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[justsomeguy]

I wonder why people bring up statements made by Microsoft in 2013 about the infinite power of the cloud.

Surely this is just teh bias anti MS agenda running wild, it can't be the denial by Tivor Tontomo that such statements were ever made.

Your post prompted me to look a few pages further back, you're right it's not all so bad - I think the couple of times I've dipped onto this I've just hit "bad" pages.

Fwiw I don't think there's an agenda. There are just a lot more pro sony people here than pro-xbox, and similarly more anti-microsoft than anti-sony. That's fine, it's just a reflection of the wider world and hence the volume of posts tends to be larger on the sony "side" (unless statham is online &#128522. No agenda.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

You want an example where MS said the cloud would improve lighting?

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...s-more-processing-power-from-cloud-computing/

This...Actually helps my argument.

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

Ms should be extremely happy if the Xbox One is selling better than the ps3 in the same time frame. after the colossus mess up that Microsoft did with the launch of the Xbox One.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

Dude, I don't know man. You said the messaging was perfectly clear and then nib95 posted like 4 examples and then there was the Turn 10 and none of that is in any way clear.

I also don't know if I'm supposed to categorize you as some Chess grandmaster or a flailing non-swimmer in a swimming pool with the statement "graphic performance like lighting, shading, and fps or actual hard graphics."

I acknowledged that it wasnt clear a few posts ago, not sure what you read.

 

[David Ricardo]

No it wouldnt the U.S. was the blulk of where the confusion and the backlash was from. Even now there are guys thinking there are 24 hour check ins, and the Xbox cant play used games. The highly viewed ps4 used game counter video is primarily American. Almost everything they backtracked on got them hurt.

Imagine if they didnt do that, then maybe you would have a case given they still sold over 3 million units by the end of the year just coming out of that train wreck.

I am only talking about power. What I'm saying is, if there was no performance gap and MS did everything the same (including the backtracking, 2014 price drop, etc) Microsoft would be ahead in the US now.

Even being underpowered, XBO is only around 10% behind in sales in the US (I'm guessing here, I tried to google the exact number but couldn't find it). Imagine if COD Ghosts had been 1080p, Tomb Raider DE 60 frames, Ryse 1080p, Killer instinct 1080p, Battlefield 4 900p, Titanfall 900p or more, COD AW 1080p, MGSV 1080p, etc...

Is it crazy to think that would have made XBO sales 10% higher in the U.S.? I don't think so. And also PS4 would have lost some sales.

This is anecdotal as it gets, but I have two friends that were long time Xbox gamers. They had og Xboxes and both bought X360 at launch and spent the whole last generation using it. When I told them the news that this time PS4 had the performance advantage, they didn't believe me. They both bought XBOs at launch. After a couple of months they saw COD 720p, and Tomb Raider DE 30fps and they both sold their XBOs and bought PS4s. They told me "you were right, this time PS4 is the one to go with".

As I said, I know it's really anecdotal evidence and it proves nothing in the big picture, but I think there are a lot of people like my 2 friends. They bought Xbox consoles because they were the best, and now that PS4 performs better, they changed sides inmediately.

I think there are enough people like that to grant that, if the performance gap didn't exist, the added XBO sales and the lost PS4 sales would make the XBO the sales leader in the US in that hypothetical situation.

 

[etta]

What the balls is hard graphics

 

[benny_a]

I acknowledged that it wasnt clear a few posts ago, not sure what you read.

I certainly don't know what I've read. But you're right, everyone knows the difference between actual hard graphics and lighting and shading.

I'm just old school and was confused. I'm going to stay with my working man's graphics.

 

[Get_craycray]

Ms should be extremely happy if the Xbox One is selling better than the ps3 in the same time frame. after the colossus mess up that Microsoft did with the launch of the Xbox One.

I think you mean Xbox 360 rather than PS3, because there's not much pride to take from the fact that a console sells better than PS3 in its early years. PS3 had a messy launch (expensive, came out a year after its concurrent, etc) and sales clearly reflect on this.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

What the balls is hard graphics

Colors, DD, AA, Res, etc.

I mean a different term but my English limitations had me fumbling for a word to use.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

I think you mean Xbox 360 rather than PS3, because there's not much pride to take from the fact that a console sells better than PS3 in its early years. PS3 had a messy launch (expensive, came out a year after its concurrent, etc) and sales clearly reflect on this.

Well at this point the ps3 was selling faster than the 36o wasnt it

 

[Ehker]

This...Actually helps my argument.

