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[Slaythe]

I can't really explain it, but Kylo is pretty much exactly what I thought Lucas was trying to go for with Anakin as he was making his transition to Vader, but either the script held Hayden back or Hayden held Hayden back..or both. Just the angst and lack of stability is what Anakin was for the final half of Episode 3, but Kylo wasn't anywhere near as cringeworthy. It was nearly perfect and how I imagine someone conflicted with the light and the dark would act.

Well Kylo had his face hidden for half the movie.

His "TRAITOR" is literally a copy paste "LIAR" of Haydenakin.

Anakin's potrayal was controlled by Lucas, so whatever we got on screen was what he had in mind. You can see in the making of footage that Lucas talks to Hayden in every scene, telling him how to play it.

That doesn't make Hayden an outstanding actor.

But come on, nobody was surviving the sand line, not even adam driver.

It was like a combination of the worst, a serviceable actor coupled with the worst kind of writing.

That being said, a movie isn't about technicalities only, and while the dialog and acting can be wonky, the overall story and character (looks, mannerism..) was not bad, for me.

I never hated the prequels nor felt hate towards Christensen.

I am just surprised to see :

OT Anakin is extremely controlled. Occasionally his emotions slip through but for the most part there is a calmness.

Kylo Ren is a lot like that, except less controlled. He still has that youthful passion.

PT anakin is nothing like Vader. He is a loose cannon. He's whiney, he is all over the place and lacks any sort of discipline

This literally describes Kylo.
Manchild with anger bursts that can't make up his mind and can't control his powers.

Anakin was a kid that was thrown into the Jedi order quite late. He had to hide what he felt, but he showed that he felt plenty (movies and clone wars cartoons).

The reason he was "nothing" like Vader was because Vader himself was a shadow of his former self. He lost everything and everyone he loved, he lost his body, his humanity, his power, his ability to kill the emperor.

He never wanted to be that "Vader". We only got a brief glimpse of fully powered Vader, which was when he plots to overthrow the chancellor and rule over the galaxy. It came back when Luke appeared and Vader saw the opportunity in Luke to have the power to get rid of the emperor.

I know it's not canon "anymore" (despite nothing contradicting it), but maybe my point of view is due to having read some EU things where they really elaborated on Vader's hindsights, and it just made a lot of sense to me. Looking back on the movies I didn't mind the wonkyness at all.

I just hate to see "Kylo is a much better Anakin" when we have literally no backstory on what his motivations are, and he is just a doubtful, weak minded manchild that committed genocide and murder his own family, for no apparent reason but to be evil.

I said in another post, Vader lost everything, Kylo stil had : loved ones, family, his body, his humanity, power. And we know he turned 'as a boy'. So I can't really take him more seriously, to me he is a puppet, and what I want from the sequels is him growing up and opening his eyes about Snoke.

Not him being a Vader clone, because he just can't have a justified and compelling backstory to justify pure evil, given who he is and how old he is, without the inclusion of Snoke toying with his mind.

 

[majik13]

I know. I don't think the snow looks good enough, I don't think any CG or fake powder snow I've seen does. The first thing I thought in the opening shot of Game of Thrones was "fake snow!". Anyway I meant to compare it with Hoth in Empire (since I mentioned that movie in the previous sentence, but it realise it was a bit unclear).

sure. I guess you meant the snow on the ground? Yeah that is real(non digital) but fake snow. And yeah never looks good. Doesnt react right. The snow falling in the sky, is like 95% digital, and I think looks pretty convincing.

 

[bananafactory]

Did anyone else get the impression Han and Leia knew Snoke? Like maybe they had met him or were at the least very familiar with him?

Just seemed like it to me when they discussed how he influenced Kylo

 

[Ithil]

I'm not sure why they're doing a Han Solo film. Boba Fett, sure, on-screen there's plenty to explore.
But it's not like Harrison Ford was all that old in ANH, to have a younger actor Han would have to be like, 18 at the most, otherwise it just looks like you recast Han.

What's he going to do at that age that's worth a whole film?

