Rottenwatch: AVATAR (82%)

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Yeah so I just got back from seeing this and absolutely loved it. I didn't think the story was as weak as a lot of people made it out to be. Sure, the basic plot arc is predictable, but if you are paying too much attention to that then you are missing out on all of the little things.

The little nuances here and there that add up, and by the time you leave the movie theater you feel like you were really there. You feel like you
became one of them too
.

Quite quickly I became attached to the characters, especially the connection between
Jake and Neytiri and how they slowly grew together from so far apart
.

This movie is a love story disguised as an action film, and just like all love stories, it isn't about what is going to happen because everyone knows what is going to happen...it is about how it happens.

The habitat of Pandora is so unique you can't possibly predict the events that will unfold around it, and to me, that is where the magic was.
 
I have to be honest when I saw
the dragon and it's entourage appear before the first fight I thought "FUCK YEAH! We're gonna fuck you up!"
then I felt guilty afterwards. :(
 
Spoiler about one of the animals.
The helicopter lizards are about the stupidest animal ever. It was cute, but I just sat there pondering what use it could be for a real animal. The things least should of been able to not spin themselves!
 
Ferrio said:
Spoiler about one of the animals.
The helicopter lizards are about the stupidest animal ever. It was cute, but I just sat there pondering what use it could be for a real animal. The things least should of been able to not spin themselves!
Click to expand...
Yeah I thought the same thing.
Having the ability the spin and fly is one thing but surely evolution would have eliminated a creature that can't fully see it's surroundings when it does it.

I also liked how weak and frail humans looked compared to the 10 foot tall Na'vi.
 
Ferrio said:
Spoiler about one of the animals.
The helicopter lizards are about the stupidest animal ever. It was cute, but I just sat there pondering what use it could be for a real animal. The things least should of been able to not spin themselves!
Click to expand...

:lol I thought this too. It must suck for them to fly around everywhere like that.
 
cartoon_soldier said:
Not for original screenplay I hope.
Click to expand...
Yeah it's not taking that away for sure, Best Director, Best Picture and Best Actress though I'd imagine. That's my guess at the moment. Weaver might pick up Best Supporting Actress.

EDIT: Art Direction too.
 
I have to eat crow. I've been poo-pooing 3D, I just never really thought it would make that much of a difference...

...then I saw the trailer for Piranha 3D!!!!!!!!!


Avatar was exactly what I thought it would be, unfortunately. 10/10 effects, 5/10 story and dialogue. It's just such a shame that all that money and time couldn't be used for a story worth giving a shit about.

Major issues: The Navi are boring, the humans are one dimensional, and the arc is so obvious it's like seeing into the future. The music is bland and unoriginal.

Nitpicks:(Off the top of my head)
Mechs with rifles and knives. Yeah, yeah, the human mechs versus the Navi mechs, I get it, it's stupid. Michelle Rodriquez painting her gunship and face. Cornball. Cockpit glass that can't block arrows. :lol

Anyway, the movie looked great, and I'm glad it's doing well so we can get more movies made with this tech.
 
stuburns said:
Weaver might pick up Best Supporting Actress.
Click to expand...

clinton_laughing.jpg
 
Also something

So the planet and everything on it is a big network/computer. Pretty much any big animal can hook their ethernet cord to the planet and access the database. Does this mean they could of also talked long distance to each other? Some good ole fashioned IM action. You'd think they'd be able to...
 
Speevy said:
Terrific film, deserves better than an 83%.

In a year where all the super serious dramas have fallen flat, this will win the Oscar.
Click to expand...

Sadly the latest George Clooney quest for best actor ever award oscarbait seems to have gotten a lot of traction.
 
It'll never win Best Picture, actor, actress or any of the supporting ones either. It excels at only a few things (which make up for the weaknesses in story) and it is those domains where it will dominate.

And how do all the creatures on Pandora evolve exactly the same capability to interact with each other?
 
stuburns said:
Yeah it's not taking that away for sure, Best Director, Best Picture and Best Actress though I'd imagine. That's my guess at the moment. Weaver might pick up Best Supporting Actress.

