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[Mass_Pincup]

All I can see here on GAF is people saying how they find refreshing that the game is only 6-7 hours long, how great the graphics are, how deep is the narrative. I think this game is being received with extreme favourable prejudice for what it seems to offer (I'm not commenting on the quality of the offering).

What kind of alternate Gaf were you browsing?

 

[bombshell]

why not posting the original interview?
http://www.develop-online.net/inter...y-at-dawn-talks-quality-over-quantity/0203245

It has a less sensationalist headline, but it says a lot more and provides better context.



...which, I dare say, comes with more actual value than a $100 steak.

I kind of hate when threads like this credit the click-baiting article instead of the clearly sourced original interview.

 

[tim.mbp]

Just a few...

https://www.youtube.com/user/nxtgen720/videos

https://www.youtube.com/user/CrapgamerReviews/videos

https://twitter.com/PNF4LYFE/with_replies

https://twitter.com/Mooch1978/with_replies

Lol

I thought you meant actual video game websites or news outlets, not random no name twitter/youtube users.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Bullying? Criticizing a game, unfairly or not, is not bullying, FFS. The developers who got harassed because of Gamergate, now they got bullied. RAD needs some perspective here.

And what game in recent memory has had as much shit thrown at it like The Order has?

Ryse. Destiny, Watch Dogs, AssCreed Unity, DmC, Thief 4, Dark Souls II... But Ryse is the most obvious comparison because it's also supposedly short, light on gameplay and heavy on pretty graphics. But yeah, point is, The Order is not a special snowflake or anything.

Well-Done Filet Mignon

Just reading that hurts the soul, y'know. What a waste of a good cut of meat.

 

[DevilFox]

I'll be honest: they're right. It started with the reveal and every little piece of news, decontextualized if necessary, has been used to shit on the game and feed the flames. This YT walkthrough and its count of gameplay/cinematics/qte minutes is just the apotheosis of this sad story and this humorous review is really spot on.
I played the game, finished today, enjoyed it a lot. I will recommend it if asked. It has its flaws but it's a very well packaged product and I'm here hoping for a sequel. I believe in the "play first, talk later" rule, but it seems that the web disagrees because there are more opinions from people who didn't play it than from people who played it. I wanted to share my impressions in the other thread but it looks like few people give a damn so just wait for the reviews and have fun on bashing it even more in the next month. I'll keep myself as far as possible from those threads, too much internet sometimes can really worsen your day.

 

[MKP64]

I think RAD's defensive PR is turning me off of the Order. I thought these guys were super confident in the product?

 

[Gbraga]

Calling that playthrough a speedrun is being insincere.

Or maybe they have no idea of what a speedrun actually is.

Which is also not very good, I guess.

 

[Chie Satonaka]

Fair enough. Lots of people on here who wouldn't dare say some of the stuff they spout to a real actual person.

I wouldn't have a problem telling a RAD developer that I think that their game doesn't provide enough value for 60 dollars to their face.

Regardless of how you feel about the game, this damage control is ridiculous. Most of the PR regarding this game has been ridiculous. Did they hire a freshman or something?

 

[Northeastmonk]

Social media is bullying. No one is going to share the same thoughts and feelings, plus the lower ends of everything are going to be guided and pointed out. The world is a scary place and you wont always meet people who like you, some will make your life a living hell just because they have that power. There's no global ethics committee. It's just tolerated under rules and regulations. It's why we have police and a legal system.

One guy with a youtube account and an early copy made all this happen. What do you do now?

What do you do now that your content can be copied and streamed to thousands just because they got an early copy?

 

[Primethius]

If they can show me evidence to a 15 hour run, I'd change my tune. But as is, we've got one convincing video playthrough - against a handful of unverifiable reports for a game that has become highly politicized.

Talking about the length of the game before the games out into the hands of many is crazy.

The dude beat it in about 6 hours. I haven't watched it so I won't comment on that. Lets take that as a fact.

That doesn't mean the game is on average 6 hours. For all we know, his completion time might be on the lower end of things.

