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the irony is painful.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

It's because he allowed a conversation. He messed up in that conversation, definitely. Of course mr. tough on crime would get it awfully wrong.

But he went in looking for a conversation, looking for a better idea of what's going on.


I'm not voting for him in the primary. Never planned on it. The funniest part of this whole thread is that I'm still picking Sanders in the primary. But that doesn't mean I'm going to let him or his supporters slide when they act up.

So it was the right strategy but the wrong execution. I could see that.


It's a shame that there seems to be this divide growing between Sanders supporters and BLM supporters. I would consider myself an advocate of both, so it's weird to see separate groups emerging over hyper-specific discrepancies in policy priorities.

 

[WanderingWind]

Here is the press release.

Well, if that gets picked up and reported on, you can kiss the movement having any sort of mainstream credibility goodbye. It won't even get up to Occupy Wall Street levels of serious coverage if that's reported as being the face of the movement. (Not that the screaming hijacking of a public debate did it any favors.) That press release is a straight up embarrassing representation of the movement. The cynical side of me thinks it's some sort of heavy handed ploy to discredit the movement. But that's tinfoil hat territory.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

So it was the right strategy but the wrong execution. I could see that.


It's a shame that there seems to be this divide growing between Sanders supporters and BLM supporters. I would consider myself an advocate of both, so it's weird to see separate groups emerging over hyper-specific discrepancies in policy priorities.

Honestly, if Bernie were to met with the founders of BLM and more chapters, maybe address crowds that aren't primarily white liberal males, this would probably subside.

The divide isn't even growing because of Bernie himself; his campaign has done quite a bit to try to close it. It's because of the hostility thrown at black activists.

 

[commedieu]

..of two belligerent self-aggrandising girls, who don't speak on behalf of the Black Lives Matter movement (thankfully).

Yeah but you know how we all have that hive mind. This is by design, this is ridiculous, but will be the voice. Watch. Just like al sharpton speaks for us all.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

Honestly, if Bernie were to met with the founders of BLM and more chapters, maybe address crowds that aren't primarily white liberal males, this would probably subside.

The divide isn't even growing because of Bernie himself; his campaign has done quite a bit to try to close it. It's because of the hostility thrown at black activists.

I think white people in general have trouble understanding why "all lives matter" is not an acceptable alternative to "black lives matter" and somewhere within the reasoning for that is the cause of their indifference.

Raising people to be "colorblind" is an awful educational policy. We should celebrate and embrace difference rather than awkwardly disregard it. In doing so, it becomes much easier to accept that certain groups of people are treated differently on the basis of skin color, rather than this "everyone is equal" mantra which suggests that such a thing is impossible. I guess that's not terribly relevant to Bernie because he seems to understand that, but I think his supporters would be wise to understand it. Supporters on both sides should recognize that a lot of voices in unison will be heard more clearly than a lot of voices shouting different things. I guess the argument is on what, exactly, everyone should be shouting.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Wait what? How is this even tangentially related to the BLM movement?
Not that a civil political organization should only support one cause, obviously, but this seem a little jarring.

There was a non-trivial outpouring of support from Palestinians during Ferguson.

 

[Maridia]

I think white people in general have trouble understanding why "all lives matter" is not an acceptable alternative to "black lives matter" and somewhere within the reasoning for that is the cause of their indifference.

Raising people to be "colorblind" is an awful educational policy. We should celebrate and embrace difference rather than awkwardly disregard it. In doing so, it becomes much easier to accept that certain groups of people are treated differently on the basis of skin color, rather than this "everyone is equal" mantra which suggests that such a thing is impossible. I guess that's not terribly relevant to Bernie because he seems to understand that, but I think his supporters would be wise to understand it. Supporters on both sides should recognize that a lot of voices in unison will be heard more clearly than a lot of voices shouting different things. I guess the argument is on what, exactly, everyone should be shouting.

I apologize if you've been following the debate more closely than I have (it's possible that I haven't seen a representative sample), but I haven't encountered much #AllLivesMatter sentiment among Sanders supporters online. What I see is almost entirely frustration that their candidate is the one being repeatedly targeted for protests.

