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[Based Calla]

I've never played a Metroid game so I'm obviously not as attached as most of you, but this actually looks entertaining. I understand that Other M was not what people wanted and it's been a long time, but the core game looks fun.

This feels like a DMC: Devil May Cry issue where it has the name, but not what people expected. Unlike DMC, this is a spinoff though, so I don't see what the real issue is. If this game was called "Shoot Guys" this wouldn't even be a discussion and most people would probably see it as neat or okay, but because the word Metroid is in the title, there's a standard that has to exist, but again, it's a spinoff, so it doesn't have to be serious and if you don't like it, don't buy it. You won't be missing much.

Also, I just heard about the change campaign to cancel this game. Anyone who actually signs that thing is pathetic. You would rather have nothing over something you don't have to play? You'd rather people have their hard work thrown away because it's not what you expected? Have we not learned from Wind Waker? Sometimes a theme change can be good.

In conclude, buy it or don't buy. Don't cancel it because you don't like it because there are people like me who would love to play this.

 

[zennyzz]

Just because his other games are successful it doesn't mean he has what it takes to make a successful Metroid. Creator of a genre, yet Other M didn't follow that train of thought.

And what proof is there that he can't make another successful 2d metroid? Case Other M sure wasn't one.

Like I said, there's a huger gap between super metroid and zero mission, than zero mission and whatever theoretical 2d metroid is in development and you can sequence break the fuck out of zero mission more than any other metroid that's not Super Metroid.

Why should I randomly assume he can't do the same, in a time period that's not yet met the distance between those two?

 

[RagnarokX]

Why are people saying Sakamoto is involved? Tanabe says that Sakamoto makes the 2D games and that Tanabe isn't involved with those, nothing about Sakamoto being involved. Even if he was, he was involved with the Prime games, too. Those are separate from his narrative and Sakamoto knows that... he helped create it.

 

[diaspora]

And what proof is there that he can't make another successful 2d metroid? Case Other M sure wasn't one.

Like I said, there's a huger gap between super metroid and zero mission, and you can sequence break the fuck out of zero mission more than any other metroid that's not Super Metroid.

Why should I randomly assume he can't do the same, in a time period that's not yet met the distance between those two?

His last game was shit? That's proof.

 

[zennyzz]

His last game was shit? That's proof.

Of nothing relating to a game of a different genre.

Unless you think Prime and Super Metroid are the same kind of game.

 

[Gartooth]

God damn, this game announcement is basically deja vu for me from Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts & Bolts. At least that game turned out great in the end (and looked graphically incredible) despite it not being anything fans wanted. I'm finding it hard to see anything redeeming in this game's first footage even under the lens that it is a "not-Metroid" game.

Is this a budget release? No single player campaign or Samus is pretty odd as well. I don't really mind the cartoony aesthetic since I loved the concept art Next Level Games had for Metroid, but this looks like garbage running on 3DS.

 

[diaspora]

Of nothing relating to a game of a different genre.

Unless you think Prime and Super Metroid are the same kind of game.

Super and Prime were good games, Other M, Sakamoto's most recent effort was shit. "b-b-but he created the story", yeah and he fucked it up too. He's the last person that should be anywhere near this series. He's Nintendo's George Lucas.

 

[danwu]

Come on, the movement, weapons, strafing and lock-on system from Prime are all there. It's very clearly inspired by Metroid.

yep ! I think people will get a much better idea when they play it for themselves how much it feels like playing Metroid prime all over again.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

His last game was shit? That's proof.

Metroid 3, Metroid Fusion, Metroid: Zero Mission were developed in-house at Nintendo by Team Sakamoto.

Metroid: Other M was developed externally at Team Ninja with Sakamoto riding the train and two additional Metroid staffers from Nintendo communicating by email.

Meanwhile, back in-house from the Metroid staff, Rhythm Heaven and Tomodachi Life were released.

Then, back at Team Ninja, Ninja Gaiden 3 was released.

There is a huge disparity between the development process there. More evidence towards the weak link is a bit obvious despite Sakamoto's mistakes.

 

[zennyzz]

Super and Prime were good games, Other M, Sakamoto's most recent effort was shit.

Being purposefully obtuse doesn't let you work around my point.

