PS4's AF issue we need answers!

Chabbles said:
LOD also improved ?
entire building missing in "before" pic
Edit, Or is that the building you take down during that mission ?

Before
image.jpg

After
image.jpg
Click to expand...


Pretty sure its a story reason that building isn't there anymore (unless I'm thinking of the wrong building).
 
It's looking more and more like a dev oversight than anything else.

If it was only happening on very graphics heavy games that push the hardware to its limits, maybe red flags would go off, but it's mostly last gen ports.

Strider? The swan? It was patched in dying light recently. And now again in DMC.

Only logical place to look is at the devs porting the games.
 
anothertech said:
It's looking more and more like a dev oversight than anything else.

If it was only happening on very graphics heavy games that push the hardware to its limits, maybe red flags would go off, but it's mostly last gen ports.

Strider? The swan? It was patched in dying light recently. And now again in DMC.

Only logical place to look is at the devs porting the games.
Click to expand...

DMC is patched now?
 
anothertech said:
It's looking more and more like a dev oversight than anything else.

If it was only happening on very graphics heavy games that push the hardware to its limits, maybe red flags would go off, but it's mostly last gen ports.

Strider? The swan? It was patched in dying light recently. And now again in DMC.

Only logical place to look is at the devs porting the games.
Click to expand...

Destiny also has some poor AF.
 
To me when Devs port over games using the GNMX API to make the DX11 ports work with minor optimisation it isn't transferring over the AF instructions. Or AF needs to be configured using the GNM API manually and this isn't being done.

The thing that really bugs me though is that this console was "designed by developers, for developers" and "Ease of development" y'know the big PR that Sony was pushing at launch and there are issues with AF?

PS4 should be pushing 8xAF at a minimum. Anything less than that is a failure imho.

Ideally 16xAF like Cory said is possible on Twitter, should be the standard.
 
-griffy- said:
But it's the same on both platforms, so it doesn't fit in with the other games being discussed.

Feels like this thread is on an endless loop at this point. At least the Dying Light patch injected a new thing into it.
Click to expand...

Always Ends up that way when console warriors shit up a thread.
 
anothertech said:
It's looking more and more like a dev oversight than anything else.

If it was only happening on very graphics heavy games that push the hardware to its limits, maybe red flags would go off, but it's mostly last gen ports.

Strider? The swan? It was patched in dying light recently. And now again in DMC.

Only logical place to look is at the devs porting the games.
Click to expand...

I saw some The Order 1886 screens that had it too. Those devs were obsessing over graphical fidelity, I don't think they could have overlooked the basics.
 
Tetranet said:
I saw some The Order 1886 screens that had it too. Those devs were obsessing over graphical fidelity, I don't think they could have overlooked the basics.
Click to expand...
While people love to claim AF is free, it is not. Some more complicated things are going on than ever before in game engines, both during initial frame build and many post operations before it is sent out. Sometimes a lower AF setting may be required in a section for some strange reason, or some proper DOF approximations will blur things in a short distance and make it look like AF is missing.

In the case of Dying Light - I don't have the game to test, but I think the example being used to claim it is only 4X or worse is silly, because the games are not the same, the resolution is not the same, and so on.
 
Tetranet said:
I saw some The Order 1886 screens that had it too. Those devs were obsessing over graphical fidelity, I don't think they could have overlooked the basics.
Click to expand...

Saw what? It has AF, stop moving the goal posts. This is turning into concern trolling and console war BS more than anyone trying to investigate something.
 
interesting to finally see a dev patch a game to add/improve af. would appear in the case of dying light that it wasn't off/low for performance reasons at all. really strange...
 
Souldestroyer Reborn said:
To me when Devs port over games using the GNMX API to make the DX11 ports work with minor optimisation it isn't transferring over the AF instructions. Or AF needs to be configured using the GNM API manually and this isn't being done.

The thing that really bugs me though is that this console was "designed by developers, for developers" and "Ease of development" y'know the big PR that Sony was pushing at launch and there are issues with AF?

PS4 should be pushing 8xAF at a minimum. Anything less than that is a failure imho.

Ideally 16xAF like Cory said is possible on Twitter, should be the standard.
Click to expand...
Yeah, there is literally no difference between 8x and 16x performance wise so I don't know from where these ideas are coming from. It's either no AF or 16x, everything in between is rather pointless.
 
-griffy- said:
But it's the same on both platforms, so it doesn't fit in with the other games being discussed.

Feels like this thread is on an endless loop at this point. At least the Dying Light patch injected a new thing into it.
Click to expand...
It was pretty clear from the beginning it wasn't an hardware issue but more something about the SDK. Xbone hasn't nothing of real advantageous to handle better AF. Maybe with a real more stronger CPU compared ps4, xbone could have had a sort of, but it's pratically the same hardware with inferior gpu and memory setup, these differences are more in favour of the ps4 than the xbone CPU advantages.
 
omonimo said:
That's enough for you or you need of more prove?