 

[Dufase19089]

As a black person, this REALLY pisses me off.

I dont even support Sanders, yet these ignorant children want to ruin his event, despite them practically telling them "Here is the mic, talk" yet they continue to yell and scream at them for 0 reason.

People like these guys literally hold back the black community.

Hell I will probably get called a House Negro or an Uncle Tom If I said this on twitter, yet freaking Bernie Sanders, fought for their rights.

I really freaking wish these people listened to what Ben Carson said about Race during the debate, but knowing these guys, they probably think he is a puppet held up by his white masters, despite his knowledge wisdom, and maturity.

Excuse me while I go let off some steam.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Here is the press release.

This is actually the official statement from BLM Seattle.

And no black American should be listening to modern Ben Carson about a thing. He adds to black discourse about as much as Bobby Jindal does to South Asians.

 

[BSherrod]

As a black person, this REALLY pisses me off.

I dont even support Sanders, yet these ignorant children want to ruin his event, despite them practically telling them "Here is the mic, talk" yet they continue to yell and scream at them for 0 reason.

People like these guys literally hold back the black community.

Hell I will probably get called a House Negro or an Uncle Tom If I said this on twitter, yet freaking Bernie Sanders, fought for their rights.

I really freaking wish these people listened to what Ben Carson said about Race during the debate, but knowing these guys, they probably think he is a puppet held up by his white masters, despite his knowledge wisdom, and maturity.

Excuse me while I go let off some steam.

People that ask the people running for the President of the United States to address issues concerning black people hold back the black community? Listen to Ben Carson about race? Nah, man.

 

[Dufase19089]

And no black American should be listening to modern Ben Carson about a thing. He adds to black discourse about as much as Bobby Jindal does to South Asians.

I think you have Ben Carson confused with Al Sharpton.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

I apologize if you've been following the debate more closely than I have (it's possible that I haven't seen a representative sample), but I haven't encountered much #AllLivesMatter sentiment among Sanders supporters online. What I see is almost entirely frustration that their candidate is the one being repeatedly targeted for protests.

I recall seeing some all lives matter sentiment in a few facebook posts Bernie made about the BLM movement. It didn't seem so much like hostility as it did naivety regarding why the colorblind philosophy doesn't fix or address current racial problems. When that naivety is presented with a situation like this, where a candidate they ardently support is targeted by a movement they seem largely indifferent about, it doesn't surprise me to see some people turn hostile. While many may not explicitly be "all lives matter" supporters, I would imagine that they are ostracizing BLM supporters out of an instinct to aggressively defend their candidate rather than consider the grievances of protesters.

I think Bernie has been pretty smart about dealing with this internal conflict among different factions of his base thus far, but it would behoove everyone involved to work toward channeling their shared frustration in a concise, unified way rather than tearing each other down over minor discrepancies regarding how much attention Bernie devotes to certain topics.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

That press release really weird. It's like they want to ignore reality.

What is with "#FreePalastine"?

 

[Jb]

There was a non-trivial outpouring of support from Palestinians during Ferguson.

Oh Ok, wasn't aware of that. Thanks.

 

[exmachina64]

That press release really weird. It's like they want to ignore reality.

What is with "#FreePalastine"?

Post 859

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

I think you have Ben Carson confused with Al Sharpton.

When you mention Ben Carson's remarks during the debate, are you talking about his comment on operating on people's brains and recognizing that they're no different on the inside? Because that's a terrible way to non-answer a question about police brutality which is very clearly dealing with societal constructs that have imposed disparities based on race and has nothing to do with eugenics, which was the pseudoscience that purported that black people, due to a number of bullshit anatomical reasons, were intellectually inferior to whites.

It's like if someone asks a question about why people drive drunk and someone proceeds to answer by explaining how cars are made. It is a totally unrelated answer which shows that the person answering, intentionally or unintentionally, has no grasp on what the issue actually is.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

I think you have Ben Carson confused with Al Sharpton.

I meant exactly what I said.

