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[Nightbird]

Well, I'm off now, my final thoughts on this for today:

It's a bummer that the feature has been cut, but it's not that tragic since there's still a bunch of optional stuff I can do in the game if I wanna take a break from the fighting. And because of this I am not going to be angry in any kind about this removal. I am also not calling this censorship because using this word makes the whole issue look more dramatic than it is

This discussion up until now also showed me that the Fire Emblem Fanbase is toxic. Not Metroid levels of bad, but it's getting there. I just hope it'll get better someday, even though I should give up on that.

I still plan to buy the game though, in fact it's the only reason why I am going to buy a 2DS even though the NX is on the Horizon.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I mean I don't particularly care, but shouldn't this issue be addressed by Nintendo/the developers before it even gets here? If they need to censore and change shit like this from their games to begin with in a market as general as the west, why not address this to begin with.

Are we still getting the lines of dialogue that came from this minigame?

 

[jnWake]

No, this mode had super lewd dialogues. It's not "entirely on the user".

I actually meant Pokémon Amie by that. I have no idea what's included in this mode, but I doubt every interaction is lewd. Some interactions are probably funny, which is what interested me a bit.

 

[Orniletter]

Yes and yes. Example of lines, example of rubbing.

Oh no, what a loss for the western Fire Emblem fanbase.

Seriously, I have to admit the "living 2D art" ,or what it's been called before, looks really nice...but if most of the dialogue follows a similar patter, then nothing of value was lost.

To it' credit, it doesn't look as bad as Danganronpa: Another Episode's touching minigame. That made that turd of a game even worse.

 

[JordanN]

Dat outrage

Spoiler

900 comments

 

[Vincent Grayson]

I mean I don't particularly care, but shouldn't this issue be addressed by Nintendo/the developers before it even gets here? If they need to censore and change shit like this from their games to begin with in a market as general as the west, why not address this to begin with.

It sounds like that's what they're doing. Or do you mean, why not mention it earlier?

I'm honestly surprised they even mention this stuff at all, given the reception these announcements get. It'd be better to just publish it as they want to publish it, and if people raise a stink about it later, then address it.

 

[CSX]

Guess now my waifu won't be apologizing repeatedly for having a small chest in English then.

Also for u crazies now cancelling your SE pre order, give us a PSA so we can get one

 

[ponpo]

Yes and yes. Example of lines.

Unreasonably levels of lewd at around ~0:50.

NoA pls.

 

[TheBryanJZX90]

I mean I don't particularly care, but shouldn't this issue be addressed by Nintendo/the developers before it even gets here? If they need to censore and change shit like this from their games to begin with in a market as general as the west, why not address this to begin with.

It would be great if a general "western" distaste for this kind of content led to less of it being produced in Japan, and perhaps an expansion of the Japanese market to be more inclusive and less otaku-ish. Japan needs that.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Yes and yes. Example of lines, example of rubbing.

Lmao.

I love this kind of WTF-ery. Goddammit NoA, lighten the fuck up.

 

[Corpekata]

Guess now my waifu won't be apologizing repeatedly for having a small chest in English then.

Also for u crazies now cancelling your SE pre order, give us a PSA so we can get one

I feel bad I can't tell if your example is real or not.

 

[jonjonaug]

Well... that was about to get X-Rated real fast.

The dude ones are mostly lewder than the lady ones. Like people in this thread keep posting about "oh noooo little girls" but the ones with younger women are a lot more tame. Even characters you'd think would have lewd ones like Camilla and not-Tharja, the dude ones make those look tame.

 

[rpmurphy]

Welp, time to cancel my preorder and buy the JP version. May get the English version if I like it enough.

 

[Jintor]

I'm torn (

Spoiler

not really

)

on one hand, I assume there was some kind of dialogue you unlocked from the minigame that was cool and character building or whatever

on the other hand you got it by treating a virtual human like virtual cattle, so that was pretty weird

 

[Crash Station]

I hope Nintendo actually addresses this at some point before the game's release. Whatever their decision, it would be nice to have information. Like are things going to be rebalanced? Maybe there will still be a way to view the 3D models without actually petting? What about the missing dialogue, character development and items exclusive to the mode?

Unrelated, I wonder if they'd consider putting it in as DLC. If it was paid, they'd make a killing on people upset over it on principle and would buy it to "stick it to the SJWs".

