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[KingK]

There seems to be a lot of people disliking Hillary for what they imagine her platform is, rather than what it actually is.

This is a very serious PR issue. Hopefully everything will become more clear as the campaigns start kicking into high gear.

Well that's because she doesn't even have a damn platform. She hasn't laid out any specific proposals, afaik, and pretty much every speech she's given so far has been empty rhetoric which is in direct opposition to actual policies she and her husband have supported in the past. She's been in politics literally my whole life and the only thing that i know that she consistently "stands for" in her platform is women's rights.

She's been a center-right politician her whole career, and now in the last few months has given a series of speeches vaguely flip flopping into a liberal progressive without offering anything specific or concrete. And her supporters are somehow shocked that people are skeptical of her multiple changes of heart and "don't know what her actual platform is."

I'm not voting for her in the primary, but like 95+% of Bernie supporters I'll vote for whoever the democratic nominee is, which will most likely be her. Her supporters have been getting pretty damn annoying though with all the condescending bullshit thrown at anybody who dares show skepticism or a lack of enthusiasm about her. We fucking get it. I can read a goddamn poll and i know that in all likelihood Hilary will be the nominee and I'll vote for her/against republicans in the general. It'd be nice if in the primary though, I could just support and vote for the guy who has identical political views as me without being called a stupid, naive, midterm abstaining, Ron Paul supporting, childish conspiracy theorist. And if Hillary's nomination is so inevitable, why the need to constantly shit talk Sanders and his supporters and try to stop people from voting for him?

I think in all likelihood she'll be an ok president. I expect republicans to control congress for the foreseeable future so I'm not optimistic of anything big getting done domestically anyway. My biggest fear is that Hilary is way, way too hawkish for me, but she might as well be Ghandi compared to the republican field sans Paul.

 

[NeoXChaos]

Well that's because she doesn't even have a damn platform. She hasn't laid out any specific proposals, afaik, and pretty much every speech she's given so far has been empty rhetoric which is in direct opposition to actual policies she and her husband have supported in the past. She's been in politics literally my whole life and the only thing that i know that she consistently "stands for" in her platform is women's rights.

She's been a center-right politician her whole career, and now in the last few months has given a series of speeches vaguely flip flopping into a liberal progressive without offering anything specific or concrete. And her supporters are somehow shocked that people are skeptical of her multiple changes of heart and "don't know what her actual platform is."

I'm not voting for her in the primary, but like 95+% of Bernie supporters I'll vote for whoever the democratic nominee is, which will most likely be her. Her supporters have been getting pretty damn annoying though with all the condescending bullshit thrown at anybody who dares show skepticism or a lack of enthusiasm about her. We fucking get it. I can read a goddamn poll and i know that in all likelihood Hilary will be the nominee and I'll vote for her/against republicans in the general. It'd be nice if in the primary though, I could just support and vote for the guy who has identical political views as me without being called a stupid, naive, midterm abstaining, Ron Paul supporting, childish conspiracy theorist. And if Hillary's nomination is so inevitable, why the need to constantly shit talk Sanders and his supporters and try to stop people from voting for him?

I think in all likelihood she'll be an ok president. I expect republicans to control congress for the foreseeable future so I'm not optimistic of anything big getting done domestically anyway. My biggest fear is that Hilary is way, way too hawkish for me, but she might as well be Ghandi compared to the republican field sans Paul.

point taken.

 

[Ecotic]

I supported Hillary in 2008 and I'll vote for her again in 2016 but not because of the Supreme Court argument. Doesn't the political system ensure that the replacement would be an accomplished academic who is a match for the ideology of the predecessor? I don't anticipate a drastic change in court composition until there are lasting supermajorities in Congress.

When there's a vacancy the President nominates whoever he or she wants. As long as the nominee is qualified, has no skeletons, and keeps quiet during the confirmation hearings he or she gets through. I don't really understand your last point about Congress and the courts, but that's not how it works.

 

[exmachina64]

I supported Hillary in 2008 and I'll vote for her again in 2016 but not because of the Supreme Court argument. Doesn't the political system ensure that the replacement would be an accomplished academic who is a match for the ideology of the predecessor? I don't anticipate a drastic change in court composition until there are lasting supermajorities in Congress.

No, there's no constitutional, legal or customary stipulation of an ideological balance of the court.

Only recently has Congress taken an interest in stymying SC nominees for political reasons. If you're not familar, I'd suggest you read http://www.scotusblog.com/ and this summary of the theories of U.S. constitutional interpretation to see where you stand on these arguments.