We really doing the "Al Sharpton the racebaiting bogeyman" garbage?

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Post 859

Oh, I get that. It's just weird. It diverts from their actual cause. It's in a press statement with wanting to hold candidates accountable (specifically Bernie Sanders), it just comes off as goofy because he can't do anything to help Palestine. It's literally asking for more than what he can give.

 

[Dufase19089]

I meant exactly what I said.

We really doing the "Al Sharpton the racebaiting bogeyman" garbage?

Nah, I am saying I like what Ben Carson has said in the past. It would seem that you dont agree with that notion which is fine.

 

[Laz-E-Boy]

I really freaking wish these people listened to what Ben Carson said about Race during the debate

yeah...nah

 

[Dufase19089]

When you mention Ben Carson's remarks during the debate, are you talking about his comment on operating on people's brains and recognizing that they're no different on the inside? Because that's a terrible way to non-answer a question about police brutality which is very clearly dealing with societal constructs that have imposed disparities based on race and has nothing to do with eugenics, which was the pseudoscience that purported that black people, due to a number of bullshit anatomical reasons, were intellectually inferior to whites.

It's like if someone asks a question about why people drive drunk and someone proceeds to answer by explaining how cars are made. It is a totally unrelated answer which shows that the person answering, intentionally or unintentionally, has no grasp on what the issue actually is.

Society says that blacks are at a disadvantage because of their race.

Ben Carson is saying that race should not be the determining factor on how you live. If you are the same on the inside, blacks do not need to allow themselves to be brought down by what people say externally.

Considering his background, I think he would understand the whole social constructs.

 

[BSherrod]

Society says that blacks are at a disadvantage because of their race.

Ben Carson is saying that race should not be the determining factor on how you live. If you are the same on the inside, blacks do not need to allow themselves to be brought down by what people say externally.

Considering his background, I think he would understand the whole social constructs.

LMAO. We are "allowing" ourselves to be brought down by "what people say"? Sir.

 

[Novoitus]

I have no respect for people who vote or support Hilary Clinton.

 

[Dufase19089]

LMAO. We are "allowing" ourselves to be brought down by "what people say"? Sir.

Yes, or do you not think what people tell us doesnt influence how we act.

You tell a kid he cannot do something, he can either work harder to prove you wrong, or he can give up and prove what you said is right.

Ben Carson is saying, your race doesnt stop you from doing what you believe you are supposed to do. People telling you that you cant do XYZ because of your race is stupid, and we should not listen to that.

 

[Messofanego]

BLM is funded by Soros, a huge Clinton supporter.

Wait, Black Lives Matter is now an organisation and is pro-Clinton? News to me.

 

[BSherrod]

Yes, or do you not think what people tell us doesnt influence how we act.

You tell a kid he cannot do something, he can either work harder to prove you wrong, or he can give up and prove what you said is right.

Ben Carson is saying, your race doesnt stop you from doing what you believe you are supposed to do. People telling you that you cant do XYZ because of your race is stupid, and we should not listen to that.

BLM isn't about what you can't do because of your race, but what does happen because of your race. It's not about you hindering your progress because you don't believe in yourself, it's about the fact that because of the color of your skin your life is valued less in this country. That's what people want Ben Carson and any other candidate to talk about it.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

Wait, Black Lives Matter is now an organisation and is pro-Clinton? News to me.

Hell no they aren't.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

Society says that blacks are at a disadvantage because of their race.

Ben Carson is saying that race should not be the determining factor on how you live. If you are the same on the inside, blacks do not need to allow themselves to be brought down by what people say externally.

Considering his background, I think he would understand the whole social constructs.

Black people are at a disadvantage because of their race. Not because of something intrinsic to being black, as Carson chose to refute despite not even being the topic at hand, but because of deliberate societal attempts to undermine black achievement. You can look at incarceration rates for crack vs cocaine, you can look at housing laws, you can look at any "tough on crime" program, etc. While external stereotypes can affect one's behavior and performance (it's been shown that standardized test results are different when students are asked to disclose their race beforehand as opposed to when they are not), there are very real and widespread systems in place that disproportionately affect people of color. To suggest otherwise is to suggest that you offer no help to alleviate the problem of racial disparity, because you refuse to accept that it exists. To do so is to say that the status quo is acceptable and I find that terribly naive, if not sugar-coated racism.