EDIT: Art Direction too.
Click to expand...

Apart from, "best effects" and related categories, maybe best director. I can't see it deserving anything related to acting, or Best Picture.
 
stuburns said:
Yeah it's not taking that away for sure, Best Director, Best Picture and Best Actress though I'd imagine. That's my guess at the moment. Weaver might pick up Best Supporting Actress.

EDIT: Art Direction too.
Click to expand...

For me, Avatar is in the contention for Art Direction and Visual Effects (who are we kidding, this one is in the bag). Maybe Cinematography and Sound Editing/Mixing.
 
Just got back.

First off, let me say it: Welcome back, James...so glad you could make it.

This was my first 3D movie. I had originally stayed away from 3D altogether, thinking that it would be all gimmicky. Cameron used it so well as a enhancement rather than as a distraction. The story he told (while it has been told before) was well done in several ways. The world of Pandora worked and from 20 minutes in, I saw the Na'vi as people and not CGI. I really liked how Cameron gave the viewer an investment in what the Na'vi had an investment in, like
the spirit tree that got bulldozed.

There were some laughable points like
Michelle Rodriguez in war paint along with her helicopter and the survival knife in the mechanical for he main bad Guy
but all in all I enjoyed it.

Lastly, the facial recognition and expressions were the best I've ever seen in CGI,especially
Sigourney and Zoe's

Gotta see again in theaters w/ other friends of mine.
 
Tobor said:
Cockpit glass that can't block arrows. :lol
Click to expand...
Did you actually look at the arrows? They were like 6 feet long and multiple inches thick! My friends and I couldn't get over how just absolutely freaking gargantuan the arrows were.
 
I wonder how they would do a sequel? Would they
have the military come back to recruit Sully and some of the navi to help them in a struggle on another world? Would another invader show up on Pandora?
 
DanielPlainview said:
It's the biggest new IP ever. I'm not trying to argue that. irfan said that only 3 franchise movies did better than it, when in reality it was actually 8 films that did better. It's not a big deal, just wondering what he was talking about.
Click to expand...
Ok, here goes;

"Avatar" sold a studio-estimated $232.2 million worth of tickets around the world this weekend, the ninth-biggest global debut of all time not accounting for ticket-price inflation. It was the biggest ever for a non-sequel, a sign that Fox's marketing machine succeeded in generating huge interest in a picture whose name alone didn't have much built-in excitement, as evidenced by modestly attended midnight screenings Thursday night.
Click to expand...
The big money for "Avatar," however, is coming from the rest of the world. Despite not yet having opened in Japan and China and frigid weather in northern Europe, it collected $159.2 million, the sixth-highest simultaneous foreign launch of all time. When accounting for the absence of those two big Asian markets, it was No. 4, behind only the sixth "Harry Potter" movie, the third "Spider-Man" and the third "Pirates of the Caribbean."
Click to expand...

Is it clear now Daniel? Or do you need these facts in a more distilled form?

Other part that I found interesting in the article:
Nonetheless, it was a solid performance, the second-biggest for December. Perhaps more importantly, those who saw the movie enjoyed it. Every demographic gave "Avatar" an average grade of A, according to market research firm CinemaScore, meaning those who didn't turn out for opening weekend will be getting strong recommendations from those who did. The combination of Christmas falling on a Friday and positive word of mouth has Fox executives buzzing that "Avatar" could gross nearly as much on its second weekend as its first and hit $200 million by the end of the year in the U.S. and Canada.
Click to expand...
 
cartoon_soldier said:
Apart from, "best effects" and related categories, maybe best director. I can't see it deserving anything related to acting, or Best Picture.
Click to expand...
Maybe not Best Picture, that's a stretch, but I do stand by Best Actress, we will have to see, it'd be a radical move for them, but I think they will.
 
Anticitizen One said:
I wonder how they would do a sequel? Would they
have the military come back to recruit Sully and some of the navi to help them in a struggle on another world? Would another invader show up on Pandora?
Click to expand...

Planet contracts a computer virus, a brave set of hackers must hack the pandora to fix it.
 