It seems clearly an SDK issue at this point. Jeez tons of posts about 'I don't believe to who said otherwise', 'but you can't prove the contrary' even with tons of explanations how weird are your strange tech convinctions and et voila with a simple patch AF can be improved XD . Even x360 had unified ram never remembered strange AF issue like the ps4.
Click to expand...

It does seem like a SDK/tool issue at this point. It's likely that AF is not defaulted to an optimal setting or that trilinear filtering is on by default. It may also not be straightforward to implement with the SDK/tools provided.

Sony has consistently been lacking in the SDK/tools development department relative to Microsoft (at least historically). I think they have more of a laissez-faire (less hand holding) type approach.
 
pixlexic said:
So does anyone know someone who worked on dying light? They would be the ones to ask about the issue since they fixed it.
Click to expand...

Twitter would be a good place to ask, wasn't one of the websites trying to get down to the bottom of this?

Muppet of a Man said:
It does seem like a SDK/tool issue at this point. It's likely that AF is not defaulted to an optimal setting or that trilinear filtering is on by default. It may also not be straightforward to implement with the SDK/tools provided.
Click to expand...

That's what it sounds like it is to me too, right from the start

I think they have more of a laissez-faire (less hand holding) type approach
Click to expand...

This is also true, alot of developers have said this about the differences between Sony and MS, less mandates and checklists with Sony.


I wonder if DF will updated their faceoff? If they don't they are surely guilty of the bias that some accuse them of
 
MikeHaggar said:
interesting to finally see a dev patch a game to add/improve af. would appear in the case of dying light that it wasn't off/low for performance reasons at all. really strange...
Click to expand...

That may not be true. it could have been that better optimization allowed for AF in the patch. We don't know.

that's why I would love for someone who worked on dying light patch to come put and say something.
 
It's an interesting issue and an annoying one for anyone who buys these games on their PS4. Reading through this thread and the (allegedly) more knowledgeable folks at B3D, there appears to be some evidence regarding how developers port code from various game engines that causes the AF issue. As far as I know, Faf is a pretty respectable guy, so I take his word over more than others. There was also some investigation as to how APUs treat AF and the impact it takes, and the conclusion seems to be a bug and/or improper method used in the how it's all ported over.

It looks like some companies are taking a step to correct it or have forgotten about it completely and are moving on. Either way, super annoying issue and maybe Sony needs to update their documentation on how to better inform the developers to fix this or port over AF the proper way, assuming that is the case at all.

Shame that it has lasted this long.
 
xenorevlis said:
While people love to claim AF is free, it is not. Some more complicated things are going on than ever before in game engines, both during initial frame build and many post operations before it is sent out. Sometimes a lower AF setting may be required in a section for some strange reason, or some proper DOF approximations will blur things in a short distance and make it look like AF is missing.

In the case of Dying Light - I don't have the game to test, but I think the example being used to claim it is only 4X or worse is silly, because the games are not the same, the resolution is not the same, and so on.
Click to expand...

Free? On PCs , the cost is so small that it essentially is. And the performance difference like someone else mentioned is non-existent. It's either 16xAF or no AF

Here's a comparison I made with ZAT comparing max settings with 16xAF vs 4xAF
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/115844

Note that the 4 frame difference is due to variance. They both go from 138 to 143 in this static scene.

Another
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/115845
 
LRbchKV.png
Click to expand...
All done on PC ver 1.50, forced in nvidia control panel.

Exact same area/time of day/location/progression, at 1080p with AA disabled.
I would definitely say the 1.50 PS4 patch brings the game up to 8X, personally.

If anyone wants to grab the same scene, start a new game and complete the initial tutorial section and as soon as you are let outside, turn left and take a screenshot, then we can match directly with the above image.
 
I thought it was 16x, but i agree with the poster above me. As long as there is some AF, i think 4x or 8x is fine. Barring in mind AF is def not free on console with limited HW, i think one of those two settings is a good compromise. Much better than none anyways, even 4x makes a massive difference to the scene
 
WoolyNinja said:
Pretty sure its a story reason that building isn't there anymore (unless I'm thinking of the wrong building).
Click to expand...

Indeed.

The before picture is a pre patch and the building isn't there due to
a story mission in where it's blown up as the building is a nest of sorts
. The higher leveled character would also suggest this.

The after picture is post patch as the AF has improved but the lower leveled character would suggest that
the player hasn't progressed as far in terms of the story missions. The building hasn't been blown up yet
.
 
Jellzy said:
The after picture is post patch as the AF has improved but the lower leveled character would suggest that
the player hasn't progressed as far in terms of the story missions. The building hasn't been blown up yet
.
Click to expand...
Lod has increased though, look at the second picture; there are more houses in the background, it's not just the building.
 
Anistropic Filtering at 8x should be sufficient for PS4, until the resolution for future games are rendered at more than 1920x1080 resolution on screen.
 
Futaba said:
All done on PC ver 1.50, forced in nvidia control panel.

Exact same area/time of day/location/progression, at 1080p with AA disabled.
I would definitely say the 1.50 PS4 patch brings the game up to 8X, personally.