 

[gazele]

I have no respect for people who vote or support Hilary Clinton.

Curious why that would be

not respecting others right to choose their choice of elected officials seems like a poor direction

 

[Messofanego]

Hell no they aren't.

Set me right, then.

 

[Dufase19089]

BLM isn't about what you can't do because of your race, but what does happen because of your race. It's not about you hindering your progress because you don't believe in yourself, it's about the fact that because of the color of your skin your life is valued less in this country. That's what people want Ben Carson and any other candidate to talk about it.

And I find that notion B.S. Sure in some area's that may be true. But to say that the entire country values black people less is insulting. Ben Carson is saying that all people have the same value as anyone else, and we should stop looking at our skin and saying that somehow there is a different value.

And again, IF someone says that you are valued less because of your skin, PROVE THEM WRONG. My mother lived in a time where people LEGITIMATELY valued her far less than her peers not only because she was black, but because she was a black woman. Sure some people would rally and protest the inequality, which is good in its own right. But she was not one of those people. She went out and worked her butt off and looked her employers in the eye and said, "You may not value me because of my race and my gender, but I will show you why you should value me, my time, and my efforts".

Lo and behold, she ended up doing better than her peers and changed the minds and opinions of those who disregarded her value.

Im not going to pretend that there are some areas that value blacks less than others. My brother lives in a city where every race undervalues the other races (Whites dont value blacks, Blacks dont value Hispanics, Hispanics dont value Asians...etc)

But I'm not going to give into the notion that cops shoot black people, just because they are black, or employers dont hire people, because they are Mexican, or restaurants wont serve you, if you say that you are gay.

Sure, individual places may do that, and screw those place. But as for the entire society in this country, minorities are NOT undervalued by the system. There is no systemic racism and what the people who ruined Sanders event did DOES NOT HELP.

Ben Carson saying that race should not be a determining factor in ones Life does more help than what the BLM have shown.

I may be just a dude with an archaic belief mindset, but I much rather give people reason to value me despite my skin color. Than have people value me because of my skin color.

And when I come across people who only see me because of skin color, I ignore those people. Because what they value is not important nor worth my time.

 

[Gun Animal]

This is shaping up to be some COINTELPRO remix type shit

This is exactly what I was thinking. Not like it's the FBI doing this shit, but it does feel like some kind of subversion or astroturfing at this point.

 

[Dufase19089]

Black people are at a disadvantage because of their race. Not because of something intrinsic to being black, as Carson chose to refute despite not even being the topic at hand, but because of deliberate societal attempts to undermine black achievement. You can look at incarceration rates for crack vs cocaine, you can look at housing laws, you can look at any "tough on crime" program, etc. While external stereotypes can affect one's behavior and performance (it's been shown that standardized test results are different when students are asked to disclose their race beforehand as opposed to when they are not), there are very real and widespread systems in place that disproportionately affect people of color. To suggest otherwise is to suggest that you offer no help to alleviate the problem of racial disparity, because you refuse to accept that it exists. To do so is to say that the status quo is acceptable and I find that terribly naive, if not sugar-coated racism.

No I am not disadvantaged because of my race.

And if they commit a crime, than they are in the wrong regardless of race. If there is a lot of people who are in prison just for being black, then thats a problem (like it was 40 50 years ago).

Also a lot of that pretty much is because of economics and not simply skin color.

My family literally grew up on these areas where blacks are commonly arrested left and right. And they were always guilty. It was not because they were black, but because of their choices.

The economic disparity in which they lived in, directly influenced their choices.

Also if identifying that you are black makes you do worse on a test, then perhaps ignoring racial background is a GOOD thing, because the less you focus on race, the better you do.