 

[Symphonic]

sure. I guess you meant the snow on the ground? Yeah that is real(non digital) but fake snow. And yeah never looks good. Doesnt react right. The snow falling in the sky, is like 95% digital, and I think looks pretty convincing.

Love the sizzle when the flakes were hitting the lightsabers.

 

[TangoAlphaLima]

Man, I don't know why, but Han's death has made me even less interested in seeing a prequel film about him.

Huh. Didn't do that for me at all. I'm actually more interested in the standalone films, as they will be able to branch out and do whatever they want without being constrained by the continuing plot lines of the saga.

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

I didn't even consider this.

It's really underwhelming knowing he just went back to being just some smuggler after the falling out with Kylo.

He went back to being Han Solo? lol

 

[Ushojax]

Yep.

They're similar, but for me it could just be that Williams went for the same generic chanting without intending to connect Snoke with Plagueis. I have a very hard time seeing them using a character from the prequels like that, although I suppose the fact that he didn't actually appear means they have some room to play around. It's hard to deny the similarity between the two pieces of music though, maybe there is something in it.

 

[Inferno313]

I'm not sure why they're doing a Han Solo film. Boba Fett, sure, on-screen there's plenty to explore.
But it's not like Harrison Ford was all that old in ANH, to have a younger actor Han would have to be like, 18 at the most, otherwise it just looks like you recast Han.

What's he going to do at that age that's worth a whole film?

Ask Lawrence Kasdan, he's writing it. Between his involvement, and Lord/Miller, it should be great.

 

[VendettaRed07]

I'm fine with Solo dying but the character deserved a better way to go than that. He's to big of a character to just be a plot device to prop up the new bad guy. They could have at least played a sacrifice angle or.. something that capped the character off on a better note.

 

[watershed]

Did anyone else get the impression Han and Leia knew Snoke? Like maybe they had met him or were at the least very familiar with him?

Yeah, everyone knows Snoke. Like the bad guys know him and talk directly with him. Han and Leia know him and how he corrupted their son. Even Max Von Sydow seemed to know Snoke. He's not really a hidden bad guy. All the major characters have a history with him. I thought that was a good touch.

 

[Gunslinger]

As long as the fight is like episode vi, or vii and not a dance show like prequels.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

You know, they really did manage to nail what it is to make a Star Wars movie. There were a couple times I almost got choked up thinking "damn, they did it right! It's not like the prequels!"

Recycled plots or excessive fanservice aside, it just felt like what we should have had all along.

And the new characters were all great. BB-8 almost stole the show. Poe was great. I actually like that Ren has a bit of a dark sense of humor ("anything else?").

I dunno. Minor gripes aside, I think they nailed it. Even knowing Han was going to die, Chewie's scream when it happened, and putting his hand to Ren's face just nailed it for me.

 

[Einchy]

I'm not sure why they're doing a Han Solo film. Boba Fett, sure, on-screen there's plenty to explore.
But it's not like Harrison Ford was all that old in ANH, to have a younger actor Han would have to be like, 18 at the most, otherwise it just looks like you recast Han.

What's he going to do at that age that's worth a whole film?

I doubt the Han Solo movie will be about how Han Solo became Han Solo but rather one of his biggest adventures before he met Luke and Leia.

 

[Jacksinthe]

So when I saw the ending to ROTJ during the marathon event, when Palpatine gets thrown by Vader, the only thing that was going through my mind was "what if he learned how to cheat death?" Yesterday wasn't the first time I saw ROTS, but I always forget about the whole Darth Plagueis story and not once bothered to think of it past the two minute scene and whether or not it had any relevancy to anything in regards to the main films. But after talking about it, reading stuff itt, and finally listening to the Snoke track from TFA score and Palpatine's Teachings from the ROTS back to back, there's no denying that Snoke is in deed Plaguies.

And that to me is a bigger shocker than Han Solo dying. And now I really want to see Episode 8.

The scenes with Snoke mirror the scenes with Vader and the emperor. Snokes has a disfigured face, presumably when Sidious "killed" him, he isn't human and he is force sensitive.

The whole thing is setup like previous entries. Plagueis was the bad guy in every Star Wars film, to date, IMO. You just never knew he was behind everything. We know he knows how to cheat death. He let the Emperor do everything for him, keeping himself and his true identity safe. He's the driving force of the dark side.

