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[Pineapple]

This is just like, abjectly not true. At the end of ANH, Luke is told to "use the force" by Obi-wan. Which means, what exactly? He had no idea, because he'd had no training. But he did it anyway to make a nigh impossible shot by (force aided) instinct. This is no different from Rey. I think our familiarity with the old films has made it hard to recognize that Luke is doing some crazy shit really fast.

Within one minute of having a helmet put on to blind him, Luke is blocking multiple shots with a lightsaber. Blind! I mean, holy shit.

It feels different. Feeling an ephemeral wave of the Force and blocking 2-3 taser shots from a practice droid, and making what was basically a sniper shot with no scope...just feels different that picking up a light saber and taking down someone who is clearly very skilled with the Force.

It would have been different had the film made it clear Kylo just wasn't that strong, but that's the opposite of what we saw - effortlessly suspending blaster shots in middair, sending people flying away or towards him, the mind torture - the film built him up as a talented Force user, and then, on top of that, revealed that he's actually a Skywalker.

People can talk about Kylo being injured with the blaster shot, but the reality is that his movement didn't seem to be impaired at all - he was moving around with grace, and was apparently well enough to throw in a few spin moves during the fight. And yet...after meditating, Rey literally beat his ass down, repeatedly.

It just didn't sit well with me.

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

Kind of random but I never really bought Vader's redemption in the OT specifically because he is complicit in planet-wide genocide in the first movie. I mean you can't really come back from that.

Well he is Space Jesus. He can do what he wants.

 

[OricWindstar]

So far I gotta say the stand-out quote is "That's not how the Force works."

But there are a lot of quotable lines in this thing.

That was my first thought to. Most of the lines I was repeating in conversation were comedic ones.

For serious ones, I really liked Kylo's exchange with Han on the bridge.

"Take off that mask."
"What do you think you'll see?"

I thought that was an appropriately Kylo-esque badass line. Like, he's still the kid trying to be Vader in his Halloween costume, but he managed to get a cool line in anyway.

Lol. I missed this.

That is fucking hilarious. I love Hamill.

 

[andythinkpad]

I give this movie 7 out of 10, basically slightly better than Jurassic World.

What I like, the new Death Star, new Darth Vadar mask design, the new robot. The rest of the stuff are too "manufacture" to me.

What turns me off about the girl character is that she is both wise cracking pilot and jedi. She can't be both archetypes! I like Fin's character, but the actor is not very expressive IMO.

I can't take Vader's grandson seriously. Its fucking adam driver, without the hipsterstache! As soon as he took off the helmet all I could think off was his face.

Also, I find it really funny that Rei's clothing goes from ancient Wuxia period dress to modern hiking clothing in the end even though they keep the dame overall shape.

 

[AniHawk]

Does BB-8 giving the thumbs up count? I know it's not dialogue, but that got a pop from my audience that was as big as the opening crawl got.

everyone loves it, but i think it's going to be hard to reference outside the movie since a thumbs up was already a thumbs up, and there's no accompanying noise or sound that's unique to the scene.

 

[Opto]

I really don't want Rey to be related to Luke at all. Her not being related to him means that Force sensitive people are starting to come back to the galaxy

 

[CrichtonKicks]

Yoda said Luke was too old in ESB

He wasn't serious...

 

[RomanticHeroX]

It's not about not believing her. It's about having an adequately satisfying narrative. The "how" part is what's important here. Like, if somebody suddenly displayed skills with a snowboard on her first trip to a snowy region, you'd ask how, yes? And if she answered "I'm a snowboarder," that doesn't really explain anything, yes?

If my friend, who I know has never been on a snowboard, and with whom I've had conversations about not being able to snowboard, was suddenly able to snowboard well then yeah, I'd probably ask. If someone I don't know came up to me and told me they knew how to snowboard, then snowboarded, I wouldn't immediately need to ask her where she learned how.

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

again, I think she mentions it after they win the desert battle and her and Fin are congratulating each other by talking over each other

That's good, then!

I guess that's just preference, then. She's says she's a pilot, he backstory doesn't have anything that directly contradicts that, so I don't need more explanation. And, she struggles with it at first, so you see her learn instead of being told about it.

Yea, preference. I don't actually have a huge problem with it, mind. I just think it is a perfectly reasonable curiousity, and one that if answered would enhance the narration, however slight.

 

[Brakke]

The set up for Rey being a pilot is identical to that of Luke Skywalker being a pilot: a single throwaway line.

Isn't it curious that we take Luke's ability at face value but are so skeptical with Rey's?

