Seems they left that for PSX, hope there's lots of footage from the show floor.
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Andy Bogard Confirmed for KoF XIV
- Thread starter Marz
- Start date
Seems they left that for PSX, hope there's lots of footage from the show floor.
SolarKnight
Member
No? What's being said is that with the exception of XII and XIII the graphics for the characters had not really been a focus of the game. Does it look bad? With a few exceptions, hell no I love the look of most KoF games, but I'm not gonna pretend that it wasn't a conscious decision to be cheap with the character graphics to focus on the gameplay, roster size, and because of an overall lack of budget. It's just that the old art style looked better than what XIV is using. Not to mention that with the low resolution it was easier to make.
I like how the animation looks like 2D KoF. Smoothness through 3D motion interpolation between frames does not quality animation make. It doesnt have all the secondary stretching and hand-drawn perspective as Xrd, but I also don't find the actual motions as "framey", personally. And it seems they've just started adding some blur effects to motion, like with Andy's Shoryuudan and Leona's Strike Arch.
The thing I miss in animation v.s 2D is the lack of any "loose" portions to clothing, especially since pants and jacket animation is pretty distinctive in most KOF / SNK games. Materials are all very rigid, and close to the base 3D mesh, just like MK. Unlike MK, at least Leona's chest moves some with her motion. Not saying it'd need DOA level bounce, but watching Jacqui wear a tanktop with NO breast motion at all looks pretty Bad. Breast sway is normally an expected thing in 3d animation, just like ponytail / bang billowing.
shinjimimura
Member
In what alternate reality KOF fans are used to crappy graphics? Classic era KOFs might have been a bit less polished in the graphic departement than other SNK's fighters of the same era (mainly due to their huge rosters), but they have never been crappy in any way or form... until XIV, of course, which looks really really awful
shinjimimura
Member
Yes, and that's because it did.
It has some nice cel-shade / colored shadows, and the backgrounds are worlds better so far, aye. But it's also a finished game that was later improved with a home release. This KOF still has yet to show us a real match, U.I elements, or a chara select that wasn't a hidden few frames. KoF XIV has plenty of time to add more refinement to it's looks. All of which we all hope happens!
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
That's not true. Even among SNK fans the repeated recycling of their old sprites was an issue. When we heard about XII using actual new sprites, most of us were relieved That's not only true for KOF but also Metal Slug.
I bought them all and enjoyed them. Especially 98, 2002 and XI. But the horrible graphics aren't defendable at all.
Edit: I think XI looked better than 2002, 2003 and Neowave. More colorful and cleaned up sprites. Btw. if Geese, Mature and Vice are in this, then it's not a new saga, but a dream match.
...WAT
I'm not saying fan weren't ready for better visuals in the later pre-XII era of KOF, to be clear, because they definitely were. But while I think people like me wanted to see the series make the jump to HD (or at least closer to HD), I don't think I ever got tired of KOF's visual. Even in the later era, SNK put so much work in the character and background graphics.
So one ARTIST leaving stopped MI? That sounds ridiculous and far fetched.
SolarKnight
Member
When said artist is the character designer, art director, and producer it's not exactly just "one artist".
I'm not saying it's the only possible reason, but iirc it was doing as well if not better than the main series at the time si I don't think its reception had anything to do with it.
Well, Falcoon wasn't just an artist. By MI2 and Reg A, he was also the MI series' producer. And you can tell that the series was "his baby".
But in any case, the story goes (according to MMCafe, SRK and other places I hovered around at the time) that MI3 and a number of other titles, like Samurai Shodown Iroha's ill-fated DS spinoff, were all cancelled because a) SNKP was focusing with almost all hands on deck for XII/XIII and b) apparently, they didn't want yet another fairly major KOF game to compete with the 2D game that they had spent so much time and money on. There's also talk that Falcoon took a number of the criticisms leveled against him to heart, which is why him bowing out may have been for more than one reason.
Even so, without him, there really wasn't anybody left at the company to champion MI's cause besides the head writer. And I don't even know if he's at the company, either (Loona probably would, though).
Sure, it was an issue. But again, as stated earlier, it wasn't something that prevented the hardcore from playing/supporting the releases, which is again, all that mattered to SNKP's bottomline.
RedAssedApe
Banned
it'd take that over this
Papacheeks
Banned
You obviously never compared king of fighters series to 3rd strike then when it came out?
3rd strike was so much better looking, and really raised the bar in terms of what was achievable for animation in a 2d fighting game.
In the 90's King of fighters was on par with I would agree Alpha 2 and 3. But once third strike came out it changed a lot of things.
And since then King of fighters has always been playing catch up. But to me I enjoy the list of characters, and the combo system. And that's mainly the reason there's still a hardcore group that plays it.