 

[Eila]

NoA trying so hard to push me away from Nintendo.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

It sounds like that's what they're doing. Or do you mean, why not mention it earlier?

I'm honestly surprised they even mention this stuff at all, given the reception these announcements get. It'd be better to just publish it as they want to publish it, and if people raise a stink about it later, then address it.

It would be great if a general "western" distaste for this kind of content led to less of it being produced in Japan, and perhaps an expansion of the Japanese market to be more inclusive and less otaku-ish. Japan needs that.

I mean that if they know their game is going to localized more than likely, why not simply not include this stuff to begin with instead of the game having to be changed/censored to such degrees during localization
It's already happened in Bravely Default (1 and 2 apparently), Fire Emblem Awakening , and now this apparently. If it's a game targetting E or T, they should know better and just not include this. Seems like more work for unnecessary fan service to include it and then have to censore it.

 

[Tingle]

I hope Nintendo actually addresses this at some point before the game's release. Whatever their decision, it would be nice to have information. Like are things going to be rebalanced? Maybe there will still be a way to view the 3D models without actually petting? What about the missing dialogue, character development and items exclusive to the mode?

Unrelated, I wonder if they'd consider putting it in as DLC. If it was paid, they'd make a killing on people upset over it on principle and would buy it to "stick it to the SJWs".

I feel like charging for stripped content is pretty... unlikely. We do know this content was on the original release, I can't imagine a spin they could use to charge for it without looking really bad.

 

[Nanashrew]

It would be great if a general "western" distaste for this kind of content led to less of it being produced in Japan, and perhaps an expansion of the Japanese market to be more inclusive and less otaku-ish. Japan needs that.

That's what Pokemon became, and instead of becoming this phenomen that would fade, they found importance in the global market so that Pokemon wouldn't fade away and with it there have been changes to be more inclusive to the west. Even that Detective Pikachu art has a more western feel like Dreamworks or something.

 

[Nerokis]

The dude ones are mostly lewder than the lady ones. Like people in this thread keep posting about "oh noooo little girls" but the ones with younger women are a lot more tame.

Does the gender of the main character have a big influence here? I mean, is there some restriction on same-sex rubbing, is it explicitly/exclusively romantic, is there less blushing when it's platonic, etc.?

This could have been an opportunity to defy stereotypical gender roles!

 

[Corpekata]

I feel like charging for stripped content is pretty... unlikely. We do know this content was on the original release, I can't imagine a spin they could use to charge for it without looking really bad.

Just attach it to a tacky amiibo.

 

[RM8]

Lol at "this game should be lewd because Mortal Kombat has gore".

 

[Risette]

Does the gender of the main character have a big influence here? I mean, is there some restriction on same-sex rubbing, is it explicitly/exclusively romantic, is there less blushing when it's platonic, etc.?

This could have been an opportunity to defy stereotypical gender stereotypes!

Nope: https://twitter.com/RyougaSaotome/status/692062061111689217 https://twitter.com/RyougaSaotome/status/692062186341011457

 

[jonjonaug]

Does the gender of the main character have a big influence here? I mean, is there some restriction on same-sex rubbing, is it explicitly/exclusively romantic, is there less blushing when it's platonic, etc.?

This could have been an opportunity to defy stereotypical gender stereotypes!

I believe most of the lines in the videos I'm linking you can only get if you've S ranked (basically married) the character in question. I think you can get the first few lines (the non-romantic ones) no matter what though, gender and support rank don't matter.

I could also be wrong, I haven't played the game myself. Just looked at a bunch of videos and read second-hand impressions.

 

[PixyJunket]

on the other hand you got it by treating a virtual human like virtual cattle, so that was pretty weird

As opposed to the rest of the game where you murder virtual humans?

 

[Vincent Grayson]

I mean that if they know their game is going to localized more than likely, why not simply not include this stuff to begin with instead of the game having to be changed/censored to such degrees during localization
It's already happened in Bravely Default (1 and 2 apparently), Fire Emblem Awakening , and now this apparently. If it's a game targetting E or T, they should know better and just not include this. Seems like more work for unnecessary fan service to include it and then have to censore it.

It's a good question, but it seems to me the clear answer is that what's problematic or inappropriate in the West often isn't regarded the same way in Japan. Given these are Japanese games, making them for their home audience and then just altering/removing as needed for the Western market makes sense.