This comparison is tired. Rey and Luke are not that similar with regard to piloting. Luke doesn't get on a joystick until like ninety minutes into the movie. He's an established protagonist and we care about him. Rey gets into a cockpit super quick. By the time Luke gets into a cockpit he's already had several space adventures.

Luke's piloting comes in against a very different dramatic backdrop than Rey's. Rey's piloting ability didn't really bother me but it's definitely possible to not grok it for reasons other than diet sexism. Rey's piloting competency is rushed in a way Luke's isn't.

 

[Cranster]

I just got back from seeing it. So good but so many questions, I was kind of expecting Hans heroic sacrifice as Harrison Ford wanted him to killed off in RoTJ. It still had me in a bit of a shock though and it was handled well. I'm going to miss Han Solo and his banter with Chewbacca in future films though.

There is alot for me to absorb now but I'm looking forward to seeing it again.

 

[OricWindstar]

Yea, preference. I don't actually have a huge problem with it, mind. I just think it is a perfectly reasonable curiousity, and one that if answered would enhance the narration, however slight.

And, to your point, I wouldn't have hated if she had some line about it.

 

[Toxi]

Luke managed to shoot into the hole was the result of = the force (make believable from the fact that he's a Jedi's bloodline) + Han Solo helps + his claim for pilot training

Rey managed to pilot Milennium Falcon, use the Force and defeat a noob Sith because = she lived alone with stick....

LOL what is this shit

So when Rey clearly shows great ability in the Force with stuff like her visions, that doesn't count because we still don't know who her daddy is.

 

[Pineapple]

I really don't want Rey to be related to Luke at all. Her not being related to him means that Force sensitive people are starting to come back to the galaxy

That has happened regardless of whether or not Rey is related to Luke - Luke was training a new generation of Jedi.

 

[bill0527]

Yoda said Luke was too old in ESB

And Luke did some amazing force shit before he got to Yoda.

Which proves the point..you don't need to undergo any type of serious training to use the force, according to the rules set in the OT. You just have to be open to it.

 

[Dion Blaster]

I was a little disappointed the Finn and Kylo fight was cut short, that had a lot of intensity.

 

[Kitschkraft]

So far I gotta say the stand-out quote is "That's not how the Force works."

But there are a lot of quotable lines in this thing.

That was a really perfect line, perfect place, made sense in universe while also winking at the audience in a way.

And it buried Finn yet again nooooo.

JJ got me though. Even though I followed spoilers, I wasn't expecting the movie to feel the way it did.

I'm wondering how Ep.8 feels. I felt like the "joy" he talked about was good for TFA, but I'd probably appreciate more tension in the next one.

In other words, an "ESB" of this trilogy.

 

[Sobriquet]

Yoda said Luke was too old in ESB

And Luke did alright I guess.

 

[NumberThree]

I don't know if it's intentional or not, but the first post in the salary thread is real good.

Lol. I missed this.

That's great.

 

[Instro]

Saw it today, had a blast. I actually would see it again in theaters, which is not something I normally do. I think Finn and Poe are my favorite characters in the movie, but the entire cast was enjoyable all around. I do agree with the comment on Rey being a bit of a Mary Sue, but I think that's relatively similar to Luke, particularly in A New Hope, which this movies riffs on heavily. It's going to be interesting to see how closely they stick to the original trilogy as far as story beats, or if we will see a different direction for the next two.

To some degree sticking close to A New Hope makes a lot of sense to recreate the magic of the original movies, bringing back lost fans and getting new young ones on board, although for a lot of people the movie will be fairly predictable. I didn't mind that so much though, even if that goes on for the rest of the the trilogy.

One thing I would have liked to have seen handled a bit differently was the reveal of Kylo Ren being Han's son. Like I think the scene with Han coming up behind him on the bridge and yelling his name would have been amazing l if we had been kept in the dark about his true identity up until that point.

Anyway

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Yoda said Luke was too old in ESB

Yoda was looking for excuses not to train Luke.

 

[kaiju]

I really don't want Rey to be related to Luke at all. Her not being related to him means that Force sensitive people are starting to come back to the galaxy

Based on what Maz said to Rey: "The family you are waiting for are not coming back. But there is one who will". Immediately Rey says, "Luke". And then Luke's strange reaction to Rey, I am leaning on Team Kenobi.

 

[Cranster]

And Luke did some amazing force shit before he got to Yoda.

Which proves the point..you don't need to undergo any type of serious training to use the force, according to the rules set in the OT. You just have to be open to it.