Him beating the game at that time doesn't somehow make it that all the GAFfers that beat it around 10-12 hours are wrong. Its different playstyles.

Assuming the game on average will take 6 hours from one youtube video is ridiculous, especially given alternative impressions.

It could just be the low end of things.

This reminds me just like the minorities in Order discussion. It all ended up being based on flawed assumptions.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

I kind of hate when threads like this credit the click-baiting article instead of the clearly sourced original interview.

My bad. I added the original source in an update.

 

[Seventy70]

I can get how making fun of a specific person is bullying, but making fun of a product that a business is putting out is not bullying. If they can't handle criticism, they should close their studio down now and find other work.

 

[Ardenyal]

There have been a lot of games recently targeted by the same shitposters. Shame that people cant get over the console wars.

 

[MaDKaT]

While it is just par for the course how the net community can be, it really has seemed that this game has sparked an inordinate amount of criticism. Just in this community alone, every little bit of news sparks multiple threads with gobs of pages, Other games can and have sparked lots of negativity but something about this game really fuels the flames.

 

[shandy706]

In my experience, the fancier, more expensive steaks also tend to be bigger because they're cut thicker

This is a steak thread, right?

This post made chuckle.

Now I'm hungry again.

 

[dark10x]

grow a thicker skin, RAD,

when we get a major zelda (freaking ZELDA, not a new, unproven generic shooter IP) it gets panned by waves and waves of haters, regardless of the quality of the game, nintendo ignores them just like they should.

you should ignore them too

I think comparing the launch of a new IP from a smaller developer like RAD to Zelda is pretty damn silly, to be honest. Zelda has a huge lineage behind it and will sell regardless. That's not the case with The Order.

 

[Loudninja]

I kind of hate when threads like this credit the click-baiting article instead of the clearly sourced original interview.

Woah they majorly cut down this interview :/

 

[loaf of bread]

Also, Gaf and the internet continue to tear ordinary people apart over semantics and take their words as if they're carefully worded PR releases and not the relaxed conversations that they are.

 

[ChawlieTheFair]

Well there was a 2nd run through that was running around the same length but I don't know if his account got axed too.

And we have all these other accounts and reviewers saying the game's length isn't an issue.

Edit: We should probably stop taking one source of info as gospel when we have many saying it isn't.

 

[sonicmj1]

I gotta say Gamespot sucks major balls lately, taking other people's interviews and taking a bunch of quotes out of context and posting it as an article with a sensationalist headline, guess that's the way shit works.

Right. Those kinds of articles are the absolute worst kind of journalism. Stirring shit just to get hits, leeching off the original work of others.

They're somewhat hyperbolic quotes, but they're not that bad in context. The Develop interview is fine.

 

[Nameless]

I liked Bungie's approach when the internet was lambasting Destiny pre-release due to fears of a lack of content/zones--they didn't say shit. No preemptive excuses, no damage control, no arguing with nebulous haters. They shut their mouths and let their game be what it was going to be(until it launched, at least).

Not sure what this standoffish attitude accomplishes for RaD besides drawing even more ire and putting a bigger spotlight on the negativity.

 

[Dragonborn]

I think RAD's defensive PR is turning me off of the Order. I thought these guys were super confident in the product?

Dude, when a game is getting this much hate, does it really surprise you that they'd get defensive? I've never seen anything like this before, it's insane

 

[Alienous]

This quote:

"If you go and you eat a steak, if you pay $100 for a steak that tastes like the best steak you've ever had in your life but it's only 200 grams versus paying the same price for the worst steak you could want--but it's all-you-can-eat," he said. "There's an argument to be made that one is better than the other depending on who you are. If you just want to be full all the time then all-you-can-eat terrible steak, maybe that's for you?"

Why do they keep defending the existence of shorter experiences (which are utterly defensible, but that isn't the point here) whilst also, simultaneously, asserting "No, The Order: 1886 couldn't possibly be short"?