To me, the odd idea is that they *shouldn't* change their products for different markets. That doesn't mean I'll never disagree with a change in particular, but it seems like a lot of people are vehemently opposed to the entire concept, which baffles me.

 

[CSX]

I feel bad I can't tell if your example is real or not.

It's real...it's from the girl I married in my JPN playthrough

Outside of the creep factor, its depressing that the lines repeat so damn much cuz there aren't too many lines.

I was expecting NOA to keep it and replace the lewd shit with more humorous lines. No one is missing anything outside of getting additional support points and some costumes that can be bought in-game.

 

[Lebon14]

If you guys think about it, it's, in a way, "the gamers of today" making that kind of censorship happens. You guys went "face rubbing is creepy remove it". Nintendo went "OK, we'll remove it". Then, you guys learn about it: "OMG!!! They removed a feature! It's censorship! I call boycott!!! >:-( ".

So, can you guys make up your mind? So should we petition The Pokemon Company to remove Pokemon Amie from Pokemon XY? "Pokemons aren't humans! They're more like pets. It's OK to pet pets." Just thinking about the flaws of thinking like this... makes me shiver.

I just really wish that the Western world would be more tolerant and open.

If it was petting "other places", then, I would have understood but this? Really? But then crude depiction of somebody's head blown away by shotgun to the face is 100% OK. X-Rays of bone breaking is also OK. But not gently rubbing a woman's face. I can't understand...

P.S Important: I'm not blaming anobody specifically here on NeoGAF with the first sentence.

 

[RM8]

As opposed to the rest of the game where you murder virtual humans?

I mean, it is a game about war. Do you find the depiction of death to be too detailed in Fire Emblem?

 

[A.E Suggs]

Dat outrage

Spoiler

900 comments

Of course itlol. I'm willing to bet the same people who are against here are the sag people complaining here and on siliconera, niche gamer, etc. Hell some people even use the same name and avatars. That's how some problems look bigger than they are but aren't reflected in sales.

 

[Crash Station]

It's a good question, but it seems to me the clear answer is that what's problematic or inappropriate in the West often isn't regarded the same way in Japan. Given these are Japanese games, making them for their home audience and then just altering/removing as needed for the Western market makes sense.

To me, the odd idea is that they *shouldn't* change their products for different markets. That doesn't mean I'll never disagree with a change in particular, but it seems like a lot of people are vehemently opposed to the entire concept, which baffles me.

Even those that are on a case by case basis are disappointed in this change. It's not a "only on principle" thing like many other censorship outrages have been.

 

[Nerokis]

Nope: https://twitter.com/RyougaSaotome/status/692062061111689217 https://twitter.com/RyougaSaotome/status/692062186341011457

I believe most of the lines in the videos I'm linking you can only get if you've S ranked (basically married) the character in question. I think you can get the first few lines (the non-romantic ones) no matter what though, gender and support rank don't matter.

I could also be wrong, I haven't played the game myself. Just looked at a bunch of videos and read second-hand impressions.

Ahh. Thanks for the information.

Definitely a missed opportunity, then.

 

[YoYo Switch]

what would the earth be like if people were able to separate video games from reality

would i finally be happy?

 

[Corpekata]

If you guys think about it, it's, in a way, "the gamers of today" making that kind of censorship happens. You guys went "face rubbing is creepy remove it". Nintendo went "OK, we'll remove it". Then, you guys learn about it: "OMG!!! They removed a feature! It's censorship! I call boycott!!! >:-( ".

.

Do you really think these people are all the same?

They type of person that flips out when Nintendo localizes something and cuts it is probably the type of person super into the petting shit in the first place.

 

[RM8]

what would the earth be like if people were able to separate video games from reality

would i finally be happy?

What would this have to do with not liking some elements in -some- games?

 

[BudokaiMR2]

Couldn't really care anyway since it's stupid and I didn't even like it in Pokémon where it made a lot more sense.

THAT SAID, in an industry where we are constantly talking about how female characters tend to be sexualized way more than male counterparts, wouldn't this have been a good example of a game with legit manservice? The dude ones always looked pretty damn lewd....

 

[GuessMyUserName]

Lol at "this game should be lewd because Mortal Kombat has gore".

I'm legitimately terrified you think goofy face rubbing is lewd

 

[Sane_Man]

Caressing a person's face is weird.

Ripping a person's spine out is fun.

That's some statement to make with that username.

