Giant Panda
Member
Naughty dog is starting to become the next Peter Molyneux.
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Naughty Dog won't push Uncharted 4 to 60fps if it compromises player experience
- Thread starter Slowdive
- Start date
Ton of future quotable embarrassing posts in here.
The smart money was always on 30fps because of franchise pedigree - graphical showcase and slower pace of encounters.
But the decision hasn't even been made yet. If they're at 37fps in an Alpha then there's a lot of engine improvement and optimization still to come and they haven't said they aren't still aiming for 30fps.
60fps was never promised and and acting as though it was is embarrassing.
I'd prefer 60fps but all the evidence says 30fps is just fine too for this franchise (I didn't notice U2 the best action TPS last gen being hurt by frame rate for example).
The smart money was always on 30fps because of franchise pedigree - graphical showcase and slower pace of encounters.
But the decision hasn't even been made yet. If they're at 37fps in an Alpha then there's a lot of engine improvement and optimization still to come and they haven't said they aren't still aiming for 30fps.
60fps was never promised and and acting as though it was is embarrassing.
I'd prefer 60fps but all the evidence says 30fps is just fine too for this franchise (I didn't notice U2 the best action TPS last gen being hurt by frame rate for example).
Sure.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Hes an ICE Team programmer who helped design the PS4 and all the internal tools and engines that power the PS4, doesn't he know that 60fps is "better"?
Sack him.
Boombloxer
Member
Not really, no.
Personally I disagree but I see nothing wrong with that. But we don't need "set pieces and experiences" in multiplayer, so can we get 60fps there, pretty please?
At least we got The Last of Us on PS4 running smoothly, that multiplayer is fantastic.
Cave Johnson
Member
Same poison, different volume.
Being a programmer & a game designer are 2 very different things
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
There's a few in here that we know have no interest and are very outspoken against consoles, yet show up like clockwork. I'm only referring to them.
Stereogatari
Banned
It wasn't hurt at all but the focus of some our arguments is that 60fps is objectively the more important goal for a medium that involves getting feedback from manipulating objects on a screen using a controller.
SneakyStephan
Banned
You're right, console gaming seems all about lowered expectations these days...
on topic: 30 fps compromises the player experience
Yaphett Kotto
Member
Yes. There are people on Gaf that have that point of view like we really need every little detail.
lukeskymac
Member
It's not. It's hardly as prevalent as that poster suggested, though.
Exactly. There's nothing shocking about what's said here. The whole of gaming dev is making though choices to get the best experience you want. Not only about graphics vs performance, about every single thing there is.
Making Uncharted 4 an awesome game is more important than honoring a stupid 60 fps promise just for the heck of the numbers, and if you actually intended to play the game, you'll think the same.
Not saying we can't ever have both, but if they had to choose it's normal they'd go with making the best game, not the smoothest, and if you're a player that's also the choice you'd take if the question arised.
However I do agree they should never have said that in the first place
But who am I to say that anyway, this thread is already full of internet experts who know full well about this topic right.
CerebralTiger
Member
Physics based interaction with environments can also be used to create more dynamic gameplay scenarios. It doesn't have to be limited to cosmetic applications.
All things that would be completely impossible at 60fps, no doubt. Line of sight loss? Yea, that's a next-gen concept we've never seen before, totally. Sound reaction? Man, I cant wait til we see that in a game.
I get what you're saying, but I think its a bit naïve to think that Uncharted is going to be doing anything super special with all that spare performance capability other than pushing the visual wow factor.
The Red Wizard
Member
This.
ND, just lock it at 30. Framerate drops are annoying so I'd rather you just accept the limit and keep it at a constant 30. It's not preferable to downscaling the graphics and getting 60FPS but I'll accept it.
I only played First Light, but yeah, I definitely prefer the unlocked framerate.
Not sure if it would be good for multiplayer though, being consistent is probably better. So it should be either 30 or 60, I guess.
lukeskymac
Member
It's not, but it sure is being used as one these days.
Marvel
could never
Yours, not mine.