 

[-MB-]

This is gonna be so much like 2000 it isn't funny anymore. After 8 years of a democratic president, the democratic base will be apathetic and not come out to vote in the GE, leading to a horrible republican 8 year presidency.

 

[HalfBakedProphet]

Well that's because she doesn't even have a damn platform. She hasn't laid out any specific proposals, afaik, and pretty much every speech she's given so far has been empty rhetoric which is in direct opposition to actual policies she and her husband have supported in the past. She's been in politics literally my whole life and the only thing that i know that she consistently "stands for" in her platform is women's rights.

She's been a center-right politician her whole career, and now in the last few months has given a series of speeches vaguely flip flopping into a liberal progressive without offering anything specific or concrete. And her supporters are somehow shocked that people are skeptical of her multiple changes of heart and "don't know what her actual platform is."

I'm not voting for her in the primary, but like 95+% of Bernie supporters I'll vote for whoever the democratic nominee is, which will most likely be her. Her supporters have been getting pretty damn annoying though with all the condescending bullshit thrown at anybody who dares show skepticism or a lack of enthusiasm about her. We fucking get it. I can read a goddamn poll and i know that in all likelihood Hilary will be the nominee and I'll vote for her/against republicans in the general. It'd be nice if in the primary though, I could just support and vote for the guy who has identical political views as me without being called a stupid, naive, midterm abstaining, Ron Paul supporting, childish conspiracy theorist. And if Hillary's nomination is so inevitable, why the need to constantly shit talk Sanders and his supporters and try to stop people from voting for him?

I think in all likelihood she'll be an ok president. I expect republicans to control congress for the foreseeable future so I'm not optimistic of anything big getting done domestically anyway. My biggest fear is that Hilary is way, way too hawkish for me, but she might as well be Ghandi compared to the republican field sans Paul.

well said, nice post. The browbeating the last few months has been exhausting

 

[ErasureAcer]

Nobody had Clinton up 22 in Iowa at any point in the lead-up to those caucuses, and certainly no one had her anywhere near 51%.

Sorry for my mistake. It appears you are right.

Read this link and didn't bother to read that person's link which one would think actually backs up his/her proclamation in the post...but does not.

Bernie is making huge strides and Clinton isn't making any at all...in fact she's going backwards in the latest Iowa poll. I still fully expect Bernie to win Iowa and New Hampshire.

 

[disastermouse]

As much as I don't want to vote for Hillary, I suspect I'll have a crisis of conscience at the last moment.

I also realize that because I live in Madison, my refusal to vote for her won't make any difference. Whomever the democrat in the general ends up being will win here.

I only recently moved (back) to Wisconsin and the last time I lived here was 1998. Is WI winner take all?

 

[eBay Huckster]

As much as I don't want to vote for Hillary, I suspect I'll have a crisis of conscience at the last moment.

I also realize that because I live in Madison, my refusal to vote for her won't make any difference. Whomever the democrat in the general ends up being will win here.

I only recently moved (back) to Wisconsin and the last time I lived here was 1998. Is WI winner take all?

from what I can remember from meticulously paying attention to the 2008 election, none of the Democratic primaries are WTA

 

[Cheebo]

As much as I don't want to vote for Hillary, I suspect I'll have a crisis of conscience at the last moment.

I also realize that because I live in Madison, my refusal to vote for her won't make any difference. Whomever the democrat in the general ends up being will win here.

I only recently moved (back) to Wisconsin and the last time I lived here was 1998. Is WI winner take all?

You do realize the election in WI was fairly close in the end between Romney and Obama right? 53 to 46. It was considered a swing state. Republicans have increasingly been improving their margins and control of state government there over the past decade.
WI is 100% not a lock for Hillary. Especially if the GOP nominates Scott Walker (who is leading in Iowa caucus polling currently).

Your state has elected Scott Walker. Multiple times. And kicked Russ Feingold out of the senate. Your state is not some kind of locked non-swing state. It's consistently considered a swing state.

Bernie is doing better than Obama in Iowa at this time.

July 2007
Clinton 51 percent
Obama 29

July 2015
Clinton 52
Bernie 33

Lmao at people thinking Clinton will fight Citizens United if she is President.

100% complete made up bullshit right here.

 

[NeoXChaos]

You do realize the election in WI was fairly close in the end between Romney and Obama right? 53 to 46. It was considered a swing state. Republicans have increasingly been improving their margins and control of state government there over the past decade.
WI is 100% not a lock for Hillary. Especially if the GOP nominates Scott Walker (who is leading in Iowa caucus polling currently).