 

[diaspora]

Metroid 3, Metroid Fusion, Metroid: Zero Mission were developed in-house at Nintendo by Team Sakamoto.

Metroid: Other M was developed externally at Team Ninja with Sakamoto riding the train and two additional Metroid staffers from Nintendo communicating by email.

Meanwhile, back in-house from the Metroid staff, Rhythm Heaven and Tomodachi Life were released.

Then, back at Team Ninja, Ninja Gaiden 3 was released.

There is a huge disparity between the development process there. More evidence towards the weak link is a bit obvious despite Sakamoto's mistakes.

So, what you're saying is that we don't need Sakamoto at all, and that if nothing else, he's the weak link? We need the rest of his team.

Being purposefully obtuse doesn't let you work around my point.

You don't have a point.

 

[Neiteio]

OK, Federation Force looks legit. I've done a complete 180* on this game, for the better.

I imagine you guys are already discussing this, but if you haven't seen it, be sure to check out the most fun Treehouse Live session ever. I had a huge smile on my face watching this. Both missions they show look great.

First, the general atmosphere and attention to detail is more on point than I had thought from the short trailer in the Digital Event. Love the haunting music in the lobby, the loadout options (healing beams, slow-down beams), the look of the environments and the enemies (the ice beasts, pirates with the sabers, etc). Love the billowing smoke effect from comrades in critical condition, and the jet-thrusters on the extended jump.

Character movement looks like it has a good feel to it, with the quick sidestep dodge, the subtle gyro tweaking reminiscent of Splatoon, etc. The charge shot (and gunplay in general) looks satisfying — very fast and punchy with the trailing effects.

Some surprisingly intense moments, where everyone is down and the sole survivor is trying to fend off pirates while reviving teammates and stopping the missile inbound on the target you're trying to protect. Or luring the beast into the cage and then slipping out of the cage so your teammates can close it.

Really intrigued by this. I want to play it. If it was that fun watching it, I'm confident it'll be fun to play. This is Next Level Games, right? It'll probably be one of the best-looking games on the system by the time it comes out. I'm already warming up to the style, which is more "bulky armor" than straight-up "chibi."

Also, Blast Ball is part of this, right? I saw videos of that and it looks like a lot of fun, as well. Really warming up to this game.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

So, what you're saying is that we don't need Sakamoto at all, and that if nothing else, he's the weak link? We need the rest of his team.

It's a package though, maybe they all balance each other.

 

[danwu]

Super and Prime were good games, Other M, Sakamoto's most recent effort was shit.

Other M is a good game, it was made with the help of Tecmo, Ninja Gaiden developers.

 

[zennyzz]

So, what you're saying is that we don't need Sakamoto at all, and that if nothing else, he's the weak link? We need the rest of his team.

Sakamoto headed rhythm heaven so...

You don't have a point.

Swing and a miss.

 

[diaspora]

It's a package though, maybe they all balance each other.

What Sakamoto brought to the table on his own was arse. Further involvement by him is absolutely not necessary.

Swing and a miss.

You understand Metroid as little as he does eh? The genre had nothing to do with why the game failed.

 

[Jezan]

And what proof is there that he can't make another successful 2d metroid? Case Other M sure wasn't one.

Like I said, there's a huger gap between super metroid and zero mission, than zero mission and whatever theoretical 2d metroid is in development and you can sequence break the fuck out of zero mission more than any other metroid that's not Super Metroid.

Why should I randomly assume he can't do the same, in a time period that's not yet met the distance between those two?

Why do we have to assume that he can create something good? The decisions he took for Other M were what dragged the game down.

In the end it's not us who decide who will direct the next game, so we will see sooner or later (probably later) how another Metroid directed by Sakamoto turns out.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

What Sakamoto brought to the table on his own was arse. Further involvement by him is absolutely not necessary.

Even if he is incompetent, he is the boss of a talented team.

 

[blitzwolf215]

OK, Federation Force looks legit. I've done a complete 180* on this game, for the better.

I imagine you guys are already discussing this, but if you haven't seen it, be sure to check out the most fun Treehouse Live session ever. I had a huge smile on my face watching this. Both missions they show look great.
.

I shall check it out now.