I don't see how improved lighting isn't graphics which goes against you saying they never said graphics.

 

[onQ123]

How much has ps eye sold

Not sure but I'm not talking about the sales I'm talking about the usage.

If you go to Live from PlayStation you see whole families doing live shows from Playroom & you see people on Twitch/Ustream/Youtube using the camera to do video overlays on their streams. Then there is PlayStation VR coming up that's also going to use the camera.

 

[...Scatter...]

What the balls is hard graphics

It's when I see graphics so good I get hard. Obviously.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

hmm, I should never use the word hard with any other adjective in the future lol.

 

[nib95]

On a side note, as much as I do think Microsoft has had very mixed messaging on this Cloud compute stuff, and basically used it as a phantom means to try to reduce the power gap in marketing speak, I'm actually really glad they're dabbling in it.

Whether it works out or not, at least we'll get a first hand example of it. The way I look at it is that Microsoft is expending it's own budget in R&D and servers, for the simple purpose of propping up some physics or whatever else in a game (or games), essentially to finally to deliver on this yet to be realised promise. In that sense, them spending extra money and time to improve a game, at no additional cost to me, in whatever experimentative or unorthodox way they deem necessary, sounds like a good deal to me.

 

[Hoje0308]

I'm not up on my terminology it seems, so I'm wondering if we've figured out whether or not lighting and/or smoke effects meet the hard graphics standard? Or are the goalposts still playing a game of musical chairs?

One example of that might be lighting," he continued. "Let’s say you’re looking at a forest scene and you need to calculate the light coming through the trees, or you’re going through a battlefield and have very dense volumetric fog that’s hugging the terrain. Those things often involve some complicated up-front calculations when you enter that world, but they don’t necessarily have to be updated every frame. Those are perfect candidates for the console to offload that to the cloud—the cloud can do the heavy lifting, because you’ve got the ability to throw multiple devices at the problem in the cloud. - Matt Booty, General Manager of Redmond Game Studios and Platforms

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...s-more-processing-power-from-cloud-computing/

Edit: And I'm a page late.

No one moved any goalposts. some forum users here need to understand not everyones out to kill you.

I separated performance based graphics with the other kind of graphics, and since I didnt have a term for the other, I used Hard.

I feel like you are trying to kill us, but instead of a knife or a gun, you've chosen arbitrary definitions to state your counterpoint to what is pretty much a cut and dry issue. So please, explain to me how your redefining of common terms is not equivalent to the moving of goalposts.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

I'm not up on my terminology it seems, so I'm wondering if we've figured out whether or not lighting and/or smoke effects ualify as hard graphics? Or are the goalposts still playing a game of musical chairs?



http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...s-more-processing-power-from-cloud-computing/

No one moved any goalposts. some forum users here need to understand not everyones out to kill you.

I separated performance based graphics with the other kind of graphics, and since I didnt have a term for the other, I used Hard.

 

[etta]

Maybe Tivor is trying to differentiate between rendered things that are calculated by the CPU and rendered things that don't require calculations, such as textures, objects and geometry?

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

Maybe Tivor is trying to differentiate between rendered things that are calculated by the CPU and rendered things that don't require calculations, such as textures and objects?

That just about correct. Thanks.

 

[Hoje0308]

Maybe Tivor is trying to differentiate between rendered things that are calculated by the CPU and rendered things that don't require calculations, such as textures and objects?

The difference between latency dependent calculations and those that aren't as time sensitive has already been discussed. It's irrelevant though, as MS tried to make it very clear that the power of the cloud was going to deliver the pretties from a server farm somewhere into your home.

 

[etta]

The difference between latency dependent calculations and those that aren't as time sensitive has already been discussed. It's irrelevant though, as MS tried to make it very clear that the power of the cloud was going to deliver the pretties from a server farm somewhere into your home.

But calculation results are easier to push through than weighty assets?

 

[Hoje0308]

But calculation results are easier to push through than weighty assets?

Depends on how quickly you need the results, as anything the cloud is being used for would be reliant on your personal connection to communicate with MS' servers. This is a moot point, however, as lighting and effects = graphics, and no amount of obfuscation will change that.

 

[nib95]

Maybe Tivor is trying to differentiate between rendered things that are calculated by the CPU and rendered things that don't require calculations, such as textures, objects and geometry?