I thought it felt significantly worse, I tried it in both and the 30fps option had this tiring effect on my eyes and made playing the game feel slow somehow. 60fps on other hand felt wonderful and made the gameplay feel smooth as butter.
I kindof suspected their 60fps goal wouldn't be that firm, especially after doing a 30 fps demo. Doing that level of optimisation late in a project isn't easy, and going back and downgrading the graphics probably won't be received well (and even that takes quite a lot of effort). Kudos to them if they do manage it though
Schweinehund
Member
There's people that are pissed about anything.
Though, they should at least try to make the multiplayer 60 fps.
GIANKRATOS
Member
There will always be people complaining in every case...
That's why I said I'd prefer 60fps. Some posts are perfectly sensible about 60/30 fos but way too many posts in here are eye rolling bad as though ND had made campaign lies and eaten babies with the usual embarrassing posts implying the demo is somehow shit now or earlier Uncharted games have somehow become embarrassments of coding.
Just silly and fairly childish. Not to mention jping the gun by a fairly long margin at this point.
Personally I've been expecting 30fps and 60fps for SP and MP to be where they'd settle unless they go for really large open MP design for a while. I don't doubt they're aiming for 60fps if Alpha is 37fps (interesting to note that puts current Alga performance way ahead of many released titles BTW) but all the signs are 30fps with better visuals delivers more sales than 60fps with lesser visuals and in the end I think market concerns and desire to showcase visuals will win out. But I could be wrong. Or they could optimize than 37 to 60 with current visuals and settle for that (I would!).
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Please tell me about these 60fps games that have complex AI behavior going on.
Ill wait right here.
Dombrowski
is responsible for the well-being of this island.
When people saw that demo, they said "Eh, was expecting more from the Naughty Gods, that didn't look mind-blowing".. The majority of people want eye candy, not 60fps. You did this.
Good, 60 fps is a gimmick. id rather have 3d
what a surprise guys.
Here's my shocked face :O
So much potential crow to be served in that "Naughty Gods" debate. Still tons of time for them to optimize to 60, they're totally not leaving themselves outs >
oui, really don't see why people are freaking out now when there's a lot of time left in the dev cycle. Although I do hope for ND's sake that they make it 60 after all their "I dreamt in 60FPS last night" etc. Then again, if anyone is capable of making UC4 in 60fps, it's Naughty Dog.
TheKastorian
Member
Keep it at 30 fps. We'll still enjoy the hell out of it like we did with their PS3 games. IQ>fps
what a surprise guys.
Here's my shocked face :O
So much potential crow to be served in that "Naughty Gods" debate. Still tons of time for them to optimize to 60, they're totally not leaving themselves outs >
Well i was one of those skeptical about them achieving the E3 fidelity at 60fps/1080p.
However i'd rather eat crow and get a 60fps game, than win an internet argument (even though some of the "believers" were really obnoxious).
I'm not freaking out. From the second we saw that teaser UC4 footage back in the day and they said 60fps I was like "lol nope." They ain't gonna do it
UrbanRats said:
Sure! But that's a fantasy world that clearly isn't going to exist
Succinct Verbosity
Member
I'll take a locked 30 over 60 with drops.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Does the story change at 60fps?
No, but it plays better.
"If smooth animation is your number 1 priority then 60hz ftw"
If that is also those posters opinions, then yeah solidifies their arguments. Ice enhancer is entirely focused on graphical fidelity, his opinion is hardly surprising.
My opinion and many others' is to prioritise lower latency, smoother animation and thus more responsive gameplay. I also prioritise high IQ too. His tweets and opinion changes nothing to my opinion and justification, as is true for many others. I suspect the post doesn't help them much
To clarify that doesn't mean locked 30 is awful when choosing to prioritise visual fidelity "player experience". It's just disappointing because that inherently does not improve MY "player experience". It cripples it
Trigonometrize.
Member
Since PSX that's almost a year with a team of 200+ people. Seems like a lot of time to me.
While many things are not new, it is about their implementation not their concept. More complex algorithms are going to take more cpu time.
I'm not freaking out. From the second we saw that teaser UC4 footage back in the day and they said 60fps I was like "lol nope." They ain't gonna do it
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