At least that's my theory. Snoke is Plagueis. The dots are all there, whether or not the lines are drawn is now on new shoulders.

 

[Sojgat]

Man, I don't know why, but Han's death has made me even less interested in seeing a prequel film about him.

It would be impossible for anything to make me less interested in seeing a prequel film about Han Solo.

It's an amazingly bad idea, and I can only hope Disney has enough sense to cancel it.

 

[NotoriousPUG]

I knew someone who came out of the movie swearing that Rey is Luke's daughter. While I doubt that because Han and Leia would have known, does anyone else feel that way?

That is exactly what I got from the movie.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

General thoughts:
Not really shocking but I really didn't like it. I mean I enjoyed my time watching it but overall, it didn't do much for me. Said by many but it really is a retread of A New Hope, even to go as far as bringing attention when they're planning to destroy the Starkiller Base. No surprises. No different take. It's just the same thing. Besides that disappointment I found joy and delight in its characters. Well some of them. Hopefully they do something to interesting in the sequels.

General Stuff:
~ The coincidences in this movie are pretty crazy. I can take Finn and Poe crashing so close to Rey is and finding the falcon on jakku but Han taking them old friend who just happens to have Luke's light saber for reason. Come on.
~ That last scene was weird and unintentionally funny. Rey and Luke just staring at each other with Rey extending her hand. So weird. Should have end with the close up on Rey's face.
~ Another single weak point on the super weapon where it somehow blows up the entire planet. Really?
~ Han's death didn't do anything for me. Mostly because it was completely telegraphed and didn't any emotional because we don't know the relationship between these two characters fully. Instead of feeling emotional I thought "yeah fuck Han, continue being awesome Kylo"
~ All the action scenes were fine but nothing more. I wasn't invested in any of it. Some kinda boring.
~ I also found the light saber fight to be kinda short and dull. Besides Kylo beating his chest their was nothing special or exciting about it.
~ Some weird moments between Rey and Finn like asking if she has a boyfriend or when Finn was going to take off in Maz's castle. That conversation just felt weird for people who haven't even know each other for a day.

Questions:
1) Starkiller Base. What a strange inclusion. I know it's there to be the deathstar superweapon that all the heroes need to blow up but what was it purpose? Was it Snoke's ultimate weapon to destroy the republic? Why did they fire it at those planet? Why did the not expect The Resistance to attack?
2) What's the state of Republic? I think I heard something about Republic sending General Leia to lead a resistance in the First Order territory. Did anybody heard something similar?
3) Why did Luke go through all this map bullshit? If he didn't want to be found why leave a map? He had to know The First Order would kill to find his location, right? Was he waiting to Rey was ready? This whole movie is his fault for being the typical cryptic Jedi asshole.
4) Are they really not going to explain how Maz got Anakin's light saber? Also why didn't she tell Han she had it?


Characters:
~ Rey seems to be main protagonist of the trilogy, our "Luke" if you will but I found her absolutely bland. I never connected with her like I did with someone like Finn. I never found her funny or smart as other characters (and film) desperately wanted us to think.
She comes across as a Mary Sue, I guess. She expertly flies a ship, resists Kylo's Interrogation and able beat him in a duel for some unexplained reason. I didn't hate her or anything but she's got to get interesting in some way or this whole trilogy is a wash for me. Also she's totally Luke's daughter, don't know how that's up to debate.
~ Finn is probably the standout character for me. He's charming and hilarious. He would be the perfect main character if it wasn't for him being "goofy" but that's part of his charm. I don't think he will become a Jedi and I really hope he doesn't. He should be able to stand on his own without "superpowers"
~ Kylo Ren the most powerful force user we've seen? Stopping that laser midair was awesome!
Him and Finn are most excited to see grow in the future. Loved his anger, determination and the look. He is very zuko from the Avatar the last airbender.
~ Poe didn't have much screen time but he was cool (and gorgeous) nonetheless.
~ Han and Chewie did there thing and that's all I have to say on them.
~ Leia is in this movie.
~Captain Phasma is a absolute chump. I mean what a waste of a actress and cool look. Apparently she gets thrown in a trash compactor but we don't get to see that or how she escapes the planet. She could grow in the sequels but I don't know why anyone would want to.
~ Maz Kanata was looking to be cool character but then just ended up being a magic exposition...person. Disappointing.
~General Hux and Supreme Leader Snoke are evil bad people! How interesting!