That and aware of it. I'd imagine most of those strong with the Force wouldn't even be aware of it had nobody mentioned it to them.

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

It feels different. Feeling an ephemeral wave of the force and blocking 2-3 taser shots from a practice droid, and making what was basically a sniper shot with no scope...just feels different that picking up a light saber and taking down someone who is clearly very skilled with the Force.

It would have been different had the film made it clear Kylo just wasn't that strong, but that's the opposite of what we saw - effortlessly suspending blaster shots in middair, sending people flying away or towards him, the mind torture - the film built him up as a talented Force user, and then, on top of that, revealed that he's actually a Skywalker.

People can talk about Kylo being injured with the blaster shot, but the reality is that his movement didn't seem to be impaired at all - he was moving around with grace, and was apparently well enough to throw in a few spin moves during the fight. And yet...after meditating, Rey literally beat his ass down, repeatedly.

It just didn't sit well with me.

Rey wasn't fighting with her A game
Not until she meditated. She was already an accomplished fighter, but that combined with the mental strength to tap into the force and do away with her fear allowed her to best the weak willed Kylo.

Spinning your sword looks great, but its not practical. Rey is basically practical real world street fighting to Ren's traditional form, and when you throw the force into the mix, It's established that Rey was stronger then Kylo Ren, because she was able to stop him from getting the map.

She was at her strongest with the force when she abandoned all fear. And having no fear during the final fight allowed her to fight like she did in the beginning.

 

[CrichtonKicks]

Yoda was looking for excuses not to train Luke.

I don't even think it was that- he just wanted proof that Luke was serious about the training and ready.

 

[MikeDown]

the movie needed to spend more time with Rey on Jakku. Also it needed more context cause I have no idea who the First Order, Republic & the Resistance are.

 

[BravesCountry]

And Luke did alright I guess.

Well the emperor would have merced him in the end if it wasn't for that meddling Vader.

 

[Blargonaut]

bleh

Anyway, there's my opinion on the whole non-issue, it's a really minor nitpick in the end, I know, so I'll just leave it at IMO statement-level.

What I'd like to push for visibility is my 'Phasma = Snoke' fanfic, once more before I revert back to lurking:

fuck

The more I think about it, the more it makes eventual sense:

• Captain Phasma = Snoke
  
• Finn = First Order double agent
  
• Finn infiltrates the Resistance, gains Rey's trust
  
• The Phasma-Finn encounter in Starkiller Base was all a ruse, set up to build up Finn's credibility to the Resistance by allowing Han and Chewie to witness Finn "helping out" by "forcing" Phasma/Snoke to lower the shields
  
• Phasma let the shields down on purpose and allowed Starkiller Base to be destroyed, because she already got what she wanted out of it (the destruction of the New Republic planets), and basically sacrificed Starkiller Base to lure the Resistance into a false sense of security in victory while the First Order and the Knights of Ren continue their work in secret
  
• Phasma uses the Snoke 'Space Voldemort' hologram as an avatar and uses a voice modulator with it, effectively hiding her identity as the First Order's Supreme Leader
  
• Double agent Finn secretly keeps Phasma/Snoke updated on Rey's Jedi training progress with Luke, while Phasma, after revealing herself to Kylo Ren as 'Snoke', finishes up his Dark Side training
  
• Phasma/Snoke uses Rey's eventual discovery of Finn's betrayal to push Rey over into the Dark Side; Rey becomes the new Dark apprentice, and Kylo Ren, now pushed to the wayside by everyone, returns to the Light after a bit of soul-searching, and kills Phasma/Snoke in the process
  
• The final climactic encounter is a reformed Kylo Ren trying to save Dark Rey from the temptation of the Dark Side as he is trying to repent for killing his father Han

 

[Schryver]

Lol. I missed this.

holy shit lol

 

[Toxi]

What turns me off about the girl character is that she is both wise cracking pilot and jedi. She can't be both archetypes!

Luke Skywalker was a wise-cracking pilot and a Jedi in training like Rey.

Anakin Skywalker was the best wise-cracking pilot in the galaxy and a fully-trained Jedi.

 

[FUBAR McDangles]

One thing I really liked in this film was how they handled lighting in most of the scenes involving Kylo Ren.

First scene with Snoke: the only light source in the scene is behind Snoke. So the entire time he is there and talking to Kylo (I.e. influencing him), he is blocking the light from hitting Ren. But then when the conversation is done and Snoke's hologram is gone, the light flashes and hits Kylo.