I mean honestly, If saying you are black alters the way you think, then maybe that should say something about our focus on our race. Ben Carson says race shouldnt matter, then perhaps we should stop focusing on race and focus on things that actually matter. If black people stopped thinking they are disadvantaged (regardless of the reality or not) then perhaps they will end up doing better in the long run.

Going off your comment about Sugar coating racism, maybe we SHOULD do that. If there is some sort of placebo effect (assuming that it can be proven) then would that not be worth it?

 

[BSherrod]

And I find that notion B.S. Sure in some area's that may be true. But to say that the entire country values black people less is insulting. Ben Carson is saying that all people have the same value as anyone else, and we should stop looking at our skin and saying that somehow there is a different value.

And again, IF someone says that you are valued less because of your skin, PROVE THEM WRONG. My mother lived in a time where people LEGITIMATELY valued her far less than her peers not only because she was black, but because she was a black woman. Sure some people would rally and protest the inequality, which is good in its own right. But she was not one of those people. She went out and worked her butt off and looked her employers in the eye and said, "You may not value me because of my race and my gender, but I will show you why you should value me, my time, and my efforts".

Lo and behold, she ended up doing better than her peers and changed the minds and opinions of those who disregarded her value.

Im not going to pretend that there are some areas that value blacks less than others. My brother lives in a city where every race undervalues the other races (Whites dont value blacks, Blacks dont value Hispanics, Hispanics dont value Asians...etc)

But I'm not going to give into the notion that cops shoot black people, just because they are black, or employers dont hire people, because they are Mexican, or restaurants wont serve you, if you say that you are gay.

Sure, individual places may do that, and screw those place. But as for the entire society in this country, minorities are NOT undervalued by the system. There is no systemic racism and what the people who ruined Sanders event did DOES NOT HELP.

Ben Carson saying that race should not be a determining factor in ones Life does more help than what the BLM have shown.

I may be just a dude with an archaic belief mindset, but I much rather give people reason to value me despite my skin color. Than have people value me because of my skin color.

And when I come across people who only see me because of skin color, I ignore those people. Because what they value is not important nor worth my time.

Why do I as a black person have to prove my worth as a human being? That's incredibly insulting and dismisses easily available statistics that show discrimination because of skin color. But #alllivesmatter, right?

 

[sneakydomo]

Yes, actually. Either that or beef up his security.

But his huff and puff and walk off the stage bit is only going to guarantee that this happens whenever there's a window for it to. Not to mention destroy his chance at the black vote.

Bernie has zero chance for the black vote. No point in even going for it. Enjoy the Clintons neoliberal economic policies for another four to eight years, it's worked out so well for the poor and disadvantaged thus far.

 

[Dufase19089]

Why do I as a black person have to prove my worth as a human being? That's incredibly insulting and dismisses easily available statistics that show discrimination because of skin color. But #alllivesmatter, right?

Yes All lives matter!

You should have to prove your worth as a human being, NOT as a black person.

EDIT: And by that I mean, show what you bring to the table. I do not mean prove that you have worth as a human being.
I mean, You are human and have worth, this is what i can do to advance humanity.

It is FAR more insulting to say, "He is the first black person to do this". While it may be good for the black community to accomplish something, its basically saying, 'look how far a black person has come' instead of, Look how far humanity has come.

Saying that All Lives Matter, does not inherently mean that black lives matter less. It simply means Black lives are just as valuable as White lives, or Hispanic Lives, European Lives, Arab Lives,...etc

Thats what Ben Carson is saying, move past Skin Color and focus on merit. Ergo what Martin Luthor King said.

 

[CygnusXS]

Yes All lives matter!

You should have to prove your worth as a human being, NOT as a black person.

EDIT: And by that I mean, show what you bring to the table. I do not mean prove that you have worth as a human being.
I mean, You are human and have worth, this is what i can do to advance humanity.

It is FAR more insulting to say, "He is the first black person to do this". While it may be good for the black community to accomplish something, its basically saying, 'look how far a black person has come' instead of, Look how far humanity has come.