Overall
As disappointing as I feared.

 

[Ushojax]

I'm fine with Solo dying but the character deserved a better way to go than that. He's to big of a character to just be a plot device to prop up the new bad guy. They could have at least played a sacrifice angle or.. something that capped the character off on a better note.

Wasn't it a sacrifice? He put his life on the line, knowing that if he was wrong about his son, that he would die. He tried to turn him back and failed. Not every sacrifice is successful.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

Whoever wrote all the names in this movie was having a seriously good day.

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

I don't know why they want to make a young Solo movie. Solo was pretty young in ANH. He was in his mid-late 20's. Are we getting teenage Solo? Who wants to see that.
I'd rather they make a kid Solo movie with Chewy and Solo going on adventures, for kids.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/12/17/daniel-craig-makes-cameo-star-wars-force-awakens

It might actually be him in the suit, but it sure as shit ain't him talking. Especially when the article specifically calls out "his clipped british accent" or whatever. That trooper doesn't have a British accent at all.

 

[Einchy]

Scientist Supreme didn't like the movie? Well, I'm shocked!

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

...

Some people will never be satisfied with new Star Wars Movies.

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

It might actually be him in the suit, but it sure as shit ain't him talking. Especially when the article specifically calls out "his clipped british accent" or whatever. That trooper doesn't have a British accent at all.

The way he dropped the blaster though. He had that Craig swagger, no doubt.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

Scientist Supreme didn't like the movie? Well, I'm shocked!

Some people will never be satisfied with new Star Wars Movies.

Really guys?

 

[Bobby Roberts]

The way he dropped the blaster though. He had that Craig swagger, no doubt.

I can buy that, definitely. Specifically that action.

 

[Tesseract]

if snoke is placeboius, prepare for some crazy resurrections

 

[Makoto]

He went back to being Han Solo? lol

In a way, yes and that's underwhelming but it would be like Luke giving up on the Jedi ways after failing to teach Kylo and going back to being an X-Wing pilot/moisture farmer.

Sure, that's what they were doing before they achieved hero status but Han Solo was pretty good at being a general (edit) and I was more curious at to what he was doing for the Republic and the Resistance since RotJ.

 

[Ether_Snake]

They should have had some internal rumblings about Starkiller, could have easily been worked into the movie in a minute.

Just have an argument between Ren and the commander dude, Ren wanting to delay the use Starkiller until he gets the map. Ren says he needs time to get the map and the commander tells him to quit dicking around trying to find Luke and that they're going ahead with their plans to use Starkiller now. Ren or Phasma could say their forces are still too small to defend a weapon so big and that unless they can quickly proceed to threaten another system they will be open for retaliation, basically revealing that the weapon is flawed. Heck you could even have other officers say the heat-holding-shield-thingie is still showing signs of instability in tests, but the commander saying they're going ahead anyway.

After it is used, at the resistance meeting, they could say they asked for help but none is coming as everyone is cowering in fear of Starkiller's power.

DONE. You've explained that Starkiller is actually not battle-ready, easy to take down, and why there isn't more people involved.

 

[Sojiroh]

Star Killer base....

Arrive.

Blow it up.

Leave.

I really really hated that. When they launched the weapon I thought 'holy ****, this is going to take 3 movies worth to bring down'.

Instead they plan a mission in 2 mins, instantly arrive at the planet and then it gets taken down by a bunch of random fighters, causing the entire planet to blow up.

They built it up to be Brock Lesnar and then took it down like it was Crash Holly and that really really sucked.

The first Death Star had a huge mission just to get the plans and was only taken down by a million to one shot by Luke Skywalker, the only guy in the rebellion that could possibly have pulled it off.

The second Death Star had a shield that required deactivating and needed almost the entire rebel fleet to launch an attack on it.

