[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #2) - One Thumb Up
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Omegasquash
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The whole kid -> adult thing is something I could write an essay on when it comes to Star Wars. It's deeply personal, that scene in particular.
Where do you slot Obi-Wan vs Anakin ROTS?
So, saw it yesterday and really liked it.
I like how the entire driving force behind the plot was to find Luke. It made him out to be legendary status not just within universe, but in reality. Luke Skywalker is on Batman level of icon after a plot like this. Before, he was the hero of the movie, but I feel like this pushed his character beyond that.
I was OK with the first order having its own death star, but it felt tossed in. This was a movie about family and lineage, not about a rebellion. The audience didn't cheer when the death star blew up for the third time, but they did get goosebumps when Rey met Luke and Han Solo's life flashed before their eyes when Kylo killed him.
I think it's really interesting that SL Snoke could possibly be Darth Plagueis. The avenues they could run down with an enemy so tied into Palpatine are fantastic. Maybe Plagueis was the true mastermind, and was controlling Palpatine. Maybe there will be a bombshell in Ep 8 that reveals something about the Plagueis/Palpatine relationship that completely shifts our perspective on Palpatine. Maybe we'll end up with a pre-prequel trilogy with Plagueis/Palpatine some day because of this (or new EU stuff?)
I like how the entire driving force behind the plot was to find Luke. It made him out to be legendary status not just within universe, but in reality. Luke Skywalker is on Batman level of icon after a plot like this. Before, he was the hero of the movie, but I feel like this pushed his character beyond that.
I was OK with the first order having its own death star, but it felt tossed in. This was a movie about family and lineage, not about a rebellion. The audience didn't cheer when the death star blew up for the third time, but they did get goosebumps when Rey met Luke and Han Solo's life flashed before their eyes when Kylo killed him.
I think it's really interesting that SL Snoke could possibly be Darth Plagueis. The avenues they could run down with an enemy so tied into Palpatine are fantastic. Maybe Plagueis was the true mastermind, and was controlling Palpatine. Maybe there will be a bombshell in Ep 8 that reveals something about the Plagueis/Palpatine relationship that completely shifts our perspective on Palpatine. Maybe we'll end up with a pre-prequel trilogy with Plagueis/Palpatine some day because of this (or new EU stuff?)
I remember the visual dictionaries went into decent depth on them.
SabinFigaro
Member
Probably mentioned already, but the moment that Kylo Ren and Rey are fighting for control of the lightsaber, and the music plays from ANH when Luke discovers his slain aunt and uncle...
...chills, just chills.
I recognized it immediately. Music is truly powerful in the way it can evoke emotional memory.
...chills, just chills.
I recognized it immediately. Music is truly powerful in the way it can evoke emotional memory.
JeTmAn81
Member
I thought the same thing about the mind trick scene though I guess it makes more sense when you think about her remembering the legends about the Jedi and the Force and deciding to try it.
The part before this when the lightsaber is stuck in the snow seemed like a direct homage to a similar scene towards the beginning of ESB when Luke is hanging in the ice in the wampa's cave. I want to go back at some point and compare the shots.
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
Man, to be in a theater in 1980 with audiences experiencing the one-two punch of Luke losing a hand and the "Sup, Son?" reveal. How cool would that be?
Hey, never say never. I could totally see a final duel with the characters from this movie hitting those highs or even higher depending on how good their development is through the second movie.
It might not mean quite as much to us as audience members since we're older now, but I think it could be outstanding indeed.
Liquidsnake
Banned
Such an awesome thing too.. Of course now Snoke wants to complete his training.
SinShep
Member
Assuming that the ones in Episode VIII will have more speed to them with Ren and (assuming) Rey's completed training by then, it'll be the perfect mix between the OT and PT duels.
BattleMonkey
Member
Yea Kylo is shown to be so powerful, grabbing people from across the room, flinging them, detecting and stopping blaster bolts in mid air, yet has a tough fight taking on Finn who got owned by a stormtrooper? I mean yea they kept making a fuss about him being injured but that blaster shot musta really nerfed Kylo hardcore.
WadiumArcadium
Member
Well it's Star Wars so yep.