 

[diaspora]

Even if he is incompetent, he is the boss of a talented team.

So we don't really need him at all =\

He's the "ideas" guy where his ideas stank?

 

[zennyzz]

Why do we have to assume that he can create something good? The decisions he took for Other M were what dragged the game down.

In the end it's not us who decide who will direct the next game, so we will see sooner or later (probably later) how another Metroid directed by Sakamoto turns out.

Because that's what a list of accomplishments is for?

If we judged everybody by solely the last thing they ever did, a fuck lot of devs who make good things'd be out on their ass.

 

[Regiruler]

Does this game have voice chat? This seems impossible to enjoy online without voice chat support.

Everyone has been too angry to bother asking, or something.

That sylux interview was the first actual information the press has bothered to dig into this game.

From a clip of blast ball I saw a tab you could press, and when you press it about 9 or so different buttons show up to give different signals. I don't know if this is the same in federation force, and I don't know if this is simply a supplement for it for use with randoms (with full VC with friends), a supplement so you don't have to talk, or a complete replacement. The metroid IP is geared towards an older audience, so hopefully their less apprehensive about voice chat considering Hunters had it (allegedly, anyway; I didn't play it).
It's far, far better than splatoon at least, which only has two signals, and one is practically useless.

 

[Jezan]

I've never played a Metroid game so I'm obviously not as attached as most of you, but this actually looks entertaining. I understand that Other M was not what people wanted and it's been a long time, but the core game looks fun.

The core game is not Metroid, it's an spin-off, good, but then I don't think you will understand why people do not like this spin-off if you haven't played any Metroid game yet, not even the art style is Metroid.

Edit: BTW the problem is not that this is an spin-off, but actually all the context on how this was announced.

 

[Mama Robotnik]

Other M is a good game, it was made with the help of Tecmo, Ninja Gaiden developers.

Massively massively disagree. Its a clumsy mess of a game, a discredit to Samus Aran and a taint on the franchise. Its boring, ugly, controls badly, overly-linear, terribly paced and unimaginative. It's such a fall from grace compared to Metroid Prime.

 

[Schnozberry]

I understand the heartbreak about Metroid not seeing a full fledged iteration, but this game actually looks like fun based on the Treehouse demo. I think the hate is misdirected.

 

[sfried]

Another Other M would have been much better than this. Yeah, I enjoyed Other M to some extent.

Oh no you didn't...
Be careful what you wish for!

 

[Toxi]

The main issue I see with Federation Force is... It really doesn't feel like it offers anything interesting as a FPS. I don't feel any real joy from the gameplay. I've seen everything in it in every other squad-based game for the last decade. It's like Nintendo's just discovering these gameplay mechanics everyone and their mother already used.

Contrast to, say, Shadow Warrior 2, where I was grinning from ear to ear because of how damn fun everything looked to do. Plus, it's on PC so it will actually have a good control scheme.

 

[danwu]

OK, Federation Force looks legit. I've done a complete 180* on this game, for the better.

I imagine you guys are already discussing this, but if you haven't seen it, be sure to check out the most fun Treehouse Live session ever. I had a huge smile on my face watching this. Both missions they show look great.

First, the general atmosphere and attention to detail is more on point than I had thought from the short trailer in the Digital Event. Love the haunting music in the lobby, the loadout options (healing beams, slow-down beams), the look of the environments and the enemies (the ice beasts, pirates with the sabers, etc). Love the billowing smoke effect from comrades in critical condition, and the jet-thrusters on the extended jump.

Character movement looks like it has a good feel to it, with the quick sidestep dodge, the subtle gyro tweaking reminiscent of Splatoon, etc. The charge shot (and gunplay in general) looks satisfying — very fast and punchy with the trailing effects.

Some surprisingly intense moments, where everyone is down and the sole survivor is trying to fend off pirates while reviving teammates and stopping the missile inbound on the target you're trying to protect. Or luring the beast into the cage and then slipping out of the cage so your teammates can close it.

Really intrigued by this. I want to play it. If it was that fun watching it, I'm confident it'll be fun to play. This is Next Level Games, right? It'll probably be one of the best-looking games on the system by the time it comes out. I'm already warming up to the style, which is more "bulky armor" than straight-up "chibi."