Your state has elected Scott Walker. Multiple times. And kicked Russ Feingold out of the senate. Your state is not some kind of locked non-swing state. It's consistently considered a swing state.


100% complete made up bullshit right here.

We know and he recanted it. Still lol though.

 

[menacin]

we all need to make bernie sanders president. its simple

 

[Wall]

I'll vote for Hillary in the general if she is the nominee, but until then.............. I'm battling for Bernie!

If you support Sanders, you really should vote for Hillary if she is the nominee but also direct your energy towards supporting progressive candidates in down-ticket races. People don't pay enough attention to elections that are not at the Presidential level.

 

[ivysaur12]

You do realize the election in WI was fairly close in the end between Romney and Obama right? 53 to 46. It was considered a swing state. Republicans have increasingly been improving their margins and control of state government there over the past decade.
WI is 100% not a lock for Hillary. Especially if the GOP nominates Scott Walker (who is leading in Iowa caucus polling currently).

Your state has elected Scott Walker. Multiple times. And kicked Russ Feingold out of the senate. Your state is not some kind of locked non-swing state. It's consistently considered a swing state.


100% complete made up bullshit right here.

I would say that 7 points is not *that* close, and having Paul Ryan (and potentially Scott Walker) on the ticket could inflate the Republican ticket versus Generic Republican in Wisconsin.

But yeah, I sort of expect to see the Democratic Party lean in Michigan, Wisconsin, and Iowa wane in the years to come as Democrats do better in Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, and Arizona.

 

[titiklabingapat]

I love Bernie and his platform and all, but LOL at all the Obama revisionist history. Obama was nowhere near a sure bet back in 2007-2008. It was a close race until almost the end of the primary. I remember logging in every day to see how the super delegates voted. That was how Obama won because him and Hillary were pretty close in the normal delegate race.

Spoiler

I was very glad Obama won and I am glad now that Hillary 2016 has latched on to Obama and his team.

 

[Maengun1]

I would love for Bernie Sanders to be President. It's not going to happen though. I'm happy he's running, I'm happy he's getting his message out, I'm glad people like his message (they should).....but he's not going to win. It's not fair, but he's just not.

The growing "screw Clinton, I'm only voting for Bernie" stuff is starting to really scare me. The "Clinton/Obama are the same as Republicans" stuff is starting to really piss me off. Have people forgotten how bad Bush was already? Obama is faaaar from perfect. Hillary is faaar from perfect. Bernie is pretty darn close to perfect....he also will not win.

I'm starting to freak out over a repeat of 2000. Bush wins, every elderly conservative Supreme Court justice immediately retires, and all the progress of the last 8 years (and there has been quite a lot!) starts getting rolled back. Bring on the new era of garbage.

 

[CornBurrito]

Huh your experience sounds a lot better than mine.

I saw Bernie Sanders at a grocery store in San Francisco about three months ago. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him or ask for an autograph or anything like that.

He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”

I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.

The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.

When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.

 

[titiklabingapat]

The growing "screw Clinton, I'm only voting for Bernie" stuff is starting to really scare me. The "Clinton/Obama are the same as Republicans" stuff is starting to really piss me off. Have people forgotten how bad Bush was already? Obama is faaaar from perfect. Hillary is faaar from perfect. Bernie is pretty darn close to perfect....he also will not win.

Many of them, I suspect is just some GOP shit stirrer. It's good to keep a close eye on them though but I wouldn't worry too much about it. Hillary is far and away a clearer front runner compared to 2008.

 

[Bornstellar]

Huh your experience sounds a lot better than mine.

I saw Bernie Sanders at a grocery store in San Francisco about three months ago. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him or ask for an autograph or anything like that.

He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”

I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.

The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.

When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.

Is this real life?

 

[Wall]

Huh your experience sounds a lot better than mine.

I saw Bernie Sanders at a grocery store in San Francisco about three months ago. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him or ask for an autograph or anything like that.

He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”

I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.

The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.

When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.

That's funny, I had the exact same experience with Jesus Christ at a Whole Foods in Brooklyn (he's back btw - the end times are upon us!).

Seriously though, at this point the militant Clinton supporters aren't doing her any favors. If the best arguments Clinton supporters can make are that she isn't going to usher in 1,000 years of darkness and to insult the supporters of her opponent, it is probably just best to remain silent. She is the by far the front-runner at the moment, and if she loses to a balding old socialist in the primary, she probably wouldn't make a good candidate in the general election anyway; she wouldn't be nearly the shoe-in that her supporters portray her to be at the moment.