I disagree, but the reason I don't feel there's much tension in the Maul fight is more a fault of the movie being a prequel. You kind of go into the fight knowing either Qui-Gon or Maul are probably not walking out of it because neither of them are even mentioned in the OT, and that Obi-Wan is completely safe since he's an OT character and it's the first movie.
#5. Edited my original post because i forgot that fight
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
I'll bring the pics here!
Star Wars Black Series - 1/12 scale
Star Wars Elite Series (Disney Store exclusive) - 8ish inches
SH Figuarts - 1/12 scale
Hot Toys - 1/6 scale
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Yeah it will be hard to top. Watching it again last week it was just as powerful as the first time I ever saw it.
On a side point ROTJ is fricken awesome.
Monocle
Member
Maybe I need to refresh my memory, but the drama of Luke's struggle with Vader stood out to me more than the actual saber clashing. The overall progression of the final battle and Vader's use of the force to ruin Luke's day with pieces of flying junk is top tier though. Easily one of the highlights of the whole series.
LegendofLex
Member
You say this, but based on ANH there was no way in hell that Vader was Luke's father.
"We had to keep your identity a secret...from a certain point of view."
tbh I think Rey is pretty good evidence that the entire notion that Force users need someone to "train" them is a load of BS and the crux of the problem throughout the entire saga. Luke manages to win in Ep VI precisely by ignoring his teachers; Vader winds up ignoring his supposed dedication to the Emperor as well, and was originally tempted to the dark side in the first place by the belief that he needed Palpatine to teach him how to save his wife.
The master-less Jedi have shown themselves to be the superior Jedi thus far.
Given what that bowcaster did to other stormtroopers hit with it, he was probably using the force to make sure all his insides stayed on the inside throughout the whole thing.
No, I think he's right, it won't be topped. The drama, tension and relationship between Vader and Luke, and the role reversal at the end of the fight, I don't think it's possible for the new trilogy to achieve that.
Yeah, nothing will ever top ROTJ's final battle. The music, choreography, and camera work are all on point. Luke temporarily going dark side and wrecking Vader was awesome. Vader's face turn at the end to save Luke is one of the few things in movies that will actually get a tear in my eye.
Also, yeah, ROTJ is glorious. I don't understand at all why that movie gets as much shade thrown at it as it does.
thecouncil
Banned
This shit right here.
Versus this:
something even i could do vs. something i definitely couldn't do.
or, a couple of dudes swinging baseball bats vs. people using the force.
Did you see what Chewie's blaster was doing to regular mooks throughout the whole film?
Leia's Force powers have always manifested themselves to be strongest in basically super long range detection. She's got some powerful force Wi-Fi, she saved Luke's life by being able to locate him at the end of ESB, and she felt Han's death as it happened. Obi-Wan was also very empathetic in this way, he felt Alderaan. Luke didn't feel shit, he's kind of a jack of all trades.
This shit right here.
Versus this:
I love both.
This shit right here.
Versus this:
I prefer the second one. Even though the first one is the best of the originals have to offer, they look so fucking awkward. Yes, the emotions behind the first are better, I guess.
I'm not that into Star Wars, so I'm just going to see it as an action movie. And if the action isn't good enough, I won't waste my money.
We'll have to wait and see honestly. It will be tough but I gotta see how 9 plays out and what relationships are built.
KoruptData
Member
My man!
SuperAndroid17
Member
Anyone else think that Rey was using a little power from the dark side in the final duel? She seemed really angry.
JaseMath
Member
I feel like TFA is a lot more forward thinking that ANH. Remember that Star Wars, at that point, was a disaster in the making. Nerds like us weren't debating the finer points of the story yet.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
The issue with the PT fights is that there's very very little physicality to it.
Like, the cinematics from The Old Republic work even though it's full of stupid dancing because there's intent, there's heft.
Like, the cinematics from The Old Republic work even though it's full of stupid dancing because there's intent, there's heft.
Yeah, exactly what are we expecting in terms of lightsabre fights in VIII & IX ?
I'm expecting Rey to be more disciplined like Luke in RoTJ. Not sure what to expect from Ren. And Luke is just gonna Luke...
No more so then Luke vs Vader in the RoTJ.