Also, Blast Ball is part of this, right? I saw videos of that and it looks like a lot of fun, as well. Really warming up to this game.

Well said and very in depth !!!

 

[zennyzz]

You understand Metroid as little as he does eh? The genre had nothing to do with why the game failed.

The genre most definitely had a part in why the game fail. Because it's not just the story that caused Other M to fail, but also the mechanics, which is inherent to problems from an attempt at a genre that Sakamoto never tried before.

 

[Griss]

Can't think of anything I'd like less in a new Prime game than for it to be based around Sylux. Also Sakamoto still working on Metroid? And all of these people somehow believed that it was a good idea to tie their prized IP to this 3DS game?

This franchise is a lost cause right now, no reason to believe otherwise.

 

[Metroidvania]

Personally, I still don't think the treehouse looks that great in motion (though it does look better than the trailer makes it seem), but that could go back to some Metroid traditional single player roots, and the bad associations by giving it the Metroid Prime name, specifically.

That, and things still look pretty bland, and I'm not looking for portables to get my FPS team-based shooter needs, but that's just me.

The surrounding 'spin-off' for a portable system during a timeframe where we haven't even seen a core game in years still feels weird and skeevy.

Best of luck to Next Level, though. Luigi's Mansion 2 was pretty good.

 

[Boney]

Why are people saying Sakamoto is involved? Tanabe says that Sakamoto makes the 2D games and that Tanabe isn't involved with those, nothing about Sakamoto being involved. Even if he was, he was involved with the Prime games, too. Those are separate from his narrative and Sakamoto knows that... he helped create it.

I believe he was a consultant about Samus' character in general during the (pre) production of Prime 1.

Found this snooping around before (2010 interview) www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/132721/the_elegance_of_metroid_yoshio_.php?page=3

well, it's a little hard to say exactly how the collaboration on Prime might have resulted in the areas where you really felt Retro shined through there because I wasn't actually very closely involved with that project, but you can certainly say that there are a lot of common Metroid elements; those are always the foundation for any of these projects, even if you have a lot of other elements arranged in a slightly different way.

 

[diaspora]

The genre most definitely had a part in why the game fail. Because it's not just the story that caused Other M to fail, but also the mechanics, which is inherent to problems from an attempt at a genre that Sakamoto never tried before.

If it was 2D it still would have been a ridiculous failure.

 

[zennyzz]

If it was 2D it still would have been a ridiculous failure.

For a story mayhaps. And I've no doubt of that. Gameplay is impossible to tell.

 

[diaspora]

For a story mayhaps. And I've no doubt of that. Gameplay wise is impossible to tell.

So, it still would have sucked. Great.

 

[zennyzz]

So, it still would have sucked. Great.

Yes, because we know if Sakamoto, a guy known for a bunch of series with minimal story has clearly been bitten by the cinematic bug, despite continuing to make minimal story games after the one story focused one.

 

[Toxi]

It's kinda hilarious how the first enemies seen in the Treehouse demo are Ice Shriekbats, aka one of the most infamously elusive scan entries in the original Metroid Prime.

 

[danwu]

The main issue I see with Federation Force is... It really doesn't feel like it offers anything interesting as a FPS. I don't feel any real joy from the gameplay. I've seen everything in it in every other squad-based game for the last decade. It's like Nintendo's just discovering these gameplay mechanics everyone and their mother already used.

Contrast to, say, Shadow Warrior 2, where I was grinning from ear to ear because of how damn fun everything looked to do. Plus, it's on PC so it will actually have a good control scheme.

Nah, Shadow Warrior isn't even close to what Federation Force is all about, sorry.

 

[diaspora]

Yes, because we know if Sakamoto, a guy known for a bunch of series with minimal story has clearly been bitten by the cinematic bug, despite continuing to make minimal story games after the one story focused one.

Yeah, the guy who told a shit story would make a 2D game with another shit story.

Nah, Shadow Warrior isn't even close to what Federation Force is all about, sorry.

Well, yeah, Shadow Warrior looks good.

 

[zennyzz]

Nah, Shadow Warrior isn't even close to what Federation Force is all about, sorry.