Saying that All Lives Matter, does not inherently mean that black lives matter less. It simply means Black lives are just as valuable as White lives, or Hispanic Lives, European Lives, Arab Lives,...etc

Thats what Ben Carson is saying, move past Skin Color and focus on merit. Ergo what Martin Luthor King said.

It's a nice message. If only your country's legal, political, and educational institutions would listen to it.

 

[Dufase19089]

It's a nice message. If only your country's legal, political, and educational institutions would listen to it.

Unfortunately, they are too busy lowering standards for minorities and women just to meet some B.S. Diversity quota instead of saying, everyone should have the same standards lets try to raise the bar.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

"all lives matter" on one hand, throwing black people under the bus on the other.

Rich. Oh, and bastardizing MLK jr into one single sentence. So original.

 

[BSherrod]

Yes All lives matter!

You should have to prove your worth as a human being, NOT as a black person.

EDIT: And by that I mean, show what you bring to the table. I do not mean prove that you have worth as a human being.
I mean, You are human and have worth, this is what i can do to advance humanity.

It is FAR more insulting to say, "He is the first black person to do this". While it may be good for the black community to accomplish something, its basically saying, 'look how far a black person has come' instead of, Look how far humanity has come.

Saying that All Lives Matter, does not inherently mean that black lives matter less. It simply means Black lives are just as valuable as White lives, or Hispanic Lives, European Lives, Arab Lives,...etc

Thats what Ben Carson is saying, move past Skin Color and focus on merit. Ergo what Martin Luthor King said.

Actually saying All Lives Matter takes away from the point of Black Lives Matters by taking the focus away from the issues that plague black people in this country that you seem to think don't exist. Also, congrats on your #AllLivesMatter bingo by bringing up MLK. By you saying that being black has no disadavantages means that you're so off base that we can't continue this.

 

[not psycho]

I think Sanders just added a "Racial Justice" page to the "issues" section of his website:

https://berniesanders.com/issues/racial-justice/

Mentions BLM in particular:

At the federal level we need to establish a new model police training program that reorients the way we do law enforcement in this country. With input from a broad segment of the community including activists and leaders from organizations like Black Lives Matter we will reinvent how we police America.

 

[Kid Kamikaze10]

I think Sanders just added a "Racial Justice" page to the "issues" section of his website:

https://berniesanders.com/issues/racial-justice/

Mentions BLM in particular:

Great to see. Hopefully we get to see that in action.

 

[CygnusXS]

Unfortunately, they are too busy lowering standards for minorities and women just to meet some B.S. Diversity quota instead of saying, everyone should have the same standards lets try to raise the bar.

Why do you think that, in your terms, standards need to be lowered (also no they don't and that's not what affirmative action does) in order to get a higher representation of black people in those bodies? Work backwards from that point and get back to us.

 

[BSherrod]

Great to see. Hopefully we get to see that in action.

This is the step in the right direction. Need to see this from all candidates.

 

[alstein]

Oh Ok, wasn't aware of that. Thanks.

I remember the Palestianians also were handing out tops on how to handle riot police during the Occupy movement.

 

[BigDes]

I mean honestly, If saying you are black alters the way you think, then maybe that should say something about our focus on our race.

Being black might not alter the way you think about yourself. The argument is that it alters the way other people think about you.

Focusing on wanting to be judged on your merits as a human being is nice and all but irrelevant if the other side refuse to acknowledge these merits simply because you have dark skin

You can stand there proclaiming that there is no institutional racism and that all the problems with race are inside the heads of the black community until the cows come home. It still won't prevent you getting six bullets in your chest when you act a bit belligerent and confused in front of a cop.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

No I am not disadvantaged because of my race.

And if they commit a crime, than they are in the wrong regardless of race. If there is a lot of people who are in prison just for being black, then thats a problem (like it was 40 50 years ago).

Also a lot of that pretty much is because of economics and not simply skin color.

My family literally grew up on these areas where blacks are commonly arrested left and right. And they were always guilty. It was not because they were black, but because of their choices.

The economic disparity in which they lived in, directly influenced their choices.

Also if identifying that you are black makes you do worse on a test, then perhaps ignoring racial background is a GOOD thing, because the less you focus on race, the better you do.