Ferrio said:
Spoiler about one of the animals.
The helicopter lizards are about the stupidest animal ever. It was cute, but I just sat there pondering what use it could be for a real animal. The things least should of been able to not spin themselves!
Click to expand...
Whatever, man. The
helicopter lizards
are fucking awesome. :lol

Anticitizen One said:
I wonder how they would do a sequel? Would they
have the military come back to recruit Sully and some of the navi to help them in a struggle on another world? Would another invader show up on Pandora?
Click to expand...
The military would send a robot back in time to kill Jake when he is still in the womb.
 
Anyone notice Pandora's shadow being cast on the gas planet? I saw it and thought about how the star would have to be on the other side of Pandora, and sure enough it led into a night scene.
 
stuburns said:
Maybe not Best Picture, that's a stretch, but I do stand by Best Actress, we will have to see, it'd be a radical move for them, but I think they will.
Click to expand...

If anyone is getting nominated it'd be Zoe Saldana. Sigourney Weaver doesn't stand a chance in hell.

Neither will, though. The Weaver character is kind of minimal and Zoe is CG. I would love it if it was Zoe, I thought Andy Serkis/WETA totally deserved an acting nom for Gollum. One day it will inevitably happen.
 
Ferrio said:
Planet contracts a computer virus, a brave set of hackers must hack the pandora to fix it.
Click to expand...

And they gotta prevent it from spreading, lest the federation deploys Dr. Device and wipes out the native population, amirite? *elbownudge*
 
Jokey665 said:
Did you actually look at the arrows? They were like 6 feet long and multiple inches thick! My friends and I couldn't get over how just absolutely freaking gargantuan the arrows were.
Click to expand...

It's 200 years in the future, that wouldn't be the same type of material we use today. Not to mention the humans knew perfectly well what kind of arrows they were using. There's no way those ships would have been cleared for flight with that kind of weakness.
But like I said, nitpick.

I forgot one. Unobtanium. :lol It's so ridiculous I thought I'd misheard it. That's modern George Lucas level shit.
 
ryutaro's mama said:
I really liked how Cameron gave the viewer an investment in what the Na'vi had an investment in, like
the spirit tree that got bulldozed.

There were some laughable points like
Michelle Rodriguez in war paint along with her helicopter and the survival knife in the mechanical for he main bad Guy
but all in all I enjoyed it.

Lastly, the facial recognition and expressions were the best I've ever seen in CGI,especially
Sigourney and Zoe's
Click to expand...
For me, I attributed getting myself invested in the Na'vi thanks to the extremely beleivable emotions from
Neytiri, especially when she cries from the betrayal and her father's death, and even her mother Moat, when she frees Jake and begs for help
.

I honestly don't see why the AMP suits having a melee weapon like the knife is laughable. Shouldn't these suits have some sort of close combat weapon in case they lose their gun or it runs out of ammo?

And yeah, the facial expressions are insane. Those nifty headgear that they wore during filming really did the trick.
 
cartoon_soldier said:
Who are you nominating for Best Actress?
Click to expand...
Saldana, of the films I've seen this year, she deserves it, and I think the academy have to at some point concede to allowing motion capture artists be up for these awards, and it's such an obvious instance to use to allow that. I really think she'll at least get the nom. We shall see though.
 
Combine said:
For me, I attributed getting myself invested in the Na'vi thanks to the extremely beleivable emotions from
Neytiri, especially when she cries from the betrayal and her father's death, and even her mother Moat, when she frees Jake and begs for help
.

I honestly don't see why the AMP suits having a melee weapon like the knife is laughable. Shouldn't these suits have some sort of close combat weapon in case they lose their gun or it runs out of ammo?

And yeah, the facial expressions are insane. Those nifty headgear that they wore during filming really did the trick.
Click to expand...

Why would they have a gun that you hold at all? You can't line of sight it, and having to mimic the action of holding it is extremely limiting. It's just bad practical design. Shoulder or arm mounted weaponry is the only design that makes sense, unless
you're trying to beat the audience over the head with the symbolism between the mechs/Navi creatures
.
 