That's not what Toxi was saying?

 

[Ocaso]

So, we're all angry over a spinoff game because...? Really, it doesn't look nearly as bad as people are making it out to be.

Seriously, would you guys rather have another Other M?

You mean a full single player adventure with great implementation of Metroid's power ups, sharp visuals, and awesome bosses that was hampered by its story and excessive linearity but was still a decent game by any other measure? Yes, absolutely.

 

[RagnarokX]

I believe he was a consultant about Samus' character in general during the (pre) production of Prime 1.

Found this snooping around before (2010 interview) www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/132721/the_elegance_of_metroid_yoshio_.php?page=3

Yeah, I know he wasn't very involved with Prime. I just meant that he was involved to some degree as a consultant so he's aware that it deviated pretty far from where he was going with Zero Mission and Fusion (and honestly from Super). That's why Metroid is essentially split into 2 alternate universes. The way Sakamoto and Tanabe probably see it is that Tanabe can continue Prime's story and Sakamoto will continue his story and the two don't really have to worry about what the other does. I'm happy, and I think most people should be happy, that this is a sign that Nintendo is willing to continue Prime's narrative since I think people took the "Prime's not canon" thing to mean that they'd never continue with Prime.

 

[zennyzz]

Yeah, the guy who told a shit story would make a 2D game with another shit story.

Or, he'd opt out of doing a story and do what he always did before.

See it goes both ways. Precedence is a very important thing.

 

[zennyzz]

Yeah, I know he wasn't very involved with Prime. I just meant that he was involved to some degree as a consultant so he's aware that it deviated pretty far from where he was going with Zero Mission and Fusion (and honestly from Super). That's why Metroid is essentially split into 2 alternate universes. The way Sakamoto and Tanabe probably see it is that Tanabe can continue Prime's story and Sakamoto will continue his story and the two don't really have to worry about what the other does. I'm happy, and I think most people should be happy, that this is a sign that Nintendo is willing to continue Prime's narrative since I think people took the "Prime's not canon" thing to mean that they'd never continue with Prime.

Sakamoto never said this.

There's no interview from him where this statement or a comparable statement was made.

Hell he's said the exact opposite.

 

[Toxi]

Nah, Shadow Warrior isn't even close to what Federation Force is all about, sorry.

Uh, that's not what I'm saying. I'm just bringing up Shadow Warrior 2 as an example of a first-person shooter that kept making me think "God, that thing looks fun. I want to try that." Nothing in the Federation Force Treehouse footage struck me the same way. You shoot stuff with just one weapon (Not including power-ups like missiles), you revive team members, you do horde mode missions, you have the basic support abilities seen in every other team FPS for years.

 

[BIONIC-ARRRMMM!!]

You mean a full single player adventure with great implementation of Metroid's power ups, sharp visuals, and awesome bosses that was hampered by its story and excessive linearity but was still a decent game by any other measure? Yes, absolutely.

Game was totes sexist, and character assassinated a character that never had an actual personality before.

 

[diaspora]

Or, he'd opt out of doing a story and do what he always did before.

See it goes both ways. Precedence is a very important thing.

When he tries to do something he fails, when his team actually does something they succeed. Not having Sakamoto around for Metroid is the best thing the series could possibly have.

 

[Ocaso]

Game was totes sexist, and character assassinated a character that never had an actual personality before.

Yes, it had a shit story. It still played pretty damn well and was a better game than the GAF narrative makes it out to be.

 

[danwu]

Massively massively disagree. Its a clumsy mess of a game, a discredit to Samus Aran and a taint on the franchise. Its boring, ugly, controls badly, overly-linear, terribly paced and unimaginative. It's such a fall from grace compared to Metroid Prime.

I guess I just adapted better !
Whenever I pick up and play the game, it feels like a totally fresh new Metroid experience with a very compelling story. The controls are easy to learn, d-pad for senses, hold b for missiles. To me, it's also the visually coolest looking Metroid game ever with brilliant art design, a very slick looking Samus.

 

[Malus]

If this game was called "Shoot Guys" this wouldn't even be a discussion and most people would probably see it as neat or okay.

I think people would be pretty disappointed if Next Level's new game was an okay game called "Shoot Guys" lol.