I don't want to come off as rude, but I think he's mostly just talking nonsense tbh. It went from him insisting they had a clear message, to being shown otherwise. To then saying they never meant graphics, but also being proven otherwise. Then it went to 'when they talk about lighting they actually mean performance', and now finally it's turned in to something completely different altogether. One inaccurate or ill conceived point after another.

But we are sort of veering off topic, and I think he's sort of already pseudo admitted he was wrong, so there's no point contuining this train of conversation.

 

[Tivor Tontomo]

I don't want to come off as rude, but I think he's mostly just talking nonsense tbh. It went from him insisting they had a clear message, to being shown otherwise. To then saying they never meant graphics, but also being proven otherwise. Then it went to 'when they talk about lighting they actually mean performance', and now finally it's turned in to something completely different altogether. One inaccurate or ill conceived point after another.

Or you can not be a jerk read where i said I acknowledged it wasnt clear, and not make up fluff from your mind I never said out of thin air and CONFUSING YOURSELF by not noticing two completely different conversations.

 

[nib95]

Or you can not be a jerk read where i said I acknowledged it wasnt clear, and not make up fluff from your mind I never said out of thin air and CONFUSING YOURSELF by not noticing two completely different conversations.

Ok dude. Sure thing. I think you even spun Bish in to confusion and bewilderment on the previous page, since he quoted some choice posts of yours. But I've got no dog in this fight, it's pointless.

 

[Chobel]

Ms should be extremely happy if the Xbox One is selling better than the ps3 in the same time frame. after the colossus mess up that Microsoft did with the launch of the Xbox One.

It's not.

 

[Hoje0308]

This thread made me tired already. Goodnight, GAF.

Ok dude. Sure thing. I think you even spun Bish in to confusion and bewilderment on the previous page, since he quoted some choice posts of yours. But I've got no dog in this fight, it's pointless.

 

[tattooed_dwarf]

Interpreting those estimates the way you have takes a very, very special mindset. For someone to warp maintaining a losing ratio into 'not losing ground' is just... I just don't have words for it.

It's not that hard to understand. If PS4 keeps selling 20 milloin a year and Xbone 10, RATIO keeps the same. So it basically means you aren't losing ground even though other guys are selling much better. And ratio to get smaller in favor of Xbone, doesn't mean that it has to sell more than PS4. Gap of sold numbers keeps growing of course in my example. But you knew all this of course already.

This isn't so simple of course, ratios might change in different countries without affecting whole ratio. But only thing MS can do is try to keep that sales ratio the same or try to reduce it.

And I have to add I'm surprised how much they still are trying in smaller markets too. For example in Finland they had special steelbox version of NHL with finnish players, from big retailers you got national team's jersey with purchase of xbone and they were main sponsor of youth ice hockey World Cup, which was huge thing in Finland. And they do many other things too, Sony doesn't even have to be so aggressive here, they have so good sales. It's shame we never get numbers to see how much these things help though.

 

[Boombloxer]

Olympic-level mental gymnastics in these last few pages.

Being on the wrong end of a 2:1 sales ratio is impressive to maintain.

"hard graphics" and cloud power

If everything was equal, they'd be ahead here

Good laughs all around.

 

[Rembrandt]

On a side note, as much as I do think Microsoft has had very mixed messaging on this Cloud compute stuff, and basically used it as a phantom means to try to reduce the power gap in marketing speak, I'm actually really glad they're dabbling in it.

Whether it works out or not, at least we'll get a first hand example of it. The way I look at it is that Microsoft is expending it's own budget in R&D and servers, for the simple purpose of propping up some physics or whatever else in a game (or games), essentially to finally to deliver on this yet to be realised promise. In that sense, them spending extra money and time to improve a game, at no additional cost to me, in whatever experimentative or unorthodox way they deem necessary, sounds like a good deal to me.

Maybe idk what "phantom means" means but it doesn't seem like one if you can acknowledge we're getting a first hand example. There's a product/service that does essentially lessen the power gap by allowing a console to do something it wouldn't be able to do without it.

 

[gtj1092]

Ms should be extremely happy if the Xbox One is selling better than the ps3 in the same time frame. after the colossus mess up that Microsoft did with the launch of the Xbox One.

I think you mean Xbox 360 rather than PS3, because there's not much pride to take from the fact that a console sells better than PS3 in its early years. PS3 had a messy launch (expensive, came out a year after its concurrent, etc) and sales clearly reflect on this.

It's not.

These string of post clearly point out why MS official PR about out pacing 360 are not as amazing as it seems. Everyone talks about the ps3s poor start but don't even realize it sold faster than the 360. And that ps3 is ahead of X1s pace. Guarantee the overlap between those saying the sales are good and those who claim ps3 started off poorly is very significant and very U.S. focused.