I'm ok with how it looks, I'm more concerned in how it plays, and how many character's there are in the roster.
I'v been playing fighter's since Street fighter 2 champion edition, and even before that.
A proper comparison would be 3rd Strike to Garou. KOF has always been a compilation game that takes assets from existing games. If you want to compare KOF to something then the Marvel vs. series is a better comparison.
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
Yeah motw was the game to counter 3rd strike. KOF stagnated for a long time. When 94 was out, I'd say it was better looking than SF2. Still don't know how this is an excuse, right after XIII.
SNK/P was on life support for a freaking long time. Even though they made XI, SamSho Tenka and NGBC at the end of the atomiswave, which all turned out to be freaking good.
When XII/XIII came out I had new hope for this company. Now with SamSho Sen and this we're back into the dark ages.
SNK/P was on life support for a freaking long time. Even though they made XI, SamSho Tenka and NGBC at the end of the atomiswave, which all turned out to be freaking good.
When XII/XIII came out I had new hope for this company. Now with SamSho Sen and this we're back into the dark ages.
I think Akihiko Ureshino, the writer (who's worked on more KoF stories since 96 up to XIII), and Falcoon have generally been on good terms, but AFAIK SNK hasn't been Ureshino's only gig, as he's apparently a contractor or something, so likely has limited influence on what happens at the company (he still seems to champion their output to an interesting extent - his Twitter account is filled with Animal Crossing takes on SNK characters, some of which fairly obscure at that).
I do recall that the initial plans for a Maximum impact 3 were originally aimed at the PS3, but clearly XII and XIII took that focus, not without some nods to MI: Billy stage in XIII has his sister using an outfit she only ever wore and an alternate in MI2, and one of Elisabeth's default palettes seems heavily based on MI's Mignon, of all people.
Jawmuncher
Member
Maybe they'll have better graphics at psx
dragonflys545
Member
LOL.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
They look better then when first shown. They bumped up from a 2/10 all the way up to a 3/10. Except the previous KoF game could be considered the best looking 2d fighter of all time, so peoples expectations are pretty high for a KoF game.
RedAssedApe
Banned
Same.
But, real talk, if Angel is in the game, I don't care how it looks, it's bought.
It's probably bought anyway, because KoF, but doubly bought if Angel is in it.
IDK what to think of it.
Characters models looks very basic at first glance, yet when the camera zooms in for a special they don't seem all that bad...I'm sure the fact that the video looks like shit even when tuned on 1080p doesn't help.
I'm intrigued to see the finished product, but this isn't pre-order material for me so far.
Characters models looks very basic at first glance, yet when the camera zooms in for a special they don't seem all that bad...I'm sure the fact that the video looks like shit even when tuned on 1080p doesn't help.
I'm intrigued to see the finished product, but this isn't pre-order material for me so far.
Hiroaki needs his shine. I can only dream at this point.
I've never really played any of the KoF games before XIII, so every time I see something new for XIV I end up having this reaction:
Holyshit. This is too good and understandable. I'm would do saying the same thing too honestly.
Not going by just this video, but my issue is the way they're animating the characters just doesn't go well with the hit stun. It makes it look incredibly awkward. I don't care how the models look, it's the animation that throws me off.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
Here's what I think I'm having a problem with on most characters:
1: Most male characters have odd proportions compared to their sprites, artwork, etc, and every character aside Chang look way, way too scrawny. Add some chest width, some muscle, some height, some thickness, some hips. They don't look like fighters. Most shown so far, Andy included, look sick.
2: The hair looks weird. I would think in the age of tools that literally bolt realistic flowing hair onto heads, there would be something that could be done to make their hair not look so bad. It's the least they could do. Hair shouldn't be too shiny and should at least move a little when dashing and doing flips in Andy's case.
3: Movements have no soul or bounce to them. They look like they were made in 3D Fighter Maker. Very utilitarian. Even worse when you see the character faces barely react to anything
4: The faces look unsightly. Very narrow faces that don't match the rest of the character. Either they need to be warmer and simpler or pale and detailed, and the current faces are in the middle. They don't match previous SNK Artworks and have very little personality. When they do expressions, the faces seem to do a very canned animation like it was animated in claymation, as unnatural as you could imagine it.
5: I really like Chang's color palette; Bright, colorful, almost watercolor-like. Iori's, Kyo's, and Andy's have this weird part-muted dark color part-pale bright color thing going on. Chang's model is the only one that really looks complete. I see improvements in Iori's model, coloring, and textures but there's still a long, long way to go before it looks like it belongs in the same game as Changs.
1: Most male characters have odd proportions compared to their sprites, artwork, etc, and every character aside Chang look way, way too scrawny. Add some chest width, some muscle, some height, some thickness, some hips. They don't look like fighters. Most shown so far, Andy included, look sick.