If anyone wants to grab the same scene, start a new game and complete the initial tutorial section and as soon as you are let outside, turn left and take a screenshot, then we can match directly with the above image.
Click to expand...

So not even 16xAF on PS4 ? Jesus.
 
RVinP said:
Anistropic Filtering at 8x should be sufficient for PS4, until the resolution for future games are rendered at more than 1920x1080 resolution on screen.
Click to expand...

I was under the impression that PS4 cannot play 4K games and that being the case then what would be the point in higher than 1080p? There are no TV screens to accommodate a 1440p output, for instance...
 
Futaba said:
All done on PC ver 1.50, forced in nvidia control panel.

Exact same area/time of day/location/progression, at 1080p with AA disabled.
I would definitely say the 1.50 PS4 patch brings the game up to 8X, personally.

If anyone wants to grab the same scene, start a new game and complete the initial tutorial section and as soon as you are let outside, turn left and take a screenshot, then we can match directly with the above image.
Click to expand...
Are we sure it's been bumped to 8X though.
Gaf's resident PC/AF expert has lol'd at the notion it's 8X. Can't really argue against this.
 
Kezen said:
So not even 16xAF on PS4 ? Jesus.
Click to expand...

....

It had NONE. Went from NONE to x8. Good enough.

There is difference between low AF and no AF at all that makes the game look like vomit.

DmC is unacceptable (worse than last gen) so hopefully they will also patch it.
 
mintylurb said:
Are we sure it's been bumped to 8X though.
Gaf's resident PC/AF expert has lol'd at the notion it's 8X. Can't really argue against this.
Click to expand...

You can because it is wrong, different resolution and Angle (The Dying Light shot is lower for 1).

I would be amazed if this is not 8x AF and would be a good base for all games with 4x being a minimum.
 
Kezen said:
So not even 16xAF on PS4 ? Jesus.
Click to expand...

Your acting surprised. We went from none to 8x, that's enough. Consoles in general suffer from weaker forms of AF in comparison to PC, even when the consoles are equal to each other. Its obviously not free
 
It is strange that it keeps happening in games though, there must be a reason other than the dev's being lazy?

How different is the actual code between the X1 & PS4 in writing the game code, could it be a issue there?
 
mintylurb said:
Are we sure it's been bumped to 8X though.
Gaf's resident PC/AF expert has lol'd at the notion it's 8X. Can't really argue against this.
Click to expand...

Not that I want to start a war or anything.
But comparing AF on completely different textures, at different angles, isn't a very reliable way of figuring out the correct AF level.
Adding differences in hardware increases the range of results too, Radeon cards can produce different results at the same AF settings as Nvidia cards, for example.

As for the AF issue with DMC, i'm on board the gnmx doesn't supply 4x/8x/16x AF by default ship already, waiting to set sail.
 
geordiemp said:
Wow, its an unknown (to me anyway) polish contractor that did DMC port ? No wonder its not exactly good port...
Click to expand...

QLOC is well known for making great ports.

If a late PC port is announced, people already hope it's either QLOC or Nixxes, those guys know their stuff. I'd give them the benefit of the doubt and just politely ask the reason DmC lacks AF instead of spamming them demanding changes.
 
HAL-x9000 said:
PC master race have spoken! We are unworthy subservient PS4 players and we should not be happy about 8x AF!
Click to expand...

I agree.

If you enjoy PC more play your games there....let us enjoy PS4/X1. 8X AF is fine by me.
We started the discussion with lack of AF on PS4, now we have it, but it isnt high enough. You cant please all of GAF.
 
Kezen said:
So not even 16xAF on PS4 ? Jesus.
Click to expand...
It may be 16xAF we don't have concrete proof yet, just that it looks like 8x on some of the screens posted. 16xAF is not a toll order for PS4 though, TLOU-R and Re-R2 both have 16xAF, TLOU is technically way over DMC.
 
thelastword said:
It may be 16xAF we don't have concrete proof yet, just that it looks like 8x on some of the screens posted. 16xAF is not a toll order for PS4 though, TLOU-R and Re-R2 both have 16xAF, TLOU is technically way over DMC.
Click to expand...

And most importantly how more expensive can x16 be compared to x8 ? It just boggles my mind that regular (understand 16xAF) is not standard on consoles.
 
Cyborg said:
I agree.

If you enjoy PC more play your games there....let us enjoy PS4/X1. 8X AF is fine by me.
We started the discussion with lack of AF on PS4, now we have it, but it isnt high enough. You cant please all of GAF.
Click to expand...

8x is definitely high enough to me.

4x is not that great, but it's a huge upgrade from no AF. Hopefully it's a simple fix and the other devs patch their games as well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

We need true hardcore games
2
64
674
OuterLimits replied
The industry needs to catch up - we need a sidegrade generation.
5
145
Walter Matthau replied
Super Fire Pro Wrestling Special translated; Suda51's first game...is dark AF
2
702
PrefectAboro replied
We need a GTA4 Remaster
2
67
3K
hououinkyouma00 replied
  • Poll
Do you still need better graphics than we have now?
2
96
2K
Grildon Tundy replied
Top Bottom