 

[boredandlazy]

It's not that hard to understand. If PS4 keeps selling 20 milloin a year and Xbone 10, RATIO keeps the same. So it basically means you aren't losing ground even though other guys are selling much better. And ratio to get smaller in favor of Xbone, doesn't mean that it has to sell more than PS4. Gap of sold numbers keeps growing of course in my example. But you knew all this of course already.

I perfectly understood what he was saying. I just didn't agree with the sentiment that staying at a 2:1 sales ratio was something you'd really classify as keeping ground with the competition.

 

[onQ123]

Maybe idk what "phantom means" means but it doesn't seem like one if you can acknowledge we're getting a first hand example. There's a product/service that does essentially lessen the power gap by allowing a console to do something it wouldn't be able to do without it.

The problem with that is that PS4 can also use the cloud so it's not closing the power gap.

 

[Dyson Industries]

Anyway, I'm back outta this thread, which seems to just be rehashing the same tired old anti-xbox anti-ms arguments that we've seen so many times already.

Sorry mate, but don't you work for Microsoft?

 

[huntingzibod]

Has anyone estimated how many have sold in 2015 based on this number?

If 18 million sales to consumers now - not too shabby.

But what is the growth since this time last year?

Estimates of 12-13 million were being thrown around Neogaf, based on MS posting '10 million iminently shipped' at the start of november 2014., but it turned out that they mos tlikely were referring to orders and possible channel stuffing right up until the end of the year.

So either MS sold ~8 million during 2015, or it sold 5 million.

At the start of 2014, MS announced sales of 2.1 million -

http://wccftech.com/microsoft-sold-two-million-xbox-one/

So 10m - 2.1 = 7.9m

So did MS really only grow Xbox 1 sales by .1m in 2015, despite Halo being launched?

The other thing to consider is, how well did the Xbox One sell outside of the holiday season.

We know the sales for October, november, and are december are yet to be revealed.

In the US at least, sales during those first two months are about 1.5m, and december is likely to be around another million at the least. So around 2.5 million in the last quarter for the US alone.

It's a lot harder outside the US to estimate sales, but we do know the Bone sold at most half of 300k

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1149321

I think it's easily safe to asume another million to 1.5 million sold worldwide during those last three months of 2015, bringing it to around 4m

That leaves 4 million sold during the rest of 2015 - or around .440k a month woldwide.

Elsewhere, at the same time, Sony announced 18.5 million sold at the end of 2014s buying season:

http://67.227.255.239/forum/showthread.php?t=965548

Now we know it's 35.9m

So they sold in the order of 17.4m in 12 months, almost doubling the user base.

During 2014, the started at 3.1 million, and rose to 18.5m

18.5 - 3.1 = 15.4

So in 2015 they grew their sales.

If the trend continues for both, then the Xbox One will probably be around 26m by jan 2017, and the PS4 around 54m.


Having said that, sales of the 360 according to here

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Xbox_360

only reached 17.3 m after just over 3.5 years on the market.

So either MS are doing a really good job of selling the Xbone, or a dreadful job of converting 360 owners to Xbone....

Take your pick.

 

[wapplew]

Having said that, sales of the 360 according to here

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Xbox_360

only reached 17.3 m after just over 3.5 years on the market.

So either MS are doing a really good job of selling the Xbone, or a dreadful job of converting 360 owners to Xbone....

Take your pick.

Wait, 360 only sold 17.3m first 3.5 years? MS could rock that out pace 360 PR for another year if true.

 

[SHAFT MASTER]

What the balls is hard graphics

Just search for it on the Googles. Make sure you have safe search off first.

 

[leeh]

Just search for it on the Googles. Make sure you have safe search off first.

Username relevant.

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

I think you mean Xbox 360 rather than PS3, because there's not much pride to take from the fact that a console sells better than PS3 in its early years. PS3 had a messy launch (expensive, came out a year after its concurrent, etc) and sales clearly reflect on this.

l was just implying the notion that Sony screwed the pooch less than Ms and had an even worse fall from grace with the ps3. Ms really screwed up with the Xbox one but managed to turn the ship quiet fast to be honest. There is no way MS pulls it back to be the dominant console, this gen, but the next Xbox could do really well again.

I think they are both doing well, with the ps4 doing unreal numbers.