 

[toddhunter]

There's an argument to be made that this game gets more hate than it deserves, but I earnestly believe that the vitriol is just one of two sides of the same coin when it comes to the console wars. I think for every person that wants to take a potshot at it for being a console exclusive, there's someone else out there willing to defend it because it's a console exclusive. Such is the nature of the silly system wars. I honestly kind of wish I could travel momentarily to the parallel Earth-2 where The Order 1886 is a multi-plat and see if the front page of that universe's NeoGAF has 20 threads on the game.

I agree. I take the "debate" about game length to simply be people arguing for and against it as a console war tool (and lets not leave out PC fans, it is called the prettiest game ever after all which will upset a lot of people).

Does anybody really care about the games length beyond? "Seems short for my taste given the gameplay, I might not buy it yet" It is pretty simple really and I'm pretty sure everybody knows that game length is meaningless. Why people are taking it so seriously is beyond me and it'll all die down in a week when the next "target" is coming up and people suddenly get concerned because Bloodborne doesn't have enough grass or something.

It seems RAD need to chill.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Sounds like RAD is legit shook over these criticisms. Would love to see how they felt about that subtitled video.

 

[Jarmel]

And we have all these other accounts and reviewers saying the game's length isn't an issue.

Video evidence > Random Testimony

 

[FinalStageBoss]

If the game is shit, I wouldn't cry for RaD for getting lots of criticism. But they do seem to be getting a lot of hate before the game has been played by most people, and before reviews are even out.

True. People criticizing the game when it's not even out make themselves look like a bunch of idiots. But gaf will be gaf.

 

[Frillen]

The game is actually in the neighborhood of 8-10 hours long, which indeed is in-line with other shooter games.

Other shooters also have additional modes, like multiplayer, challenge, co-op, new game + etc. etc.

 

[robertlebrone]

And what game in recent memory has had as much shit thrown at it like The Order has?

Destiny.

 

[loaf of bread]

I think RAD's defensive PR is turning me off of the Order. I thought these guys were super confident in the product?

Give me a break

Destiny.

Not even close to the same scale, and that all came after people actually played it not before.

 

[Mushroomer25]

The problem is that your sample number is.....1

I'll take one verifiable report over six dozen unverifiable ones.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

This thread is going to fast, lol, missed this:

How would you feel if you spent 5 years of your life working day and night working on something you're deeply passionate about and have it get hated, shit on, and disregarded by hundreds of thousands of people before you've even released it.

Yeah that's gotta suck, but remember that it happens to just about every game with shitty reviews and scores out there.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Not going to lie, the game does look awesome. But, for me, I don't want to spend $60 for this length. I try for at least 15 hours if its going to be that price.

 

[Cornbread78]

What a bunch of pansies. Grow the fuck up.

Nerds talk shit on the internet, it is what it is. I'll play the game and make up my own mind.

And this is why they just need to ignore it, because these same children and fanboys harassign them online are the same ones that would be kissing their a$$ in person. Jeleously breeds negativity, but there ain't a way in hell they would heckle this dude to his face in the real world...

So yeah, e-pein.... go figure. all bad and tough "online"

 

[SerTapTap]

Have these people used the internet before? Jesus, harden the fuck up.

This really doesn't excuse anything though. "It's the internet" has never been a good excuse for the extreme amounts of hate and ignorance. A lot of people have disgusting attitudes and do disgusting things on the internet, it's not okay just because it's common.

I definitely think this game gets really unreasonable amounts of hate, not entirely sure why. Destiny was full of straight-up lies and if anything had more defenders, and the whole discussion about that game only turned partially negative after release which...would seem to be the reasonable time to start any such hate brigade.

 

[Hexa]

Good lord this game gets so much hate, and its not even fucking out yet.
I really hope this game does well both critically, financially and is all around an amazing game, so it is undeniably proven that haters don't matter, so devs don't have to feel bad and can just ignore this shit.

 

[Scrulox]

It seems like RAD just likes to treat criticisms as mindless hate and conveniently ignore them. I have another theory that is gonna seem really really crazy. What if there are good reasons for all these criticisms or hate? I mean when you sell a 60 dollar game that offers only 7 hours of playtime on a normal play-through meaning the player doesn't walk around in circle for 30 minutes every time they enter a new area, half of the time you are watching cutscenes while the other half being extremely typical or uninspirational solider vs soldier TPS gameplay, you should expect criticisms.