Hillary supporters to need to acknowledge that there are entirely legitimate reasons for people to have reservations about her candidacy, her Iraq war vote being just one example. It would be far more helpful for Hillary supporters to highlight what they believe are her positive qualities in the primary. Then, in the general, if there are indeed people who would have voted for Sanders but are planning to sit out the election, Hillary supporters should try to convince those people at that time by pointing out the many reasons why the goals motivating a Sanders vote would be better served by voting for Hillary while working in other ways to advance the agenda Sanders represents.

 

[Cheebo]

I would love for Bernie Sanders to be President. It's not going to happen though. I'm happy he's running, I'm happy he's getting his message out, I'm glad people like his message (they should).....but he's not going to win. It's not fair, but he's just not.

The growing "screw Clinton, I'm only voting for Bernie" stuff is starting to really scare me. The "Clinton/Obama are the same as Republicans" stuff is starting to really piss me off. Have people forgotten how bad Bush was already? Obama is faaaar from perfect. Hillary is faaar from perfect. Bernie is pretty darn close to perfect....he also will not win.

I'm starting to freak out over a repeat of 2000. Bush wins, every elderly conservative Supreme Court justice immediately retires, and all the progress of the last 8 years (and there has been quite a lot!) starts getting rolled back. Bring on the new era of garbage.

This feels exactly like 2000 all over again. Liberals grown complacement and used to having a democrat in White House and forgetting just how awful it was when a Republican is president.

This "more of the same" bullshit from hard to please liberals is what got us Bush and the Iraq War.

Those who refuse to vote unless it's a hardcore liberal nominee are just as dangerous to the county as tea partiers.

 

[Archer]

I respect Bernie very much, but I'll vote for Hillary.

Corporatism is not all bad, but the GOP have certainly stained the concept for the past... 15 years? Fifty years?

 

[collige]

Huh your experience sounds a lot better than mine.

I saw Bernie Sanders at a grocery store in San Francisco about three months ago. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him or ask for an autograph or anything like that.

He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”

I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.

The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.

When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.

This will never get old.

 

[CyclopsRock]

I'm genuinely curious as to why people go to these events.

 

[Archer]

I'm genuinely curious as to why people go to these events.

To learn more, to get into the moment, to laugh at the oddballs who are overly into it.

 

[dehydratedbabies]

I'm genuinely curious as to why people go to these events.

For Bernie Sanders supporters at least it's mostly to say to the mass media and the public at large "we out here".

 

[dehydratedbabies]

I would love for Bernie Sanders to be President. It's not going to happen though. I'm happy he's running, I'm happy he's getting his message out, I'm glad people like his message (they should).....but he's not going to win. It's not fair, but he's just not.

How do you know that? With what crystal ball are you viewing the future? And what are you doing to help him?

 

[NeoXChaos]

I would love for Bernie Sanders to be President. It's not going to happen though. I'm happy he's running, I'm happy he's getting his message out, I'm glad people like his message (they should).....but he's not going to win. It's not fair, but he's just not.

The growing "screw Clinton, I'm only voting for Bernie" stuff is starting to really scare me. The "Clinton/Obama are the same as Republicans" stuff is starting to really piss me off. Have people forgotten how bad Bush was already? Obama is faaaar from perfect. Hillary is faaar from perfect. Bernie is pretty darn close to perfect....he also will not win.

I'm starting to freak out over a repeat of 2000. Bush wins, every elderly conservative Supreme Court justice immediately retires, and all the progress of the last 8 years (and there has been quite a lot!) starts getting rolled back. Bring on the new era of garbage.

The problem is simply the "Screw Clinton, I wont vote at all if she is the nominee" folks. There is nothing for us Clinton supporters to be worried as far as the primary is concerned. Bernie Sanders will get votes no doubt and that is perfectly fine. Look at the primary as a Gore Vs Bradley race. Bernie is Bradley and Clinton is Gore. We are running a race not a sprint. The results will speak for themselves in 7-11 months. If by chance he catches fire, he will be buried with negative ads by her SuperPACs. It wont come to that and I would not expect it to.

Food for thought: Between 69'-93', Republican Presidents stacked the Supreme Court. Carter did not get to pick 1 Supreme Court Judge during his term.