Good job on Ms tho, its a good console and I enjoy it a lot. The exclusives really speak to me, as do sonys. Good generation so far. ps4 for multiplats and Xbox for exclusives for me. ( bar bloodborne) an exact opposite of last gen. Goes to show the strength in having the best performing third party games

 

[Raist]

Odd skepticism in this board.

Back several months the Xbox One was estimated to be around 15 million sold. Lets look at what comprised those numbers.

The U.S. was around 9 million and the UK was over 1 million. over Ten million were those two countries alone. You had Germany, France, and Spain, which made that around 12 million or so

That left 3 million for ROTW LTD since 2k13 launch and the tier two launch for the others.

Now, of course everyones right in assuming those countries barely grown, but the problem is that everyones acting like Xbox One is selling zero in these territories.

Lets take the 3 million for those other territories and put it to the side.

Currently, right now, the U.S., and some in this thread agree, that including december the Xbox One will reach over 11 million in the U.S., but lets just use a flat number at 11.

The Xbox one is over 2 million in the UK, likely over 2.5 if we include December.

Thats 13.5 million units. The 3 million for those other countries would make it 16.5 million. But of course, we know the Xbox one did not sell zero. Even if only five hundred thousand sold, that would still make it 17 million.

This is not even including the LTD sales for Germany, France, and Spain, which would easily put it around twenty mill. Especially including this December.

But of course, we have the ones who think the other countries are like 1.5 million.

IT still works, because you have 13.5 million units UK and U.S. alone, and that using a flat 11 million. You at 1.5, thats 15 million.Germany, France, and Spain would fall on 18 million even still, especially if we include an expected meh December.

None of this is including the sales source this year began either. But the thing is we know ROTW is over 1.5 LTD.

so the concern for these numbers doesnt make sense to me.

So depending on how you look at it, the Xbox one is 18 to 2o million sold with around 2o to 22 million units shipped.

I think you managed to not have a single number right.

Wait, 360 only sold 17.3m first 3.5 years? MS could rock that out pace 360 PR for another year if true.

There are mistakes in that table. I mean 1.2M for the Oct-Dec 2007 quarter? wtf.
Anyway, the 360 was at 17.7M shipped in December 2007.

 

[ethomaz]

We talking about X1 load times now....?

Back on point. I think that MS is positioning themselves for a long game. This does not discount the well-documented missteps concerning the X1. MS needs to be aggressive and keep working for mindshare, perhaps creating a base for global awareness expansion. That is unless they think that UK/US is suffice.

Sorry but there is nothing MS is doing for long term than Sony... to be fair I believe Sony is in a better position for long term than MS.

 

[Chris1]

Sorry but there is nothing MS is doing for long term than Sony... to be fair I believe Sony is in a better position for long term than MS.

What does what Sony's doing have anything to do with what he just said?

I think it's pretty hard to argue MS is trying to set themselves up for the long term (as in, next gen and the future). In the past MS was just sort of taking 1 day at a time, now it feels like their eyes are set on the future instead of the now (which makes sense, given their position this gen).

All the new IP's aren't an attempt to claw back this gen and somehow win, they're an attempt to set up franchises for next gen IMO.

 

[slavesnyder]

What does what Sony's doing have anything to do with what he just said?

I think it's pretty hard to argue MS is trying to set themselves up for the long term (as in, next gen and the future). In the past MS was just sort of taking 1 day at a time, now it feels like their eyes are set on the future instead of the now (which makes sense, given their position this gen)

All we know for sure is that they have big plans for Windows (of course they have).
About Xbox? We don't even know if there will be a next gen box. All we have is a lukewarm "I guess so,... Highly likely." by The devision's head Spencer. This was far from a confirmation.
If there will be a next gen, console development should be in full Force already. And it would not have been a huge secret reveal to just say: Of course, definitely.

 

[ethomaz]

Odd skepticism in this board.

Back several months the Xbox One was estimated to be around 15 million sold. Lets look at what comprised those numbers.

The U.S. was around 9 million and the UK was over 1 million. over Ten million were those two countries alone. You had Germany, France, and Spain, which made that around 12 million or so

That left 3 million for ROTW LTD since 2k13 launch and the tier two launch for the others.

Now, of course everyones right in assuming those countries barely grown, but the problem is that everyones acting like Xbox One is selling zero in these territories.

Lets take the 3 million for those other territories and put it to the side.

Currently, right now, the U.S., and some in this thread agree, that including december the Xbox One will reach over 11 million in the U.S., but lets just use a flat number at 11.