It's baffling how liking seeing in a game an act that is for obvious reasons harmful to someone else and illegal is more socially acceptable than liking petting a consenting character's face.

You're entirely missing the point. It's a pointless feature and I'm glad it's being removed because it's just odd and not in the least fun. I don't 'object' to it morally. I'm just fine with the decision to remove it because the game is better off without it.

Removing someone's spine in Mortal Kombat is over the top cartoon violence. I'm able to separate fiction from reality, like the rest of us I hope. The same way I can watch and enjoy a horror film without feeling like a psychopath...

 

[RM8]

I'm legitimately terrified you think goofy face rubbing is lewd

Can we please stop pretending this mode didn't have suggestive lines?

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Are the European versions going to have this?

Watching that video, that's honestly fucking weird though. I won't say I'm glad its gone, I'll say no way in hell would I ever use that option. Nothing was locked behind that petting right?

 

[mikefrails]

So why do people actually care besides (misuse of) the "but censorship is bad!" stance?

It's mostly all for the sake of debate. People are posturing "I don't like thing - so thing shouldn't be in game" as good arguments and those who are a bit more leveled towards content inclusion are naturally calling it out.

 

[Jintor]

As opposed to the rest of the game where you murder virtual humans?

Let's not pretend murder hasn't been the operative verb of at least half of videogames for most of its history.

If you want to unpack it, virtual murder has less associations tied to it in terms of "HEY DUDE YOU ARE MURDERING A DUDE" (most of the time, variations on dramatic effect/type of game etc) than this face rubbing minigame did. Violating/consensually accessing someone's personal space usually isn't mechanically represented in games.

 

[jonjonaug]

If you guys think about it, it's, in a way, "the gamers of today" making that kind of censorship happens. You guys went "face rubbing is creepy remove it". Nintendo went "OK, we'll remove it". Then, you guys learn about it: "OMG!!! They removed a feature! It's censorship! I call boycott!!! >:-( ".

So, can you guys make up your mind? So should we petition The Pokemon Company to remove Pokemon Amie from Pokemon XY? "Pokemons aren't humans! They're more like pets. It's OK to pet pets." Just thinking about the flaws of thinking like this... makes me shiver.

I just really wish that the Western world would be more tolerant and open.

If it was petting "other places", then, I would have understood but this? Really? But then crude depiction of somebody's head blown away by shotgun to the face is 100% OK. X-Rays of bone breaking is also OK. But not gently rubbing a woman's face. I can't understand...

P.S Important: I'm not blaming anobody specifically here on NeoGAF with the first sentence.

I don't think these two schools of thought are entirely mutually exclusive.

I'm personally not a huge fan of the whole thing, and would rather the time and money spent making it have been spent elsewhere. But since it's already in the game, it feels weirdly paternalistic of NoA to remove it after the fact. Having a big company decide what is and isn't OK for me to experience actually creeps me out more than the original minigame in the first place. Which I don't actually find all that creepy, especially by dumb anime standards, just weird, out of place, and kinda funny.

 

[Joyful]

how is it not censorship

 

[TheBryanJZX90]

I mean that if they know their game is going to localized more than likely, why not simply not include this stuff to begin with instead of the game having to be changed/censored to such degrees during localization
It's already happened in Bravely Default (1 and 2 apparently), Fire Emblem Awakening , and now this apparently. If it's a game targetting E or T, they should know better and just not include this. Seems like more work for unnecessary fan service to include it and then have to censore it.

I absolutely agree! I would be very pleased if the Japanese market was less concerned with pandering to their otaku fanbases and instead produced games that a wider variety of Japanese people could enjoy. I think this would be much healthier for the overall Japanese market and would lead to more games being produced in Japan that I personally enjoy.

 

[Draxal]

Guess now my waifu won't be apologizing repeatedly for having a small chest in English then.

Also for u crazies now cancelling your SE pre order, give us a PSA so we can get one

Lol, I married Matoi in my play through as well.

 

[YianGaruga]

Can we please stop pretending this mode didn't have suggestive lines?

They could have changed, you could say localized, the lines

 

[RM8]

They could have changed, you could say localized, the lines

And wouldn't that be evil censorship?

 

[Dandy Crocodile]

And wouldn't that be evil censorship?

There'd still be complaints but at least the gameplay would still be there.

 

[snikky]

They could have changed, you could say localized, the lines

Then people would still complain about censorship while the others would still complain the creepy mini game is there.

Lose lose.