Then, in the pivotal scene with Han. Room is in darkness. Han calls out Ben. He turns. Rey and Finn come in through the door above and the sunlight flashes down on Ben and Han.

Then, when Han and Ben are talking, every time it would show the close up of Kylo, there were two emergency lights behind him. Over one shoulder was a red light. Over the other was blue. Demon and Angels speaking in his ears?

As the conversation wore on, the camera would shift ever so slightly or the lights would intensify or dull to make one brighter than the other. Near the end of the conversation, after Ben says there is something that Han must help him with, the blue light is nearly gone.

Then the sunlight goes down and all the white light disappears making the entire room covered in darkness again. When they do a close up of Kylo at that point, all the blue light is gone and the red emergency lights are the only lights on the room.

Obviously signifies him finally turning away 100% from the light. But it was really cool how they handled the ambient lighting to show it.

 

[kurahador]

LOL what is this shit

So when Rey clearly shows great ability in the Force with stuff like her visions, that doesn't count because we still don't know who her daddy is.

Uhh....yes? If this film is trying to do the show don't tell approach, the assumption we can make from her journey is she's a Skywalker.

Unfortunately...you guys didn't want that for some reason with one guy even wanting midichlorians to come back into play.

 

[CrichtonKicks]

the movie needed to spend more time with Rey on Jakku. Also it needed more context cause I have no idea who the First Order, Republic & the Resistance are.

Why? You get about the same as Luke on Tatooine in ANH.

Honestly if they had cut the Rathkar(sp?) fight then the running time would have been right in line with ANH and Empire which would have been perfect.

 

[eyeball_kid]

I'm going to miss Han Solo and his banter with Chewbacca in future films though.

Aren't we all? I've seen it twice and seeing Han killed – especially like that – was tough both times. I never cared that much about Luke as a kid; for me, Star Wars was an adventure starring Han & Chewie.

 

[duckroll]

This comparison is tired. Rey and Luke are not that similar with regard to piloting. Luke doesn't get on a joystick until like ninety minutes into the movie. He's an established protagonist and we care about him. Rey gets into a cockpit super quick. By the time Luke gets into a cockpit he's already had several space adventures.

Luke's piloting comes in against a very different dramatic backdrop than Rey's. Rey's piloting ability didn't really bother me but it's definitely possible to not grok it for reasons other than diet sexism. Rey's piloting competency is rushed in a way Luke's isn't.

Is this really true though? I mean Luke is a farmer who has lived his entire life in relative comfort under the support of two loving foster parents. Is it really more believable that someone like that would be a super ace pilot after just following Han Solo around for a few days? I don't think skill rubs off that way!

On the other hand, Rey is portrayed as a survivor in a hostile environment since young, able to fend for herself, knows a lot about ship electronics, hangs out in a junkyard cum refueling/repair hub all day, and is a huge rebel alliance fangirl. Her ability to ace stuff in the Falcon is overdone for sure, but it's overdone in the same way everything in Star Wars tends to be overdone. Anakin's "natural talent" as a little kid in TPM was far more hilarious.

 

[NeOak]

Saw it today.

Still trying to process that scene.

I know I'll be pissed all week long.

 

[crisdecuba]

Dipping into the thread to ask a question. The way I've made sense of the Kyle / Rey fight is that he isn't actually trying to kill her and instead is either:

Trying to follow through on the direction from snoke to bring her to him, or

Wanting to give her the chance to join them (an ultimatum he likely has given to other Jedi in the past). Isn't that was sith do? (Try to gather young talent underneath them?)

To me either of those explain how the fight played out. He doesn't care about Finn and takes him out of the fight, but does t want to kill Rey, which gives her an opening to win.

Thoughts?

 

[Brakke]

One thing I would have liked to have seen handled a bit differently was the reveal of Kylo Ren being Han's son. Like I think the scene with Han coming up behind him on the bridge and yelling his name would have been amazing l if we had been kept in the dark about his true identity up until that point.

Yeah what this movie really needed was a dude on a bridge telling "I am your father". Finally something to tie it back to an iconic moment from the Original Trilogy!

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

the movie needed to spend more time with Rey on Jakku. Also it needed more context cause I have no idea who the First Order, Republic & the Resistance are.

The peaceful REPUBLIC is what formed after the evil EMPIRE. The FIRST ORDER is the last remnants of the EMPIRE. The RESISTANCE is what was formed to stop the FIRST ORDER.

It's all their in the beginning with the yellow text.