I mean honestly, If saying you are black alters the way you think, then maybe that should say something about our focus on our race. Ben Carson says race shouldnt matter, then perhaps we should stop focusing on race and focus on things that actually matter. If black people stopped thinking they are disadvantaged (regardless of the reality or not) then perhaps they will end up doing better in the long run.

Going off your comment about Sugar coating racism, maybe we SHOULD do that. If there is some sort of placebo effect (assuming that it can be proven) then would that not be worth it?

I don't see how you fail to understand that economic standing and race are not two exclusive factors. One influences the other.

How can you look at that and not understand that it's the cumulative effect of slavery which led to Jim Crow laws, which led to separate but equal, which led to mass incarceration and the war on drugs, all of which were/are efforts specifically designed to undermine black advancement. The ONLY difference today being that this effort has to pretend to have no basis in race thanks to Nixon's Southern strategy, as detailed here by Lee Atwater in 1981:

You start out in 1954 by saying, “Nigger, nigger, nigger.” By 1968 you can’t say “nigger”—that hurts you, backfires. So you say stuff like, uh, forced busing, states’ rights, and all that stuff, and you’re getting so abstract. Now, you’re talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you’re talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is, blacks get hurt worse than whites.… “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, uh, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “Nigger, nigger.”

To say that you need to prove people wrong via excelling in your field is entirely secondary to the fact that we should first demand there be a fair chance to do so. Your argument, and Carson's, is tantamount to "Shut up about the inequality and deal with it" and that does not merit serious consideration as a policy position.

 

[Dufase19089]

Actually saying All Lives Matter takes away from the point of Black Lives Matters by taking the focus away from the issues that plague black people in this country that you seem to think don't exist. Also, congrats on your #AllLivesMatter bingo by bringing up MLK. By you saying that being black has no disadavantages means that you're so off base that we can't continue this.

No, its not. In fact it actually brings focus to black issues! If you start at a position that All Lives Matter and you see black lives being treated differently, you are forced to focus on black lives, because you believe that ALL lives matter. Therefore you make changes so that Black Lives are treated the same way as other lives, because they are inherently the same.

Being black does not have any disadvantages. We live in a world where Barack Obama is president, Oprah Winfrey is the richest woman, and richest black person. There are more black millionaires thanks to music and sports than any other time in history.

Affirmative action and Equal treatment laws practically allows any person of any race, background, gender, sexual orientation to attend schools, get jobs...etc

The only true disadvantage would be economic. And that is not because of skin color.

You take a close look at the stats and I can guarantee you that race isnt the main issue.

You look at black students in higher education and they will tell you that most of the racial opposition they get is from other blacks.

Are there still racial issue. Absolutely. But it is not nearly as widespread as you make it out to be.

Hell even back to the Bernie Sanders thing. They literally were giving the people a chance to speak, but instead of listening and being respectful, they were loud and ignorant. They kept yelling "Dont silence her, LET HER SPEAK" When the guy was LITERALLY saying, "We will give you a few minutes"

That is the issue I have. When they are telling themselves "they are trying to silence us, they wont let is speak" when they are flat out given a chance to prove that what they have to say matters.

They Literally gave up a chance to speak their minds, because they believed that they would never get a chance to speak.

 

[Dufase19089]

Being black might not alter the way you think about yourself. The argument is that it alters the way other people think about you.

Focusing on wanting to be judged on your merits as a human being is nice and all but irrelevant if the other side refuse to acknowledge these merits simply because you have dark skin

You can stand there proclaiming that there is no institutional racism and that all the problems with race are inside the heads of the black community until the cows come home. It still won't prevent you getting six bullets in your chest when you act a bit belligerent and confused in front of a cop.

You assume that Cops will shoot me because I am black. I do not.

I have been stopped by cops literally for walking out side. I never had an issue, nor was there ever a problem. I was stopped in different states and counties. Same result. I was allowed to leave. No issue whatsover.

I am not saying I should pretend that a Cop will never shoot me, I am simply not assuming that he will shoot me.