Star Killer base though went down like an absolute bitch.

Star Killer base had a shield too and it was built right in the planet, they had to do that crazy thing with the Falcon to get pass it.

 

[Sephzilla]

Really guys?

I know it's your opinion, but going off of your impressions post it really feels like you went into the movie trying to not like it. A lot of the complaints you have with this movie could honestly be applied to OT movies as well.

 

[Apharmd]

Thoughts on the film:

insert some good shit right here

man, some really great posts in this thread. thank you for your insight, legendsoflex

this is going to be very simplistic and some high school-tier analysis here, but i really liked that a theme concurrent with the major characters in the firm is not running away and taking the easy way out.

that's pretty much what leia and han did when ben turned to the dark side, finn was just absolutely convinced that there was no way to resist the first order and rey just literally and figuratively ran away from the lightsaber hilt

it's too bad that when han solo finally forced himself to stop and confront kylo, dude paid a steep price; that last affectionate gesture killed me

 

[TangoAlphaLima]

I'm fine with Solo dying but the character deserved a better way to go than that. He's to big of a character to just be a plot device to prop up the new bad guy. They could have at least played a sacrifice angle or.. something that capped the character off on a better note.

He was trying to rescue his son. I thought it was a pretty awesome way for him to go out.

 

[Fliesen]

ok, just came back from my 3rd time watching it:

a few things i noticed, regarding certain fan theories:

* "Rey is Han and Leia's second daughter / Kylo Ren's sister"

The only version of this would be if Leia didn't know until she actually met Rey after Starkiller base's destruction. There were people saying 'well, maybe Han Solo wasn't close to Jakoo by accident, maybe he was watching over her. Seeing as Han's first idea is to drop Finn and Rey off at the next best planet and seeing as, after being informed that a friend of theirs, Leia says to Finn: 'i know, Han told me about her. I'm sorry ...' (...but there's nothing we can do about it?).​

* Luke is standing at a grave / gravestone.

i think that's just another spiky rock of that spiky rock formation. So close to the cliff would be the worst place to bury someone, anyways ...​

Also: i love how Poe used the line "While there's still light, we have a chance" (talking about when the superweapon would be charged)

But this perfectly matched the Han Solo / Kylo Ren confrontation.
- Ren: "Will you help me?"
- Han: "Yes, anything"
Ren goes on to drop his helm, lower his sword and offer it to Han Solo, his hands open.
Han Solo grabs the sword.
The camera looks at Rey and Finn. They look outside. We see the sun going dark. There's no more light...
This is where Kylo Ren starts grabbing the sword, trying to point it towards Han Solo's chest.

Really liked the way that played out.


Also. yeah, that scene, when Rey grabs the sword for the first time consistently kills me, emotionally. That moment is literally when the force awakens. Also, the one where she's being pushed towards the ravine by Kylo Ren and she's "The force ..." and she follows Maz Kanata's advice from the trailer. "Just let it in".

He was trying to rescue his son. I thought it was a pretty awesome way for him to go out.

he sacrificed his life to offer his son a chance for redemption. I think that's a perfectly fine way to go.

 

[eot]

sure. I guess you meant the snow on the ground? Yeah that is real(non digital) but fake snow. And yeah never looks good. Doesnt react right. The snow falling in the sky, is like 95% digital, and I think looks pretty convincing.

Yeah, it's everything, how it reacts, how it gets on people, how if you're on an ice planet stuff is going to look frosty, but most importantly how it completely changes the lighting. The only reason I'm annoyed by it, well two reasons the first being that I notice it at all, but the main reason is that I think the setting could've made for a really striking scene visually and I don't think it was.

 

[Lan Dong Mik]

Holyfuuuuuck!! I loved this so much! I need to see it again stat! I pretty much loved the entire movie start to finish. That Kylo/Rey duel was so great. The only thing that I was annoyed by was that the my boys from the Raid just seemed wasted. It was cool to see them, but dammit use their skills JJ!!!

Also, am I blind or was this scene below not in the movie? My son said it was, but I don't remember seeing it:

 

[civilstrife]

So, something I couldn't figure out, are they building a romance between Rey and Finn? I feel like I'd prefer them not doing that

They are clearly building one between Finn and Poe.