 

[cntr]

Is this real life?

it's a meme

 

[dehydratedbabies]

The problem is simply the "Screw Clinton, I wont vote at all if she is the nominee" folks. There is nothing for us Clinton supporters to be worried as far as the primary is concerned. Bernie Sanders will get votes no doubt and that is perfectly fine. Look at the primary as a Gore Vs Bradley race. Bernie is Bradley and Clinton is Gore. We are running a race not a sprint. The results will speak for themselves in 7-11 months. If by chance he catches fire, he will be buried with negative ads by her SuperPACs. It wont come to that and I would not expect it to.

Food for thought: Between 69'-93', Republican Presidents stacked the Supreme Court. Carter did not get to pick 1 Supreme Court Judge during his term.

I think the problem is "Bernie Sanders will never win because not enough people or money support him" folks. If all of them were to actively support Bernie Sanders instead of immediately accepting a potential defeat he'd win.

And stop comparing the 90s/early 2000s to today. Too much has changed for that to be a worthwhile comparison. Embrace the fact that you can't predict the future.

it's a meme

 

[ChaosXVI]

I'm still team Bernie until the nominee is decided, and until then I'm going to flood my facebook feed with pro-Bernie shit, non-stop, everyday, just like all of my extended family do with all of their racist, stupid bullshit.

And if Hillary ends up getting the nomination, I'll vote for her, and I'll be fine with it...but I'd obviously prefer someone more in line with my way of thinking. But a democratic win is far, FAR too important to throw my vote away on someone who isn't the democratic nominee, and I expect everyone else currently supporting Bernie to agree.

 

[NeoXChaos]

I think the problem is "Bernie Sanders will never win because not enough people or money support him" folks. If all of them were to actively support Bernie Sanders instead of immediately accepting a potential defeat he'd win.

And stop comparing the 90s/early 2000s to today. Too much has changed for that to be a worthwhile comparison. Embrace the fact that you can't predict the future.

For once I agree with you. If he has enough money and support behind him, he can pull off an upset. If not, he is doomed.

 

[Damaniel]

I think the problem is "Bernie Sanders will never win because not enough people or money support him" folks. If all of them were to actively support Bernie Sanders instead of immediately accepting a potential defeat he'd win.

And stop comparing the 90s/early 2000s to today. Too much has changed for that to be a worthwhile comparison. Embrace the fact that you can't predict the future.

But I don't want him to win the primary. Not because of his positions (I love his positions and I *really* wish they were mainstream), but because he'd be eviscerated in the general election. Think Mondale levels.

Given the choice between the ideologically perfect candidate who will get creamed, and the 'meh' candidate who can actually win, when there are Supreme Court nominations on the line and Republicans that would block anything resembling a progressive agenda anyway, I'll take 'meh' any day of the week. Of course, if Sanders magically does manage to win the primary, I'll give him my full support, both by voting and donating money, but I'll still be very pessimistic about his chances of actually winning.

 

[dehydratedbabies]

But I don't want him to win the primary. Not because of his positions (I love his positions and I *really* wish they were mainstream), but because he'd be eviscerated in the general election. Think Mondale levels.

Given the choice between the ideologically perfect candidate who will get creamed, and the 'meh' candidate who can actually win, when there are Supreme Court nominations on the line and Republicans that would block anything resembling a progressive agenda anyway, I'll take 'meh' any day of the week. Of course, if Sanders magically does manage to win the primary, I'll give him my full support, both by voting and donating money, but I'll still be very pessimistic about his chances of actually winning.

How do you know that he would be "eviscerated" in the general election?

 

[Wreav]

How do you know that he would be "eviscerated" in the general election?

Because America won't vote for a self described socialist, even if a small and vocal minority on the internet thinks otherwise.

 

[FStubbs]

Honestly, Sanders will do much more good in the Senate just like Elizabeth Warren will. Having a powerful liberal block in Congress will do more good than having a President Sanders with a Tea Party controlled congress with ZERO ability to compromise because they are so ideologically divergent.

To be fair, a large part of the intractable Congress we have right now is due to the personal animus Tea Party representatives and Senators have against Obama as a person more so than his politics. Sanders doesn't have that issue.

I'll let you fill in the gaps on what that issue is.

That being said, as the poster above said, Sanders would get destroyed in the general election since he's a self described socialist. That's a no-no. You have a better chance as a self-described racist in this country. (Ann Coulter would get voted in before Sanders would).

We're years away from that term losing its meaning.

Anybody who wants Sanders' policies in the White House should hope for a Democratic primary short enough not to damage Hillary but long enough to move her to the left some and take on some of Sanders' policies without the "socialist" stigma.