 

[ghst]

Boyega seems like a great actor, and good to have a positive role model in such a big film. Weird thing though: dude is English and has an English accent, but they made him use an American accent for the film?

he's ironed it out but he's still naturally got a bit of an MLE sarf london twang. can't be having that in a disney film.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

This is exactly what I'm hoping against.

But once again, I don't understand the coma ending unless this is what they want to do. So...ugh.

They had to do something to him in that situation or else Ren looks ridiculous because he didn't try to kill the traitor Stormtrooper who started this whole mess. Since killing him was off limits the closest thing to death was a coma.

Since he's not a Jedi he's going to spend Ep 8 with Poe.

 

[CrichtonKicks]

Anakin's "natural talent" as a little kid in TPM was far more hilarious.

"Let's try spinning! That's a good trick!"

 

[NumberThree]

One thing I would have liked to have seen handled a bit differently was the reveal of Kylo Ren being Han's son. Like I think the scene with Han coming up behind him on the bridge and yelling his name would have been amazing l if we had been kept in the dark about his true identity up until that point.

I think that would've been too far in the "I am your father" territory. Maybe they could've saved it to when Han & Leia meet (and Han says he saw their son) instead of dropping it in the Snoke scene.

 

[Dalek]

This guy can probably beat Kylo Ren in a melee fight.

I loved that stormtroopers weren't just incompetent fodder in this movie. This was a great touch.

But the best stormtroopers are the ones that turned around when Kylo was having his temper tantrum.

 

[NimbusD]

I'm sure Luke felt Han dying.

So sad that they'll never get a reuniting scene

 

[lastplayed]

So sad that they'll never get a reuniting scene

Neither will Han and Lando.

 

[FlashbladeGAF]

Aren't we all? I've seen it twice and seeing Han killed – especially like that – was tough both times. I never cared that much about Luke as a kid; for me, Star Wars was an adventure starring Han & Chewie.

Luke is my favorite and Han's death felt the same each time.

Something was in both eyes that hurt vey very badly.

 

[tokilamockingbrd]

Signs Rey is gifted/attuned (and possible trained) with the force before she actually uses it opening against Kylo Ren.

1. Not selling BB-8. The force guided here there. She did not know BB-8's importance but she went with what she felt to be right. The way she pauses showed me something else was going on there.
2. Piloting the Falcon. She seemed to be able to antipate things before they happened. Particularly the way she set up the 2nd tie kill.
3. Closing the door at the right time on the Ralthar to save Finn. She did not use the force to close the door, but the force guided her timing (much like Luke in ANH using a torpedo to blow up death star 1).
4. Her reaction to the Saber. The force was directly speaking to her.


There could be more, but those are 4 instances I felt were foreshadowing of what happened in act 3.

 

[Toxi]

Uhh....yes? If this film is trying to do the show don't tell approach, the assumption we can make from her journey is she's a Skywalker.

Unfortunately...you guys didn't want that for some reason with one guy even wanting midichlorians to come back into play.

No, the assumption that can be made is that she's strong in the Force, like plenty of Star Wars characters who aren't Skywalkers.

Could she be a Skywalker? Sure, but from the information we have, that's hardly a certainty in the same way "she's strong in the Force" is.

 

[ant_]

One thing I really liked in this film was how they handled lighting in most of the scenes involving Kylo Ren.

First scene with Snoke: the only light source in the scene is behind Snoke. So the entire time he is there and talking to Kylo (I.e. influencing him), he is blocking the light from hitting Ren. But then when the conversation is done and Snoke's hologram is gone, the light flashes and hits Kylo.

Then, in the pivotal scene with Han. Room is in darkness. Han calls out Ben. He turns. Rey and Finn come in through the door above and the sunlight flashes down on Ben and Han.

Then, when Han and Ben are talking, every time it would show the close up of Kylo, there were two emergency lights behind him. Over one shoulder was a red light. Over the other was blue. Demon and Angels speaking in his ears?

As the conversation wore on, the camera would shift ever so slightly or the lights would intensify or dull to make one brighter than the other. Near the end of the conversation, after Ben says there is something that Han must help him with, the blue light is nearly gone.

Then the sunlight goes down and all the white light disappears making the entire room covered in darkness again. When they do a close up of Kylo at that point, all the blue light is gone and the red emergency lights are the only lights on the room.

Obviously signifies him finally turning away 100% from the light. But it was really cool how they handled the ambient lighting to show it.

Yes. All the lighting with Ren was amazing.

When he was interrogating Rey as well, she was completely invoked in light while his face was engulged in darkness. The contrast was jarring and it was incredibly well done. At this point there was a sliver of light on his face, too.