 

[DeathyBoy]

I don't know why they want to make a young Solo movie. Solo was pretty young in ANH. He was in his mid-late 20's. Are we getting teenage Solo? Who wants to see that.
I'd rather they make a kid Solo movie with Chewy and Solo going on adventures, for kids.

I always got the impression Han was mid-late 30s, contrasing with Leia/Luke being so young. Like Han was the guy who'd seen some shit and was slowly entranced by Luke's naivity.

 

[Einchy]

Really guys?

Have you been reading your own posts lately? You've shit on the movie non stop before you even saw it. It's like you wanted to hate it and I'm not surprised that you thought it was a disappointment.

 

[SparksterMeta0]

It seems like the first act of a trilogy has someone die by a lightsaber, much like someone losing a hand in the second act (though that remains to be seen in the next movie).

Phantom Menace? Qui-gon Jinn by Darth Maul.
A New Hope? Obi-wan by Darth Vader.
This? Han Solo by his own son!

Speaking of the latter mention, I had a feeling that was going to happen when Kylo Ren said he was suffering and went "will you help me?", and I knew where that was headed. Still didn't expect Han to die at all in the movie, though. It was sad to watch.

As for Kylo himself, he's a pretty good villain. Hell, it was awesome when he stopped a laser shot midway in the beginning until he left.

However, I say "pretty good" because it was somewhat hard for me to take him seriously later on when he took his helmet off, which I didn't think they would do it that soon. Even harder when he threw a lightsaber temper tantrum twice. In fact, I, among others, laughed at that. The part during his first freakout with two random stormtroopers turning the other way drives the point home that this is another person you don't want to piss off.

Then again, he's still young and still learning the ways of the Dark Side. We'll see what happens in Episode VIII.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

I know it's your opinion, but going off of your impressions post it really feels like you went into the movie trying to not like it.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised by the reaction but that's truly not the case.

Have you been reading your own posts lately? You've shit on the movie non stop before you even saw it. It's like you wanted to hate it and I'm not surprised that you thought it was a disappointment.

I didn't do that at all. Critical of some aspects but that's it.

 

[Tookay]

Scientist Supreme didn't like the movie? Well, I'm shocked!

Some people will never be satisfied with new Star Wars Movies.

Do you guys really have to do this?

 

[Kuros]

Kylo isn't a Sith.

 

[Shuggananas]

fuck I want to rewatch the movie just for the sequence where the starkiller shoots and destroys all these planets, it was so gorgeous

 

[VendettaRed07]

Wasn't it a sacrifice? He put his life on the line, knowing that if he was wrong about his son, that he would die. He tried to turn him back and failed. Not every sacrifice is successful.

I suppose it is in a way...But Its just a downer way for him to go out like that regardless of what the specifics of the story in the movie were, considering the entire series. He was never going to succeed at turning him back, and they telegraphed that "he is literally walking to his death right now" way to hard before it happened. It just feels to me they did it more so as a way to make the new guy "the guy who killed Han Solo, we gotta get him" rather than give someone like him a decent way to go off.

 

[jett]

opening scene of SWVIII - Luke and Rey quietly have a moment of rest in his cottage...

"Rey, I have something very important to tell you."

just when you think he's about to reveal that he's her father...

"Midi-chlorians are a microscopic lifeform that reside within all living cells and communicates with the Force."

Actually, a Star Wars movie starting right where the previous one left off would be a first. I wonder if that's actually going to happen.

 

[Calcium]

Man, Chewbacca had it fucking rough in this movie. I seriously teared up when he got shot and then his reaction to losing his best friend. Poor Wookie.

 

[Messypandas]

Also, am I blind or was this scene below not in the movie? My son said it was, but I don't remember seeing it:

It wasn't.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

I really liked the fight between the (seriously hurt, right?) Ren and Finn/Rey. It all felt a bit clumsy here and there, which I like a lot more than the crazy ballet stuff. The sabers felt kind of dangerous in the OH&S (lol) way that they so clearly are, whereas in the prequels they might as well have been regular swords during combat.