The movie explicitly showed you a couple of times how powerful the bowcaster is. I'm sure getting shot in the stomach with one probably fucking hurt.
astroturfing
Member
i guess i enjoyed the movie but ehh.. i still just don't like Abrams' style. way too much action and boring chases, and predictable plot turns. it all just feels like style over substance.. BUT that might be just me, as i can't stand most stuff by Abrams (Trek was REALLY bad, Lost a huge waste of time, Super 8 was silly, etc). the movie definitely had some great moments/scenes (Rey scavenging for example), but i had already seen most of them in trailers so the whole movie didn't leave a huge impact on me, sadly. i wish hadn't watched any trailers.
my biggest gripe has to be the god-awful CGI characters Maz and Snoke though, during the close ups i almost wanted to yell "NO!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING" to the big screen.. awful choice showing them like that, the way their faces were animated took me right out of the movie, they didn't have a believable presence at all. i'm pretty sure there were better CGI characters a decade ago.. so wtf? also the monsters on Han's freighter looked shitty, not convincing at all. i don't mind CGI if it's actually tastefully done and the animations are believable, but here it's just not the case. i was kind of shocked tbh, i was under the impression that nowadays they can make CGI look almost real. here it looked amateurish even.
oh and what's with some of the really heavy handed shit like that "hey look we're SPACE NAZIS" rally with the First Order dude giving a speech to the stormtroopers.. holy shit was that cringey or what, the stormtroopers even did a sieg heil (basically)..! good god. one of the most cringeworthy scenes i've seen recently. embarrassing.
oh well, i have a feeling the next one is going to be much, much better. will definitely go see it. the one thing they did well with this movie is giving a nice foundation to the following movies, i'll admit that. i definitely want to see how Luke fits in to all of this and what happens with Kylo and Snoke (goddamn what awful names for villains lol).
my biggest gripe has to be the god-awful CGI characters Maz and Snoke though, during the close ups i almost wanted to yell "NO!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING" to the big screen.. awful choice showing them like that, the way their faces were animated took me right out of the movie, they didn't have a believable presence at all. i'm pretty sure there were better CGI characters a decade ago.. so wtf? also the monsters on Han's freighter looked shitty, not convincing at all. i don't mind CGI if it's actually tastefully done and the animations are believable, but here it's just not the case. i was kind of shocked tbh, i was under the impression that nowadays they can make CGI look almost real. here it looked amateurish even.
oh and what's with some of the really heavy handed shit like that "hey look we're SPACE NAZIS" rally with the First Order dude giving a speech to the stormtroopers.. holy shit was that cringey or what, the stormtroopers even did a sieg heil (basically)..! good god. one of the most cringeworthy scenes i've seen recently. embarrassing.
oh well, i have a feeling the next one is going to be much, much better. will definitely go see it. the one thing they did well with this movie is giving a nice foundation to the following movies, i'll admit that. i definitely want to see how Luke fits in to all of this and what happens with Kylo and Snoke (goddamn what awful names for villains lol).
Everything seems like the pinnacle of what's possible until it isn't anymore.
I'm not saying that this trilogy will ever deliver something so good. I'm just saying that it seems a bit rash to call it completely impossible.
Thanks. I think my personal list matches yours fight-for-fight.
Yeah, it's great. It's like they remembered that film is a visual medium and you can convey information about the characters just through tiny details like that.
Action is meaningless if there are no stakes or internal character struggle behind it. If you aren't invested in the characters, who gives a shit?
Ewoks.
Or the movie deliberately focusing on how he is bleeding and hitting the wound as he fights.
Ether_Snake
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The line from the trailer "there was an awakening in the force, both the light and the dark" which was cut from the movie, my guess is the light is Finn, the dark is Rey. Maz seems very interested in pushing Finn to use the sabre, and try to make him stop from running away from his fate. My guess is Maz will keel pushing Finn in that direction, knowing Rey is probably at risk of falling to the dark side.
Like in the OT, Yoda and Obi had two options, and they would have two once again.
Nah, plus Leia would be her aunt but there was very little connection at all.
Like in the OT, Yoda and Obi had two options, and they would have two once again.
Nah, plus Leia would be her aunt but there was very little connection at all.
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