I see a lot of films in a month--eight this week alone--and Avatar is without a doubt the most boring, clumsy film I've seen in a while. The first hour and a half is spent slowly developing Pandora, while Jake provides background narration as exposition for anything Cameron couldn't find time to show or didn't trust his audience to figure out, entire minutes are wasted on shots of the wilderness and wildlife, which though beautifully rendered, belong in an artbook rather than the film, and the plot is a complete joke.
Evil corporate and military men seek to usurp an indigenous people in order to attain their "Unobtainium".
Retarded.

The last hour is spent on huge, Michael-Bay-esque explosions and incomprehensible battle sequences. It's nothing but a display of graphical advancement--which it excels at--but a five minute tech demo for studios would've served just as well as this 2.7 hour mess. The only people I can imagine liking this are potheads who got high before watching it and possibly people who have never seen an action movie in their life.
 
Napoleonthechimp said:
And how do all the creatures on Pandora evolve exactly the same capability to interact with each other?
Click to expand...

Common ancestor with that ability?
Given it appears to provide positive survival abilities e.g. communication, information etc natural selection would favour the retention of it
.
 
If Unobtanium is so expensive and so rare, how come he has a small nation's worth floating on a desk ornament in his unsecured office?
 
JzeroT1437 said:
I see a lot of films in a month--eight this week alone--and Avatar is without a doubt the most boring, clumsy film I've seen in a while. The first hour and a half is spent slowly developing Pandora, while Jake provides background narration as exposition for anything Cameron couldn't find time to show or didn't trust his audience to figure out, entire minutes are wasted on shots of the wilderness and wildlife, which though beautifully rendered, belong in an artbook rather than the film, and the plot is a complete joke.
Evil corporate and military men seek to usurp an indigenous people in order to attain their "Unobtainium".
Retarded.

The last hour is spent on huge, Michael-Bay-esque explosions and incomprehensible battle sequences. It's nothing but a display of graphical advancement--which it excels at--but a five minute tech demo for studios would've served just as well as this 2.7 hour mess. The only people I can imagine liking this are potheads who got high before watching it and possibly people who have never seen an action movie in their life.
Click to expand...

What the hell?
 
JzeroT1437 said:
I see a lot of films in a month--eight this week alone--and Avatar is without a doubt the most boring, clumsy film I've seen in a while.
Click to expand...


People eat Domino's seven days a week but it doesn't make them gourmands.
 
OuterWorldVoice said:
If Unobtanium is so expensive and so rare, how come he has a small nation's worth floating on a desk ornament in his unsecured office?
Click to expand...
Expensive and rare on earth, not on Pandora.
 
Mario said:
Common ancestor with that ability?
Given it appears to provide positive survival abilities e.g. communication, information etc natural selection would favour the retention of it
.
Click to expand...
Yeah but
animals can interact with plants and trees too
... that aspect of it lost me.
 
Tobor said:
It's 200 years in the future, that wouldn't be the same type of material we use today. Not to mention the humans knew perfectly well what kind of arrows they were using. There's no way those ships would have been cleared for flight with that kind of weakness.
But like I said, nitpick.
Click to expand...

I think you might be underestimating the penetrative power of
arrows and overestimating how strong glass can be made. Bullets have pretty weak penetrative power, but the amount of kinetic energy in a flying arrow is massive, and the penetrative power of arrows is much higher because of the sharp tip. Especially when those arrows are twice the size of human arrows and drawn by much stronger people.

Yeah yeah, 200 years in the future, but if the humans could make an impenetrable seethrough material that's lightweight and thin I'd expect them to be using it for more things than cockpit windows. Fences, larger windows on the big gunship, etc.

Also note that when they were firing up at the gunships earlier in the movie: that's the worst possible scenario for arrows. At the height of their arc they'd have the least energy.
 
Combine said:
I honestly don't see why the AMP suits having a melee weapon like the knife is laughable. Shouldn't these suits have some sort of close combat weapon in case they lose their gun or it runs out of ammo?
.
Click to expand...
For me it was laughable because of how he pulled it out and the fact that it was a
FUCKING SURVIVAL KNIFE!!!
 
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