The Xbox one is over 2 million in the UK, likely over 2.5 if we include December.

Thats 13.5 million units. The 3 million for those other countries would make it 16.5 million. But of course, we know the Xbox one did not sell zero. Even if only five hundred thousand sold, that would still make it 17 million.

This is not even including the LTD sales for Germany, France, and Spain, which would easily put it around twenty mill. Especially including this December.

But of course, we have the ones who think the other countries are like 1.5 million.

IT still works, because you have 13.5 million units UK and U.S. alone, and that using a flat 11 million. You at 1.5, thats 15 million.Germany, France, and Spain would fall on 18 million even still, especially if we include an expected meh December.

None of this is including the sales source this year began either. But the thing is we know ROTW is over 1.5 LTD.

so the concern for these numbers doesnt make sense to me.

So depending on how you look at it, the Xbox one is 18 to 2o million sold with around 2o to 22 million units shipped.

I have a hard time believing in UK over 2.5m for Bone.

PS4 didn't reach 3m yet and the gap is over 500k.

What does what Sony's doing have anything to do with what he just said?

I think it's pretty hard to argue MS is trying to set themselves up for the long term (as in, next gen and the future). In the past MS was just sort of taking 1 day at a time, now it feels like their eyes are set on the future instead of the now (which makes sense, given their position this gen).

All the new IP's aren't an attempt to claw back this gen and somehow win, they're an attempt to set up franchises for next gen IMO.

I don't see anything MS is doing like a long term strategy... to be fair they are still trying to catch what Sony did right at launch and post launch.

They have a lot of work to be done before start to thing in long term goals.

And what new IPs? What I see are third-party new IPs set to go to multiplatform.

MS didn't show any new IP this gem unless I'm missing any small game announced by them.

 

[gamz]

All we know for sure is that they have big plans for Windows (of course they have).
About Xbox? We don't even know if there will be a next gen box. All we have is a lukewarm "I guess so,... Highly likely." by The devision's head Spencer. This was far from a confirmation.
If there will be a next gen, console development should be in full Force already. And it would not have been a huge secret reveal to just say: Of course, definitely.

Of course their going to be a next gen Xbox. My guess probably with the Surface team. Xbox is still an important IP to MS.

 

[Raist]

Have you tried accounting for PS4's 36 million, just as an experiment.

USA - 10.8 (through Nov 15)
UK - 2 (5th May 15)
France - 1.1 (through 2014)
Germany - 1.6 (through march 15)
Japan - 2.3 (through 2015)
Spain - 0.7 (17th June 15)
Middle-east - 1 (4th Sept 15)
South Africa - 0.04 (20th Oct 14)
Greece - 0.04 (26th July 15)
Portugal - 0.1 (Through April 15)
Italy - 0.21 (through June 14)
Poland - 0.1M (5th Sept 14)
Australia - 0.2 (6th Nov 14)

Total ~20.2M.

So there's 15.7M missing.
The most significant are December for the US, 2015 for France and most of 2015 for Germany, the UK, and to a lower extent Spain, Italy and Canada. Plus a bit over 100 countries for which we have no data whatsoever.
In any case, we do have their official shipment numbers.

 

[SpinningBirdKick]

Which ever way you cut it a 2:1 sales ratio in favour of your main competitor is a terrible performance.

There's seems to be a much stronger case for it getting worse rather than improving too.

 

[KurtSloane]

Which ever way you cut it a 2:1 sales ratio in favour of your main competitor is a terrible performance.

There's seems to be a much stronger case for it getting worse rather than improving too.

Basically this, although X1 sales are not appallingly bad, those numbers compared to their competition are awful.

 

[Kyougar]

About Xbox? We don't even know if there will be a next gen box. All we have is a lukewarm "I guess so,... Highly likely." by The devision's head Spencer. This was far from a confirmation.
If there will be a next gen, console development should be in full Force already. And it would not have been a huge secret reveal to just say: Of course, definitely.

I mean, the head of the division doesnt have a definitive "YES THERE WILL BE A NEW XBOX AFTER XBOX ONE!" answer when asked about nextgen.
Thats like asking Apple if they will bring out a new iPhone and they say "...likely?"

 

[gamz]

I mean, the head of the division doesnt have a definitive "YES THERE WILL BE A NEW XBOX AFTER XBOX ONE!" answer when asked about nextgen.
Thats like asking Apple if they will bring out a new iPhone and they say "...likely?"

Yes! A company rarely talks about a next generation when they are in the current generation.