbed down because of it.
What Nintendo and the Wii U is doing is great. They know the limitations of the console. We all do, especially up against Sony and MS.
Even with these 'simple' graphics, Wii U owners are getting polished games. The most polish that goes into any games. The IQ, resolution, and frame rate are the best they can be, given the hardware and game style/type.
Some people just want raw power, which is not always a good thing. It can lead to 'lazy' development, that is what they industry has become for many big titles.
The Nintendo teams are, without doubt, the most polished developers in gaming. For that they should be praised.
EDIT: Driveclub thread? Driveclub thread
How many 'lazy dev's' posts do we get in every triple A game? Every PC game is 'not optimised'. 360 and PS3 cross-gen titles? What a waste of resource. And "my next gen" game is dumbed down because of it.
What Nintendo and the Wii U is doing is great. They know the limitations of the console. We all do, especially up against Sony and MS.
Even with these 'simple' graphics, Wii U owners are getting polished games. The most polish that goes into any games. The IQ, resolution, and frame rate are the best they can be, given the hardware and game style/type.
Some people just want raw power, which is not always a good thing. It can lead to 'lazy' development, that is what they industry has become for many big titles.
The Nintendo teams are, without doubt, the most polished developers in gaming. For that they should be praised.
EDIT: Driveclub thread? Driveclub thread
Let me stop you there: I didn't. I'm talking about the sense of speed conveyed by the visuals, and 30fps with obnoxious amounts of motion blur doesn't do that well.
is this a 2008 multi gen, multiplatform game?
I wonder what could have been done if it was an exclusive and featured a slower gameplay and simpler levels...
Might have had attractive textures?
What a terrible screenshot to make your point with.
You might want to keep an eye out for Rime.
And I agree that Nintendo's developers are wizards. I will pick up a Wii U to accompany my PS4 when the price is right (UK here, still pretty expensive).
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/wii-u-basic-toad-treasure-tracker-169-85-stopto-net-2101176
170£ including toad treasure tracker. There are similar deals all the time (the deluxe + game mostly goes around 200£)
And on topic: True, there are some great looking games on WiiU - like many said mostly because nintendo has it's own distinct art-style that give a clean look with nice contrasts and not too many muddy textures etc.
tkscz
Member
Not sure why EVERY thread about liking the WiiU's graphics turns into "TEH TECHNICALS! TEH TECHNICALS! IT'S SO LAST GEN!" That's not what the thread was about, it was about appreciating what has been pulled off for what is under the WiiU's hood. If someone is comparing it to a PS4 or XB1 game, just pay them no mind, no one really expects the WiiU to pull off technical visuals like that, and we really don't want to have a graphics comparison thread. We just want to appreciate what we have. With that said, I like the visuals of the WiiU, regardless of tech or art, I think the games we've seen so far (mostly from Nintendo) look damn good.