I hope RAD realizes that the only thing that's exceptional about this game is their presentation and nothing more. I watched the play-through videos and the story isn't even good. Comparing to The Last of Us which has interesting gameplay, emotional story and exceptional presentation, The Order is like one third of a game. With that said, I literally cannot imagine anyone not criticizing The Order so as to discourage a game like this being made.

 

[nelchaar]

If you like the game/interested in the premise/like shooters: Buy it

If not: Don't buy it

I don't understand why people feel the need to rail on games or the visions of developers.

No Man's Sky: Too open world. What do you even do? What's the goal?

The Order: Too linear. Cinematic LOL. Another TPS.

There always seems to be a hateful minority. Hell, I even remember TLOU getting hate. Just chill, play the games you like, ignore the games you dont.

 

[SSReborn]

While it is just par for the course how the net community can be, it really has seemed that this game has sparked an inordinate amount of criticism. Just in this community alone, every little bit of news sparks multiple threads with gobs of pages, Other games can and have sparked lots of negativity but something about this game really fuels the flames.

Not only is it the console war thing but the whole cinematic story vs gameplay thing as well so people who usually get into arguments with relation to those things come into these threads.

 

[Loudninja]

I don't think people need to go out there and be unbiased supporters of our stuff or anything either. I want them to make up their own minds about the game period. It just seems like the pendulum swings the other way so frequently. I mean, we'll see, right?

http://www.develop-online.net/inter...y-at-dawn-talks-quality-over-quantity/0203245

 

[Maximus.]

They are totally right. It's seems like people tend to focus more on things they don't like then things they do like, personally found it weird.

This is common and it does suck. Now I'm not defending this game because we will have to see how it actually plays out, but yes people tend to speak more about negative things than positive things.

 

[bombshell]

I think RAD's defensive PR is turning me off of the Order. I thought these guys were super confident in the product?

They are confident in their product, but they had maybe not expected street dates to be broken so many places for up to 2 weeks prior to the game's launch.

 

[Primethius]

I'll take one verifiable report over six dozen unverifiable ones.

And your verifiable report still doesn't mean much. See my previous post.

Don't conflate one completion time with average time.

 

[ChawlieTheFair]

Video evidence > Random Testimony

One of them was forbes.

Edit: random being gaffers, could very well be journalists for big sites.

 

[El-Suave]

Well, they're right. For whatever reason, this game has generated a ton of hate from the moment it was revealed. We all know what type of game it is.

On the contrary, I think the hype levels were higher than usual at first with Sony's rather weak first party output last year. There were interviews where the devs seemed surprised their game carried so many hopes if I remember correctly. Then the hype collapsed and it it turned into the opposite. It's partly their own fault though, they've shown too little for too long, sold some features wrongly and also made some statements that rubbed some people the wrong way. Those are the cards you're dealt when you make single player cinematic games unfortunately.

 

[WordsintheWater]

Right. Those kinds of articles are the absolute worst kind of journalism. Stirring shit just to get hits, leeching off the original work of others.

They're somewhat hyperbolic quotes, but they're not that bad in context. The Develop interview is fine.

I agree, the quotes probably won't please everyone and they are somewhat hyperbolic, but the original interview is actually pretty good.

 

[CoG]

Lol

I thought you meant actual video game websites or news outlets, not random no name twitter/youtube users.

Well, here's hoping Polygon won't disappoint on the review score!

 

[Plinko]

Sounds an awful lot like preemptive damage control.

 

[Gen.Grievous]

I guess it's hard to refuse an interview this close to launch but anything they say will be taken out of context and used to create clickbait headlines. Smarter thing would be to shut up and let people play the game to find out if it's any good.

Seems like every non open world single player game these days is being ridiculously scrutinized though.

 

[Jarmel]

One of them was forbes.

So?