 

[megatronium]

Came for this:

Left learning about Bernie

 

[CitizenCope]

we all need to make bernie sanders president. its simple

I'm on board.

 

[inm8num2]

we all need to make bernie sanders president. its simple

"It's simple. We elect the Sandman."

 

[TheLaughingStock]

I wish more people would fight and bicker over votes for state, local, and congressional officials.

 

[Lord Panda]

Finally a candidate that isn't a total slime ball ... which means his chances of being elected are slim.

 

[dehydratedbabies]

Because America won't vote for a self described socialist, even if a small and vocal minority on the internet thinks otherwise.

Dear America: Wreav knows what you will and will not do! Be aware!

 

[exmachina64]

Dear America: Wreav knows what you will and will not do! Be aware!

He's referring to this thread.

 

[dramatis]

this so much.. people expect hilary clinton of all people to keep her promise.. just lol
look at all those campaign promises obama made and still hasnt kept

Does the same not apply to Bernie Sanders then? I'm not under the impression that he'll be able to do half of what he says if he gets into office either. Not so much the fault of the president but mainly because of Congress.

Well that's because she doesn't even have a damn platform. She hasn't laid out any specific proposals, afaik, and pretty much every speech she's given so far has been empty rhetoric which is in direct opposition to actual policies she and her husband have supported in the past. She's been in politics literally my whole life and the only thing that i know that she consistently "stands for" in her platform is women's rights.

This argument doesn't work when she quite clearly articulates in her recent speeches what her positions are on certain issues. Perhaps if you bothered to look up even her platform on her website you'll find it fairly detailed (hell, it's ridiculously detailed for a campaign site to be honest). But that would ruin your narrative of Hillary being inconsistent and vague and lacking a platform.

You don't have to be a Hillary supporter, but at least be informed about what you're attacking.

 

[disastermouse]

The problem is simply the "Screw Clinton, I wont vote at all if she is the nominee" folks. There is nothing for us Clinton supporters to be worried as far as the primary is concerned. Bernie Sanders will get votes no doubt and that is perfectly fine. Look at the primary as a Gore Vs Bradley race. Bernie is Bradley and Clinton is Gore. We are running a race not a sprint. The results will speak for themselves in 7-11 months. If by chance he catches fire, he will be buried with negative ads by her SuperPACs. It wont come to that and I would not expect it to.

Food for thought: Between 69'-93', Republican Presidents stacked the Supreme Court. Carter did not get to pick 1 Supreme Court Judge during his term.

The difference between Bernie and Clinton is bigger then the difference between Bradley and Gore.

 

[boiled goose]

You can be against something but still need to use it because your opponents will either way. Is she just supposed to not take money while the Republican candidates rake it in?

I'm not saying she should nt fundraise, I'm saying people don't believe her that she wants to change the system. She is the system. The powerful are her social circles. She works for them.

 

[lednerg]

The next president could be appointing as many as four Supreme Court justices. That is far more important than frankly anything. Justices serve for decades, and having even one more conservative in there would be a disaster, let alone four. There's nothing so bad about Hillary that should allow for that to happen.

 

[benjipwns]

It was stolen by a stopped recount.

The Supreme Court stopped the recount and that's why Gore lost. He was going to win in the recount and it was stopped. It had nothing to do with Nader. The article you posted is just a guy with an axe to grind against Nader.

The court ruled 7-2 that using different standards in different counties (the Gore position) was a violation of the Equal Protection Clause. (Which was the position of the three dissenting Florida Supreme Court justices, not a single member of which was Republican.)

The 5-4 ruling was that Florida couldn't meet the statutory deadline for recounts, but didn't dismiss the case. It was eligible to go back to the Florida Supreme Court to possibly change the deadline but the Gore team chose to drop the case because they didn't like the odds.

Indeed, the Supreme Court never issued a remedy or a suggestion of one as how to determine the outcome.

It in all probability should not have heard the case but it's questionable how the situation would have been resolved.

Though the ultimate irony is that had Gore gotten the limited recount he wanted, Bush would have won by even more. Had the Court ordered a statewide recount as a remedy rather than remand the case, which would have been 5-4 along partisan lines, Gore would have won by between 60 and 200 votes.

 

[ThankYouDaletech]

I just hope Hillary Clinton can take care of the corporations. They need the help.

 

[benjipwns]

I just hope Hillary Clinton can take care of the corporations. They need the help.

I guess this isn't the right economic climate for an expensive, poorly-trained visionary.