2: The hair looks weird. I would think in the age of tools that literally bolt realistic flowing hair onto heads, there would be something that could be done to make their hair not look so bad. It's the least they could do. Hair shouldn't be too shiny and should at least move a little when dashing and doing flips in Andy's case.
3: Movements have no soul or bounce to them. They look like they were made in 3D Fighter Maker. Very utilitarian. Even worse when you see the character faces barely react to anything
4: The faces look unsightly. Very narrow faces that don't match the rest of the character. Either they need to be warmer and simpler or pale and detailed, and the current faces are in the middle. They don't match previous SNK Artworks and have very little personality. When they do expressions, the faces seem to do a very canned animation like it was animated in claymation, as unnatural as you could imagine it.
5: I really like Chang's color palette; Bright, colorful, almost watercolor-like. Iori's, Kyo's, and Andy's have this weird part-muted dark color part-pale bright color thing going on. Chang's model is the only one that really looks complete. I see improvements in Iori's model, coloring, and textures but there's still a long, long way to go before it looks like it belongs in the same game as Changs.
I mean it doesn't look completely awful but something tells me that KOF14 is being made for half the budget of SFV but it's going to have at least double the character count so every single facet of the games look is going to be a compromise.
Maybe a little bit more money should have been tossed in there to make everything a little spiffier and ... I don't know , launch it as a lower budget game with constant updates that you can pay for. Maybe just have 12 characters in there (4 teams) and then every 4 months add another team , once 24 characters are in there add in a single player mode and should the game continue to be played just keep adding characters in for a couple more years.
Instead... we get this...
Maybe a little bit more money should have been tossed in there to make everything a little spiffier and ... I don't know , launch it as a lower budget game with constant updates that you can pay for. Maybe just have 12 characters in there (4 teams) and then every 4 months add another team , once 24 characters are in there add in a single player mode and should the game continue to be played just keep adding characters in for a couple more years.
Instead... we get this...
Agreed. Iori's legs in particular looks really weird. I know he's always been lanky, but he's approaching stick figure territory here.
butman
Member
Here is where we can identify folks who started with XII or XIII. They roided the fuck out of the roster for those new sprites, the leaner characters look more like their old sprites which I personally think is better.
vs
Andy didn't get as bulked up as some folks did in XIII, but he's still a lot thicker then he used to be.
Better example is Ralf
vs
I was playing a CPS3 copy of Street Fighter 3 at the GameFan offices long before the game was even available on home consoles in order to be compared in detail by most people.
What does Street Fighter 3 have to do with this? One of Capcom's most legendary and complex games in terms of sprite artwork and pixel detail beats your average output from SNK? No crap. How does that, in any way, change the fact that one of the things SNK fans generally love/loved about Neo Geo fighters was SNK's trademark sprite and background work?
Not everything has to be SF3 to be appreciated for its beauty and design, especially since most 2D fighters could never even live up to it (or Capcom's other CPS3 output).
I think it has more to do with some people currently comparing XIV to it's current competition (SF5, GGXRDR,T7, and KI) and bringing up the series dire need of new fans, which will likely be drawn to those other games.
I can't get mad at SNK's decisions anymore. I was done trying to understand them when they did not release the rest of their neogeo KOF, Samsho, and Garou games to the neogeo calalog on PS3. The same catalog that had KOF94 to 96 with actual great net code.
Here is where we can identify folks who started with XII or XIII. They roided the fuck out of the roster for those new sprites, the leaner characters look more like their old sprites which I personally think is better.
vs
Andy didn't get as bulked up as some folks did in XIII, but he's still a lot thicker then he used to be.
Better example is Ralf
vs
Ralf is my favorite KoF character so I was disappointed they did this to him, and worse of all they made Clark look like a pallette swap of him again, clark looked way cooler with his pseudo-trucker get up.
At the very least it would seem they will be back to how they were before with this new style.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
XII/XIII had amazing art but this was a definite problem. Especially Ralf and Clark, geez. Athena got hit with the kawaii stick too.Here is where we can identify folks who started with XII or XIII. They roided the fuck out of the roster for those new sprites, the leaner characters look more like their old sprites which I personally think is better.
vs
Andy didn't get as bulked up as some folks did in XIII, but he's still a lot thicker then he used to be.
Better example is Ralf
vs
Seriously, even though it's past gen and all, it still hurts to sit down and think back about it: such a goddamn shame.
Man, Toy Story was such a good movie.
spazchicken
Member
He looks so bad... like 90s cg bad.
Not fair? Yeah, I know. Capcom actually knows what they're doing, to some extent.
Finaika
Member
At least KOF's background has colors.